New EuCon project

[Geoff Waddington]

Originally Posted by Funkybot

Geoff, are we expected to be able to assign sends in Channel mode with this implementation?

This video covers that functionality in Pro Tools (Send talk starts at 2 minutes): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xu2s56asC4g&t=291s

The same method works in Cubase.

Not sure if it's intended or planned for this Reaper integration but figured I'd ask since I tried last night and couldn't get it going. The Channel Mode showed the selected channel sends, but there didn't seem to be a way to press both page buttons to enter an assignment mode.

Planned, but down the road.

Any of the assign type stuff, inputs, sends, etc., will follow after FX Custom Knobs

[Funkybot]

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

Planned, but down the road.

Any of the assign type stuff, inputs, sends, etc., will follow after FX Custom Knobs

Sounds good! Thanks for clarifying. And thanks for all the Eucon support. Things are feeling really good at the moment.

[RobinGShore]

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

Excellent !!
I don't think there is way to have a "display only" EuCon automation mode, let's leave it as a low priority bug for now, cool ?

Sounds good, this is definitely more of an annoyance than a bug.

New build is up.

EuCon Exp.zip

Fixed timeline offset bug.

Confriming that the timecode bug is now fixed. Thanks!

[BenMeyers]

Hey, I just saw you posted an alpha of the new project. I just want to ensure, do you install it the same way as the CSI Eucon stuff?

Thanks...

[Funkybot]

Originally Posted by BenMeyers

Hey, I just saw you posted an alpha of the new project. I just want to ensure, do you install it the same way as the CSI Eucon stuff?

Thanks...

Pretty much. After you download the new Eucon beta from the 1st post of this thread just...

1. Copy the .dll or .dylib into the [Reaper resource path]\User Plugins\ folder

2. Then copy the entire Eucon folder from the zip into the main Reaper resource path

3. Open Reaper

4. Go to Preferences -> Control\OSC\Web

5. Click Add to add a new Surface

6. Select Eucon from the list

7. Ok your way out of there to save everything

Note: if you had any other previous versions of Eucon (either from CSI or the older Alpha), then I'd probably remove those .dll/.dylib files from the User Plugins folder first.

[Productionsfl]

Thanx so much for this Geoff! I was going to revert to mackie emu because of loading time and stumbled on this.
Loading time is incredible here on my 150 track templates /projects.

One problem I have had all along is that selecting a track on the artist control touchscreen does not scroll to the selected track in reaper (tcp or mcp). It selects the track correctly but the tcp and mcp do not scroll to view.

Using latest reaper and euconntrol (Artist Conrol, Artist Mix and Avid Control)

[reinaldo]

Awesome job! Just started using it on my Avid S1. So far it's great. I'll be reporting back any findings.

Thanks so much for this!

[BenMeyers]

I have to say you guys really impress me. I just set up the template for our broadcast for church and did a mix of this past Sunday's worship set in it and the Avid Control app works great with the newest Eucon stuff. The old one crashed, and CSI the track names committed seppuku 30 seconds in. The only thing not there is meters. I thought I saw them this morning when I first tried it though? Great work. Keep it up! Thanks to you we'll be able to use Reaper instead of Pro Tools after all at church.

[Geoff Waddington]

Anyone mind if set the minimum Mac OS to Catalina ?

[RobinGShore]

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

Anyone mind if set the minimum Mac OS to Catalina ?

I'm still on Mojave, but it's probably about time I upgrade anyways. Do what you gotta do.

[Geoff Waddington]

Originally Posted by RobinGShore

I'm still on Mojave, but it's probably about time I upgrade anyways. Do what you gotta do.

Cool, found a way to get around it for now, but it is inevitable...

[Geoff Waddington]

Just a quick FYI on FX.

As has been stated you must supply default maps to get Custom Knobs to work.

The primitive basics of this are operational, a bit of manual intervention is required, unfortunately.

If you want an FX map, just like in CSI, you toggle FX write on, only this time it's EuCon FX write -- Cmd+Opt+7 on my machine.

Then just insert an FX, and you will have a starting point in EuCon/FXZones:

VST: UAD Pultec MEQ-5 (Universal Audio, Inc.)
VST: UAD Pultec MEQ-5 (Universal Audio, Inc.)
2 0 LM Freq
2 1 LM Peak
2 2 Mid Freq
2 3 Mid Dip
2 4 HM Freq
2 5 HM Peak
2 6 Enable
2 7 Output
2 8 Bypass
2 9 Wet

The second line is a duplicate of the first, usually very long, plugin name.
You should change this second line to something more readable, it will be used for displays.

