Reaper vs Pro-Tools editing

[wills]

Just started using Reaper after around ten years working on Pro-Tools. Don't laugh but I still have a G4 running OS9 and PT LE 5 with a Digi 001! This has been fine for my purposes up till I got my hands on a Macbook and decided I'd like more a portable studio - at least more portable than draggin' around a G4 complete with CRT monitor!

Working on a project the other day I found I could complete the boring task of importing files from another machine and organising the folder structure in a fraction of the time it took previously. Awesome. The guy I was working with who is totally uninterested in technology was stoked! He was used to the tedious wait while I pissed about converting files and organising the hard drive. Shit, why did I wait so long to change up!

Anyway, being so used to PT I'm finding it difficult to get my head around editing in Reaper. I'm used to that list of files PT keeps on the right of screen and the mouse edit tools. I'd often create regions and use them to replace dud sections of a track and the like. Any tips for how I might achieve a similar task - or any editing tips for an ex PT user?

Cheers

[airon]

I'm a regular Protools hound myself(dialogue, fx and mixing) and know exactly what you mean.

Here are a couple of tips on the basic concepts and editing workflows : http://www.cockos.com/wiki/index.php...ost_Production

It'll get you started. I'll chip in again tomorrow, if nobody's beaten me to it . Plenty of Protools people here.

[airon]

Wills, if you want the lowdown via voice, let me know. I'll PM you my Skype contact if you're interested.

[evillain]

I just downloaded Reaper 3.13 as well. I have been strictly a Pro Tools guy for 10 years. I am working on a BLA modded Digi 002 with Pro Tools 8 on a 17" Macbook Pro.

I am trying out Reaper because I need a DAW with ADC, and mixing in LE can be a pain with manual Time Adjusting, and even using the Mellowmuse ATA.

So far, I think Reaper is really amazing. I tried switching to Logic, but it was just waaaaaay too much going on. Amazing program, but not for me.

I love the simplicity of Reaper. The routing Matrix is brilliant.

BUT!!!

I just want Pro Tools style editing. Is that really too much to ask for? Nothing is as easy as editing in Pro Tools, and I promise I will make the full switch to Reaper if I can edit with the same speed and ease as Pro Tools!!!

Is this possible??

Can i customize it somehow to do this??

Can this be implemented in a future update??

Thoughts?

[Guitar486]

Hopefully this is coming soon xD

http://forum.cockos.com/showpost.php...9&postcount=56

Be patient

[evillain]

Also....

i just want to use my "two finger scroll" feature to look around the edit window, like in Pro Tools. But when i scroll, it zooms in and out. This is very frustrating and I don't like this workflow.

And the Navigator window?!?!?! why must i open another window to scroll around my project?

I really want to switch over, but I do a lot of Pro work, and I am very much considering an HD rig....but I want Reaper to change my mind!!!

[manning1]

mate.
have you really explored reapers editing in depth ??
why not give examples of what your trying to do so folks can chime in.
yesterday for example (and ive done this on a thousand traks now prolly..)
just some examples of what i was doing in reaper.
1. general editing/clean up of a trak.
2. subtle fade ins on consonants n "esses" to even things out.
3. subtle fade outs on printed verbs.
4. automating a pan for a trak to move in the stereo image.
and oodles of other stuff i dont have time to type out.
theres even clever triks with reafir to change a traks sonic print as
well as normal nr.
the only thing there isnt is interpolation from what ive seen mate.
so please give examples so people can point you in the right direction.
do a list..
i want to do a , b , c etc etc.

gotta go now. will check back in 7 hrs or so.
all i can say is thers a ton of deep power in reaper,
and its like anything new..ya gotta familiarise yourself.
now i'm gonna go edit a difficult voc trak..lol.
god bless.

[evillain]

ok...i will try to be more specific..

and let me say that I really love Reaper so far...i'm not trying to hate. I have just been so frustrated lately with no ADC in Pro ToolsLE....and learning a new DAW is adding to that frustration!!

**inhale......exhaaaaaleeee.

ok...i am calm now.

1. I would like to quickly navigate around the edit window by scrolling side to side. Click on where I want to edit, zoom in closely, and toggle between Slip and Grid mode.

2. I would like to highlight one area in a region in one track, with a selector tool. When i grab a point in a region with the mouse, it moves the whole file over, instead of highlighting it. I seem to only be able to do this at the top of the window, but it highlights all the track in the area i selected.

