Old 04-28-2018, 05:00 AM   #321
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Originally Posted by Sju View Post
Hey guys. Doing a bit of research on articulation switching methods, and thought this would be a good place to get knowledgeable answers.

I'm wondering if key switching has any advantages compared to channel switching?

As I understand, the advantage of key switching is real-time playability, but a sampler using channel switching could operate in the same manner with an preprocessor that switches the MIDI output channel with keyswitches?

Channel switching sampler would then have the sole advantage of being able to play multiple articulations at the same time (impossible with keyswitching as far as I understand).

Am I missing any other pros/cons?

Thanks in advance.

PS. thank you tack for that script, it looks really useful!

There are SWS actions for changing channel input, even if your midi input device/keyboard transmits channel one by default. (includes CC data as well.)

SWS actions "Map Selected tracks midi input to channel 1"
and so on for the other channels.
I use keystrokes 1-0 for Mcha 1 - 10, and logo (Win key) + 1 to 6 for the rest.
So let's assume you have legato on channel 1, and Staccato on channel 2.

You press 1, and you hear the legato when you play your input device.
You press 2, and you hear the Staccato, even though you are inputting from your midi device which is transmitting on channel 1.
This is important as a "preview" mechanism, as you might for example prefer spiccato over staccato after trying them both for a particular passage, in tempo, and alongside any legato you've already recorded.

I work like this and it functions well, and importantly, is fast. (with sufficient practise).



A couple of caveats.

If you have the track FX window open, then the keystrokes won't work, because the arrange (main) window is not in focus.

I don't know if this is a caveat as i find it to be an asset, but if you have channel 2 selected, then any CC data you transmit will be for channel 2. So you can vary volume, velocity, expression directly for each articulation. I find this useful because most of the staccatos i have across my libs are a little "bright" compared to the legatos, so i'm likely to adjust them by default.
And, if you have more than one artic playing at once (because you can, using channels) then you can balance them really effectively.


If you wish to add the same CC data to all channels at once then there is another action to "Set selected tracks midi input to all channels." (Which i have mapped to Logo + 7)


This is all in the main window. I have the same keystrokes mapped to switch the same channels in the midi editor, if i wish to manually input notes out of tempo, for example.

Remember that CC data can be written per channel, but if you wish to edit the data in the ME, you need to select the correct channel to do so. (Which is entirely sensible.)

Hope this helps.

Keyswitching is a decision made by sample companies in the assumption that users will find it to be the most friendly way to handle artics that may seem like they're breeding in large numbers.

It is NOT the only way to work, and i suggest you set up a test track, assign the actions, and then practise channel switching for an afternoon, and draw your own conclusions.

I have 2 1st violin tracks to handle artics from my various sample libs, with all the "popular" artics on the first, and the less used artics on the other, saved as a 1st Violins track template.
As soon as we have some sort of track notes (text window) docked next to the track list that will save listed artics per track, as part of a track template, you'll have no need to open the FX window if you can't remember which artic you assigned to which channel, as it will be listed next to where you're working. We have the track notes window already (thanks again SWS), and it can be docked on the left, changing with selected tracks which is really cool imho, but they can only be saved with the project, for the moment.

If you have your tracks preloaded in a project template, then you're good to go.

Alex.

Last edited by alextone; 04-28-2018 at 05:16 AM.
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Old 09-25-2018, 02:08 PM   #322
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What about the simple and elegant way of adding articulations through actions?

IF actions included:
"insert note at C-1" to "insert note at G9" (ALL the notes)

We could:
insert at least all the keyswitches through a comprehensive and custom floating toolbar.

If actions included:
"insert MIDI CC [all of them]", then the custom toolbar would be complete.

AND:
I could finally make my custom guitar fret toolbar in which I could combine actions to insert notes according to string and fret number.

BUT:
would require that the action allows auditioning of the inserted note.

Last edited by krahosk; 09-25-2018 at 02:50 PM.
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Old 09-25-2018, 09:13 PM   #323
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Quote:
Originally Posted by krahosk View Post
What about the simple and elegant way of adding articulations through actions?

IF actions included:
"insert note at C-1" to "insert note at G9" (ALL the notes)

We could:
insert at least all the keyswitches through a comprehensive and custom floating toolbar.

If actions included:
"insert MIDI CC [all of them]", then the custom toolbar would be complete.

AND:
I could finally make my custom guitar fret toolbar in which I could combine actions to insert notes according to string and fret number.

BUT:
would require that the action allows auditioning of the inserted note.
The method above would require a user to input new keyswtiches, CC values, and channel changes whenever he/she changed patches or instruments.

The key benefit of an articulation mapper is that you can mix and match instruments without having to redo every articulation. For example, if I write a melody line for a trumpet which contains staccatos, legato, and other articulations, I should be able to copy that MIDI data (including notation) into another part (say a violin section) and simply load the violin articulation map to trigger the right samples.

