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Old 07-17-2017, 08:16 PM   #41
ashcat_lt
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Ha ha, I think you're basically talking about the beginning of the bedroom studio, aren't you ashcat?
Well, I was talking about me trying to get the things I hear in my head on to a format I could hear from outside my head and maybe play for other people. It was never a struggle though. A challenge, a learning experience, an occasional success and frequent failure, but not much struggle...except all that damn noise!
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Old 07-17-2017, 09:26 PM   #42
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Well, I was talking about me trying to get the things I hear in my head on to a format I could hear from outside my head and maybe play for other people. It was never a struggle though. A challenge, a learning experience, an occasional success and frequent failure, but not much struggle...except all that damn noise!
Yeah, and I have a feeling young folks starting out today face many of the same same challenges, except for the "noise".

Back in the late 60s I think it was, I had my first 4 track tape deck, a Teac 3340. It used 1/4 inch tape which was 1/16 inch allotted per channel. Actually less than that when you took into account the outside edges and the gap between the tracks. Back at that time, that deck was pretty amazing for what you could do.

I can't even imagine a 4 track cassette deck. That would be 1/64th inch per channel minus the edges and in between gaps. Not only the noise, but wow and flutter would be pretty bad.

Folks today, can't even imagine it unless they also experienced it.
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Old 07-17-2017, 10:17 PM   #43
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For me, it was:

the darn mic position!

as a one man show, mic placement was a PITA I avoided at all costs till someone on the reaper forum mentioned using a super long delay while muting the direct monitoring to actually hear what the mic is recording.

so you can move the mic without having to mess with the damn DAW.

That little paragraph on the reaper forum changed my life, and i will never thank you enough.

within a few months I went from "dude, everything sounds like you recorded them in a cardboard box" to "Whoa dude, that acoustic guitar sounds sweet!"

And yes, mic placement is more important than any EQ. One of my good friends once said:" in an ideal world, EQ is only there to enhance the good, and cut unnecessary frequencies". It shouldn't be used as a magic fixing tool.
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Old 07-17-2017, 10:24 PM   #44
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What was your biggest struggle when you started learning to mix/produce.

not to cut anything at all prior pre-production
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Old 07-17-2017, 10:38 PM   #45
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… using a super long delay while muting the direct monitoring to actually hear what the mic is recording.

so you can move the mic without having to mess with the damn DAW.
Can you elaborate on this concept? I don't quite understand.
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Old 07-17-2017, 11:31 PM   #46
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Can you elaborate on this concept? I don't quite understand.
Let's say you're recording acoustic guitar. on the track you're recording on, put one instance of readalay. Then, dial in a super long delay time (like 5-7 seconds.) with only one tap.. you only want it to repeat once.

Then, you set the "dry" signal at zero, leaving only the "wet" signal on.

the result of this is that what you play will go out of the monitors (or in my case, headphones) 5-7seconds later. So you play a couple licks, stop playing and actually listen to how it sounds. Then you move the mic accordingly. Then you play again.

All that without having to touch your damn computer. So you can focus on how your mic sounds. This technique is also really cool to find the sweet spot in a room for vocalists and such.


For recording drums, this technique is actually priceless, since you don't have to cope with the very loud drums.
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Last edited by g4greg; 07-18-2017 at 01:34 AM. Reason: terrible grammar
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Old 07-18-2017, 07:23 AM   #47
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It might have been me.

I use delays when dealing with drum and guitar mic positions for problematic sources when I'm setting up for live sound checks, especially if we've got time because they want it recording. It's hard to get enough separation in this situation on-stage otherwise.

I once used four mics in a kick drum to get a point across about why I "fiddle" with mic positions (it "can't make a difference" because the source sound is "loud enough not to") -somebody learned something here, as I made them live with their recording for several days with "their" mic position before substituting in my choice.

What I really want is a motorised mic stand for kick drums I can operate from FOH.



>
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Old 07-18-2017, 07:24 AM   #48
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What I really want is a motorised mic stand for kick drums I can operate from FOH.



>
They make one but not sure about kick drums.
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Old 07-18-2017, 07:38 AM   #49
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They make one but not sure about kick drums.

Heh! I shouldn't be surprised



>
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Old 07-18-2017, 07:42 AM   #50
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Heh! I shouldn't be surprised



>


But they ain't cheap!
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Old 07-18-2017, 09:10 AM   #51
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But they ain't cheap!
If I had that need more often, 100 USD in parts and an Arduino board and I could make my own. Hell, I think I have half those parts already such as the stepper motors etc.
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Old 07-18-2017, 06:37 PM   #52
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I think this is worth repeating as someone above already has in a different way. We often forget that so much of what we do in the recording and mixing process in the end really just doesn't matter to the average listener. Over the past few months I have cut 3 covers of songs with backing tracks I purchased. Vocals were mine and new. The song I personally like the most overall is my group of listeners least favorite. The song that I think is the best over all recording, vocal performance and mixing end results comes in second and you guessed it the song that by far to me is the worst recording of the three with more things wrong than I can fix and forced me to just settle for the best I could get with what I had to work with is the most favorite and has been the best received. I have boiled it down to 2 things. My listeners just happen to like the SONG best and even though I recorded it poorly it was my most dynamic and best vocal performance of the three. So there ya go. In a perfect world you would capture the best performance of the most liked song, engineered to the highest standards. This more often than not just is not the case. I am trying to sharpen my engineering skills so when that SONG and PERFORMANCE happen I am sure to capture it.
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Old 07-18-2017, 06:58 PM   #53
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I think this is worth repeating as someone above already has in a different way. We often forget that so much of what we do in the recording and mixing process in the end really just doesn't matter to the average listener.
No, it isn't worth repeating. If you don't care about the craft enough to have standards high enough so that you aren't swayed by the random inklings of some random joe blow listener on the street, you are in the wrong business and part of the problem. It's your duty to retain standards that can withstand the near-constant stream of bullshit that is the internet and hearsay. Because no one else gives a shit should be your clue how easy it is to stand out above the rest by giving one yourself. That's a direct order mister.

Now, ^that is my fatherly voiced, R. Lee Ermey style, semi-humorous pep talk so don't let it offend you - nor do I think you really don't care, I know you do, because you replied as if you do - but I stand behind the message hidden in the stern delivery which should be a reminder for all of us. You are exactly right though, they don't care, they NEVER have, but they aren't supposed to care, however we ARE supposed to care, even if the medium is two paper cups and string.
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Last edited by karbomusic; 07-18-2017 at 07:05 PM.
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Old Yesterday, 01:32 AM   #54
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Thanks, g4greg. That's a neat trick.
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Old Yesterday, 02:16 AM   #55
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Getting the lower end right.
This was it for me as well. Also for some reason letting too much honky 500 Hz-ish tone through, I don't know why it was such a struggle to learn to hear that during the process. I mean, I would be sanity checking a mix some time later and it was always "what, again?!" and immediately had to dial down something in the 500 Hz department. Learned to listen for it, eventually, and I think missing it had something to do with ear fatigue
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