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Old 11-01-2016, 04:01 PM   #281
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Thanks insub!
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Old 11-01-2016, 04:13 PM   #282
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Thanks insub, but I get a "You are not signed in" message, I think that's what prevented me before.

Okay I used another provider and got in, Thank you.
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Old 11-01-2016, 04:15 PM   #283
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Np. Let me ask you a question then: How do you use frequency response correction EQ? How does this help? I don't think I've ever heard of such thing before.
I came up with it after reading a thread about some VST that would automatically compensate for the frequency response of your headphones if you used a model from the list. They had the response for the HD280 but not the HD380 Pro. Either way, I wasn't going to pay for the VST, it was more expensive than what I had paid for my headphones.

Anyway, the idea is the same as correcting the response of any speaker by using EQ. However, I could only find one response graph for my headphones on the internet (and it was very hard to find) that was by a company who had made an iPhone app to do the same thing. Use EQ to attempt to flatten the response of any headphone. And, they had a very substantial database. I tried to make my own response graph, but I didn't have the right tools.

I did, however, get approximately the same response measured as the graph that I'd found. So, I combined the two, in an average because my measurement was kinda faulty, and figured a reverse EQ curve that would generally make my nearly flat response headphones even more flat. It was a painstaking process.

I used REW Room EQ Wizard and a Bheringer ECM8000 mic to make my measurement and figure out the corrective EQ. The problem was that the filters in REW don't use the same measurement to define the Q-value of each filter. REW defines the Q-value as Bandwidth in octaves while ReaEQ uses Q. I found a website that had a Q calculator that would convert the values to what ReaEQ uses.
http://www.sengpielaudio.com/calculator-bandwidth.htm
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Old 11-01-2016, 04:17 PM   #284
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The funny thing is that I know about folders but I like dragging the send manually because I like seeing the jack symbol hahaha
LOL. Dave is just old-school. Never learned to do it the "Reaper" way!
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Old 11-01-2016, 04:20 PM   #285
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LOL. Dave is just old-school. Never learned to do it the "Reaper" way!
Me? old school? nahh I just have time to waste

Jokes aside... I obviously know about folders. Who doesn't?
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Old 11-01-2016, 04:47 PM   #286
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Here is what the response correction looked like. It sounded too harsh as-is, but at 70% wet mix did seem to flatten the response a bit. However, I have no basis for comparison other than what my ears can tell.

Essentially, if you invert the image vertically then you'd have the approximate response curve of Sennheiser HD 380 Pro headphones, according to what I measured and the graph I found on the web.
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Old 11-01-2016, 04:47 PM   #287
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Indiscipline's project is way more sophisticated than all the others.
He managed to get a clear sound throughout, but with a lot more work.
He has some interesting techniques, like the volume envelope automation that closely follows the contour of the audio envelope in order to completely stabilize the volume I assume.
I wonder why he does that instead of using a compressor. To save some CPU ?

Also what I notice is some equalizations are very sophisticated, much more than what I did which is often very basic.

I think one of the big mistakes I've made is slap a crappy impulse response reverb on the main bus. It gives me a boxy sound that people don't like. My main voice isn't great either. I think I suck at equalization, which kind of sucks as it's 80% of mixing.

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Old 11-01-2016, 04:49 PM   #288
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Here is what the response correction looked like. It sounded too harsh as-is, but at 70% wet mix did seem to flatten the response a bit. However, I have no basis for comparison other than what my ears can tell.

Essentially, if you invert the image vertically then you'd have the approximate response curve of Sennheiser HD 380 Pro headphones, according to what I measured and the graph I found on the web.
Interesting. Goes really far. 12 db is a lot. But you said you didn't do it for the competition mix, right? I'd love to hear version you'd do with response correction - would you able to do that? Cheers
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Old 11-01-2016, 04:53 PM   #289
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Indiscipline's project is way more sophisticated than all the others.
He has some interesting techniques, like the volume envelope automation that closely follows the contour of the audio envelope in order to completely stabilize the volume I assume.
I wonder why he does that instead of using a compressor. To save some CPU ?
I do that very often too, primarily to keep dynamics of the instrument intact, and I compress usually only to even out smaller ranges, colour or change the sound character, or to get more fat drums.
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Old 11-01-2016, 04:57 PM   #290
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Interesting. Goes really far. 12 db is a lot. But you said you didn't do it for the competition mix, right? I'd love to hear version you'd do with response correction - would you able to do that? Cheers
That'd be an interesting experiment. I started after all this because my mixes made using the headphones came out way too bright, especially for drums. Using the corrective EQ on the Master from the get go prevented me from mixing so bright. But, see... there are some adjustments in the mid and low-mid as well as bass. So, I might give it a go, but I'd have to start all over and I'd end up making different compressor decisions too, I think.
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Old 11-01-2016, 04:58 PM   #291
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Originally Posted by lolilol1975 View Post
Indiscipline's project is way more sophisticated than all the others.
He managed to get a clear sound throughout, but with a lot more work.
He has some interesting techniques, like the volume envelope automation that closely follows the contour of the audio envelope in order to completely stabilize the volume I assume.
I wonder why he does that instead of using a compressor. To save some CPU ?