The other benefit is that the user can create the articulation mapper once and not have to worry about it again. The above method would require me to reference relevant keyswitches, CCs, etc. A mapper that does this for the user would be a huge time saver.
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Old 09-26-2018, 04:09 AM   #324
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Do the Cockos team still work on Articulation Mapper ?
Last Schwa message on it was just after 5.32 release...
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Old 09-26-2018, 04:14 AM   #325
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Do the Cockos team still work on Articulation Mapper ?
Last Schwa message on it was just after 5.32 release...
It is/was be in some pre-releases, but needed more love. It will probably appear when 6.0 will be released.
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Old 09-26-2018, 07:23 AM   #326
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Originally Posted by vitalker View Post
It is/was be in some pre-releases, but needed more love. It will probably appear when 6.0 will be released.

I hardly hope so.
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Old 09-26-2018, 08:05 AM   #327
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Quote:
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Do the Cockos team still work on Articulation Mapper ?
Last Schwa message on it was just after 5.32 release...
Use Reaticulate script by @Tack. It's the best articulation mapper you could hope for.
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Old 09-26-2018, 08:08 AM   #328
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Nothing against Tack and his work, but his script doesn't read articulation information from the notation view
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Old 09-26-2018, 09:43 AM   #329
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Originally Posted by robgb View Post
Use Reaticulate script by @Tack. It's the best articulation mapper you could hope for.
I already got it, of course. But I still hope Cockos team will put that functionnality in Reaper itself.
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Old 09-26-2018, 03:42 PM   #330
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Would the new MIDI implementations "MPE" (Multidimensional Polyphonic Expression) help and simplify expression mapping?

https://www.midi.org/articles-old/mi...expression-mpe

The specification:
https://www.midi.org/downloads?task=...ethod=download
(you have to register for this download to work)

MPE has been standardized this year (2018) by the official MIDI Manufacturers Association (MMA).
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Old 09-26-2018, 05:57 PM   #331
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Quote:
Originally Posted by krahosk View Post
Would the new MIDI implementations "MPE" (Multidimensional Polyphonic Expression) help and simplify expression mapping?

https://www.midi.org/articles-old/mi...expression-mpe

The specification:
https://www.midi.org/downloads?task=...ethod=download
(you have to register for this download to work)

MPE has been standardized this year (2018) by the official MIDI Manufacturers Association (MMA).
Nope. MPE is for ROLI keyboards, it allows each note to have its own CCs basically. Nothing to do with switching articulations.
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Old 09-26-2018, 05:59 PM   #332
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It doesn't sound like it's designed for that purpose. More to the point, any MIDI standard would have to be adhered to by every synth/sample library (which isn't realistic).
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Old 10-21-2018, 09:30 AM   #333
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@justin and/or schwa

Now that there are pres and dev branches in LoL, would it make sense to test potential articulation mapper functionality in the dev branch? Even if we aren’t in the V6 cycle yet?
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Old 10-21-2018, 03:20 PM   #334
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reddiesel41264 View Post
Nope. MPE is for ROLI keyboards, it allows each note to have its own CCs basically. Nothing to do with switching articulations.
????
It can perfectly be used independent of ROLI.

I recently did a proof of concept (see -> https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=211580 ) that Midi MPE data can be created in Reaper and is acknowledged by a PianoTeq plugin.

Here I preceeded each note-on by an appropriate pitchbend message and with that perfectly was able to create a microtonale scale.

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Old 10-21-2018, 06:16 PM   #335
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The risk with using MPE for articulation mapping is that:

1. There could be conflicting messages if an MPE controller and/or VST were used on a track with articulations

2. MPE (as I understand it) would be necessarily limited to 16 note polyphony (notes temporarily remapped to other channels.). This is fine in most uses with monophonic instruments but could present a problem with polyphonic instruments.
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Old 10-21-2018, 09:28 PM   #336
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1) when using MPE, articulations are not polyphonic but per voice.
2) correct for notes with equal rights. But AFAIK, you can dedicate one or some channels to notes without articulation and transfer as many "simple" notes on same as wanted.

-Michjael
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Old 10-22-2018, 06:49 PM   #337
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1) when using MPE, articulations are not polyphonic but per voice.
That's not my point. The point is that if you start using MPE outside its intended function, you will likely experience issues if/when plugins start using MPE as part of its playback structure.

Here's a different analogy. Let's say we Reaper uses CC32 for articulation mapping (UACC). We immediately run into issues and workarounds if the VSTi library uses CC32 for anything. The same logical problem exists with trying to use MPE for articulation mapping. At some point you will run into issues for a VSTi that actually uses standard MPE.
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Old 10-22-2018, 09:38 PM   #338
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Rather obviously the method used by any of Reaper's internal (or affiliated extension's) algorithms needs to be dedicatedly configured for any kind of target VST.

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Old 10-23-2018, 08:25 AM   #339
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pcartwright View Post
@justin and/or schwa

Now that there are pres and dev branches in LoL, would it make sense to test potential articulation mapper functionality in the dev branch? Even if we aren’t in the V6 cycle yet?
+1 here! Would enjoy testing out the articulation mapper before V6 enters pre-release building. Combining CC / Key switch / whatever method articulation switching with notation symbols via a native REAPER method will be great to use and test out!
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