Old 01-04-2020, 01:11 PM   #1
dupont
Human being with feelings
 
dupont's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: France
Posts: 719
Default Stuck MIDI notes

Another plugin with stuck note issue in Reaper 6 : Zebra 2.5
OSX El Capitan.

I'm fed up with this issue.
dupont is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2020, 01:18 PM   #2
dadada
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 78
Default Same here

For me it is not related to Zebra, happens with Arturia Fragments but also Kontakt.
Happens in current Reaper 6.03, has been happening with 5.X as well.
0sx 10.14.6
Different VST versions, I also run another machine with 10.15, same issues.

Sometimes happens, sometimes doesnt.
Tried all the tricks in other threads on this forum.
dadada is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2020, 01:24 PM   #3
Rangler
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: May 2016
Posts: 547
Default

Happens randomly for me as well.
__________________
MacBook Pro; Late 2016, 16 GB
Rangler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2020, 02:41 PM   #4
Dstruct
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 12,335
Default

I also have stuck notes sometimes shortly after arming a track for the first time and playing notes on my MIDI keyboard. After that it's ok most of the time (REAPER 6.03/x64 + Surge 1.6.4.1)
Dstruct is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-02-2020, 05:14 AM   #5
dadada
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 78
Default

Are developers aware of these issues? For anyone working on complex midi arrangements this is extremely frustrating....

Can looking into this be a priority for the next update?
It makes Reaper almost unusable for music involving MIDI/VSTis.
dadada is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-02-2020, 07:52 AM   #6
Janne83
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Earth
Posts: 1,838
Default

I reported a similar issue not so long ago:

https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=230632

Flush Fx on stop in prefrences/playback does help a bit but but doesnt completely solve the issue. My most problematic vsti is u-he Hive and also others
__________________
Win10, R 64bit
Janne83 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-02-2020, 11:18 AM   #7
dupont
Human being with feelings
 
dupont's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: France
Posts: 719
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by dadada View Post
Are developers aware of these issues? For anyone working on complex midi arrangements this is extremely frustrating....

Can looking into this be a priority for the next update?
It makes Reaper almost unusable for music involving MIDI/VSTis.
reported many times !
dupont is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-02-2020, 11:19 AM   #8
dupont
Human being with feelings
 
dupont's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: France
Posts: 719
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by dadada View Post
For me it is not related to Zebra, happens with Arturia Fragments but also Kontakt.
Happens in current Reaper 6.03, has been happening with 5.X as well.
0sx 10.14.6
Different VST versions, I also run another machine with 10.15, same issues.

Sometimes happens, sometimes doesnt.
Tried all the tricks in other threads on this forum.
do you mean Arturia Pigment ?
dupont is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-02-2020, 11:37 PM   #9
lolilol1975
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 1,598
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by dadada View Post
Are developers aware of these issues? For anyone working on complex midi arrangements this is extremely frustrating....

Can looking into this be a priority for the next update?
It makes Reaper almost unusable for music involving MIDI/VSTis.
Just FYI, I had (a long time ago) stuck notes with malformed MIDI files, in particular when several MIDI events were overlapping, aka when, on the same note, there was a MIDI event that was starting when the previous one wasn't finished.

Nothing prevents MIDI files to contain overlapping events. In particular, I've had files downloaded from popular sites that had them and these files would lead to stuck notes (sometimes, one MIDI event could hide completely another one, leading to the sequence ON ON OFF OFF; in the MIDI editor, though, you see only one note, as the other one is hidden under it). Once I removed the overlapping notes, it solved the issue in my case.

According to a post I read, Reaper automatically merges overlapping events. I don't know if this is true. If it is, either it doesn't do a good work at it, or it is relatively new, because when I had the problem, it clearly wasn't doing it. I don't know if Reaper also deals with the case ON ON OFF OFF. What I've read though leads me to think that overlapping events is a widespread problem that isn't unique to Reaper, and that some VSTi don't deal correctly with overlapping events too. The MIDI spec is unclear what to do in that case, so implementers are left guessing what to do in those cases, so it's best to avoid overlapping events altogether.
https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=517522

Interestingly, I've read in the Cakewalk forum that "While that is true about Note ON/OFF, Sonar internally does not store Notes that way. It stores "Note + duration" instead. That way it is technically impossible copy "Note ON" separately."

That is a good way to solve the stuck notes issue, but it means Sonar has to analyze the entire MIDI file before playing it (which shouldn't be too much of a problem), and also it cannot do that whith live recording since you don't know in advance the duration of a note while recording it.

