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 01-17-2019, 01:55 PM #1 InfiniteDimensionality Human being with feelings   Join Date: Jun 2017 Posts: 176 Tempo map alternate curves We only get linear and square? Why not go ahead and add the others, all the cod e already exists... We all know that any continuous curve can be represented by lines so why make us have to put in, say an exponential tempo change by hand that is not very accurate? I know they wouldn't be used much in most music but if it's not their it can't be experimented with. I'm specially talking about the slope shapes for points.
 01-17-2019, 02:33 PM #2 G-Sun Human being with feelings     Join Date: May 2010 Location: Norway Posts: 7,248 I had the same request many years ago, and I still could like to use such lines. But then I went down the rabbit-hole and got a deeper understanding of a DAW and it's tempo-line at a mathematical and technical level. The tempo-line is the fundament that everything in your project is locked into. Using straight line is complicated enough -using curves is a can of worms. Just put in as many points as you like to get what you want. __________________ Reaper x64, win 8.1 My music on Bandcamp
 01-17-2019, 02:40 PM #3 EvilDragon Human being with feelings     Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Croatia Posts: 23,331 Yes, not going to happen. Even linear changes are a tremendous issue to take care of properly.
 01-17-2019, 02:47 PM #4 Bri1 Banned   Join Date: Dec 2016 Location: England Posts: 2,432 ello-can you not achieve that with playrate automations? technically it's varying the speed the same--it's just not getting translated back as savable,readable tempo info..> sure some genius will change that by a simple script..
01-17-2019, 03:12 PM   #5
InfiniteDimensionality
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Quote:
 Originally Posted by G-Sun I had the same request many years ago, and I still could like to use such lines. But then I went down the rabbit-hole and got a deeper understanding of a DAW and it's tempo-line at a mathematical and technical level. The tempo-line is the fundament that everything in your project is locked into. Using straight line is complicated enough -using curves is a can of worms. Just put in as many points as you like to get what you want.
Not true, as I mentioned, all continuous curves can be approximated as lines... If it it can be done with lines it can be done with continuous curves.

The mathematics proves this and hence you didn't dig deep enough. In fact, reaper already approximates the continuous curves as splines because that is all a digital computer can do(everything is discrete in nature since the computer is a device that is discreatized... e.g., digit audio).

For example, suppose we wanted the exponential curve between two points.

f(t) = a*exp(b*t)

between points 0 and 1, where a and b are appropriately chosen.

then f(0 + k*dt) = a*exp(b*dt)

is really just a set of N points which are then connected by lines to interpolate.

This is all reaper does behind the scenes(even if it uses the continuous formula) for it's curves in other areas...

For example, if N = 2, then

f(0) = a and f(1) = a*exp(b)

where a and b are chosen to to map between the two tempo points. It's just a line though. So a spline of degree 1 for f(t) above is just single straight line.

Reaper has no problems with lines, right?

So, having an order 2 just splits the midpoint and adds two lines... which again, reaper can do lines.

Since, we can do this by hand with lines and draw any curve, or use a script to draw them(which I already have done but it is tedious), your conclusions are wrong and I suggest you go back and figure out where your logic went wrong.

Again, if it can do it with lines then it can do it with any curve that can be approximated by splines and everyone familiar with calculus knows this is all continuous functions.

What you have to get through your *thick* skull(not an attack, but get upset if you must) is that:

1. Reaper allows one to use lines to draw any curve.
2. Any "curve" can be draw with lines.
3. Any existing problem with "curves" will also exist with lines.

It is simply false to state what you have. You may believe what you say is true but it is fundamentally false(and it can be proven).

For example, Could you not write a script that simply draws the curves for you(what reaper does for envelopes) as splines(lines?) With significant degree of accuracy?(N is large))

If so, then that means reaper can do it too.

One can claim that curves have problems, but they have no more problems than lines have because any curve is a spline and a spline is lines... it's basic logic.

Again, I'm not asking for some infinite precision processor...

The fact is, if one can do it with lines then they can do it with curves to all practical accuracy required... to pretend otherwise is being ignorant. (It's ignorance because it perpetuates a falsity which is wrong. I know that no one likes to be wrong but it's ok to put your emotions aside for the truth.)

(Again, I'm not attacking you, just trying to correct your misconception so you benefit from increased awareness(hopefully you care enough about it to not get emotional)).

All you have to do is this:

1. Convince yourself that any curve that is continuous can be approximated by lines to any degree of accuracy is a fact. If you don't believe this then we can prove you are wrong quite easily and so it will solve that problem, so assume it is true for now if you disagree.

