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09-12-2016, 02:49 PM
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#161
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by suleiman
Only the version called MegaReaper Drumkit has 127 velocity layers and 2 to 4 round robins, with the wav files being multichannel.
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Hi,
it looks and sounds awesome! However I would be grateful if you could make at least some short video on this. I guess there are people as me who has just started with midi/samples etc. Seeing '127 velocity layers', '2 to 4' round robin I think it must be something I will for sure skip/ not utilize (not take advantage). How to handle with such kind of package? So far I clicked "play/space", I see in one track there is sequencer and there I can map what is played and where. Is it your idea on how to handle when you are in front of your idea to compose a song?
Anyway, I am looking forward you make some video
Thank you! I guess big effort!
Kind regards
tom.kw
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09-12-2016, 03:00 PM
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#162
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: The Reflection Free Zone
Posts: 3,026
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Something like that Tod, yes. Given the current limitations of RS5K I don't know what could be achieved at the moment.
I was inspired by Scotts recording of his kit, and would like to record a fairly wide dynamic range (say 8-16 velocity layers). Also for max fidelity would sample each of the 5 strings to at least the 15th fret. Then maybe 2-3 round robins too. I think I would just use 'i' finger articulation throughout. Aparently Jamerson played 90% of notes with just 'i'.
The tricky problem is that a bass will need loop points for sustained notes for all of those 5*15*16 = 1200 samples (or 2400 or 3600 for 2-3 round-robin) and that is one hell of an editing job. The alternatives are each sample is 5 seconds long (way too big a recording I think) or just 5*15 'long notes' choosable by keyswitch or channel.
If RS5K got dtd streaming plus the extra tabs and tables that would allow channel routing and round-robin in the one instance then it could be done. But a big job.
I don't know anything much about Kontakt scripting except that it seems like anything is possible. But again big job if setting up loop points for more than a thousand samples.
I would record uncompressed or EQ'd DI signal for the two pickups. Carefully tuned and graded dynamics.
Last edited by hamish; 09-12-2016 at 03:05 PM.
Reason: proofed
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09-12-2016, 03:55 PM
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#163
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: St George, UT _ USA
Posts: 2,881
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Not surprisingly confused a bit here. Downloaded Tod's Kontakt files, but trying to avoid much time/effort without knowing what to expect.
Have Addictive Drums2 _w/several adPaks;_ Stylus RMx _ w/ton of 3rd-Party RMX loops, Jamstix3 _ w/all add-ons, NI Komplete 10 Ultimate _ w/ Abbey Road 50s, 60s, 70s, et al.
Got message re. preferences for 'preferred' results posted here.
Am I advised to proceed and test results throughly, or is this aimed mainly for those not using purchased Drum Library VSTi like those listed ??
Boring repeat _ but pianist/keyboardist wanting solid drum tracks when needed ...
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09-12-2016, 04:53 PM
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#164
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Kalispell
Posts: 14,745
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hamish
Something like that Tod, yes. Given the current limitations of RS5K I don't know what could be achieved at the moment.
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Hi Hamish, you've got some good ideas here. May I suggest we don't let the limitations of RS5K influence us right now, there is a much better format that is free. There is the TX16Wx, but it doesn't have DFD either so is rather RAM heavie. But there is Sforzando, which does DFD and is also free. Suleiman mentioned DSmolken, he did a great job programming SMDrums in Sforzando, I was impressed.
Quote:
I was inspired by Scotts recording of his kit, and would like to record a fairly wide dynamic range (say 8-16 velocity layers). Also for max fidelity would sample each of the 5 strings to at least the 15th fret. Then maybe 2-3 round robins too. I think I would just use 'i' finger articulation throughout. Aparently Jamerson played 90% of notes with just 'i'.
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I can tell you've thought about this quite a bit. Of course the more velocity layers the better, but there does come the point of no returns. Here again Hamish, it would be something for you to determine. There are several factors concerning Velocity levels, especially the way the various sample players respond to them. Of course Kontakt does a great job of dealing with this. RS5K less so, but it does have a Velocity Intensity setting, but you do have to get the levels of the rendered sample velocity layers, set up right to work with it. But this is all done in the final sample rendering phase.
