Old 09-19-2018, 06:13 AM   #1
flicker177
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Default Melodyne ARA2

Hi all,

I've been playing with Reaper pre-release (5.96-pre6) and the latest Melodyne beta to check out the ARA2 capabilities. I'm on Celemony's beta list so I have a new, legal copy of the beta.

I have a very simple 1 track project with a clarinet and some leakage from a live performance. It plays fine. Then I add Melodyne VST3 to the track. Melodyne detects the audio and shows all its blobs fine.

Then if I play the project many notes are garbled and the tempo of the audio wanders all over the place, sometimes fast, sometimes slow. This seems very strange as I've not asked Melodyne to do anything yet, I've done absolutely no editing. It seems to me that the project should play exactly the same as before I added Melodyne as an FX.

Anyone with more experience have any ideas? Maybe I'm missing something obvious. I notified Celemony but I don't know if the problem is Melodyne or Reaper.

--Bill
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Old 09-19-2018, 02:15 PM   #2
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You have to confirm your project tempo in Melodyne first.
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Old 09-19-2018, 02:53 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mercado_Negro View Post
You have to confirm your project tempo in Melodyne first.
That's pretty terse. I don't see a "confirm project tempo" in Melodyne. Also I've never asked it to do anything, I just inserted the FX.

IMHO Melodyne shouldn't be messing with my audio before I do any editing.

That said, how do I "confirm project tempo?"

--Bill
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Old 09-20-2018, 02:16 AM   #4
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I hate this too. I wish there was a way to just make Melodyne use the DAW tempo all the time. It also changes the rate of the item. I usually have to click Apply Constant Tempo.
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Old 09-20-2018, 04:34 AM   #5
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Do you guys think there is something REAPER could improve in this regard?
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Old 09-20-2018, 05:37 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by schwa View Post
Do you guys think there is something REAPER could improve in this regard?
That's helpful. I had to use "Apply Project Tempo" rather than "Apply constant tempo" but now the project plays fine and I can edit notes. I agree that the default should be to just use the project tempo. After all, I just inserted Melodyne to tune some notes. I never wanted to mess with the tempo and never asked Melodyne to touch the tempo.

Schwa, I don't know if that's something you can do in Reaper or if that's a Melodyne thing.

Thanks all for the help!

--Bill
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Old 09-20-2018, 06:19 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flicker177 View Post
That's helpful. I had to use "Apply Project Tempo" rather than "Apply constant tempo" but now the project plays fine and I can edit notes. I agree that the default should be to just use the project tempo. After all, I just inserted Melodyne to tune some notes. I never wanted to mess with the tempo and never asked Melodyne to touch the tempo.

Schwa, I don't know if that's something you can do in Reaper or if that's a Melodyne thing.

Thanks all for the help!

--Bill
HI!
Sorry if I am out of the right place for this question.

What Melodyne Should I buy to test in reaper? the current V.4 in the shop of Celemony is ARA2?

I would like yo buy the essential version in order to begin my tests.

Thanks in advance.
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Old 09-20-2018, 06:33 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by javiramallo View Post
HI!
Sorry if I am out of the right place for this question.

What Melodyne Should I buy to test in reaper? the current V.4 in the shop of Celemony is ARA2?

I would like yo buy the essential version in order to begin my tests.

Thanks in advance.
ARA2 plugins by celemony are not yet publicly available.
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Old 09-20-2018, 12:15 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason Brian Merrill View Post
ARA2 plugins by celemony are not yet publicly available.
And, so how people is testing It?
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Old 09-20-2018, 12:17 PM   #10
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They have joined Celemony's beta test program
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Old 09-21-2018, 12:46 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by schwa View Post
Do you guys think there is something REAPER could improve in this regard?
Yes, I think there should be a default option to only use REAPER's project (constant) BPM no matter what happens with the item. If I need to change the timing of a note, I prefer to do it manually.
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Old 09-21-2018, 05:19 AM   #12
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I think a few technical questions are in order first to decide what to do:

- What should happen if there are stretched items in the track you're adding Melodyne to?

- How would happen if you add Melodyne as take FX and that take is stretched?

- What should happen if you add Melodyne as take FX and later you stretch that take?

- What should happen if the project has several tempo changes?

I'd go along with the premise that REAPER should always ask what to do when you insert Melodyne because we can face all these scenarios.
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Old 09-21-2018, 07:36 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mercado_Negro View Post
I think a few technical questions are in order first to decide what to do:

- What should happen if there are stretched items in the track you're adding Melodyne to?

- How would happen if you add Melodyne as take FX and that take is stretched?

- What should happen if you add Melodyne as take FX and later you stretch that take?

- What should happen if the project has several tempo changes?