2. Reaper handles lines(splines) without issue(or with issue, it doesn't matter because if it has issues with lines then it will have them independently of the curves and so the curves have nothing to do with that problem).

Hence curves have no problem being implemented. Again, there is ample proof in many directions to show that reaper is fully capable of implementing this. Saying it can't on belief is not good enough, you must prove it can't handle it for some reason.. I've already proven that there is no logical reason why it can't do it and it has all the tech to do it... the question is if the will is there to do it.

 01-18-2019, 09:38 AM #6 G-Sun Human being with feelings     Join Date: May 2010 Location: Norway Posts: 7,248 __________________ Reaper x64, win 8.1 My music on Bandcamp
 01-18-2019, 12:53 PM #7 InfiniteDimensionality Human being with feelings   Join Date: Jun 2017 Posts: 176 Yes, that is your response, no logic, no proof, just a attacking the messenger that proved you wrong instead of working towards a proper solution... You are clueless and your response proves it. I will not respond to you, I'm sure I will get reprimanded for "attacking" you, and you will get away with it. So be it...
01-19-2019, 09:14 AM   #8
Masi
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Quote:
 Originally Posted by InfiniteDimensionality Not true, as I mentioned, all continuous curves can be approximated as lines... If it it can be done with lines it can be done with continuous curves.
You good at math but not at programming. Just because you can express ideas in formulas it doesn't mean you can turn them into usable code. The implementation of algorithm must be fast enough to work in real time. And too make it even more tricky all the tiny tempo changes must be signalled to all the synchronized plugins (synths but also all FX with tempo sync). In the end you won't have only an apoximation of a curve despite all your nice math.

Quote:
 Originally Posted by InfiniteDimensionality What you have to get through your *thick* skull(not an attack, but get upset if you must) is that:
If it's not meant as an attack that then I wonder how you talk to people in your daily life.

Masi

01-19-2019, 05:09 PM   #9
InfiniteDimensionality
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Quote:
 Originally Posted by Masi You good at math but not at programming. Just because you can express ideas in formulas it doesn't mean you can turn them into usable code. The implementation of algorithm must be fast enough to work in real time. And too make it even more tricky all the tiny tempo changes must be signalled to all the synchronized plugins (synths but also all FX with tempo sync). In the end you won't have only an apoximation of a curve despite all your nice math. If it's not meant as an attack that then I wonder how you talk to people in your daily life. Masi
No, this is an attack: You are an idiot.

I've actually been programming 20+ years, about twice as long as I have done math.

You obviously have less programming experience.

1. Reaper already uses the mathematical expressions for the envelopes and so has no problem with processing. Sure the tempo map may be more intensive but not any more than any other... but if you actually were as good a programmer as you think:

2. No one says the curves have to be computed at play time. Reaper can easily internally compute the spline and simply display it in continuous form but internally pre-compute it for performance reasons.

See, the problem with people like you is that you are ignorant and your ignorance makes you believe you actually know what you are talking about. Hence why I called you an idiot. It is not actually an attack, but a true statement.

See, On one hand you say reaper can do it with splines... then on the other hand you say it can't be done with continuous mathematical curves and your ignorance fails to realize they are actually the same.

There is no such thing as continuous mathematical functions, it is made up in mans mind. There are actually no such things as lines, too are made up idealizations of a collection of points.

The only difference between representation is computational power and representation. You at least claim it is a computation issue, which is acceptable since DAW's must run in real time...

But then you fail to have the knowledge to realize that it is not a computation issue because it can be precomputed.

You don't seem to understand that if I can do it by hand then it can be done by automation...

I already have a script that can draw any mathematical curves I choose... I simply draws them as a spline. It has no issues and I can approximate them to any desired degree.

Reaper can simply do this. You want an sigmoid curve then it draws it as a spline and you see it in the tempo map as a spline. THAT WORKS as is. It can do this now without issue and it alleviates the problem. It's not ideal because we can't then easily change it without having to change all the lines.

Hence, it can internally precompute it for performance, if that is a problem and then visually we can see it as the continuous function.

See, you can make claims that something is impossible, but you actually have to prove it to be logically and correct. None of you have donee so and you offer no real facts why it would be impossible, just your own ignorance based opinions.

When I come along and say it can be done almost surely I am made out to be the bad guy. I'm suppose to, what? Suck up and kiss your feat for being the gods you think you are? Seriously?