3. I would like to highlight a particular region, and hit left to go to begginning of that region, and right to go to end of that region.

4. I would like to have a Crop Tool, A fade Tool, a Selector Tool, and a multi task tool, like Pro Tools has.

5. I would like to have zones in each region that select the proper tool when i mouse over that area...ie...a fade tool appears when I am at the begging or end of a region.

6. I notice when I hover at the top of a region, I can adjust the gain of the track...but it is labeled "Volume". Does this work like a Trim PLugin? I assume it affects the regions loudness, not the volume fader output?

7. Are the meters showing Peak or RMS? or both?

8. I think I said toggle between Slip and Grid Mode already. and even shuffle mode.

9. and in Grid mode, can I change the size of the grid?


that is all I can think of for now. any help would be amazingly appreciated. I am not going to give up. I want to learn this. If I can edit and mix as quickly as Pro Tools, then I will be amazingly happy.

[manning1]

evillain
have you spent time with the docn yet ??
i use pc so hopefully this applies to you also.
have you also perused keyboard shortcuts ??
you can also do custom actions.
i normally set markers for quik navigation
eg verse 1/chorus etc etc.
or drag horizontal slider at bottom of traks view.
or use mousewsheel.
to answer your q's...i'll try n help.
fyi there are people on these forums i understand
who have not only created their own pt looking gui..
but also actions. cos they go tween pt n reap.
1. read keyboard shortcuts.
eg mousewheel scrolls etc.
2. to select eg a part to edit in a trak...
HIGHLITE OUTSIDE THE TRAK IN BLANK SPACE..dont drag ON the trak.
(a tip..starting out leave a free trak tween recorded traks..
till you get used to hiliting in free space.
so you can drag mouse under area you want to hilite.)
then on hilited area right clik over it for options,
3 n 5. i dont use regions mate.
have to ask someone else.
check kbd shortcuts again.
but you could use markers also i guess n clik on a marker labelled start or end.
4. i dont need those tools.
what do you define as crop ??
if i want to say delete a breath in a vocal before a verse i just split
before breath hold arrow over left edge of audio clip n drag to right.
conversely after splitting you can drag a right edge left.
eg some noise after vocal verse has ended.
fade//pretty easy...just hold mouse over left or right corner of trak or seperated
clip in a trak.
for volume fade say of whole mix...
draw in volume automation on master , eg fade out of song.
6. yes drag down and the clip will lower in volume.
(also check out item properties.)
7. meters can be set however you want. peak/rms etc or both.
IT IS IMPORTANT TO LEARN TO RIGHT CLIK OVEDR EVERYTHING IN REAPER
for options etc etc. also check the pan options.
8/9. define what you mean by slip n grid n shuffle.
n i'll detail how i do things.

really i think its important you spend some time with the reap docs.
its just familiarisation often.
hope this helps a tad.
all the best.
ps..really explore all the mousewheel options n keyboard shortcuts
etc etc.
pm me if ya got more q's if you wish.
all the best.

[evillain]

manning1.....thank you so much.

I will definietly spend time going over the entire manual, which i feel was written really well, except that it is geared towards PC users.

Grid mode is when wherever you select it forms to the grid that you specify....examples...1/4 note grid, to 32nd note grid....sample grid....millesecond grid.....etc. Any edit I make will be to the grid.

Slip mode is when it is free and you can slide anything anywhere.

For instance....if I want to edit up to the first hit of the drums, and move them to a locked grid. I would edit up to the first hit in Slip mode, then go to grid mode to lock it to the grid on 1.

A "region" is the audio track itself. If it is cut into 3 parts, then it is 3 regions. At least that is how PT names it.

I have a lot to learn, and I think what keeps most interested in this program is that I know it is just gonna get better and better all the time. Or at least that is the perception I am getting.

Thank you again!!