Last edited by lolilol1975; 02-03-2020 at 12:00 AM.
lolilol1975 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2020, 12:06 AM   #10
lolilol1975
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 1,598
Default

Also https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewt...86316#p6986316
lolilol1975 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2020, 04:22 AM   #11
dadada
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 78
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by dupont View Post
do you mean Arturia Pigment ?
Sorry, yes that is one candidate but it happens with many others.
dadada is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2020, 03:08 AM   #12
Dstruct
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 12,335
Default

I see a CC64 Hold Pedal message being sent in my case. Weird, since I don't have any hold pedals connected. Maybe my MIDI keyboard is faulty ...

Last edited by Dstruct; 02-12-2020 at 03:18 AM.
Dstruct is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-2020, 10:52 AM   #13
BirdBird
Human being with feelings
 
BirdBird's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2019
Posts: 133
Default

Bump, I still keep getting this with multiple plugins and have no idea what is causing it. It is incredibly frustrating. I only get this bug in REAPER, nothing else does this.
BirdBird is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-2020, 01:20 AM   #14
Janne83
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Earth
Posts: 1,838
Default

Still having issues here also. But now with the latest releases even the note off command (F3) doesnt stop the stuck notes.(specially with Hive and Pigments). Still erratic(not always) when I move notes ,change the tempo, preview MIDI from Media explorer.
The only option to stop them is to put vsti offline or restart.
__________________
Win10, R 64bit
Janne83 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-2020, 06:06 AM   #15
BirdBird
Human being with feelings
 
BirdBird's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2019
Posts: 133
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Janne83 View Post
Still having issues here also. But now with the latest releases even the note off command (F3) doesnt stop the stuck notes.(specially with Hive and Pigments). Still erratic(not always) when I move notes ,change the tempo, preview MIDI from Media explorer.
The only option to stop them is to put vsti offline or restart.
Same here, the only way I can manage to get rid of it with certain plugins is setting them offline and online or restarting.
BirdBird is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-2020, 06:50 AM   #16
vanhaze
Human being with feelings
 
vanhaze's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Netherlands
Posts: 4,932
Default

Same here:

Stuck notes with many, and i mean:many, thirdparty instrument plugins.
All Notes OFF command doesn't work for me fullproof.

In the more than 10 years i am using Reaper, this big issue has never been solved in my case.

The many other DAW's i use totally don't suffer from notes hanging with the same instrument plugins.

Grrrrr.....
__________________
Reaper - OSX (always latest version)
OSX Catalina (always latest version)
My Reaper Tips&Tricks: https://www.youtube.com/user/vanhaze2000/playlists
vanhaze is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-29-2020, 10:43 AM   #17
dupont
Human being with feelings
 
dupont's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: France
Posts: 719
Default

Issue still here and happened again this morning with Tyrell N6, Spire and Zebra.
F3 and stop playback does not stop the stuck note any more.
Sometimes the note stops playing when I hit a key on the midi keyboard, I think the key that made the note stuck at first.

Frustrating.
dupont is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-29-2020, 11:59 AM   #18
vanhaze
Human being with feelings
 
vanhaze's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Netherlands
Posts: 4,932
Default

I hear ya.
The very same in my situation.
Reaper is amazing but the note hang issue i experience for so much years now makes me really sad and frustrated.

Logic, Live, Studio One, Bitwig: in all these DAW's i do not suffer from any note hanging when using many thirdparty instrument plugins, while these same plugins all give note hangs in Reaper.

Unbelievable..
__________________
Reaper - OSX (always latest version)
OSX Catalina (always latest version)
My Reaper Tips&Tricks: https://www.youtube.com/user/vanhaze2000/playlists
vanhaze is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-29-2020, 12:45 PM   #19
STOP
Human being with feelings
 
STOP's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Québec
Posts: 44
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by dupont View Post
Sometimes the note stops playing when I hit a key on the midi keyboard, I think the key that made the note stuck at first.

Frustrating.
Same here, I have to hit all keys until I find the stuck key.
STOP is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 02-29-2020, 01:09 PM   #20
vanhaze
Human being with feelings
 
vanhaze's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Netherlands
Posts: 4,932
Default

That's Annoying 10.0.
#pity

Cockos should make fixing this everlasting note hang problem their top priority number 1.
__________________
Reaper - OSX (always latest version)
OSX Catalina (always latest version)
My Reaper Tips&Tricks: https://www.youtube.com/user/vanhaze2000/playlists
vanhaze is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-01-2020, 04:49 AM   #21
dupont
Human being with feelings
 
dupont's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: France
Posts: 719
Default

I think it's time Cockos tell us more about this issue.
Are they searching for a fix ? When ? Must we deal with this issue for ever because no fixes can be found ?
dupont is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-01-2020, 09:03 AM   #22
BirdBird
Human being with feelings
 
BirdBird's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2019
Posts: 133
Default

Justin or Schwa, if you are reading this thread we would appreciate some guidance on how to troubleshoot/identify problems with this. I have identified a few specific situations where this happens. But I am not sure if I should create a seperate thread where we all hunt down cases that causes this or should we just dump them here?
BirdBird is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2020, 02:28 AM   #23
Janne83
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Earth
Posts: 1,838
Default

A few more observations:

-VST3 versions cause more stuck notes and more oftenly- if i change tempo mid playback every time.