Concerning Round Robins, we found with our test with SMDrums that odd numbered RRs work better than even numbered RRs.
Quote:
The tricky problem is that a bass will need loop points for sustained notes for all of those 5*15*16 = 1200 samples (or 2400 or 3600 for 2-3 round-robin) and that is one hell of an editing job. The alternatives are each sample is 5 seconds long (way too big a recording I think) or just 5*15 'long notes' choosable by keyswitch or channel.
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This can be tricky, but with Kontakt we can have one main group of samples that are the sustaining samples. Then we can have 3, 5, etc., attack samples that are set up in RRs. This can work well for giving you the different RRS. I'm not sure what the other formats can do.
Quote:
I don't know anything much about Kontakt scripting except that it seems like anything is possible. But again big job if setting up loop points for more than a thousand samples.
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There are many things that can be done with Kontakt scripting, but for the sake of everyone, that probably shouldn't be a priority. With Kontakt I can kind of get the sound of sliding across fretts to a particular note. It's not perfect but it sort of works.
Quote:
I would record uncompressed or EQ'd DI signal for the two pickups. Carefully tuned and graded dynamics.
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That sound good Hamish.
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09-12-2016, 04:53 PM
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#165
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Mortal
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Wickenburg, Arizona
Posts: 14,047
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I'm ostensibly making trigger instruments out of this, but I'm having too much fun auditioning the samples
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09-12-2016, 05:15 PM
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#166
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Mortal
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Wickenburg, Arizona
Posts: 14,047
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Slate instrument editor GUI epic fail This is going to take a while
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09-12-2016, 06:16 PM
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#167
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Kalispell
Posts: 14,745
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pipelineaudio
Slate instrument editor GUI epic fail This is going to take a while
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Hey Pipe, what are you trying to do, load SMDrums into the Slate player?
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09-12-2016, 06:16 PM
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#168
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 5,646
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pipelineaudio
Slate instrument editor GUI epic fail This is going to take a while
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does it not automap browsed or drag/dropped samples as per name / rms ?
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09-12-2016, 06:24 PM
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#169
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 5,646
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tod
Hey Pipe, what are you trying to do, load SMDrums into the Slate player?
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he is trying to make a trigger instrument out of the wav files
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Salamat
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09-12-2016, 06:40 PM
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#170
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 5,646
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@ hamish & tod : 3600 samples editing = no problem ...thanks to all of Tod's mentoring. Reaper does that stuff like nobody's business
also DI is a good option in my opinion.
the best way to go about it would probably be by doing up and down runs at 4 to 5 dynamic levels. So that would be at least 2 up and down runs for each approximate dynamic level across all the notes. That would provide at least 4 round robins.
And I would say let each note ring out for at least 6 to 7 seconds.
opinions / feedback.
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09-12-2016, 06:59 PM
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#171
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Kalispell
Posts: 14,745
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As far as making loops, that's possible, but bass samples might be a little more difficult than orchestra samples.
However, in case you missed this:
https://youtu.be/gup0XcNapmI
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09-12-2016, 07:11 PM
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#172
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 5,646
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sostenuto
Not surprisingly confused a bit here. Downloaded Tod's Kontakt files, but trying to avoid much time/effort without knowing what to expect.
Have Addictive Drums2 _w/several adPaks;_ Stylus RMx _ w/ton of 3rd-Party RMX loops, Jamstix3 _ w/all add-ons, NI Komplete 10 Ultimate _ w/ Abbey Road 50s, 60s, 70s, et al.
Got message re. preferences for 'preferred' results posted here.
Am I advised to proceed and test results throughly, or is this aimed mainly for those not using purchased Drum Library VSTi like those listed ??
Boring repeat _ but pianist/keyboardist wanting solid drum tracks when needed ...
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if you are a drum obsessive (and given your purchases, lets face it, you are) this is a great kit to have for free. the kit, the sounds, the depth of sampling make sure that it works really well for more dynamic forms of music (NOT suitable for modern metal for eg).
having said that, you already have drums coming out of your ears, so do you really need another one ? your call
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09-12-2016, 07:29 PM
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#173
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 5,646
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tod
As far as making loops, that's possible, but bass samples might be a little more difficult than orchestra samples.