Seriously! Do you ever stop to analyze your own thinking to see if it actually makes sense? You are saying that something is *IMPOSSIBLE* to do! H ow the hell do you actually know that to be able to say it? Do you have a god complex? Did you prove it was impossible mathematically?

See, what you idiots(that is the correct term, which I will explain why shortly, get offended if you want), do is accept something as impossible when it is actually possible. You justify it with false hoods and say "It is impossible because of X"... and I say "no, that is wrong, it is not impossible because of X" and I back up my claims. Instead of attacking my claims and pointing out errors like I have done with yours you attack me. Now, that is essentially being an idiot. What would be awesome if you guys just recognized what you are so you could learn and grow and stop limiting yourself and everyone else because of your ignorance.

Just ask yourself this: "What if it is possible"? "What if it is actually very easy to do"? "What if it could be done(coded) in a few hours and work well"?

That is, simply ask yourself "What if I am wrong". Which you have not done and so that is what makes you an idiot. Because you refuse to question your own intelligence you will always remain ignorant.

01-20-2019, 03:33 AM   #10
Masi
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Quote:
 Originally Posted by InfiniteDimensionality No, this is an attack: You are an idiot.

Masi

 01-20-2019, 04:27 AM #11 Bri1 Banned   Join Date: Dec 2016 Location: England Posts: 2,432 lolz-- suggestion was made towards combining both tempo maps+playrate automations= /ignored. humans are not robots...(do they play that way?) ^ maybe some might be programmed that way today=dunno
 01-20-2019, 07:44 AM #12 pcartwright Human being with feelings   Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 946 What is the intent of using a curved line vs. a series of steps? Is it to save time entering tempo changes?
01-20-2019, 09:08 AM   #13
enroe
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Quote:
 Originally Posted by InfiniteDimensionality I've actually been programming 20+ years, about twice as long as I have done math. You obviously have less programming experience ...
Woaa - if you get so emotional enraged about such a small point
you need to care not to die of cardiac infarction. Care for
yourself!

Quote:
 Originally Posted by InfiniteDimensionality ... if it can do it with lines then it can do it with any curve that can be approximated by splines.
Yes, this is something everyone learns in school.

For me this is an argument for the thesis that
reaper doesn't need automation-curves, because
linear lines are enough. You said is yourself:
With these linear parts you can approximate every
curve. That means: Curves are not needed!

Also Reaper needn't be a mathematical playground
for curve-addicts. For me it's enough if I can do
any practical automation - gladly with linear fragments
only.
__________________
free mp3s + info: andy-enroe.de songs and weird stuff: enroe.de

 01-20-2019, 01:12 PM #14 pcartwright Human being with feelings   Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 946 It would be helpful to know why the tempo curve is needed. Like ED said, actual implementation of the curve isn't likely, but getting the same/similar result is possible.
01-20-2019, 10:31 PM   #15
InfiniteDimensionality
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Quote:
 Originally Posted by enroe Woaa - if you get so emotional enraged about such a small point you need to care not to die of cardiac infarction. Care for yourself! Yes, this is something everyone learns in school. For me this is an argument for the thesis that reaper doesn't need automation-curves, because linear lines are enough. You said is yourself: With these linear parts you can approximate every curve. That means: Curves are not needed! Also Reaper needn't be a mathematical playground for curve-addicts. For me it's enough if I can do any practical automation - gladly with linear fragments only.

No, that is not the problem.. The reason to use curves is because one doesn't have to manually enter in a lot of points and that if reaper rendered the curves to splines then one would have to deal with a bunch of points(it can do this internally by precomputing the spline before playback).

The flaw in your thinking is that you think everyone should conform to what you believe is enough for you... just because you don't do it and you think that no one else needs to do it. That clearly is a form of psychopathy.

Instead of trying to justify your own position and denying mine based on your own self-centeredness, the question should be is implementing the feature worth the expense... a cost-benefit analysis. That is the real problem, and not the stupid arguments that it is first impossible, and then "It's not needed".

If it were not "needed"(desired) obviously I would have never posted the request. You can claim that since it can be done by hand that it is not needed, which is a ridiculous argument because then one can say that about everything. Why not just go back to punch cards? It's not technically needed to use transistors and massive amounts of memory to achieve what we need.

...and to say "Yes, this is something everyone learns in school." is simply not true since it's clear that the first 3 people in this thread didn't get this. When I tried to teach it to them I get attacked and I'm the idiot.

When I state that the fact that everything is ultimately rendered in to splines(computers being discrete linear devices) so it is not a problem with the reasons given(the impossibility of it) and that precomputation can be used to deal with the performance side, I'm still attacked.