Also what I notice is some equalizations are very sophisticated, much more than what I did which is often very basic.

I think one of the big mistakes I've made is slap a crappy impulse response reverb on the main bus. It gives me a boxy sound that people don't like. My main voice isn't great either. I think I suck at equalization, which kind of sucks as it's 80% of mixing.
I'm anxious to take a look at the top two mix projects, especially. I might have some time tonight or tomorrow night. CAN'T WAIT!
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Old 11-01-2016, 05:07 PM   #292
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I'm anxious to take a look at the top two mix projects, especially. I might have some time tonight or tomorrow night. CAN'T WAIT!
I hope you won't be disappointed then :P
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Old 11-01-2016, 05:10 PM   #293
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I do that very often too, primarily to keep dynamics of the instrument intact, and I compress usually only to even out smaller ranges, colour or change the sound character, or to get more fat drums.
I'm wondering if he used this script: http://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=181934
Else it must have been rather laborious.
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I'm anxious to take a look at the top two mix projects, especially. I might have some time tonight or tomorrow night. CAN'T WAIT!
There is certainly a lot to learn in the first one. He uses a lot of saturation plugins, in particular 2 special ones: "ind-valve-saturation" and "Smashed Transistors-triplefold-mort".
Also some waveshaping distortion and some hardware emulation.
On the drums he uses "Downward expansion", no idea why.
All of these techniques deserve an explanation.

The second one is simpler, just well done I guess.
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Old 11-01-2016, 05:15 PM   #294
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@insub Mate, your mix is ID7 not 5! I think you did drums too loud.

@lolilol1975 Maybe he did! i don't do it as detailed. But the script looks interesting.
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Old 11-01-2016, 05:22 PM   #295
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Here is what the response correction looked like. It sounded too harsh as-is, but at 70% wet mix did seem to flatten the response a bit. However, I have no basis for comparison other than what my ears can tell.

Essentially, if you invert the image vertically then you'd have the approximate response curve of Sennheiser HD 380 Pro headphones, according to what I measured and the graph I found on the web.
Wooo, that's almost reverse from what I'd think for earphones. So your earphones must be really low on the high end and really high on the low end. That's pretty strange.
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Old 11-01-2016, 05:57 PM   #296
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@insub Mate, your mix is ID7 not 5! I think you did drums too loud.
Oh crap. I fixed the original post indicating the wrong ID#. LOL, I have a tendency to put drums too far forward. I guess coming from a EDM & hip-hop background hasn't worn off yet.

I would've spent more time mixing on this, but I had ended up using a lot of the time I had available editing out mic bleed from all the tracks. Only one track was recorded hot enough for me to get a usable gate setting.
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Old 11-01-2016, 06:05 PM   #297
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Wooo, that's almost reverse from what I'd think for earphones. So your earphones must be really low on the high end and really high on the low end. That's pretty strange.
Yeah, well considering that the response graph I found was accurate. Here it is:
http://en.goldenears.net/13496

But, what I measured in my own test matched almost exactly the response above 1 kHz, so that leads me to believe that Golden Ears' reported graph is true. I attributed the difference at less than 1 kHz be due to my faulty test environment.

EDIT: Corrected link.
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Old 11-01-2016, 06:08 PM   #298
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Oh crap. I fixed the original post indicating the wrong ID#. LOL, I have a tendency to put drums too far forward. I guess coming from a EDM & hip-hop background hasn't worn off yet.

I would've spent more time mixing on this, but I had ended up using a lot of the time I had available editing out mic bleed from all the tracks. Only one track was recorded hot enough for me to get a usable gate setting.
Don't worry about it. I don't worry about bleeds too much.

I actually did my mix too, but wasn't feeling confident enough to share it. But would you guys like to hear it also?
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Old 11-01-2016, 06:49 PM   #299
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Yeah, well considering that the response graph I found was accurate. Here it is:
http://ko.goldenears.net/board/index...nt_srl=2239941

But, what I measured in my own test matched almost exactly the response above 1 kHz, so that leads me to believe that Golden Ears' reported graph is true. I attributed the difference at less than 1 kHz be due to my faulty test environment.
I'm not sure what I'm looking at with that link.

I've got a pretty decent acoustic mic, and just for the heck of it I ploted out my low budget earphones a while back. I was just curious how it would turn out and this is basically it.

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Old 11-01-2016, 06:56 PM   #300
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@Tod & Mik

I'm afraid I've derailed this thread with the headphone Frequency Response stuff. Would you like me to create a new thread? I think I will just because maybe some others are interested.

Here's the new thread if you all are interested.
http://forum.cockos.com/showthread.p...45#post1751345

EDIT: @Tod: It'd be nice if you re-posted your graph over in that thread. I quoted your comment and answered on the other thread. And, corrected the link in Post 297.
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Old 11-02-2016, 09:20 AM   #301
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A belated thank you to DaveKeehl for organizing all of this. It think its a fantastic idea that I think will be a valuable learning experience for a lot of us. In particular being able to dive into other sessions and learning from them.