However, in case you missed this:
https://youtu.be/gup0XcNapmI
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one other option would be to make straight loops, of hamish playing straight 8ths or 16ths for each note and then make rex files out of it. i use the "big bad bass" rex set toolbox folder a lot in my own stuff, and it sound phenomenal.
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09-12-2016, 08:02 PM
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#174
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: St George, UT _ USA
Posts: 2,881
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Quote:
Originally Posted by suleiman
if you are a drum obsessive (and given your purchases, lets face it, you are) this is a great kit to have for free. the kit, the sounds, the depth of sampling make sure that it works really well for more dynamic forms of music (NOT suitable for modern metal for eg).
having said that, you already have drums coming out of your ears, so do you really need another one ? your call
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Thank-you much after you factoring in what I already use. Have read the Thread and merits of this Library got my attention. It's donwloaded so will spend some time.
Subtle point like 'NOT modern metal' is cool to hear as that base is covered with XLN stuff.
Regards
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09-12-2016, 10:04 PM
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#175
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Mortal
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Wickenburg, Arizona
Posts: 14,047
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Quote:
Originally Posted by suleiman
does it not automap browsed or drag/dropped samples as per name / rms ?
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It assumes the lowest number is the highest velocity...I think I can do it with autorename plus though
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09-12-2016, 10:27 PM
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#176
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: The Reflection Free Zone
Posts: 3,026
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Some good ideas on creating a bass instrument there. I tried a couple of D Smolkens basses in sforzando and really they were underwhelming for me.
Rex idea is good. Likewise Tod, I think what you were saying re a single sustain layer plus say 5 attack layers x 3 round robin would be a very good approach for size vs sonic usefulness.
We should probably take this to another thread, or email. Also I'm in the process of moveing and a new job, so the next 3-4 weeks may be difficult. Still I think something can happen over October.
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09-13-2016, 07:08 AM
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#178
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Sep 2016
Posts: 6
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Midi Note Names
Quote:
Originally Posted by GrooveMonkee
Fantastic job Suleiman! Very impressive work! It's it's really great that you posted the kits for free.
If anyone is wondering about note name file location, on my PC the note name files go here:
C:\Users\User_Name\AppData\Roaming\REAPER\MIDINote Names
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Russ, Suleiman - In the Megababy Sequencer, I couldn't get the Mega Repaer Drums note name file to appear in the drop down menu ("Drum Map Note Names") using the above path - C:\Users\User_Name\AppData\Roaming\REAPER\MIDINote Names
But I DID get it to be visible in the drop down menu by putting it in :
C:\Users\User_Name\AppData\Roaming\REAPER\Data\seq baby_data
BUT, even when I selected it in the dropdown menu, the note names didn't change (just remained C1, C #1, ... etc.) rather than the drum names. So, I am confused.
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09-13-2016, 04:09 PM
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#179
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 5,646
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ldetlefs
Russ, Suleiman - In the Megababy Sequencer, I couldn't get the Mega Repaer Drums note name file to appear in the drop down menu ("Drum Map Note Names") using the above path - C:\Users\User_Name\AppData\Roaming\REAPER\MIDINote Names
But I DID get it to be visible in the drop down menu by putting it in :
C:\Users\User_Name\AppData\Roaming\REAPER\Data\seq baby_data
BUT, even when I selected it in the dropdown menu, the note names didn't change (just remained C1, C #1, ... etc.) rather than the drum names. So, I am confused.
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I will check and get back to you. I myself am lost after losing my last machine. I tended to set up and forget, but now i must remember .......curse ye THC !
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09-13-2016, 05:44 PM
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#180
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Nashville TN
Posts: 9
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Sorry but I was referring to the midi editor aka "piano roll" editor, not the sequencer. I don't know anything about the sequencer, sorry.
__________________
Regards,
Russ
groovemonkee.com
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09-13-2016, 05:49 PM
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#181
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Nashville TN
Posts: 9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by suleiman
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Cool! Happy to contribute to the cause!
