Old 01-07-2017, 10:23 AM   #1
Dannii
Human being with feelings
 
Dannii's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Adelaide, South Australia (originally from Geelong)
Posts: 5,598
Default This is BRILLIANT!

Thanks to Plush2 on THIS THREAD, I just discovered a great little Aussie utility to route 5.1 channel surround from VLC Player directly into REAPER via ASIO. It can be used to route any audio from any app into any other app too (even over a network connection).

I had previously experimented with VB-Audio Hi-Fi Cable but could never get it to work without clicks and pops. After that, I just looped a digital output from my RME Fireface back to another input and that worked well but it only worked with VLC in stereo and it used up a physical in and out on the Fireface.

Anyway, the solution for me is O Deus ASIO Link. There's also two others with more i/o but the basic one gives eight i/o which is more than enough for surround from VLC up to 7.1 channel.
I'm routing VLC into REAPER and then using REAPER to upmix 5.1 (or 7.1) to Ambisonic third order and out to my 3D cube monitoring rig and it works flawlessly. I'm listening to Jean-Michel Jarre "Aero" DVD (5.1 DTS audio) right now while I am connected to the net and typing this and it is rock solid. No pops, glitches or noises even with the web browser running using a WiFi internet connection.

It doesn't need to resample and clocks to the ASIO driver (RME in my case) so the audio is bit perfect with no degradation.

It isn't free but it is very reasonably priced (and cheaper for you guys in the USA given the Aussie dollar exchange rate right now).
I also purchased their MIDI Thru utility which is very handy too.

Great stuff!
__________________
Dannii is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2017, 10:50 AM   #2
vburel
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 30
Default

note that HIFI-Cable + ASIO bridge cannot help you to route VLC 5.1 audio into Reaper.
But you can do that with Voicemeeter (or Banana version).
vburel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2017, 12:10 PM   #3
Dannii
Human being with feelings
 
Dannii's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Adelaide, South Australia (originally from Geelong)
Posts: 5,598
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by vburel View Post
note that HIFI-Cable + ASIO bridge cannot help you to route VLC 5.1 audio into Reaper.
But you can do that with Voicemeeter (or Banana version).
Perhaps, but I never had much luck with the VB-Audio stuff. It worked in stereo but not without crackles and audio glitches. It ran fine for a while but after about ten minutes, I'd start to have issues.

O Deus ASIO Link just works, REALLY well.
__________________
Dannii is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2017, 01:08 PM   #4
serr
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 12,558
Default

I've been using Soundflower for that for a long time now. (Also a virtual audio device app.)

Set it as your OS audio device and any media player will have the 5.1 output coming down channels 1-6.

Make an aggregate device of Soundflower + an audio interface and you can shuttle audio around any way you please.

You can use Reaper as a "plugin" for any media player doing this.

My only complaint about VLC is the need to switch core audio (ASIO for Windows users) to the specific channel format being listened to (5.1 vs. 4.0, 4.1, 2.0, etc). If you don't, you'll get everything from wrong channel assignments to fake center channel summing that you didn't ask for.

Songbird will always play the correct channels in the correct speakers with the system set to 5.1 and you can mix and match different channel formats in the same playlist. I'm still using XBMC media center for surround audio + video content. One of the most horrendous GUI disasters I've ever seen but it seems to just work.

Apparently we're all supposed to buy that J River media player app? Every time I ask if that just cleans this all up and handles all formats as 1:1 as possible I get... crickets.
serr is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2017, 01:21 PM   #5
Dannii
Human being with feelings
 
Dannii's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Adelaide, South Australia (originally from Geelong)
Posts: 5,598
Default

Being on PC, I can't really comment on Soundflower.
Quote:
Originally Posted by serr View Post
..
My only complaint about VLC is the need to switch core audio (ASIO for Windows users) to the specific channel format being listened to (5.1 vs. 4.0, 4.1, 2.0, etc). If you don't, you'll get everything from wrong channel assignments to fake center channel summing that you didn't ask for....
Perhaps it is different on Mac but I've never had that issue with VLC here on Windows. It plays stereo out the L & R channels, 5.1 out the correct channels and other combinations correctly here without any tweaking.
__________________
Dannii is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2017, 01:42 PM   #6
serr
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 12,558
Default

Last time I tried VLC it was making a fake mono sum of the front L,R channels and putting that in the center speaker for 4.0 content with core audio set to 5.1.