Very happy to hear this will now be a monthly occurrence. Although my work schedule varies drastically, I'm happy to help out with future contests Dave if you can still use someone.

I think the best mix won, that is who I voted for. I did think my mix would do better in the rankings than it did, but thanks for the honorable mention from Indiscipline and Dave. Despite having added a decent amount of top end, it appears I still needed way more overall as it was too dull compared to the other mixes that ranked higher than mine.

Currently installing some musicals on a cruise ship and can't download the sessions on this meager wifi, but very much looking forward to diving into your guys' sessions when I get back to on land.
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Old 11-02-2016, 09:46 AM   #302
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hey did you see the admins moved this thread to another category and made it sticky???

but now I've already created the November thread... mmh what do I do now? xD
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Old 11-02-2016, 10:18 AM   #303
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A belated thank you to DaveKeehl for organizing all of this. It think its a fantastic idea that I think will be a valuable learning experience for a lot of us. In particular being able to dive into other sessions and learning from them.

Very happy to hear this will now be a monthly occurrence. Although my work schedule varies drastically, I'm happy to help out with future contests Dave if you can still use someone.

I think the best mix won, that is who I voted for. I did think my mix would do better in the rankings than it did, but thanks for the honorable mention from Indiscipline and Dave. Despite having added a decent amount of top end, it appears I still needed way more overall as it was too dull compared to the other mixes that ranked higher than mine.

Currently installing some musicals on a cruise ship and can't download the sessions on this meager wifi, but very much looking forward to diving into your guys' sessions when I get back to on land.
Hi soundguy yeah I was sure your mix would be ranked higher thanks if I something I'll let you know
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Old 11-02-2016, 11:28 AM   #304
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hey did you see the admins moved this thread to another category and made it sticky???

but now I've already created the November thread... mmh what do I do now? xD
Maybe you can ask them for advice on the best way to move forward. If it's a single thread that will be sticky we may just have to deal with the uber-long thread and move the other thread information here. Maybe we can encourage people to talk about the current competition in its own thread and save this sticky thread for reporting news about what's going on.

EDIT: Oh, they moved it to the collaboration sub-forum too.
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Old 11-02-2016, 12:40 PM   #305
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Might be a management headache for the admins but would love to just make the current one the sticky each month which replaces the previous sticky.
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Old 11-02-2016, 12:54 PM   #306
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Might be a management headache for the admins but would love to just make the current one the sticky each month which replaces the previous sticky.
it would be awesome but I think that if I ask they will punch me in the face
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Old 11-02-2016, 01:13 PM   #307
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Might be a management headache for the admins but would love to just make the current one the sticky each month which replaces the previous sticky.
Just the way it's done in the Pre-Relaese Forum with the latest pre? That would be cool...
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Old 11-02-2016, 01:14 PM   #308
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Just the way it's done in the Pre-Relaese Forum with the latest pre? That would be cool...
Yes, exactly. That's what I used for the idea to be honest. If we stay on schedule, it just needs to be switched at the top of the Month or whichever day. I actually think it would be good for the forum/community. We have the occasional contest but having something regular, at least for some time, I think would be valuable.
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Old 11-02-2016, 01:18 PM   #309
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it would be awesome but I think that if I ask they will punch me in the face
But now they know that we know...
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Old 11-03-2016, 05:07 AM   #310
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I didn't vote because it felt weird to vote when I had a submission. I would have voted for the mix that won though.

I probably shouldn't have submitted my mix since I didn't really have the time to do it properly. I thought what the heck, I'll send it anyway.

This contest is a fantastic idea. I'm glad that it will continue.
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Old 11-03-2016, 06:04 AM   #311
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It should only feel weird if you're voting for yourself.

I think we need as many people to vote as possible, and it's uncertain how many votes we'll get outside of the people participating.
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Old 11-03-2016, 06:26 AM   #312
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It should only feel weird if you're voting for yourself.

I think we need as many people to vote as possible, and it's uncertain how many votes we'll get outside of the people participating.
Yeah, it would be weird to vote for yourself, but political candidates do, so maybe it's just in my mind. I wouldn't vote for myself anyway. Even after 40 years, mixing is not one of my strong points and aging ears don't help.

I think it will be difficult to get very many people who didn't participate to vote since they would have to (or should) listen to all the submissions critically and that takes time. We certainly need as many votes as possible. I'll vote next time whether I participate or not.
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Old 11-04-2016, 04:41 AM   #313
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I think it's time to do some sort of advertisement I think youtube would be great since that are a lot of other channels like REAPER TV or THE REAPER BLOG who kinda promote the use of Reaper.
Insub already told me he's down to do the voiceover dialogs, anyone alse interested in expanding the REAPER Contest staff?
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Old 11-04-2016, 05:00 AM   #314
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The admins put the November thread in the sticky section and changed this one to normal! This is great!
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