__________________
Regards,
Russ
groovemonkee.com
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09-14-2016, 02:26 AM
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#182
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Mortal
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Wickenburg, Arizona
Posts: 14,047
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Jeez even with rename this TCI Editor is the pits...gonna rethink this
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09-14-2016, 09:37 PM
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#183
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 5,646
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could someone please link the txt files for note names shared on the original megababy sequencer thread, and also which folder to put them in the resource path ?
also, kids : dont do drugs.
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09-16-2016, 06:17 AM
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#184
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Nashville TN
Posts: 9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by suleiman
could someone please link the txt files for note names shared on the original megababy sequencer thread, and also which folder to put them in the resource path ?
also, kids : dont do drugs.
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Hey Suleiman...I can re-arrange the note name files I created (maybe you want them in reverse order?). Let me know....
__________________
Regards,
Russ
groovemonkee.com
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09-16-2016, 07:39 AM
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#185
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 5,646
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GrooveMonkee
Hey Suleiman...I can re-arrange the note name files I created (maybe you want them in reverse order?). Let me know....
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thanks Russ ! I was talking about the note name txt files for a native reaper plugin called the megababy sequencer. someone shared 60 note name maps for battery kits....
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09-16-2016, 08:06 AM
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#186
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Kalispell
Posts: 14,745
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Quote:
Originally Posted by suleiman
could someone please link the txt files for note names shared on the original megababy sequencer thread, and also which folder to put them in the resource path ?
also, kids : dont do drugs.
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Check your email..
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09-16-2016, 07:20 PM
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#187
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 5,646
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tod
Check your email..
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Obliged !! Thanks....
can you also tell which folder in the resource path should i put them in for them to show up in reaper's megasequencer ?
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09-16-2016, 08:49 PM
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#188
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Kalispell
Posts: 14,745
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Quote:
Originally Posted by suleiman
Obliged !! Thanks....
can you also tell which folder in the resource path should i put them in for them to show up in reaper's megasequencer ?
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Well the Note names folder is where ever you create it so it can be anywhere. I use portable installs, so I just create a folder called "Note Names" in the main install folder. Actually I call it 01_Note_Names so that it will be at the top.
It don't even have to be in your resource folder, but I think that's where Reaper will look for it to start with.
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09-17-2016, 07:15 PM
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#189
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 5,646
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Found it !!
For the megababy sequencer (excellent for drums) , the note names go in :
REAPER_resource_path/Data/seqbaby_data...if you explore that folder you will find a txt file called default kit which also shows how to make it for your kits.
And this has the battery 3/4 kits note names (ignore everything except the seq baby folder, as the plugin is included in the reaper installer anyways).
https://stash.reaper.fm/18598/sequencer_baby_v2_jnif.zip
and this is that awesome piece of code in action lest ye forget
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09-25-2016, 08:51 PM
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#190
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Sep 2016
Posts: 6
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Pattern Device
Is this kit something that I could use a pattern device with, rather than inputting with a keyboard or clicking on the midi squares? The MegaReaper is not technically a drum machine, right? Or is it?
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09-26-2016, 07:45 AM
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#191
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Kalispell
Posts: 14,745
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ldetlefs
Is this kit something that I could use a pattern device with, rather than inputting with a keyboard or clicking on the midi squares? The MegaReaper is not technically a drum machine, right? Or is it?
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No, since it uses multi channel audio files, it can only be used with ReaSamploMatic.
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09-27-2016, 01:10 AM
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#192
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 5,646
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ldetlefs
Is this kit something that I could use a pattern device with, rather than inputting with a keyboard or clicking on the midi squares? The MegaReaper is not technically a drum machine, right? Or is it?
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Since it uses the native reaper sequencer plugin "megababy", you can program pattern in and trigger them.
also, you can use it with ANY software or hardware that can send MIDI to it, so technically ANY pattern device worth its salt would be compatible with it.
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11-22-2016, 08:59 AM
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#193
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 34
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Hello Tod,
Thank you for your work. It adds a lot of realism to programmed drums.
I have several questions about the hihat folder, how they were recorded. Pardon me but I'm not a drummer, and I'm trying to understand how a pedal work.
Does 'Hat tight' mean it was recorded with the tip of the stick ?