FYI Soundflower gives you 32 channels so you can go pretty wild routing things.

Last edited by serr; 01-07-2017 at 01:51 PM.
serr is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2017, 01:43 PM   #7
Dannii
Human being with feelings
 
Dannii's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Adelaide, South Australia (originally from Geelong)
Posts: 5,598
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by serr View Post
Last time I tried VLC it was making a fake mono sum of the front L,R channels and putting that in the center speaker for 4.0 content with core audio set to 5.1.
Interesting. I wonder if that is a difference between Mac/Windows versions or if it was something that has been rectified since you last tried it?
__________________
Dannii is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2017, 02:05 PM   #8
serr
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 12,558
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ReaDave View Post
Interesting. I wonder if that is a difference between Mac/Windows versions or if it was something that has been rectified since you last tried it?
Perhaps the time is near for another media player shootout?
Maybe someone is finally actually making something convenient here in 2017?

Last time I went through everything it turned into a long list of why you should avoid A through Z and I ended up back with Songbird. It does just work though.
serr is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2017, 02:13 PM   #9
Dannii
Human being with feelings
 
Dannii's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Adelaide, South Australia (originally from Geelong)
Posts: 5,598
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by serr View Post
Perhaps the time is near for another media player shootout?
Maybe someone is finally actually making something convenient here in 2017?

Last time I went through everything it turned into a long list of why you should avoid A through Z and I ended up back with Songbird. It does just work though.
I know how you feel!! I went through something similar numerous times here on Windows too. Funny thing is, on my previous DAW PC, VLC was temperamental, dropped frames and generally not that great so I switched over to Media Player Classic Home Cinema edition which worked extremely well.
On my current DAW PC, things are the exact reverse. MPC HC is temperamental and drops frames while VLC just works.
__________________
Dannii is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2017, 02:22 PM   #10
cyrano
Human being with feelings
 
cyrano's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Belgium
Posts: 5,246
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ReaDave View Post
Interesting. I wonder if that is a difference between Mac/Windows versions or if it was something that has been rectified since you last tried it?
There is no real standard for channel numbering and it seems to differ between most tools I've tried.

I suppose Serr just needs to install the newest VLC? I'm not sure tho, as VLC is one of the programs that hurts my memory. It just seems so illogical that it's use doesn't stick.

And next to Soundflower Jack, or JackOSX, can also do this, as Soundflower seems to be stuck in beta since a while. of course, Audio Hijajck Pro can also do this, but it is not free. It's been a while since I last used Jack and it was kind of buggy, but it can do even more, like sending audio over the network.

Personally, I use the spdif or ADAT iO on my FF400 and Totalmix to route around problems like these if I have to. And since I hardly use 5.1, I seldom have to do that.
__________________
In a time of deceit telling the truth is a revolutionary act.
George Orwell
cyrano is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2017, 02:27 PM   #11
Dannii
Human being with feelings
 
Dannii's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Adelaide, South Australia (originally from Geelong)
Posts: 5,598
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cyrano View Post
..Personally, I use the spdif or ADAT iO on my FF400 and Totalmix to route around problems like these if I have to. And since I hardly use 5.1, I seldom have to do that.
That's precisely what I was doing with my Fireface UFX. Now that I've expanded it with two ADA8200s, I need the ADAT i/o for them. I am also using the AES i/o to connect my Sound Devices 744T so I no longer have the options of digital i/o routing via TotalMix FX without reaching behind my rack and repatching things.
I also wanted 5.1 from VLC into REAPER which the digital i/o routing didn't allow.

I'm a very happy chappy now though with the solution in my original post, hence sharing it.
__________________
Dannii is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2017, 02:29 PM   #12
cyrano
Human being with feelings
 
cyrano's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Belgium
Posts: 5,246
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by serr View Post
Perhaps the time is near for another media player shootout?
Maybe someone is finally actually making something convenient here in 2017?
I haven't found one, as long as it's video.