[manning1]

evillain
answers.
1. i use reaper more like i used to tape..
but in the top left icon row.
right clik over the icon that looks like a grid
for grid settings.
so you can edit to the grid.
2. i use what you call slip a lot cos as i said i use reap
more like when i was tape
multitrak 2 inch in the past.
so i turn off grid to move anywhere.
what you call slip.
(also understand item properties where you can
also input start position etc.
right clik over a trak or clip/piece of trak for item properties.
note also in item properties..semitone ..
ive used this to fix up the odd vocal note.
split the note then go to item properties.
(also check out reatune.))
3. what you call a region 3 parts for example of a trak.
eg verse chorus another verse etc. i cut up a trak like that.
i also do stuff like lets say a vocal word or phrase is used in verse 1,
and then the same phrase or word is used in verse 4..
but i dont like the one in verse 1 and want to use the one in verse 4..
then i cut the bad one n replace with the one copied from
verse 4. i did that with a word the other day.
use the waveform visual display to even out the trak.

really its best to just get stuck in..
cos theres a boatload of triks to find out.

heres an example without useing a plug in.
youve got a trak where the singer is up n down in vocal volume n the level
is low in some places n high in others.
split around the problem parts..and rather than boosting the low
parts higher...bring the high parts lower (mouse at top of clip..
n drag down),...then use overall trak volume to balance in the mix.

another example..lets say you have a really cool drum roll in one part of a drum
trak you would like to use elsewhere..you can do that.
just cut out the bad one you dislike n replace with a copy of the good one.
(on the good one right clik over it and select copy area).

if you do heavy editing of a trak/clean up like i sometimes do..
youll end up with of course lots of clips.
just lasoo all the clips to hilite , right clik ..
then select glue.

a important tip...really understand all the menu options when you
right clik over a trak or hilited split area of a trak.
all the best.

[Shan]

Being a 10+ year user of PT, I've been gradually setting up Reaper to mimic PT in areas including the editing. I've gotten it close, and even improved in spots. The port over has been quite a bit of work thus far but will help many of the PT veterans once done. Definitely go and vote for the following FR's:

http://forum.cockos.com/project.php?issueid=122

http://forum.cockos.com/project.php?issueid=1256

http://forum.cockos.com/project.php?issueid=892

Here are some old images of the menus I've been overhauling recently:





[img]http://img197.**************/img197/4883/mainfile.png [/img]



[img]http://img10.**************/img10/7030/viewrulers.png [/img]

I recently got the selecting to behave very similar to PT which has been quite a bit of work via a few scripts and actions etc.

Shane

[Shan]

Also, take advantage of Screen Sets and the SWS/Xenakios extensions to get some more of the PT functions and feel such as the SWS Track List etc:

http://www.standingwaterstudios.com/

[img]http://img24.**************/img24/4663/ptscreenset2.jpg[/img]

[img]http://img24.**************/img24/2015/ptscreenset.jpg[/img]

Shane

[Kitana_One]

OMFG!!!!

Reading your last two posts kick started a choir of fucking angels in my head!!!

A Track Show/Hide Bin and a Regions Bin was one of my first FR's for Reaper. I have no problem translating menu's, functions and etc between PT and Reaper... it's just a lack of certain features that I've been wanting.

Thank you for posting this!!!


Now I have to go and figure out how to install these scripts.

[manning1]

Shan
nice work mate..kudos.

[buckman]

Shan. Thanks for this I'm also in the pt boat.

But PLEASE tell me your theme that your using? Looks ace!

Where can I get it? What's it called!

Thanks

[Shan]

One big tip is to assign your PT shortcut "Command+Shift+N", which is used to create new tracks, and have it open the "Open Track Template" window instead. From here you can have the standard "PT style", Audio, MIDI, Aux, tracks etc ready to go.



Your I/O, monitor mode, MIDI settings, Tick/Sample based time, etc will be saved for the "track type" you'll be using it for:



Shane

[Shan]

Originally Posted by buckman

Shan. Thanks for this I'm also in the pt boat.

But PLEASE tell me your theme that your using? Looks ace!

Where can I get it? What's it called!

Thanks

At this point in time I'm still using the default REAPER theme. I've been overhauling the menus and shortcuts first. A definitive PT theme will be last.

Shane

[buckman]

Ok thanks. Look forward to that theme..

Looks a little like PT but is a very nice clear Reaper theme for working..

[Shan]

Originally Posted by buckman

Ok thanks. Look forward to that theme..

Quite a bit of work, but eventually it'll get there:





Shane

[buckman]

Thanks Shane look forward to it.

Will your theme include the previous screenshots of the "protools" style menus that you put side by side?

It almost looks like a new program/pro tools hybrid!

Can't wait

[Shan]

Originally Posted by buckman

...Will your theme include the previous screenshots of the "protools" style menus that you put side by side?

Yes.

Originally Posted by buckman

It almost looks like a new program/pro tools hybrid!

Rea Tools

Shane

[ankely]

Shan, you Rock !!!