See, the real problem is that people just like to be douchebags... instead of trying to find a way there are always the naysayers who actually are quite ignorant and just enjoy trying to shut down any progress in any form so they can remain in their state of comfort.

Instead of actually figuring out the meat and potatoes we have to eat garbage... which I'm not willing to do regardless who it offends.

01-20-2019, 10:54 PM   #16
InfiniteDimensionality
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Quote:
 Originally Posted by pcartwright It would be helpful to know why the tempo curve is needed. Like ED said, actual implementation of the curve isn't likely, but getting the same/similar result is possible.
The need should not matter. One can't decide to do something based on the hypothetical "need" that someone else may have. Why? Because you can't truly know if something is needed until it is done... the only valid way to progress is to say "Will it most likely be useful and are there other similar cases where it proves to be useful? Are there any theoretical proofs that make it useful?".

So, I shouldn't have to list all my reasons... and even if I did it wouldn't change anything.

For example, anyone at any point in time can say "It's not useful, I don't have any use for it" just like enroe did. Such mentalities destroy progress because no one can make progress because some idiot will always say "NO, NO PROGRESS!".

Also, if I list my reasons, you my disagree... and if you have the self-centered egotistical megalomanic disorders that are common in society, then you will say that my reasons are not valid and yours are.

Also, if I list my reasons people then come back, as you have done and say "It can be done using X"... which is another fallacy.

Why? Because my needs may be only a few in which X might apply but others that were not listed(mine or others) may not work by the method X given.

The issue should be judged on it's pure merits, not on peoples opinions, biases, ego, etc. Of course, that is really all that has happened here.

The questions should be.

1. Will it hurt anything
- No, because it can always be disabled internally by the developers if it did and it already exists in fundamental form in the software so only bugs could be created, which can be fixed. But the feature itself is not innately dangerous... e.g., nukes are.

2. Can it be done. I pointed out that it can without issue and described the outline of how. Envelopes already do this, so I never even had to do it.

This does suggest the performance issue, but then I showed how that could be solved(precomputing, that is how all performance issues are solved when practical).

3. What is the cost to implement it... This is really the crux of all features. If it is possible to implement then it is just a matter of how much time. This gets down to desire.

In this specific feature it is easy to implement... it's already 95% done.

4. Many features are denied by the peons who claim they are not useful or possible... only to find out that they are both useful and possible. The peons lack imagination and knowledge... I know, it's not their fault... it never is.

Now, I will give you my reason for needing it, my main reason.

1. Drumming - I am a drummer and I like to practice to various non-linear tempo changes. I use reaper to do this since it's easy to create a click track and try different curves. Because I'm limited to linear, it is very limiting. Using non-smooth curves(low resolution splines) gives a jerky tempo that is not as easy to follow.

One can argue that is not needed because music doesn't generally change tempos... which is a statement based in ignorance(again, it does not base it on pure meaning but on biases and ignorance).

There are reasons to practice to non-linear tempo changes that go beyond what non-drummers can understand.(of course, can be used by non-drummers if they get it but it is another heard mentality to think that because it hasn't been done then it can't be done... fire was once thought to be quite useless).

2. Retards and accelerandos, common in some music, are not linear based... hence using them can be helpful and having smooth curves help make this work much easier. I draw them by hand... usually it takes around 5-10 points to get smooth and correct. with proper curves it can be done in 2 or 3 points and makes changing them much easier.

When changing hand drawn curves one has to modify all the points. You want to change the rate of change you have to modify ALL points. Why? There is absolutely no point in requiring one to do this when all the code already exists in reaper to allow curves in tempo maps. Maybe a few extra lines have to be added but most of the code already exists. A tempo map is an envelope. It maybe that reaper internally does not represent them the same and so it will be more work, but it should be, in fact, quite easy. Only the devs know how easy which means they first have to work on it to see. The point being, there should be no BS about "It's too hard! or It's impossible". In fact, those statements are far more ignorant than just saying "We don't want to put in the time, we have better things to do!" which is at least being honest.

If one always looks at the usefulness of something as what it is currently, then there is no point. Kill all humans! Every human starts out as a baby which is absolutely useless. That is the mentality of the peons that have posted. Kill the baby because there is no use for it! The reality is that only with time does something become useful... even fire took many millennia to become useful!

What people who are denying this feature really need to ask themselves is why. Is it because they are ignorant, arrogant, or lazy. I can accept lazy... I can even accept ignorance as long as it is willing not to remain ignorant. I can even accept arrogance as long as it is logical and truthful. I have not found any of that in this thread and we all suffer for it(not much but there is no point in the first place).

