View Poll Results: Post-Fader FX?
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Sounds great!
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No way.
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6.11% |
01-15-2019, 02:16 AM
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#161
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Mullet
Posts: 829
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So...it took me like 5 minutes to copy the airwindows code into a JSFX and make a console plugin with faders...
Why he doesn’t put a gain fader on his ? pure stupidity, nothing else. There is no reason, real or imaginary, that he couldn’t put a gain on his plugins...so go bitch at him instead of making it reapers fault...
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01-15-2019, 03:25 AM
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#162
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 59
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and why will it be useful to have the gain in the plugin?
I'm not sure you understand the issue.
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01-15-2019, 03:32 AM
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#163
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Mullet
Posts: 829
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I understand perfectly...
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01-15-2019, 07:43 AM
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#164
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,978
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bezusheist
So...it took me like 5 minutes to copy the airwindows code into a JSFX and make a console plugin with faders...
Why he doesn’t put a gain fader on his ? pure stupidity, nothing else. There is no reason, real or imaginary, that he couldn’t put a gain on his plugins...so go bitch at him instead of making it reapers fault...
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Any chance you will share that JSFX console plugin with us, please? :-D
Thanks ;-)
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01-15-2019, 08:09 AM
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#165
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Mullet
Posts: 829
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attached is the first version of console. all other versions share the same basic function (sin(x) > asin(x)). there is an input gain for the channel and an output gain for the buss.
you can change the gain range by editing the code...
i could do the other versions but honestly i don't feel like trying to sort through his clusterfuck of code to get the important stuff.
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01-15-2019, 08:21 AM
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#166
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 642
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bezusheist
I understand perfectly...
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With all due respect - nope.
Your argument was already mentioned by mschnell.
If you don' t need faders for mixing then this might be perfect for you but there other people out there and they might work in a way you cannot imagine.
Edit: But thanks for the efforts and bumping the thread also. :-)
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01-15-2019, 08:24 AM
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#167
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Mullet
Posts: 829
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i was specifically talking about the airwindows stuff...(replying to poster)
(having the gain w/in the plugin)
(*the guy is an idiot for releasing a gain dependent plug-in without a gain control...)
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01-15-2019, 08:50 AM
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#168
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 642
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bezusheist
i was specifically talking about the airwindows stuff...(replying to poster)
(having the gain w/in the plugin)
(*the guy is an idiot for releasing a gain dependent plug-in without a gain control...)
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Personally for me the gain in the plugin wouldn't change much - still can't use the faders and have to open up a plugin window just to change the volume of a track.
Calling someone an idiot because of this is a bit much don't you think?
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01-15-2019, 09:23 AM
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#169
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 59
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Still believe the gain in the plugin is totally useless.
I mix with faders, like I believe most people do.
If I want to open a plugin to set the level of the track I will probably anyway use something else but this is not the topic.
So, in case I'm stupid and don't understand what you mean, please explain why a Gain (while I think gain is not the right thing, it is probably a trim what you mean) will solve the issue with Airwindows Console.
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01-15-2019, 09:32 AM
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#170
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Mullet
Posts: 829
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulRain
So, in case I'm stupid and don't understand what you mean, please explain why a Gain (while I think gain is not the right thing, it is probably a trim what you mean) will solve the issue with Airwindows Console.
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no, i mean gain...it goes both ways (+/-).
the "real" issue, and not some personal preference issue, is that you need to control the input level to the "channel". you can do that with a gain slider/knob in the plug-in or the DAW, it makes no difference... technically.
so, no, it does not solve the personal preference issue...but it does solve the "real" issue.
edit: i guess post fader efx is the best answer to the overall problem
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Last edited by bezusheist; 01-16-2019 at 03:00 AM.
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01-15-2019, 09:51 AM
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#171
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 59
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I'm probably missing something.
As far as I understand what I need is a way to not change the level of the signal between Console Channel and Console Buss, the Gain in the plugin still, for what I understand, does not solve anything.
If the Gain control in the plugin is before the coding it will mess up the gain-staging, if it is after the coding it will mess up the relationship between Channel and Buss.