- VST3 version doesnt react to All notes off (F3), VST2 does

-happens with long notes

- when copying and moving midi items, happens more often when I use Take FX on midi items- I use arpeggiators that way
__________________
Win10, R 64bit
Janne83 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-2020, 05:59 AM   #24
BirdBird
Human being with feelings
 
BirdBird's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2019
Posts: 133
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Janne83 View Post
A few more observations:

-VST3 versions cause more stuck notes and more oftenly- if i change tempo mid playback every time.

- VST3 version doesnt react to All notes off (F3), VST2 does

-happens with long notes

- when copying and moving midi items, happens more often when I use Take FX on midi items- I use arpeggiators that way
Same over here, modifying MIDI items or MIDI data during playback seems to cause it very reliably.
Here is an example:
* Mute MIDI item while the project is in playback
* Undo it during playback when the playhead is over a note

Another example:
* Split MIDI item during playback
* Undo it during playback when the playhead is over a note

Here is one more:
* Open MIDI editor for a MIDI item
* Draw a note right as the playhead goes over it

I also get it sometimes if I draw in notes during playback unrelated to the issue above but im not sure what causes it.

In my case I straight up can't use arpeggiators reliably, because it gives me stuck notes, take FX or not.
BirdBird is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-2020, 07:31 AM   #25
vanhaze
Human being with feelings
 
vanhaze's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Netherlands
Posts: 4,932
Default

Thank you for these observations regarding hanging notes.
Are you on Windows or OSX ?
Cause i notice, by having done alot of posts-reading in the community, that
OSX users suffer way more from note hang issues than Windows users.

I truly hope Cockos has its eyes on this important thread..
__________________
Reaper - OSX (always latest version)
OSX Catalina (always latest version)
My Reaper Tips&Tricks: https://www.youtube.com/user/vanhaze2000/playlists
vanhaze is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-2020, 11:57 AM   #26
BirdBird
Human being with feelings
 
BirdBird's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2019
Posts: 133
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by vanhaze View Post
Are you on Windows or OSX ?
Cause i notice, by having done alot of posts-reading in the community, that
OSX users suffer way more from note hang issues than Windows users.
On Windows 10 here, I would guess it is just related how REAPER juggles note on/off messages.


Quote:
I truly hope Cockos has its eyes on this important thread..
Hopefully, I still run into this issue every single time I use REAPER.
BirdBird is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2020, 01:43 AM   #27
Stirner
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Posts: 31
Default

I have written in another similar thread. I very often (almost always) had this problem with u-he's Diva in Windows. Than I changed some preferences and the problem is completely gone.

MIDI devices - Reset by/all - all checked (4 checkboxes)
Playback - Flush FX on stop + Send MIDI off when unarming
VST - uncheck "Don't send note-offs on stop".

Maybe it will help you too.
Stirner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2020, 01:47 AM   #28
BirdBird
Human being with feelings
 
BirdBird's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2019
Posts: 133
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stirner View Post
I have written in another similar thread. I very often (almost always) had this problem with u-he's Diva in Windows. Than I changed some preferences and the problem is completely gone.

MIDI devices - Reset by/all - all checked (4 checkboxes)
Playback - Flush FX on stop + Send MIDI off when unarming
VST - uncheck "Don't send note-offs on stop".

Maybe it will help you too.
Unfortunately none of these solve the issue with a lot of plugins.
BirdBird is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-09-2020, 04:23 AM   #29
dupont
Human being with feelings
 
dupont's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: France
Posts: 719
Default

this morning two Threads about stuck notes in the bugs report forum, new features still going on the pre-release forum but no news about this bug !
dupont is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2020, 08:45 AM   #30
ivansc
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Near Cambridge UK and Near Questembert, France
Posts: 19,684
Default

A question:
Stuck notes is an issue with every sequencer & DAW I have used in decades.
Always on a windows machine fro XP on up but also previously an Amiga.