01-21-2019, 06:30 AM   #17
pcartwright
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Quote:
 Originally Posted by InfiniteDimensionality So, I shouldn't have to list all my reasons... and even if I did it wouldn't change anything.
I'm not going to get into this any deeper, but having some pragmatic reason for a feature is far more helpful than saying there is a hypothetical need.

Ultimately, Reaper is an audio production software and its features lend themselves to optimizing production. Explain why the curve would optimize your workflow, and accept that many will disagree and suggest alternatives.

In the end, the likelihood of this feature being implemented is pretty small. However, if you come into the conversation with a problem you're trying to solve (i.e. how do I make tempo accelerando sound more natural/consistent) then you may get some responses that are helpful to your end goal even if the tempo curve isn't implemented.

Last edited by pcartwright; 01-21-2019 at 07:01 AM.

01-21-2019, 06:28 PM   #18
InfiniteDimensionality
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Quote:
 Originally Posted by pcartwright I'm not going to get into this any deeper, but having some pragmatic reason for a feature is far more helpful than saying there is a hypothetical need. Ultimately, Reaper is an audio production software and its features lend themselves to optimizing production. Explain why the curve would optimize your workflow, and accept that many will disagree and suggest alternatives. In the end, the likelihood of this feature being implemented is pretty small. However, if you come into the conversation with a problem you're trying to solve (i.e. how do I make tempo accelerando sound more natural/consistent) then you may get some responses that are helpful to your end goal even if the tempo curve isn't implemented.
This is the problem:

I ask for the feature, which is well within my right to do so.

Then the first two responses are that it is impossible to do because the posters are god(as only god truly knows what is possible and impossible).

Then I shoot them down that they are wrong and it is possible the whole point of the thread spirals out of control...

Do you not agree with the above analysis?

So, effectively they have destroyed any progress can be made because of their ignorance, of which I simply tried to correct using logic and well known mathematics and computers knowledge(of which they seem to pretend to be experts but are clearly lacking in this common programming knowledge).

Then I'm left still having to defend the reason I give for asking for the feature...

Rather than discuss and debate the feature on it's merits it always gets bogged down in to those who have to try to prove how intelligent they are by shooting things down(i.e., play god so they can feel in control of whatever control they actually lack).

I have enough experience and knowledge to know the feature could be easily implemented by Cockos without any real hassle(it could literally be done in a day). Of course, they are not my slaves and I can tell them what to do with their time... that is not my point.

But the fact is, it is a relevant feature and suggesting alternatives does not solve the innate issue and never will completely solve the problem(although a script could come very close and if done well it might be acceptable).

What generally happens is the people who are not intelligent as they think they are believe that if Cockos didn't implement it then it must be impossible because they worship at their feet(in the sense that they believe they must be experts and would do everything that is possible). So they try to identify with their gods so they can be perceived as one too...

In fact, since we have no control over it, it is pointless for anyone to say anything in an unhelpful way, and claiming something is impossible is extremely unhelpful UNLESS one has a air tight proof(which is not the same as a feeling or belief or desire).

Let Cockos decide, if they do so in ignorance then so be it... since they are the ones that are the part of the product then only they have the right to do so.

Now, if the first response started differently like "I've done some research and what I know about the situation is that it seems impossible" rather than "I'm a god(expert) and it IS impossible".

One is based in intelligence and one is in ignorance... can you spot which one?

01-22-2019, 02:12 AM   #19
Masi
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Quote:
 Originally Posted by InfiniteDimensionality I have enough experience and knowledge to know the feature could be easily implemented by Cockos without any real hassle(it could literally be done in a day).
I admit that I haven't done any DAW programming so my assumption in an earlier reply may be completely wrong. So I haven't bothered to have a look at the C extension API that Reaper has, but maybe you can implement that feature on your own. AFAIK you can even sell this extension, no need to make it free as eg SWS.

Quote:
 Originally Posted by InfiniteDimensionality What generally happens is the people who are not intelligent as they think
You seem to think highly of yourself. Did it ever occur that you are yourself not so smart as you think?

Masi

01-22-2019, 02:24 AM   #20
Judders
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Quote:
 Originally Posted by InfiniteDimensionality So, effectively they have destroyed any progress can be made because of their ignorance...
No, I'm pretty sure any progress was destroyed by you being a twat.