After the second line there is the pattern:

The first number is the thermometer type 0 - 6
0 = off
1 = ring point
2 = left
3 = right
4 = center
5 = center anchored
6 = center inverse

The second number is the parameter number and should be left untouched.

The next item is the param name, you can edit this if you wish, it is used for display only.

This will provide you with a default map that you can then customize.

Is this too onerous ?

Can't think of a simpler way to do the definitions.

[Heb]

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

Excellent !!



I don't think there is way to have a "display only" EuCon automation mode, let's leave it as a low priority bug for now, cool ?

First of all thank you for picking up the work on eucon again, been using the old beta and an artist mix + avid control app for several years now.
The new version is much faster.
Unfortunately I use latch preview all the time, always in global mode, but with the latest release of the new version Reaper crashes as soon as I enable latch preview.
It doesn't matter if I enable it in reaper or trigger it with an action set up on a softkey in eucon, and it only happens when the control app is active.
If eucon is enabled but not connected to any surface I can enable latch preview in reaper without it crashing.
That is unfortunately a showstopper for me

I never had any problems with it in the old Beta.

[Heb]

Originally Posted by RobinGShore

Automation buttons on the dock are working great now, Thanks!

I use latch-preview all the time in Reaper (I think most people doing post-production stuff probably do), but I emulate the Pro Tools methodology, and only ever use it as a global override, never as an individual track mode. Tracks are usually touch, latch, or read, and when I need latch-preview I turn it on globally then switch the global override back off when I'm done with it. With that in mind the way eucon is working in this latest build is pretty nice, as the mode cycle skips preview and only includes the modes I actually use on my tracks.

This is exactly how I use latch preview

[Geoff Waddington]

Originally Posted by Heb

First of all thank you for picking up the work on eucon again, been using the old beta and an artist mix + avid control app for several years now.
The new version is much faster.
Unfortunately I use latch preview all the time, always in global mode, but with the latest release of the new version Reaper crashes as soon as I enable latch preview.
It doesn't matter if I enable it in reaper or trigger it with an action set up on a softkey in eucon, and it only happens when the control app is active.
If eucon is enabled but not connected to any surface I can enable latch preview in reaper without it crashing.
That is unfortunately a showstopper for me

I never had any problems with it in the old Beta.

Cool, i will work on a solution.

[Geoff Waddington]

BREAKING CHANGE BREAKING CHANGE BREAKING CHANGE

New build is up.

EuCon Exp.zip


Make sure you get the new EuCon folder !!!



Baby steps toward Custom Knobs.

This doesn't actually let you control things yet, but it does let you do the configuration part, so thought it would be worth putting it up there for you to try.

1) With a working EuCon installation

2) Open project

3) Go Menu->Actions->Show action list... and type euc in the filter

4) Run "EuCon Toggle Write Params when FX inserted"

5) Insert a plugin you would like to map

6) Close Reaper -- no need to save

7) Go to EuCon/FXZones in the Reaper resource path.

8) You should see a .txt file with a garbled name to keep the filesystem happy that sort of resembles your plugin name

9) Open the file with a text editor

10) Change the second line to something readable for display -- it's like an alias

11) After those 2 lines all lines consists of 2 numbers and text, the first number is the thermometer/ring type 0 - 6 -- play with it and see what you get

12) DO NOT touch the second number -- that's the param number

13) The third item is the text reported by the plugin -- feel free to change it to suit your environment -- it is used for display only on your surfaces.

14) Run Reaper, and using the Control app or whatever you have, select Inserts -- you should see your plugin, and also all the parameters.

This is just a basic POC, but have a play and let me know what you think -- it is currently limited to 8 FX max.

[Funkybot]

Perhaps, a dumb question, I don't know how native Eucon FX work...but would the FX work in the Artist Mixes that don't support the Custom Knobs functionality? Just without the customization part?

[Geoff Waddington]

Originally Posted by Funkybot

Perhaps, a dumb question, I don't know how native Eucon FX work...but would the FX work in the Artist Mixes that don't support the Custom Knobs functionality? Just without the customization part?

Not sure, but I think so, and they may even be able to use Custom Knobs as well.