[scottedog]

Originally Posted by ankely

Shan, you Rock !!!

Yes indeed. I'll second that.

[daverich]

Originally Posted by buckman

Shan. Thanks for this I'm also in the pt boat.

But PLEASE tell me your theme that your using? Looks ace!

Where can I get it? What's it called!

Thanks

it's the default reaper3 theme.

Kind regards

Dave Rich

[buckman]

Thanks but my default Reaper3 theme doesn't look like this?

[daverich]

Originally Posted by buckman

Thanks but my default Reaper3 theme doesn't look like this?

just use different colours for the mixer strips.

It's the same theme.

Kind regards

Dave Rich

[buckman]

Im a newbie but have tried to change the color strips and it doesnt come out like this?

Can you post an example?

Also Shan's theme has the Protools menu's etc which i believe are changed?

Thanks

[daverich]

Originally Posted by buckman

Im a newbie but have tried to change the color strips and it doesnt come out like this?

Can you post an example?

Also Shan's theme has the Protools menu's etc which i believe are changed?

Thanks

sorry,- I'm at home today, but it's pretty simple to do - try right clicking on them.

I believe the theme itself isn't out yet? (with the extra menu entries etc)

Kind regards

Dave Rich

[Shan]

Originally Posted by buckman

Im a newbie but have tried to change the color strips and it doesnt come out like this?

Can you post an example?

Also Shan's theme has the Protools menu's etc which i believe are changed?

Thanks

I slowly started creating the PT 8 theme in that last screen shot of the mixer above. I'm working on porting all the PT menus/functions/shortcuts first though. Many functions are done with scripts using AutoHotKey, which isn't cross platform unfortunately. Hopefully we can do this using Python or Pearl. At least my first Python script was a successful one...and cross platform

The theme and menu overhaul etc isn't out yet, but I have full intention on releasing it to help those of us being converted from the Pro Tools religion. Even the most simplest of menus can be quite the brain freeze challenge in spots.



Shane

[Shan]

Hardware I/O Inserts for our Digi hardware. Yay!




...and yes, full delay compensation, including a ping to compensate the hardware latency which PT HD doesn't even have.

Shane

[buckman]

This Theme and its layouts/menu's just keeps getting better!! Can't wait for this!

[Kainer]

Originally Posted by buckman

This Theme and its layouts/menu's just keeps getting better!! Can't wait for this!

Me too!
And some of the pro tools using guys around me as well!
Looks promising Shan!

[Vulkanizer]

Originally Posted by buckman

Im a newbie but have tried to change the color strips and it doesnt come out like this?

Can you post an example?

Also Shan's theme has the Protools menu's etc which i believe are changed?

Thanks

I think you might need to go to preferences>appearance and then check the box ib the top right corner ("tint track panel backgrounds") to allow for the whole panel to change color.

Cheers

[Shan]

PT 8 scrollbars in REAPER. As Phil Jackson would say, "Noyce". :



Shane

[fuseburn]

I'd like to advertise shamelessly for my #1 feature request which could be easily described with "ProTools style edit groups" - Just check the link in my signature !

Amazing how much work you guys put into mimicing PT in every aspect...SWS Tracklist is amazing, sure. But as an ex-PT-guy I'd already be fully satisfied to have edit groups ;-)

[Shan]

Originally Posted by fuseburn

I'd like to advertise shamelessly for my #1 feature request which could be easily described with "ProTools style edit groups" - Just check the link in my signature !

Amazing how much work you guys put into mimicing PT in every aspect...SWS Tracklist is amazing, sure. But as an ex-PT-guy I'd already be fully satisfied to have edit groups ;-)

Edit groups are pretty essential. I voted on that one long ago. Start voting for that FR Gents.

Shane

[The Spark]

Originally Posted by fuseburn

I'd like to advertise shamelessly for my #1 feature request which could be easily described with "ProTools style edit groups" - Just check the link in my signature !

Amazing how much work you guys put into mimicing PT in every aspect...SWS Tracklist is amazing, sure. But as an ex-PT-guy I'd already be fully satisfied to have edit groups ;-)

+1

I voted yes on this before, but it cant be stated enough.

[fuseburn]

Thank you guys ;-) ! Very appreciated.

[ChadB]

Sorry, I've been searching with no luck yet. How do you get the SWS Tracklist to show on the far left of the screen like it's docked (Shane's screen shot).