Does 'Hat loose' mean it was recorded with the shoulder of the stick ?
Does 'Hat open' mean it was recorded fully open ?
Does 'Hat closed-open' refer to how hard the foot press the pedal to switch from closed to open ?
Does 'Hat foot' refer to the sound created when switching from open to closed ?
I don't get this one :'Hat foot open'
Thank you Tod
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11-22-2016, 12:55 PM
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#194
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Kalispell
Posts: 14,745
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deeruss
Hello Tod,
Thank you for your work. It adds a lot of realism to programmed drums.
I have several questions about the hihat folder, how they were recorded. Pardon me but I'm not a drummer, and I'm trying to understand how a pedal work.
Does 'Hat tight' mean it was recorded with the tip of the stick ?
Does 'Hat loose' mean it was recorded with the shoulder of the stick ?
Does 'Hat open' mean it was recorded fully open ?
Does 'Hat closed-open' refer to how hard the foot press the pedal to switch from closed to open ?
Does 'Hat foot' refer to the sound created when switching from open to closed ?
I don't get this one :'Hat foot open'
Thank you Tod
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You're most welcome deeruss.
'Hat tight': In this case it's the hat closed fairly tightly and hit with the tip of the stick. In our next library we will also have the stick hitting the edge.
'Hat loose': This is where the hat is partially closed, and in this case I think SMM used the tip of the stick. Here again, in our next library we will have more variations of this.
'Hat open': This is just like it says, the hat is completely open, pedal is up, and in this case hit with the tip of the stick.
'Hat closed-open': Yes, I think the pedal is open, then closed and opened. I really like this one, it can be used in a few various ways, especially with the "Hat foot".
'Hat foot': The hat is open and then closed fairly tightly.
Quote:
I don't get this one :'Hat foot open'
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Maybe SMM can better explain this one, but I think he hit the hat with the tip and opened it at the same time. Hopefully SMM will see this and pop in here.
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11-22-2016, 11:50 PM
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#195
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 261
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tod
I don't get this one :'Hat foot open'
Maybe SMM can better explain this one, but I think he hit the hat with the tip and opened it at the same time. Hopefully SMM will see this and pop in here.
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All samples that used a drumstick were recorded by hitting
the hi-hat with the tip of the stick.
The "hat foot open" is most likely the samples that were recorded
by striking the hat with the tip of the stick as it opened. I think
that you are correct about that Tod. I had made a few of those to
keep things sounding real when programmed.
Side note:
Tod is correct when he said that there will be more Hi-Hat variations
recorded for our next batch of samples. These will be included in
the next drum sample project.
We do have plans to create a brand new drum sample project.
All drums and cymbals will be recorded using new and improved
studio techniques, new microphone placements, and new tuning for
the future project.
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11-23-2016, 01:32 AM
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#196
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 5,646
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And more late hours on the machine while the wife grumbles....
Looking forward to it SMM!
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11-23-2016, 04:10 AM
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#197
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 34
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A huge thank you Tod & SMM, it's clearer now.
Fantastic work.
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02-21-2017, 12:19 PM
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#198
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 2
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Hi Guys. First of all, this is my first post in here, so hello to all!
Thanks for SMDrums Team. Samples sound truly amazing. And the fact that it's free - completly amazing. Great job!
I have one question though - I'm using sforzando version with reaper. It works great but i have one problem: it sounds like loose hihat is playing only with one velocity or with one sample. There is no audible (for me at least) difference between notes played with different velocity. I checked files on disk and they're all there.
Can you help?
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02-21-2017, 01:07 PM
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#199
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 1,429
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Opening up the loosehat mapping it looks like the lovel entries are missing for all the regions.
I'm sure the great SM guys will jump in and fix it.
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02-22-2017, 04:21 AM
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#200
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 1,429
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Goldreap
Opening up the loosehat mapping it looks like the lovel entries are missing for all the regions.
I'm sure the great SM guys will jump in and fix it.
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Actually I might have a go at fixing it myself.
Tod, would it be a matter of manually editing the mapping file, entering all the lovel values (using one of the other working mappings as a guide to the structure)? I could then PM it to you for testing?
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