Don't know if you have it, but you should get the Avid Control app, it's free, and is much more in keeping with modern EuCon, still, the Mixes should be able to benefit from most of this -- just maybe not be able to config things as easily in the Mixes, not sure, but if I have this right, Custom Knobs you design in an 1x8 style in the app should be usable by the Mix... this is all new to me too

[Funkybot]

Geoff, the new Eucon Toggle Write action is a little inconsistent. It'll write once or twice then stop. Then I'll run it again, and it'll write once or twice then stop writing. And so on.

The FX appear on the Artist Mix displays in the order in the .txt files. Just don't actually do anything once mapped (but as you say, this is just a POC so probably intended).

[Funkybot]

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

but if I have this right, Custom Knobs you design in an 1x8 style in the app should be usable by the Mix... this is all new to me too

From what I read on Gearslutz, it sounds like Avid specifically excluded Custom Knobs from the Artist Mixes. So we'll see.

It's no biggie as I'm using other surfaces for FX anyway but this is a pretty slick way to get create auto-FX maps. Definitely handy. POC passed IMO!

[Geoff Waddington]

New build is up.

EuCon Exp.zip

The plugin you want to map must now be first in the Track.

So if you have ten plugins, just create 10 Tracks, and drop one per Track.

This seems to cure the intermittent behaviour.

[Geoff Waddington]

Originally Posted by Funkybot

From what I read on Gearslutz, it sounds like Avid specifically excluded Custom Knobs from the Artist Mixes. So we'll see.

It's no biggie as I'm using other surfaces for FX anyway but this is a pretty slick way to get create auto-FX maps. Definitely handy. POC passed IMO!

Thanks, yeah, even though it requires some manual intervention, I can't see how to get it any more automated, some decisions simply must be made by users.

A GUI would probably help once we settle on things.

[RobinGShore]

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

Is this too onerous ?

Nah, this really isn't that bad at all. A little tedious for plugins with lots parameters that need name changes, but I don't see any way around that.

If there are parameters we don't care about using can we just delete those lines from the text file or will that break things?

Eucon shows all the plugins I've generated text files for as being present on every track, even if the tracks in Reaper don't have any plugins loaded. I know you're still in the early stages so I'm assuming this is already on the docket to be fixed, but I wanted to flag it anyways.

Changing the names of the plugin/parameters is working well. The different thermometer styles look like they're working, but it's hard to tell without being able to actually change the values.

it is currently limited to 8 FX max.

What happens if we try to generate more than 8 text files? Will it delete old ones or will or will it just stop working?

[Geoff Waddington]

Originally Posted by RobinGShore

Nah, this really isn't that bad at all. A little tedious for plugins with lots parameters that need name changes, but I don't see any way around that.

Cool, we will stay with this method, at least for now.

Originally Posted by RobinGShore

If there are parameters we don't care about using can we just delete those lines from the text file or will that break things?

Not sure, a better way, once we have Custom Knobs, is to leave them out that way.

Originally Posted by RobinGShore

Eucon shows all the plugins I've generated text files for as being present on every track, even if the tracks in Reaper don't have any plugins loaded. I know you're still in the early stages so I'm assuming this is already on the docket to be fixed, but I wanted to flag it anyways.

Yeah, this is very early, just trying things out, modifying the sample code and seeing what happens, that sort of stuff -- in other words I don't really have the first clue about what I'm doing... yet

This was more to confirm that we can have Reaper/CSI generate files that can be read and utilized by EuCon, on that I think we get to put a check mark

Originally Posted by RobinGShore

Changing the names of the plugin/parameters is working well. The different thermometer styles look like they're working, but it's hard to tell without being able to actually change the values.

Cool.

Originally Posted by RobinGShore

What happens if we try to generate more than 8 text files? Will it delete old ones or will or will it just stop working?

It maps the first 8 files it finds and just ignores the rest, you can have as many files present as you want, it will only read the first 8.

[Heb]

I think I've found a bug..
In the control app, if I solo or mute a track, the buttons need to be pressed twice to take the channels out of that state..

[Heb]

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

Cool, i will work on a solution.

Greatly appreciated!!

[somedolphin]

Hey Geoff this is amazing! Thanks for working on Eucon again for us

The basic track functions look good so far on the Artist Mix.
At first glance I see the vol meters aren't working but the rest looks good so far!