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01-16-2019, 02:48 AM
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#172
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 124
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Post fader inserts would make me a happy man...
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03-04-2019, 11:57 AM
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#173
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Oct 2018
Posts: 202
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posted a new thread about this, but then I found this one... oops.
So i'll add my plus one.
ahem....
+1
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03-04-2019, 02:51 PM
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#174
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: UK
Posts: 40
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This would definitely make my workflow easier, so a +1 from me.
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04-15-2019, 12:11 PM
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#175
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Cologne
Posts: 1,636
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crucial for binaural mixes
I want to give this a bump again. I'm doing binaural stuff at the moment and really need this feature for that for a simple reason: the binaural panner has to be post-fader. Otherwise sends (to reverbs e.g.) won't work, as the stereo reverb needs a "normal" signal that is binauralized after processing. Sending a binaural signal to a reverb will result in a strang sounding reverb that has to be binauralized again...
Off course you can add tracks that sit between the source track and the fx track and are used for binaural panning only (and pre-fx send the signal to the reverb). But as you need a binaural panner on every track, you'd have to create one "workaround-track" for EVERY channel.
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05-27-2019, 06:39 PM
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#176
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 37
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+1 Yep. Yep yep!
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05-27-2019, 10:19 PM
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#177
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Krefeld, Germany
Posts: 14,690
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gass n Klang
I'm doing binaural stuff at the moment and really need this feature for that for a simple reason: the binaural panner has to be post-fader.
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This is (the only ?) really decent reason for post Fader FX I heard of, but as I do think it's really worthwhile, I do support it even though I'm sure I'll never use something like this.
But I think an additional "Post Fader FX" chain is not a too nice option. It might be more desirable and "Reaperish" and obvious to have a kind of "Fader" pseudo FX that can be placed in any location of the FX chain and can be routed via the normal pin-routing means - and at best would be able to receive Midi (and also automation and "Learn") messages in the normal way, any plugin is handled by the Reaper infrastructure.
Also see this request -> https://forum.cockos.com/showthread....0&page=30#1169
-Michael
Last edited by mschnell; 04-12-2020 at 02:14 AM.
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05-30-2019, 06:49 PM
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#178
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2018
Posts: 113
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ReaDave
Can't believe I missed this one. So, a big +1 from me on this too.
This is great......
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The whole mixer area of Mixbus\32C is a workflow masterpiece.
Ability to recreate it in Reaper would be fantastic.
Sadly Reapers devs have the mentality to complicate things instead of simplifying. Otherwise they would be counting the number of clicks needed to perform this or that=production time and fatigue (and medical costs to repair carpal tunnel syndrome or stiff neck syndrome).
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06-02-2019, 09:46 PM
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#179
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Krefeld, Germany
Posts: 14,690
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ANDYZ
Sadly Reapers devs have the mentality to complicate things instead of simplifying.
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Welcome to the Reaper forums !
"Simplified" necessarily dictates a dedicated predefined workflow. Happily there are DAWs to do this for users who like exactly this kind of workflow..
Allowing the user to choose / define his or her own workflow necessarily needs a higher degree of complexity. Exactly this is what we love Reaper for,.
-Michael
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06-02-2019, 09:56 PM
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#180
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2018
Posts: 113
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mschnell
Welcome to the Reaper forums !
"Simplified" necessarily dictates a dedicated predefined workflow. Happily there are DAWs to do this for users who like exactly this kind of workflow..
Allowing the user to choose / define his or her own workflow necessarily needs a higher degree of complexity. Exactly this is what we love Reaper for,.
-Michael
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But Michael...I need MORE complexity that it is now to allow to refine\create simple workflow aka Mixbus mixer.
Id like to have means to design in-mixer channelstrips that look good and easy to use from the mixing standpoint. Meaning less clicks and more flow. Exactly as Harrison Mixbus did.
I am very content with Reapers edit window possibilities, just dont like mixer window for now.
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06-03-2019, 03:46 PM
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#181
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Krefeld, Germany
Posts: 14,690
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I have no experience with doing Reaper GUI design and edit-mode scripting. But I do know that incredible stuff is possible.
