v6.73+dev0102 - January 2 2023

[vitalker]

Originally Posted by Mercado_Negro

This is exactly what I was suggesting because it doesn't make any sense to have two or more razor edit areas playing at the same time.

They make sense, but not in context of comping.

[IrishRover79]

something weird happening with the RE buttons

[PhelixK]

Originally Posted by IrishRover79

something weird happening with the RE buttons

– yeah, controls aren't scaled on mac/retina. Works fine in normal res. though.
Actions to move/copy-to-first are working too.

[_Stevie_]

Originally Posted by Gass n Klang

It's important being able to create multiple comps and to be able to comp from a comp.

And I have still a visual problem with lanes: If you got 50 takes (sounds much but it isn't, if you record song part after song part and wanna have a new lane per take...) you don't see anything, even at 100% zoom at my 34" 4k monitor. That's why I think lanes need to be on separate lane subtracks

Yep, that's a huge issue. In May 2022 I did some vocal recordings via the new lane feature. There were 16 takes on that track and it was absolutely impossible to see the waveforms of the single takes.

[luiza177]

Originally Posted by Odys

My suggestion:

Comping submode for fixed lanes


Comping lane always on top, markers don't disappear, select desired take with quick swap method with swipe or arrows from top track or individual takes


Comping versions and toggle between comping and editing. Edit, turn back to comping mode and select favorite.


Comping doesn't have just be to select best version of a take but also can be used as super-duper patchworking sound design tool. Edit, turn back to comping mode and select favorite.

I love this idea! +1

[Embass]

[BartR]

All of you guys, have an electronic microscope instead of normal eyes'pupils? :-D
May I hope in a more readable stuff ? :-D

[MonkeyBars]

Originally Posted by vitalker

[*]+ Undo: consolidate undo points when inserting multiple FX via action [t=274365]

Works perfectly now, thanks for the fix!

[Embass]

[Embass]

[Jae.Thomas]

Originally Posted by Mercado_Negro

This is great, schwa. I tested it a few minutes ago and it works nicely that way. Now, what I see that's counterproductive is having two or more razor edit areas on two or more different lanes playing at the same time like this:



I think only the latest created razor edit area should delete the previous and play.

WAIT WHAT? THIS LOOKS AWESOME!

[Mercado_Negro]

Originally Posted by vitalker

They make sense, but not in context of comping.

I think comping is the goal here, no?

[sockmonkey72]

Originally Posted by Mercado_Negro

I think comping is the goal here, no?

Comping is a goal, but not the only one, if Kenny's comments are to be taken at face value. Of course, he also said this, referring to comping implementations in other software:

Originally Posted by Kenny Gioia

Or maybe they're smart enough not to need to see other's sub-par work?

So maybe his comments aren't really meant be taken at face value.

[vitalker]

Originally Posted by Mercado_Negro

I think comping is the goal here, no?

May be one of many.

[Jae.Thomas]

I'm going to compare with what I remember of take markers, this has some obvious advantages for sure.

I am using these actions:

- Select Razor edit area and time (this makes it so it's looping a particular part to audition - it's very helpful and I would have had to make 2 actions before I think - split the item, then select time... now it's one action.

- Select Razor edit area ignoring snap

but is there a way to have Select Razor edit area and time ignoring snap? For fine tuned adjustments?

[schwa]

Originally Posted by Jae.Thomas

is there a way to have Select Razor edit area and time ignoring snap? For fine tuned adjustments?

By actions do you mean mouse modifiers? There is an arrange view right-drag modifier "select razor edit area and time ignoring snap".

[Thunderfinger]

Originally Posted by vitalker

[*]+ Media item lanes: add controls to razor edits on fixed lane tracks to move area without contents, copy contents to first playing lane

The new "copy area contents to first playing fixed lane" action is a great addition to my type of workflow. Copying to a specific lane allows for easy custom actions to repeat the same tasks quickly.

Request: Could we get a toggle to only display the soloed lane? When I'm done comping, I don't need to see all of the item lanes anymore, I only want to see my comp.

2nd request: Could we get actions to solo next/previous lane, and first/last lane? It would give more options to focus the correct lane in custom actions without having to click.

[IrishRover79]

Originally Posted by luiza177

I love this idea! +1

+1

Another advantage of this is that the take numbers stay aligned with the lane numbers.

[Jae.Thomas]

Originally Posted by schwa

By actions do you mean mouse modifiers? There is an arrange view right-drag modifier "select razor edit area and time ignoring snap".