Also I tried plugin mapping which works ok but the parameter text is getting strangely cut off. Some longer words are displayed but short ones get cut off like "Wet" is dypayedd on the Artist Mix as "We".

Anyways thanks again for this gift!
Blessings..
Isaac

[introvert]

Hey, thanks for resurrecting this project!

I'm trying to get it going today and having a problem or two. This might be user error, I'm generally only using this setup in Pro Tools.

I've got an Avid Dock, S1, and a pair of tablets on them. I'm on MacOS Catalina, running Reaper 6.34 and using the copy of Eucon Exp I downloaded about 20 minutes ago.

When I select a track, the fader on the Dock always snaps back if I try to move it. If I move it on the S1 though, it updates and all is good, and the Dock fader will chase the S1 fader for the same track. Automation mode is off for all tracks in this scenario.

When I've got a project with more than 8 tracks in it, both control surfaces will stop following the selected track if it's beyond 8. It's like 8 is the limit that the control surface can address.

Any ideas?

And I'm happy to start using this every day for work and provide whatever feedback I can. I'm excited this is up and running again. Thank you!

[RobinGShore]

Originally Posted by introvert

Hey, thanks for resurrecting this project!
When I select a track, the fader on the Dock always snaps back if I try to move it. If I move it on the S1 though, it updates and all is good, and the Dock fader will chase the S1 fader for the same track. Automation mode is off for all tracks in this scenario.

I've got pretty much the same setup as you (I'm on Mojave instead of Catalina, but everything else is the same) and I'm not seeing this. The Dock fader work as expected when I move it, and doesn't snap back, and both s1 and dock faders will "chase" each other if they're controlling the same track. Maybe there's a preference in Eucontrol you need to change?

When I've got a project with more than 8 tracks in it, both control surfaces will stop following the selected track if it's beyond 8. It's like 8 is the limit that the control surface can address.

I'm seeing what I think is the same thing. It's not that eucon can't see beyond 8 tracks, but the attention fader on the dock only works for tracks that are currently being displayed on the S1. If my S1 is showing tracks 1-8, I can select any of those tracks in Reaper and the dock fader will follow the selection, but if I select track 9 or higher in Reaper it won't work. If I bank the S1 to the next set of 8 tracks, I can get tracks 9-16 to come up on the dock, but now the dock won't follow selection for tracks 1-8 since they are no longer shown on the s1. This is not how it should work. The expected behavior is that the dock fader should follow whatever track I select in Reaper whether or not that track is currently being displayed on the s1.

Geoff, you should be able to see this behavior even if all you have is an artist mix and no dock. Go into the Eucontrol settings on your computer and in the Assign tab, change one of the faders from "auto assigned" to "attentioned track". The attentioned track should show whatever track you have selected in Reaper, but you'll see that it only works for tracks that are already being displayed on the surface.

[introvert]

Originally Posted by RobinGShore

I've got pretty much the same setup as you (I'm on Mojave instead of Catalina, but everything else is the same) and I'm not seeing this. The Dock fader work as expected when I move it, and doesn't snap back, and both s1 and dock faders will "chase" each other if they're controlling the same track. Maybe there's a preference in Eucontrol you need to change?

This was some issue with the Dock. I discovered it was misbehaving in Pro Tools as well, and after some tinkering with the EuCon software it's now behaving. So please disregard.

The rest of what you wrote sounds like it reflects what I'm seeing. Thanks for digging more into it!

[RobinGShore]

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

Not sure, a better way, once we have Custom Knobs, is to leave them out that way.

Custom knobs is already working actually (if you open a plugin in the app you can rearrange/exclude parameters). I was more asking about this as a way to prefilter the parameters before using custom knobs. The custom knobs interface is much easier to use when starting with less parameters, and deleting stuff from the text file is quicker than hunting and pecking through a long list of parameters in the app.

I know it's still early and you're figuring things out as you go, but something that's missing from the fx text files right now is the ability to assign parameters to the Sel and In buttons. The basic unit of the custom knobs feature in Eucon is not the individual knob, but the "knob cell" which consists of the knob as well as the two buttons, and a display. The text file is able to address the knob and the display (name and thermometer), but not the two buttons. Custom Knobs let's you rearrange knob cells that are included in the default map (i.e the text file) but it doesn't let you define new ones, which means for now there's no way to assign parameters to the two buttons. I know it'll make the text files more complicated to deal with, but I'm hoping you can find a way to include the buttons in them. Being able to use those two buttons in fx maps is really nice and makes for much more compact maps.