Regarding the Mixer design, did you check out the "HEDA mixer" -> https://reaper.hector-corcin.com/app/hedamixer ?
-Michael
Last edited by mschnell; 06-03-2019 at 03:55 PM.
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06-03-2019, 04:45 PM
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#182
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2018
Posts: 113
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mschnell
I have no experience with doing Reaper GUI design and edit-mode scripting. But I do know that incredible stuff is possible.
Regarding the Mixer design, did you check out the "HEDA mixer" -> https://reaper.hector-corcin.com/app/hedamixer ?
-Michael
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I am new to the forum but not new to Reaper at all. I think I checked every possible customization/script/theme, its a fun by itself. I run Symbiosis theme which was the only one I was able to connect to.
The design representation of the software is not clicking with me, Id say Reaper vibe resembles a pile of random dusty tools in a rusty shed instead of neat well-organized production shop.
Reaper is way ahead in possibilities over other DAWs and it makes it a great DAW. I am sure one day it will be possible (because why not?) to design what I would like it to have:
Harrison Mixbus\32C mixer window workflow because I am spoiled by how it feels and looks, especially the fact that I dont need to open countless windows (Reapers FX parameters/sends suck now because they are too small and crowded and not customizable in size, so yeah I miss the channelstrip deep design option):
I hope the devs and users will read this post and support this option of workflow.
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06-03-2019, 10:41 PM
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#183
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Krefeld, Germany
Posts: 14,690
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I seem to understand that a new feature that is going to be in the released version soon is the possibility to use scripts in the GUI design. This might help to give you the possibility to create something like you describe.
(As said I am not an expert on this at all.)
-Michael
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06-04-2019, 02:24 AM
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#184
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Belgium
Posts: 10,474
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With routing flexibilty of REAPER, Post Fader FX is not so useful
IMHO, it will bring more problem (with sends) than solution
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06-04-2019, 07:08 AM
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#185
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Krefeld, Germany
Posts: 14,690
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reno.thestraws
IMHO, it will bring more problem (with sends) than solution
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That is why a Gain/Pan pseudo plugin (defining the location and routing of the fader in the current FX-chain) seems to make more sense than an additional FX-chain behind the traditional fader.
-Michael
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06-16-2019, 02:50 PM
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#186
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mschnell
That is why a Gain/Pan pseudo plugin (defining the location and routing of the fader in the current FX-chain) seems to make more sense than an additional FX-chain behind the traditional fader.
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I don't know that anyone has proposed a unanimously perfect solution. I think the simplest way is just to have the same drop down menu on FX as there is on sends. If the default is pre-fader, people who don't dig the idea wouldn't even notice. "Simplest" in terms of GUI, I mean - I think something would've been implemented by now if it didn't imply routing madness behind the scenes, heh.
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"Recording engineers do not die. They are dragged into the earth by the sheer weight of their balls." -- Malcolm Chisholm 1929-2003
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06-16-2019, 10:05 PM
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#187
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Krefeld, Germany
Posts: 14,690
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As it seems that you easily can do a plugin that is a fader/pan on it's own behalf - but of course does not show it's GUI where we are accustomed to see the fader and pan knobs, the Audio routing seems straight forward, while the "Gui linkage" is a new concept.
Maybe the most flexible way would be to have such a plugin - providing Volume and "Pan" with two or more channels - that can be placed wherever you like - even multiple times -, and features it's own GUI - allowing the usual "atomation" etc parameter linking -, and additionally features a "Main Volume" toggle option, that links it to the track's basic Volume/pan controls, while disabling the traditional function of these.
-Michael
Last edited by mschnell; 06-16-2019 at 10:12 PM.
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06-17-2019, 03:07 AM
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#188
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 642
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mschnell
That is why a Gain/Pan pseudo plugin (defining the location and routing of the fader in the current FX-chain) seems to make more sense than an additional FX-chain behind the traditional fader.
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In principle both variants you are describing will end up being the same. The Mixbus screenshots shows a simple but perfect solution already.