I'd go along with the premise that REAPER should always ask what to do when you insert Melodyne because we can face all these scenarios.
In all these scenerios if you've just added Melodyne the project should play exactly as it did before Melodyne was added until you do editing in Melodyne. I don't know how easy that would be but an editor shouldn't do anything ever until you instruct it to edit something. If it might change something by just adding it, it should stop and ask what you want to do first.

--Bill
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Old 09-23-2018, 03:08 AM   #14
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I have two questions concerning ARA/Melodyne/reaper:

1.
On my computer (windows 10) Melodyne analyzes audio only if the reaper window has focus. Is there a way to make melodyne analyze audio in background? For larger files this can take some minutes and I would like to use my computer for other things in the meantime.

2.
I am quite unexperienced concerning tempo stuff in reaper. Since melodyne is very powerfull in this regard I would like to add a variable speed audio item to a variable speed reaper-track. Melodyne detects the tempo curve of the file correctly and the melodyne-internal metronome matches perfectly. But I found no way to make melodyne adapt the audio file to the track and the reaper metronome.

This video indicates that this is done automatically in studio one:
https://youtu.be/ix1FKDtfiUs?t=5m38s

Using the option "Confirm # as file temp" seems only to change the playback rate of the item in reaper statically. The reaper metronome still does not match the file tempo.

Thanks in advance!

Last edited by multibody; 09-23-2018 at 04:10 AM.
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Old 09-23-2018, 05:35 AM   #15
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1: Reaper in the preferences has a setting not to stop the GUI thread when it does not have the focus. (If not set - the default - it clears the tracks' waveform display when loosing the focus))

2) I asked exactly this (supposedly) this forum some time ago and the method was explained, but as I don't have Melodyne yet, I forgot how it is supposed to work.

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Old 09-23-2018, 06:26 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mschnell View Post
1: Reaper in the preferences has a setting not to stop the GUI thread when it does not have the focus. (If not set - the default - it clears the tracks' waveform display when loosing the focus))

2) I asked exactly this (supposedly) this forum some time ago and the method was explained, but as I don't have Melodyne yet, I forgot how it is supposed to work.

-Michael

Hi Michael,

thanks a lot for your answer. The proposed solution for question 1 works like a charm. It can be found here:
Prefs > Media > Set Media Items Offline when Applications is not active

Concerning my second question I did search some of your (many ) posts. This was the closest I found:
https://forum.cockos.com/showthread....melodyne+tempo
I believe this is not the post you were referring to?

I have a really hard time getting my head around this whole topic. There are so many options (project tempo map, timebase tempo envelope, timebase item, project playback rate, item playback rate, several melodyne options ...)

It would be really helpful if Kenny could make a video on this topic...
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Old 09-23-2018, 02:16 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by multibody View Post
Concerning my second question I did search some of your (many ) posts. This was the closest I found:
https://forum.cockos.com/showthread....melodyne+tempo
I believe this is not the post you were referring to?
Nope. This discussion was this year.

I asked if I mainly intend to buy it for creating tempo maps, would Melodyne in Reaper really do the job.

Quote:
Originally Posted by multibody View Post
It would be really helpful if Kenny could make a video on this topic...
He certainly will once the ARA2 version of Melody is officially released .

-Michael
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Old 09-24-2018, 07:03 AM   #18
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One question.
Melodyne and REAPER are both supporting today ARA technology, right?
If both are supporting it, why I put the Melodyne plug-in in the FX of a track and I need press the "Transfer" button for to analyze the audio file? Isn´t this made automaticly in a plug-in with ARA technology?
And I´m using one Pre version, which I supose have implemented the ARA technology, and Melodyne 4.1.1.
Why this occur?
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Old 09-24-2018, 07:12 AM   #19
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Quote:
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Melodyne and REAPER are both supporting today ARA technology, right?
Reaper only supports ARA2 which is available only in the Melodyne version which is not publicly available at the moment. (ARA1 was never supported by Reaper.)
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Old 09-25-2018, 04:41 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xenakios View Post
Reaper only supports ARA2 which is available only in the Melodyne version which is not publicly available at the moment. (ARA1 was never supported by Reaper.)
Thank you for your info. I didn´t know about that.
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Old 09-28-2018, 10:59 AM   #21
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For the first time i had some time to play around with Melodyne ARA2 beta in Reaper (5.96pre12 -OSX).

Immediately, wishing there was a possibility to have to same keyshortcuts i use for navigating in Reaper (like vertical zoom, horizontal zoom, scoll left / right, etc) in Melodyne available, when it has focus.

Any chance devs, this could be implemented ?
Or is that a feature request i should ask Celemony for ?