I didnt see that in the left drag context!!! I apologize it's probably in another context. I will check again!

[Kenny Gioia]

Originally Posted by ferropop

...but currently there's no way to visualize WHERE the committed pieces came from, other than maybe color.

My feeling on it:

1. Many people don't care
2. Colors
3. Item name can be based on the track and lane it was recorded into
4. Choose the preference (doesn't exist yet) to cut when promoting a section so you always see the wholes created and know where it came from.

Are any of these perfect? No? Do they need to be? I don't know.

[Jae.Thomas]

I think it would be neat to have more indication of where it came from, but would it then complicate other usages of fixed lanes?

[vitalker]

Originally Posted by Jae.Thomas

I think it would be neat to have more indication of where it came from, but would it then complicate other usages of fixed lanes?

It could be an additional indicator on items with lane number. Like we have mute button, volume knob, fx button etc.

[Kenny Gioia]

Originally Posted by ferropop

Given that there's nothing concretely special about the Top Lane or the Currently Playing lane, it just feels dangerous to be able to "commit" to these two arbitrary options.

I disagree. If you want your Top Lane to be the comp, there's nothing arbitrary about it. Or if you've chosen to make another lane your comp, you can do this as well.

[Kenny Gioia]

Originally Posted by vitalker

I fully disagree. If you want one area, you draw one area. If you want to hear multiple lanes, you draw more areas.

I agree. And most people will be drawing one area at time anyway. Draw, promote, move on.

[Kenny Gioia]

Originally Posted by Vagelis

Thanks for this but i feel it's a half baked feature. Can you please give us the same functionality with previous markers where everything outside them was muted but for razor edits in lanes?

I have a couple of items in lanes and i choose some parts of it. When it's playing the parts without razor edits i can hear all items in lanes which is not very relative to comping.

I think you already have this if you don't solo any lanes.

[Vagelis]

Originally Posted by Kenny Gioia

My feeling on it:

1. Many people don't care
2. Colors
3. Item name can be based on the track and lane it was recorded into
4. Choose the preference (doesn't exist yet) to cut when promoting a section so you always see the wholes created and know where it came from.

Are any of these perfect? No? Do they need to be? I don't know.

Imo it's nice know from where your comps came from in case you want to re-comp other parts and not the same. Using REs for comping can't do it since they never stay visible when we edit something and they have some more disadvantages as i mentioned earlier.

[schwa]

Originally Posted by Gass n Klang

And I have still a visual problem with lanes: If you got 50 takes (sounds much but it isn't, if you record song part after song part and wanna have a new lane per take...) you don't see anything

The visibility issue with a high number of lanes is something we plan to address, but that's a few more steps down the road.

[Kenny Gioia]

Originally Posted by Triode

I'm open to other options if they occur but a "special status comping lane" could be limiting in other ways depending on how it's implemented.

I agree. It's most flexible without a special lane.

[Gass n Klang]

Originally Posted by Kenny Gioia

My feeling on it:

1. Many people don't care
2. Colors
3. Item name can be based on the track and lane it was recorded into
4. Choose the preference (doesn't exist yet) to cut when promoting a section so you always see the wholes created and know where it came from.

Are any of these perfect? No? Do they need to be? I don't know.

1. Many people don't work with professional clients. It's absolutly common to have somebody sitting in the room for the final cut who is commenting like: "I liked that phrase more in the previous version you sent me". So you always and instantly need to know, which takes you're cutting. Directly.
2. not reliable, as they can be changed too easily without recognizing
3. yes, that's an opportunity, but then lanes always should keep their names. If you delete lane 5, because something went completely wrong, then take 6 should stay on lane 6. This is how pro tools does it. Each playlist gets a new name (track name + incrementing number) and keeps it, no matter what. If you record 5 guitar takes and 7 drum takes and then do a take together, it's playlist 8 for both instruments. SO HELPFUL, especially if tutti takes get the same color.!!!
4. not helpful, in all professional contexts I know, it's crucial to have the rough material untouched. ("can we listen to take 3 again...")

[Kenny Gioia]

Originally Posted by Vagelis

Imo it's nice know from where your comps came from in case you want to re-comp other parts and not the same.

Which is why I suggested:

4. Choose the preference (doesn't exist yet) to cut instead of copy when promoting a section so you always see the holes created and know where it came from.