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07-27-2019, 09:18 AM
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#189
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Nov 2018
Posts: 57
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With post-fader FX you can set plugins as clippers, so you get analog console style of mixing
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07-27-2019, 10:09 AM
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#190
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 1,701
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+1 Yet another vote for this. For those of us that need this, there is no suitable workaround. Doing this via sends for every single track is an absolute nightmare.
Think about it. You have a virtual instrument. You want to do a simple volume ride into the efx. Virtual instrument is pre-fader, efx are post fader. I ride the track fader and I'm sending more or less of the virtual instrument into the efx. Job done.
Here's the alternative. I have my track with a virtual instrument. There is only pre-fader FX. So to ride the level into other EFX I need to create a second track and put the efx on that track. I then need to create a send to that track and then instead of riding the track volume fader, I'm riding a send level.
Ok, now multiply that by 1000 for those of us that use film scoring templates. That is in no way tidy or convenient. It is a gigantic mess at that point. I understand some of you don't need it. But some of you also don't need midi, or timecode or video. Doesn't mean that the feature is not sorely needed. It is.
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07-27-2019, 10:27 AM
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#191
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Dec 2016
Posts: 876
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Limiter post fx
This would be super useful so the user could put s limiter on a track post fader and if the user went over 0db the limiter could safe gaurd against clipping the track.
Depending on what pan law is set, it is possible to clip a track by panning the audio. It would be nice to be able to limit that clip on the track level.
This would also be useful when riding the track fader into a compressor.
There should be a check box in the io section of the FX that allows the plugin to be post fader. This would then move the plugin at the bottom of the FX chain and process post fader and pan.
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07-27-2019, 10:35 AM
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#192
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Black Forest
Posts: 5,054
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Yes, pleeeeease, this would be such a timesaver and tremendously increase the workflow!
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08-02-2019, 05:29 AM
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#193
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Arse end of the earth.
Posts: 2,988
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Tough call, but i'm predicting Tools new album will be out before this gets implemented.
13 years, wow.
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08-08-2019, 02:26 PM
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#194
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 34
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As for the Master Bus (don't know if that has been already suggested):
1. Create a track, call it "Master Trim" or something.
2. Route everything to it, take everything off the Master except the Master Trim.
3. Put the plugins you want pre on the Trim channel, post plugins go on the Master channel. The Master stays at 0, fades are done with the trim. There you go, post fader effects on the Master Bus.
I think it would be nice to have a post fader option, although I wouldn't see any benefit for me. Also have the before mentioned Mixbus... sounds great but other than that is pure nightmare
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08-08-2019, 08:38 PM
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#195
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2018
Posts: 375
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Life would be too easy if I didn't have to constantly reposition my post-FX EQ's.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Billoon
Tough call, but i'm predicting Tools new album will be out before this gets implemented.
13 years, wow.
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lmao
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11-27-2019, 01:31 AM
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#196
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2018
Posts: 4
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If I understand correctly, Reaper 6 is closing inn. Would love to see the devs give some attention to this. a configuration similar to mixbus would be great, but not important (to me atleast). If they only added a way to easily set up a post-fader fx, I would be forever grateful.
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11-27-2019, 06:22 AM
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#197
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: Quebec, Canada
Posts: 550
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So if I move a track fader down and it has a send to a reverb, the send will be unaffected?
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12-30-2019, 12:43 PM
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#198
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 164
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+1
Needed without a doubt -- it's in most other DAWs for a very great reason.
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12-31-2019, 11:12 AM
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#199
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2019
Location: UK
Posts: 938
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+100 on this. Reaper is so flexible and powerful, yet we're missing something as simple as post fader FX.
There are workarounds, but they defeat the point of Reaper: maximisation, tailored workflow and efficiency.
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12-31-2019, 11:32 AM
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#200
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2019
Posts: 853
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Agreed. I'd like to see a post fader section of the mixer, just like the sends or fx parameters section (with handles for resizing and hideable). This would mean I could set up my main channel EQ embedded in the mixer in the post fader section, and they will all be nicely lined up.
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