Warm Regards !
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Old 10-01-2018, 07:58 AM   #22
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Melodyne 4.2 with ARA2 support is out: https://www.celemony.com/en/melodyne-update?checkLang=1
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Old 10-01-2018, 08:22 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mustgroove View Post
Melodyne 4.2 with ARA2 support is out: https://www.celemony.com/en/melodyne-update?checkLang=1
Apparently REAPER is not supported yet.
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Old 10-01-2018, 08:31 AM   #24
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This doesn't seem like much of an announcement of such a major update, and I don't see anything at that link about ARA2. It's still in beta, AFAIK, or was 10 days ago.

-Susan
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Old 10-01-2018, 10:09 AM   #25
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Eager beavers at work!

Read the whole "ARA 4.2 works in Logic announcement and NOWHERE is ARA2 mentioned.
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Old 10-01-2018, 11:30 AM   #26
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Still in beta test phase.
Tried to pursue them for a beta test sign-up..
Was diligently turned down once again !

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Old 10-01-2018, 11:42 AM   #27
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How can it be that a company which makes such a great product has such horrible marketing and customer support, leaving it's customers in the mist.
(I myself can speak out of experience with Celemony).
Oh wait, it's a retorical question.
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Old 10-01-2018, 02:37 PM   #28
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Hm, integration seems to work for me. No transfer button, audio clips are automatically analyzed, there's clip mode and track mode, Melodyne shows DAW-tempo and detected tempo...
Isn't that ARA 2? What's missing?

I'm on 5.96pre12, Melodyne studio 4.2.0.020 VST3.
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Old 10-01-2018, 07:49 PM   #29
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Well that didn't take long - ARA2 is in the current RC.
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Old 10-02-2018, 03:17 AM   #30
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Somehow, I don't have luck with ARA2 and Melodyne...

Put a Melodyne VST3 on the item, the audio gets calculated in the Melodyne window, but there is absolutely no audio output, neither when editing the blobs nor when playing back the wav.
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Old 10-02-2018, 03:53 AM   #31
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Stevie,
I just tested your situation myself:

Outcome for me:
The audio does play back but i hear no audio preview of blobs when i edit blobs,
not in Reaper Stop Mode nor in Reaper Play Mode.

Reaper 5.96rc2 - OSX Mojave.
Latest Melodyne version.
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Old 10-02-2018, 04:09 AM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by _Stevie_ View Post
Put a Melodyne VST3 on the item
If I've understood right, it is intended to be used as a track effect in ARA mode. To get the blob audio preview, the track audio needs to be running which can be achieved at least by rec arming the track. (Maybe there is also a preference in Reaper that keeps the audio engine running without having to rec arm.)
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Old 10-02-2018, 04:11 AM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ivansc View Post

Read the whole "ARA 4.2 works in Logic announcement and NOWHERE is ARA2 mentioned.
It's not mentioned but the now publicly available Melodyne 4.2 update still works with Reaper's ARA2 implementation.
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Old 10-02-2018, 04:21 AM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xenakios View Post
If I've understood right, it is intended to be used as a track effect in ARA mode. To get the blob audio preview, the track audio needs to be running which can be achieved at least by rec arming the track. (Maybe there is also a preference in Reaper that keeps the audio engine running without having to rec arm.)
Just did furthermore testing.
Outcomes for me, having Melodyne VST3 plugin on Audio Track:

- Audiotrack doesn't need to be rec & monitor armed for blob editing audible preview
during Reaper Stop Mode.
- No audible preview when editing Blobs, during Reaper Play Mode (no matter rec&monitor arm status is)
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Old 10-02-2018, 06:40 AM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xenakios View Post
It's not mentioned but the now publicly available Melodyne 4.2 update still works with Reaper's ARA2 implementation.
So we finally ARE on the final stage...

At least all the whiners will now only have to whine about how expensive the new ARA2 version of Melodyne is!

(Juuust kidding)
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Old 10-02-2018, 07:28 AM   #36
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No mention of REAPER on their page about the update - only the Apple product.

What's up with that? I think I read Cockos worked closely with Celemony on ARA2?
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Old 10-02-2018, 07:47 AM   #37
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So how doth that work anyway? If I insert Melodyne conventionally it shows the transfer button and does not show any audio content automatically and I couldn't find a Melodyne entry in either the track's or the item's context menu... :-/
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Old 10-02-2018, 07:54 AM   #38
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You must use the VST3 version of Melodyne, are you doing that ??
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Old 10-02-2018, 08:15 AM   #39
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Yup - Melodyne studio 4.2.0.020 64bit VST3
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Old 10-02-2018, 08:32 AM   #40
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Are you positive that it isn't calling the old plugins at all?

this was the problem I had initially. I had both versions and it picked the older one
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