Quote:
Last time I went through everything it turned into a long list of why you should avoid A through Z and I ended up back with Songbird. It does just work though.
I did find this very minimalistic free audio player recently: Taply. It's just a QuickTime wrapper, but it's lean and mean. One of my friends swears it sounds better than anything else:

https://www.bluem.net/en/mac/taply/

There's some other interesting stuf there too. Like a lib to make gui parts for shell and other scripts.
__________________
In a time of deceit telling the truth is a revolutionary act.
George Orwell
cyrano is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-08-2017, 12:58 AM   #13
vburel
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 30
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ReaDave View Post
Perhaps, but I never had much luck with the VB-Audio stuff. It worked in stereo but not without crackles and audio glitches. It ran fine for a while but after about ten minutes, I'd start to have issues.
Sometimes it is not easy to find the right configuration. However Voicemeeter is made to let you record 8 tracks with Reaper (connected to voicemeeter virtual ASIO driver), see use case #3 in user manual:
http://vb-audio.pagesperso-orange.fr...UserManual.pdf

To get 7.1 channel from VLC, you have to configure Voicemeeter Virtual input in 7.1 otherwise it stays stereo (see user manual page 14).
vburel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-08-2017, 11:46 AM   #14
Dannii
Human being with feelings
 
Dannii's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Adelaide, South Australia (originally from Geelong)
Posts: 5,598
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by vburel View Post
Sometimes it is not easy to find the right configuration. However Voicemeeter is made to let you record 8 tracks with Reaper (connected to voicemeeter virtual ASIO driver), see use case #3 in user manual:
http://vb-audio.pagesperso-orange.fr...UserManual.pdf

To get 7.1 channel from VLC, you have to configure Voicemeeter Virtual input in 7.1 otherwise it stays stereo (see user manual page 14).
It wasn't so much a configuration issue for me but rather an issue with performance. Things would work ok for a while but after ten minutes or so, I'd start to get random crackles and sync issues. The O Deus stuff doesn't seem to have these problems here on my machine.
__________________
Dannii is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-08-2017, 12:16 PM   #15
serr
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 12,558
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ReaDave View Post
It wasn't so much a configuration issue for me but rather an issue with performance. Things would work ok for a while but after ten minutes or so, I'd start to get random crackles and sync issues. The O Deus stuff doesn't seem to have these problems here on my machine.
I've had that before in OSX too. I believe it's a sync issue at root cause (probably stating the obvious). It was more of an order of operations thing with when to talk to devices and which one to talk to first. I haven't had a sync crash (we'll call it) for a long time that wasn't operator error.

I suppose there have been software updates along the way too so I can't be 100% sure. Multiple devices and virtual devices and multiple audio apps all running together is just fiddly sometimes. Watch for how the devices like to be operated and don't argue with them.
serr is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-08-2017, 12:20 PM   #16
Dannii
Human being with feelings
 
Dannii's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Adelaide, South Australia (originally from Geelong)
Posts: 5,598
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by serr View Post
I've had that before in OSX too. I believe it's a sync issue at root cause (probably stating the obvious). It was more of an order of operations thing with when to talk to devices and which one to talk to first. I haven't had a sync crash (we'll call it) for a long time that wasn't operator error.

I suppose there have been software updates along the way too so I can't be 100% sure. Multiple devices and virtual devices and multiple audio apps all running together is just fiddly sometimes. Watch for how the devices like to be operated and don't argue with them.
Yeah. True.
I gave up on the whole idea of internal routing once I got my Fireface UFX and patched everything using physical digital connections.
The O Deus stuff has changed all that though because it really was just a matter of install, set up and use. It just works. No fuss.
It isn't free but for me, the relatively small cost is worth it.
__________________
Dannii is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-08-2017, 04:37 PM   #17
airon
Human being with feelings
 
airon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Berlin
Posts: 11,817
Default

Looks interesting, and I might have a stack of use cases for it further down the line.