This is how I've always done it to get doubles and triples of a vocal. I would cut where it came from so I couldn't accidently choose that phrase again as a re-comp or a double or triple.

[tonalstates]

Originally Posted by Gass n Klang

1. Many people don't work with professional clients. It's absolutly common to have somebody sitting in the room for the final cut who is commenting like: "I liked that phrase more in the previous version you sent me". So you always and instantly need to know, which takes you're cutting. Directly.
2. not reliable, as they can be changed too easily without recognizing
3. yes, that's an opportunity, but then lanes always should keep their names. If you delete lane 5, because something went completely wrong, then take 6 should stay on lane 6. This is how pro tools does it. Each playlist gets a new name (track name + incrementing number) and keeps it, no matter what. If you record 5 guitar takes and 7 drum takes and then do a take together, it's playlist 8 for both instruments. SO HELPFUL, especially if tutti takes get the same color.!!!
4. not helpful, in all professional contexts I know, it's crucial to have the rough material untouched. ("can we listen to take 3 again...")

Agreed

[Gass n Klang]

Originally Posted by schwa

The visibility issue with a high number of lanes is something we plan to address, but that's a few more steps down the road.

good to know, thanks! please keep in mind, that just showing only one lane at a time doesn't really solve the problem. I think it's undispensable to be able to see which takes cover which parts of a song at a glance. If a recording session is running out of time, you need to have an overview, how much material you recorded for every part.

[Kenny Gioia]

Originally Posted by Gass n Klang

1. Many people don't work with professional clients. It's absolutly common to have somebody sitting in the room for the final cut who is commenting like: "I liked that phrase more in the previous version you sent me". So you always and instantly need to know, which takes you're cutting. Directly.

Correct. And that is my point. Many people won't care. But some will.

Originally Posted by Gass n Klang

2. not reliable, as they can be changed too easily without recognizing

Fair.

Originally Posted by Gass n Klang

3. yes, that's an opportunity, but then lanes always should keep their names. If you delete lane 5, because something went completely wrong, then take 6 should stay on lane 6. This is how pro tools does it. Each playlist gets a new name (track name + incrementing number) and keeps it, no matter what. If you record 5 guitar takes and 7 drum takes and then do a take together, it's playlist 8 for both instruments. SO HELPFUL, especially if tutti takes get the same color.!!!

Good point. Maybe as lanes are created they always keep their names. So if you delete lane 3, you now have lane 1,2 and 4. And no 3.

Originally Posted by Gass n Klang

4. not helpful, in all professional contexts I know, it's crucial to have the rough material untouched. ("can we listen to take 3 again...")

Well… I have been doing it professionally this way for 30 years. So… But your point is still valid.

Thanks

[musicbynumbers]

Originally Posted by Kenny Gioia

I agree. And most people will be drawing one area at time anyway. Draw, promote, move on.

I like the idea that you can do multiple razor selections in various lanes to try out those areas for a take and then maybe you can then promote them all at once.

What about the idea that the lane we set to record to is the lane they get promoted to?

That way we could easily create alternate comps this way.

[Jae.Thomas]

Originally Posted by schwa

By actions do you mean mouse modifiers? There is an arrange view right-drag modifier "select razor edit area and time ignoring snap".

I'm using the media item modifiers... bottom half. Let me see how the arrange thing works.

[Kenny Gioia]

Originally Posted by musicbynumbers

I like the idea that you can do multiple razor selections in various lanes to try out those areas for a take and then maybe you can then promote them all at once.

That makes some sense the more I think about it but it does present some limitations.

For instance, there are actions to move razor edits up/down one lane at a time. They would be useless. You would have to use the buttons in the razor edit.

Originally Posted by musicbynumbers

What about the idea that the lane we set to record to is the lane they get promoted to?

What's wrong with having them go to the currently soloed lane?

[Gass n Klang]

Originally Posted by Kenny Gioia

Good point. Maybe as lanes are created they always keep their names. So if you delete lane 3, you now have lane 1,2 and 4. And no 3.

yes, that could be an option. If you delete 3 and create a new one it should be 5.

[Gass n Klang]

Originally Posted by Kenny Gioia

Well… I have been doing it professionally this way for 30 years. So… But your point is still valid.

I know, but everybody has different clients

[Jae.Thomas]

is it the expected behavior that when you click the box in the middle of the razor edit preview it does not create a new lane in which to put that segment?

[BartR]

Originally Posted by vitalker

+ Windows: reduce flicker in actions window

This worked. Thanks a zillion