 01-22-2019, 03:41 AM #21 Philbo King Human being with feelings     Join Date: May 2017 Posts: 1,556 Your attitude torpedos any urge to help you. Consider that being correct doesn't get you any benefit if no one can stand you. __________________ Tangent Studio - Philbo King www.soundclick.com/philboking - stream music www.facebook.com/philboking - gigs and news
01-22-2019, 05:03 AM   #22
Bri1
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Quote:
 Your attitude torpedos any urge to help you. Consider that being correct doesn't get you any benefit if no one can stand you.

i think a personally biased opinion should not apply to all other peoples.. that's just silly.

 01-22-2019, 11:35 AM #23 strachupl Human being with feelings     Join Date: Jan 2013 Posts: 394 I have a question. In compare the way FL Studio vs Reaper tempo envelope works. Is it not like FL Studio tempo envelope works like Reapers playrate envelope and Reaper tempo envelope is more like a grid adjuster/wrapper? ps. cause in Fl I liked that and many things more was there possible. I wondered if I could use playrate same in Reaper and if there are some differences/cons? __________________ The truth is not in the middle but exactly where it is.
01-22-2019, 02:23 PM   #24
InfiniteDimensionality
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Quote:
 Originally Posted by Judders No, I'm pretty sure any progress was destroyed by you being a twat.
Says the anus. It's ok for you to attack me but not me attack you. Yeah, you seem to think that I must bow down to your greatness for you to be nice to me... doesn't work that way asshole. (but right, it's ok for you to call me a twat, come in to a conversation that you have no point being in and say something totally irrelevant and you think you are in the right... typical of psychopaths)

01-22-2019, 02:23 PM   #25
InfiniteDimensionality
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Quote:
 Originally Posted by Philbo King Your attitude torpedos any urge to help you. Consider that being correct doesn't get you any benefit if no one can stand you.
I don't give a shit if people can't stand me... I'm not going to shit on the truth just to make you feel good about yourself because you have some deep seeded complex.

01-22-2019, 02:28 PM   #26
InfiniteDimensionality
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Quote:
 Originally Posted by Masi I admit that I haven't done any DAW programming so my assumption in an earlier reply may be completely wrong. So I haven't bothered to have a look at the C extension API that Reaper has, but maybe you can implement that feature on your own. AFAIK you can even sell this extension, no need to make it free as eg SWS. You seem to think highly of yourself. Did it ever occur that you are yourself not so smart as you think? Masi
The point is that cockos could do it with a few lines of code that are much more effective and direct then trying to hack something by an outsider.

Yes, it did occur to me, I never said I was smart... in fact, I know I'm a dumbass, maybe you should ask yourself that question and the others who actually think they are smarter than they are...

See, when you actually learn something you realize how little you know, and few seem to know anything since they think they are so intelligent.

Think about it, I get attacked for pointing out someone's ignorance and that person never learns they are ignorant. That is the problem with morons is that they simply follow the ass in front of them rather than learning to think for themselves. If I'm smarter than you, knock me down, right? Instead of learning and discussing things intellectually lets play the 12yo play ground games, right?

It really is typical, you psychos come in and blame me when, in fact, I didn't start anything... I just finished it. You guys read a few comments and do a quick analysis and decide to jump on the bandwagon without actually having a clue what is going on.

Of course, all I hear is baaa baaa baaaaaa ba baaa.

01-22-2019, 02:32 PM   #27
InfiniteDimensionality
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Quote:
 Originally Posted by strachupl I have a question. In compare the way FL Studio vs Reaper tempo envelope works. Is it not like FL Studio tempo envelope works like Reapers playrate envelope and Reaper tempo envelope is more like a grid adjuster/wrapper? ps. cause in Fl I liked that and many things more was there possible. I wondered if I could use playrate same in Reaper and if there are some differences/cons?

If it is done somewhere else it proves that it can be done. In fact, most things in life can be done and morons are the ones who do understand how life really works.

99% of problem solving comes down to desire. Can Reaper do what FL, in every respect. Is it cost effective? That is the real question and only the people who do the work can decide.

I haven't used FL in a long time so I really don't know what you are talking about, but FL definitely has done some things reaper could learn from.

The dev team in reaper is not really interested in making reaper the best DAW. We will see in v6 if they modernizing reaper. It has so many features but also lacks in many ways.

The only reason we love reaper is because it has a large collection of features that no other DAW has, and we accept all the crap it also has. Soon other DAW's will catch up to reapers feature set.