So I am left wondering if it was something I was doing in my MIDI programming or an innate MIDI problem.

In every case I had played in or moused in the MIDI part, only to find that on playback there were extended notes. Examining the MIDI parts, the notes had actually been lengthened, in a lot of cases extremely so.
My workaround in Bars n Pipes Pro was to select all the changed notes & reduce their length to a 16th or an 8th in bulk & then reset the individual lengths I required.

Summing up, that was/is my experience, but I have read so many posts on here and elsewhere with different symptoms and different workflows that I am getting more and more convinced that this isn`t just one problem.
__________________
"What a dick comment. I'm gonna make sure to avoid your name." Dicks other than Trump can speak????
ivansc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2020, 11:37 AM   #31
EvilDragon
Human being with feelings
 
EvilDragon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Croatia
Posts: 23,949
Default

https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewt...?f=31&t=541167

Looks like there are also some issues on u-he side regarding this. Not that I stumbled upon any of them...
EvilDragon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-12-2020, 02:23 AM   #32
dupont
Human being with feelings
 
dupont's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: France
Posts: 719
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by EvilDragon View Post
https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewt...?f=31&t=541167

Looks like there are also some issues on u-he side regarding this. Not that I stumbled upon any of them...
Ed, on my mac, stuck notes happens nore frequently with UHE plugins but also with other.
With other DAWS, Logic 10, Live 10 and Studion one 4, no stuck notes even with UHE.
dupont is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-12-2020, 03:02 AM   #33
Janne83
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Earth
Posts: 1,838
Default

Same here. Only happens in Reaper. Cubase 10.5 and ableton 10 work without stuck notes with the same presets and mid. Im on WIn 10 1909
__________________
Win10, R 64bit

Last edited by Janne83; 03-12-2020 at 03:17 AM.
Janne83 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-12-2020, 05:46 AM   #34
EvilDragon
Human being with feelings
 
EvilDragon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Croatia
Posts: 23,949
Default

Would be nice to post that MIDI file then.
EvilDragon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-12-2020, 06:42 AM   #35
STOP
Human being with feelings
 
STOP's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Québec
Posts: 44
Default

Test with synth1
1- Put a long note in ME
2- place cursor just before the note
3- hit play
4- re-hit play (or spacebar) anywhere in the middle of the note.

Note is stuck

Last edited by STOP; 03-12-2020 at 06:51 AM.
STOP is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-12-2020, 07:35 AM   #36
Janne83
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Earth
Posts: 1,838
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by EvilDragon View Post
Would be nice to post that MIDI file then.
its randomly any created midi item that contains longer notes. When you try to copy this item during playbays sooner or later a note gets stuck (happens when the draged item pases the moving playback cursor), also when changing tempo during playback or exporting a MIDI file during playback. I cand do the same actions in CUbase and Live without problem.

If its VST3i the Notes off command (F3) doesnt work, if its VSTi it does.

Happens mostly with uhe stuff, but also Pigments and MAssiveX - all latest legit versions. Ive experimented with the flush fx on stop, reset cc and other playback options to no avail.
__________________
Win10, R 64bit

Last edited by Janne83; 03-12-2020 at 07:41 AM.
Janne83 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-12-2020, 12:27 PM   #37
dupont
Human being with feelings
 
dupont's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: France
Posts: 719
Default

here it happens even with no midi clip.
Play and tweak plugin parameters in loop mode and randomly gets stuck notes.
dupont is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-12-2020, 12:51 PM   #38
vanhaze
Human being with feelings
 
vanhaze's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Netherlands
Posts: 4,932
Default

Exactly my very same experience...

In my experience/situation, Loop mode being active (thus,Repeat = ON) makes
the note hang issue bigger.

OSX user.
__________________
Reaper - OSX (always latest version)
OSX Catalina (always latest version)
My Reaper Tips&Tricks: https://www.youtube.com/user/vanhaze2000/playlists
vanhaze is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2020, 04:19 AM   #39
STOP
Human being with feelings
 
STOP's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Québec
Posts: 44
Default

Solve most of the VST3 stuck notes if I add ReaControlMIDI on the midi tracks.

Thanks to Joffo78 for the hint. Post#2
https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=232988
STOP is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2020, 06:37 AM   #40
vanhaze
Human being with feelings
 
vanhaze's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Netherlands
Posts: 4,932
Default

Mmmm.. interesting, i have to test that.
Thx for the tip !
__________________
Reaper - OSX (always latest version)
OSX Catalina (always latest version)
My Reaper Tips&Tricks: https://www.youtube.com/user/vanhaze2000/playlists
vanhaze is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 12:38 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions Inc.