[Geoff Waddington]

Originally Posted by RobinGShore

I've got pretty much the same setup as you (I'm on Mojave instead of Catalina, but everything else is the same) and I'm not seeing this. The Dock fader work as expected when I move it, and doesn't snap back, and both s1 and dock faders will "chase" each other if they're controlling the same track. Maybe there's a preference in Eucontrol you need to change?




I'm seeing what I think is the same thing. It's not that eucon can't see beyond 8 tracks, but the attention fader on the dock only works for tracks that are currently being displayed on the S1. If my S1 is showing tracks 1-8, I can select any of those tracks in Reaper and the dock fader will follow the selection, but if I select track 9 or higher in Reaper it won't work. If I bank the S1 to the next set of 8 tracks, I can get tracks 9-16 to come up on the dock, but now the dock won't follow selection for tracks 1-8 since they are no longer shown on the s1. This is not how it should work. The expected behavior is that the dock fader should follow whatever track I select in Reaper whether or not that track is currently being displayed on the s1.

Geoff, you should be able to see this behavior even if all you have is an artist mix and no dock. Go into the Eucontrol settings on your computer and in the Assign tab, change one of the faders from "auto assigned" to "attentioned track". The attentioned track should show whatever track you have selected in Reaper, but you'll see that it only works for tracks that are already being displayed on the surface.

Thanks, will have a look.

[Geoff Waddington]

Originally Posted by RobinGShore

Custom knobs is already working actually (if you open a plugin in the app you can rearrange/exclude parameters). I was more asking about this as a way to prefilter the parameters before using custom knobs. The custom knobs interface is much easier to use when starting with less parameters, and deleting stuff from the text file is quicker than hunting and pecking through a long list of parameters in the app.

Give it a try and see what happens

I don't know how effectively the logic coded thus far deals with non contiguous param nums that's all, so beware

Originally Posted by RobinGShore

I know it's still early and you're figuring things out as you go, but something that's missing from the fx text files right now is the ability to assign parameters to the Sel and In buttons. The basic unit of the custom knobs feature in Eucon is not the individual knob, but the "knob cell" which consists of the knob as well as the two buttons, and a display. The text file is able to address the knob and the display (name and thermometer), but not the two buttons. Custom Knobs let's you rearrange knob cells that are included in the default map (i.e the text file) but it doesn't let you define new ones, which means for now there's no way to assign parameters to the two buttons. I know it'll make the text files more complicated to deal with, but I'm hoping you can find a way to include the buttons in them. Being able to use those two buttons in fx maps is really nice and makes for much more compact maps.

Yup, I know knob cells well, just haven't completed things yet

We use 0-6 for thermometer styles, why don't we just use 7 for In and 8 for Sel ?

See any holes with that approach ?

[Geoff Waddington]

New build is up.

EuCon Exp.zip

Hopefully fixes the attentioned Track bug.

[RobinGShore]

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

We use 0-6 for thermometer styles, why don't we just use 7 for In and 8 for Sel ?

See any holes with that approach ?

That sounds good on paper. I guess the best way to see if there are any holes is to give it a try

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

New build is up.

EuCon Exp.zip

Hopefully fixes the attentioned Track bug.

Yep, it's fixed. Thanks

[introvert]

Originally Posted by RobinGShore

Yep, it's fixed. Thanks

Working here too. Thank you sir!

[somedolphin]

Cool now it's not displaying the same plugin on every track! Thanks!
The plugin parameters text is still getting strangely cutoff.

I attached a screenshot so you can see what I mean.

[Productionsfl]

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

Anyone mind if set the minimum Mac OS to Catalina ?

I’m stuck on high Sierra but will definitely have to upgrade hardware in the next year… so I’ll follow as long as it doesn’t break!

[Mne]

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

Anyone mind if set the minimum Mac OS to Catalina ?

High Sierra here too

[Nick Morris]

been away for a bit with projects, but just had a chance to try this new eucon version. Geoff, this is a great step forward in responsiveness and definitely see this more "eucon" approach being a better fit outide of CSI.

Noticed metering is still not there yet, and lot of talk about custom knobs. What are custom knobs? I am testing on an artist mix so it might not even apply?