01-22-2019, 02:54 PM   #28
Judders
Human being with feelings

Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 8,726

Quote:
 Originally Posted by InfiniteDimensionality Says the anus. It's ok for you to attack me but not me attack you. Yeah, you seem to think that I must bow down to your greatness for you to be nice to me... doesn't work that way asshole. (but right, it's ok for you to call me a twat, come in to a conversation that you have no point being in and say something totally irrelevant and you think you are in the right... typical of psychopaths)
Not at all, I'm not in the right and I don't mind you calling me an anus or psychopath one bit.

Good luck with your feature request, you're really building up the good will and community spirit!

 01-22-2019, 04:11 PM #29 Bri1 Banned   Join Date: Dec 2016 Location: England Posts: 2,432 @InfiniteDimensionality- am i on your ignore list? seems that way-- what was wrong with 'workaround' suggested? what is also 'wrong' with drawing curves with straight lines? why seeming be so upset ? name calling with accompanying spitting hissing fits do not seem to translate well on these forums- along with *humour* > apparently.. ignorance seems to have special places in some minds..default mode,apparently.
01-22-2019, 06:52 PM   #30
strachupl
Human being with feelings

Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 394

Quote:
 Originally Posted by Bri1 @InfiniteDimensionality- am i on your ignore list? seems that way-- what was wrong with 'workaround' suggested? what is also 'wrong' with drawing curves with straight lines? why seeming be so upset ? name calling with accompanying spitting hissing fits do not seem to translate well on these forums- along with *humour* > apparently.. ignorance seems to have special places in some minds..default mode,apparently.
heheh
Please do sine wave shape for 8 bits and post a gif you doin it
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The truth is not in the middle but exactly where it is.

01-22-2019, 07:01 PM   #31
Bri1
Banned

Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: England
Posts: 2,432

Quote:
 Please do sine wave shape for 8 bits and post a gif you doin it

lol,sorry -do not quite understand request>? 8 bits of what?
i know it can be done for years ago reason never has curves-but sinewaved automations were created for it quite easily--possibly recorded from lfo's or other softwares+imported into the automation clip toolbox!

think this is another "mountain out of a molehill" case.

01-22-2019, 08:40 PM   #32
strachupl
Human being with feelings

Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 394

Quote:
 Originally Posted by Bri1 lol,sorry -do not quite understand request>? 8 bits of what? i know it can be done for years ago reason never has curves-but sinewaved automations were created for it quite easily--possibly recorded from lfo's or other softwares+imported into the automation clip toolbox! think this is another "mountain out of a molehill" case.
*beats, sorry

Show me sine wave shape envelope builded from linear points for 8 beats in tempo envelope lane. Try to make it smooth, take your time.
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The truth is not in the middle but exactly where it is.

01-23-2019, 02:09 AM   #33
Masi
Human being with feelings

Join Date: Sep 2015
Posts: 637

Quote:
 Originally Posted by InfiniteDimensionality FL definitely has done some things reaper could learn from.
And probably things from Live, PT, Cubase etc. But the reverse is also true as seem to love some of the unique features of Reaper.

Quote:
 Originally Posted by InfiniteDimensionality The dev team in reaper is not really interested in making reaper the best DAW. [...] Soon other DAW's will catch up to reapers feature set.
Is it the passion for Reaper besides your depise of stupidity and ignorance that makes you rage?

Masi

01-23-2019, 02:15 AM   #34
Masi
Human being with feelings

Join Date: Sep 2015
Posts: 637

Quote:
 Originally Posted by InfiniteDimensionality Yes, it did occur to me, I never said I was smart... in fact, I know I'm a dumbass, maybe you should ask yourself that question and the others who actually think they are smarter than they are...
I know that I'm not super intelligent and my knowledge (and experience) is limited. I just asked because I wanted to know how you judge yourself.

Quote:
 Originally Posted by InfiniteDimensionality It really is typical, you psychos come in and blame me when, in fact, I didn't start anything...
If that happens often to you you could consider two things. Either explore the possibility that you are a psycho yourself or to learn how to deal with psychos in a way that is less exhausting for you.

Masi

01-23-2019, 03:03 AM   #35
Bri1
Banned

Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: England
Posts: 2,432

Quote:
 Show me sine wave shape envelope builded from linear points for 8 beats in tempo envelope lane. Try to make it smooth, take your time.

lolz- how about you show how easy it is to create! ?
should take you no longer than 1 minute.. you know how reaper works,right?