Thanks for the tip.
__________________
Using Latch Preview (Video) - Faderport 16 setup for CSI 1.1 , CSI 3.10
Website
"My ego comes pre-shrunk" - Randy Thom
airon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-08-2017, 10:43 PM   #18
vburel
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 30
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ReaDave View Post
It wasn't so much a configuration issue for me but rather an issue with performance. Things would work ok for a while but after ten minutes or so, I'd start to get random crackles and sync issues.
No, it's a typical issue due to configuration. It usually means that the driver selected as output A1 (master stream) is not enough stable or that its buffer size is too small. That's why it is recommended to keep default settings and select your best audio device as output A1 (ASIO first if present, WDM or KS... MME as last choice)...
vburel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-17-2017, 03:12 PM   #19
the_drumreaper
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 23
Default Upmix 5.1 to 4 channel ambisonic first order template

Hi Dave. Do you have a template for a 5.1 upmix to ambisonic 4 channel configuration?
the_drumreaper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-17-2017, 06:21 PM   #20
Dannii
Human being with feelings
 
Dannii's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Adelaide, South Australia (originally from Geelong)
Posts: 5,598
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by the_drumreaper View Post
Hi Dave. Do you have a template for a 5.1 upmix to ambisonic 4 channel configuration?
Actually, I do have a template for a very good 5.1 to Ambisonic upmix but I'm not using free plugins to achieve it. I'm using the Blue Ripple Sound 5.1 upmixer in combination with their cube decoder for monitoring on my Auratone 3D cube array.
The Blue Ripple plugins are fairly expensive but they are worth every cent.
This upmixing setup 'fills in the gaps' between the 5.1 channels so the sound is a much better sound field than you get playing back on an actual 5.1 speaker setup. It also provides third order output (16 channels) but you can still use just the first four channels for first order Ambisonics.
__________________
Dannii is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-17-2017, 08:54 PM   #21
the_drumreaper
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 23
Default Nugen 5.1 / 7.1 + free blue ripple O3A decoder

Nugen 5.1 / 7.1 + free blue ripple O3A decoder. One day I will get to your level. For now I will try this. Thanks for the tip.
the_drumreaper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-17-2017, 09:03 PM   #22
Dannii
Human being with feelings
 
Dannii's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Adelaide, South Australia (originally from Geelong)
Posts: 5,598
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by the_drumreaper View Post
Nugen 5.1 / 7.1 + free blue ripple O3A decoder. One day I will get to your level. For now I will try this. Thanks for the tip.
That's probably not going to do what you want though. The Blue Ripple decoders take an Ambisonic input and decode it to specific speaker channels. The Nugen upmixer will give you discrete 5.1/7.1 outputs but you need something to convert that to Ambisonic format. That's what the Blue Ripple upmixers do. They take discrete channel inputs and convert to Ambisonic output which you then monitor via the decoder set to your monitor setup.
__________________
Dannii is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-18-2017, 03:34 AM   #23
skippertag
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 474
Default

Hey...

Do you know if Asio link can handle more than one soundcard like VMB can do.

I have two soundcards to run my all in one monitoring system which I like to adjust all from within REAPER which is of course the only Daw which can manage that :-)

actually with VMB I can only send one signal to the second soundcard and then have to switch buttons there... but it would be really cool to just do that from internal REAPER routing..
skippertag is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-18-2017, 11:19 AM   #24
the_drumreaper
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 23
Default It worked, but with some changes

I used a 5.1 flac track with a O3A decoder 5.1, then on my render track an ambix encoder i6 o1 and an ATK FOA transform rotate to play with positioning just a little. Complete 4 channel ambisonic conversion. Lovin it
the_drumreaper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-07-2018, 01:32 PM   #25
airon
Human being with feelings
 
airon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Berlin
Posts: 11,817
Default

Looks like the gentleman developing this fine piece of gear died in April 2017, according to this post on Reddit.

I was looking for it again, because a colleague was looking for just such a solution. I hope the family member gets the free version off the ground, or releases the source code at some point.
__________________
Using Latch Preview (Video) - Faderport 16 setup for CSI 1.1 , CSI 3.10
Website
"My ego comes pre-shrunk" - Randy Thom
airon is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 07:01 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.