01-23-2019, 04:04 PM   #36
InfiniteDimensionality
Human being with feelings

Join Date: Jun 2017
Posts: 176

Quote:
 Originally Posted by Masi I know that I'm not super intelligent and my knowledge (and experience) is limited. I just asked because I wanted to know how you judge yourself.
Which is moronic because you shouldn't give a shit about how I judge myself... What the fuck does that have anything to do with the thread? See, you think you are in some superior position to "judge" people when you come in to a thread that simply asks for a feature to add curves to the tempo map that has gotten so far off course as to now be totally meaningless...

See, if you really cared about anything having to do with this thread the questions and answers would be on topic... instead I'm having to defend myself in a way totally unrelated to the original topic because you decided to jump on the band wagon and be a judge.

Quote:
 If that happens often to you you could consider two things. Either explore the possibility that you are a psycho yourself or to learn how to deal with psychos in a way that is less exhausting for you. Masi
Given your superior psychoanalysis, you would think you realize you too are a psycho? We are all psychopaths.. it is not a matter of aye or nay but by amount. So your false dichotomy doesn't apply. In any case, I think humans beings in particular would want to reduce as much psychopathy as possible, right? One way to do that is not let people believe they are right when in fact they are wrong.

When someone tells someone they are wrong and proves it, it should be a joyous moment because now both parties involved have improved the universe... When someone tells someone they are wrong and proves it the person that was wrong instead becomes offended and insulted because...

Well, precisely because they are psychopaths... they have a god complex. "I DARE YOU QUESTION MY INTELLIGENCE" is exactly what they are saying... because only god's intelligence can't be questioned.

So, it is my duty, and yours too if you actually care about yourself, your family, and humanity, you wouldn't participate in the wrong side. One of the reasons there are so many psychopaths today is precisely from people not stepping up and tell them they are wrong... instead they are allowed to continue believing the very thing that makes them a problem for themselves and society.

It's actually very honorable and courageous to prove to someone they are wrong... that is the only way most people can grow. Instead, what is honorable and courageous is to get offended.

The fact is, and if you cared enough to do your research before jumping to any possible conclusions:

1. I posted a statement about a feature request.
2. It was immediately shot down as impossible.
3. I defended that it was possible and provably possible by logical recourse.
4. I then get jumped on about all kinds of irrelevant shit.
5. You then decide that it's your job to psychoanalyze me... yet have you mentioned anything about the people who actually decided to derail this topic?

See, you think it is your job to "put me in my place" by proving something... the problem is, you failed to actually do your due diligence and understand what actually happened....

If you really care and care about resolving the problem in a meaningful way then go read the topic from start to finish and find out and then point out the issues and who has them. Also, you must truly understand the feature and it's issues related to it or it is pointless as you will just go with your emotions and side with who ever you relate to the most...

Truth above feelings!

Last edited by InfiniteDimensionality; 01-23-2019 at 05:04 PM.

01-24-2019, 01:12 AM   #37
Masi
Human being with feelings

Join Date: Sep 2015
Posts: 637

Quote:
 Originally Posted by InfiniteDimensionality Which is moronic because you shouldn't give a shit about how I judge myself... What the fuck does that have anything to do with the thread?
Absolutely nothing. I continue to post here only for my personal amusement.

Masi

 01-24-2019, 02:12 AM #38 Bri1 Banned   Join Date: Dec 2016 Location: England Posts: 2,432 heheh-- wow-must have members who credit me with the ignore button-- thanx4 da compliments peoples=luvs ya.! i think the request is quite feasible-doable-npz-- the real 'problem' is lack of knowledge of veteran users even+ ignorance factors.. @strachupl - tbh i could show you in less than 1 min-but then-your not doing the thinking for yourself are you?-- just be sure it's easily done...get to learning if your interested m8 carry on.
01-24-2019, 04:06 AM   #39
strachupl
Human being with feelings

Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 394

Quote:
 Originally Posted by Bri1 heheh-- wow-must have members who credit me with the ignore button-- thanx4 da compliments peoples=luvs ya.! i think the request is quite feasible-doable-npz-- the real 'problem' is lack of knowledge of veteran users even+ ignorance factors.. @strachupl - tbh i could show you in less than 1 min-but then-your not doing the thinking for yourself are you?-- just be sure it's easily done...get to learning if your interested m8 carry on.
You are talking much but meaning shit.
Stop talking shit, show the envelope shape you claiming we easily can do.
__________________
The truth is not in the middle but exactly where it is.

01-24-2019, 04:57 AM   #40
InfiniteDimensionality
Human being with feelings

Join Date: Jun 2017
Posts: 176

Quote:
 Originally Posted by Masi Absolutely nothing. I continue to post here only for my personal amusement. Masi
Obviously...

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