Old 05-02-2022, 06:43 AM   #41
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Default What's wrong with the volume meter?

Hey, great theme to start off, but even in your print screen, the db meter info doesn't match the fader position.
It always was that way until I installed this theme.
Why are they not aligned?
When I have the fader at 0dB I would also expect the scale next to it to reflect this. Is this something that can easily be changed in the settings somewhere?
Thanks for helping
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Old 05-03-2022, 06:46 AM   #42
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Beautiful theme!

Only a tiny gripe I have with it please - both play rate control and time signature are missing from the transport.

Any plans on including them?
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One issue for me is that the playback rate slider is missing form the transport bar.

Unzip the Peace theme and add the following to the TRANSPORT section of your rtconfig.txt file. Make sure to make a backup in case you screw something up, or you'll have to download and reinstall the theme.

set trans.curtimesig ?trans_flags&4 [720 10 50 32 0 0 0 0]
set trans.rate.fader w<1252 [0] ?trans_flags&2 [890 15 160 25 0 0 0 0]
set trans.rate.fader.fadermode [-1]
set trans.rate.fader.color [197 197 197 1]
set trans.rate ?trans_flags&2 [785 10 110 32 0 0 0 0]

Here's what it looks like:

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Old 05-03-2022, 07:04 AM   #43
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Since there's been no word from Ice Cold Milk in some time, and his comments on YouTube indicate disinterest in doing much more work on Peace, I respectfully submit some modifications I've made to the theme:

- time signature and rate controls
- better pan and width controls
- TCP track tinting
- nicer volume knob for the TCP in the standard layout
- some improvements to peak values display in MCP (cut-off values and color)
- better sizing for fxparms/sends & improved send dial

on Dropbox for now...

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Old 05-03-2022, 10:16 AM   #44
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Just a quick draft,
but this distribution will make much more sense to me..

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Old 05-03-2022, 11:08 AM   #45
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Gosh, this is one of the only theme that may make me move from the default v6, but the fact that tracks are not indented in the MCP is a real drawback for me. It really gives a clear view on my signal flow when mixing, as I use folders a lot.

Anybody could indicate me how to add/restore it by modding the theme ? Thanks !
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Old 05-03-2022, 11:11 AM   #46
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Just a quick draft,
but this distribution will make much more sense to me..

I'd rather just swap volume label and width, and then put pan above width and done... This uses more space, which eliminates my primary reason for using this theme.
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Old 05-03-2022, 11:25 AM   #47
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Another option..

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Old 05-03-2022, 12:09 PM   #48
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A couple ideas for the Transport..





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Old 05-03-2022, 12:54 PM   #49
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Here's what I'm talking about. Honestly, I don't really care about how this stuff is organized, as long as it's always in the same place and easy to find. Yes, phase belongs with pan/width conceptually. But making that work with these theme elements is enough of a pain that I'm probably not going to bother (as you can see, the element label backgrounds all need attention to look good in this arrangement). I just want something I can use painlessly.

I do like this arrangement, though:



It matches the MCP arrangement and is clear. When the track height gets too shallow to show the volume slider, pan is replaced by the text volume, like this:

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Old 05-03-2022, 01:02 PM   #50
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great theme and great modifications. Thanks!
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Old 05-04-2022, 01:45 AM   #51
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Here is an updated modification with the reorganized elements as shown above, in case you prefer that. Let me know if you run into any problems!

UPDATE: theme updated in-place (fix some niggles)
UPDATE AGAIN: theme updated in-place again (fix some more niggles, some MCP work) -- now there's only a single version with the reorganized elements, which is what I'll work from moving forward.
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Old 05-04-2022, 04:37 AM   #52
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great job !

now the transport thing s
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Old 05-04-2022, 12:34 PM   #53
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one thing I would like to see is a layout option where you can show/hide the width fader. I hate this thing
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Old 05-04-2022, 12:43 PM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by permeke View Post
one thing I would like to see is a layout option where you can show/hide the width fader. I hate this thing
It's pretty useful for stereo sources which lean to one side or another. But I hear you -- I saw that FTC's Echolot mod has a switch to show/hide it. Anyway, I'm probably not going to make that layout anytime soon, but if someone were to jump on it, I guess the phase button could go in its place.

Big thanks to Ice Cold Milk for this really nice theme.
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Old 05-04-2022, 03:08 PM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sockmonkey72 View Post
Here is an updated modification with the reorganized elements as shown above, in case you prefer that. Let me know if you run into any problems!

UPDATE: theme updated in-place (fix some niggles)
is it expected that the db scale next to the faders doesn't match the actual scale of the fader's position?
shouldn't the scale show 0db where the fader is at 0db?
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Old 05-04-2022, 09:40 PM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chiefthomson View Post
is it expected that the db scale next to the faders doesn't match the actual scale of the fader's position?
shouldn't the scale show 0db where the fader is at 0db?
EDIT: I think this is a visual misunderstanding. 18dB headroom before 0db digital clipping is pretty standard, so having a -18dB(FS) reference level on the meters makes sense to me (aside: the default metering goes up to +6dB, since clipping won't actually occur until the signal hits the DACs at the master -- you can just reduce the level at the master in that case and you haven't lost anything. Thanks 64-bit floating point mixing engine!).

What's confusing in this case is just that the volume label then uses 0dB to indicate unity, and then shows a relative dB increase or decrease of amplitude.

The meter scale, although it's right next to the volume fader, is actually completely decoupled from what that fader does. The meter is showing the track's output in dbFS. The volume fader/label show merely a relative dB increase/decrease from unity. As long as your levels are hot enough for recording and not clipping at output after mixing, the numbers shouldn't matter. I find the volume label indicator more useful, in fact, since I know what +-6dB is going to do to my audio, whereas the metering doesn't help me much beyond showing that my levels are very hot or quiet.

From a theming perspective, you can position the volume fader anywhere, it doesn't have to be right next to the meter, that's just how most people do it. I understand why the conceptual disconnect is confusing, but that's just the way it's designed. This is pretty much the same across all themes I have tried -- when the volume fader is directly next to the meter scale label and approximately the same height, unity gain's fader position is close to the -18dB reference level -- but once again, they actually have nothing to do with one another.
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Old 05-04-2022, 11:43 PM   #57
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Here's a quick mock-up of how visually decoupling the volume fader from the meter would look. Obviously it's terrible, but should give you a better idea of what I'm talking about. Not planning to do this, though.

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Old 05-05-2022, 04:19 AM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sockmonkey72 View Post
EDIT: I think this is a visual misunderstanding. 18dB headroom before 0db digital clipping is pretty standard, so having a -18dB(FS) reference level on the meters makes sense to me (aside: the default metering goes up to +6dB, since clipping won't actually occur until the signal hits the DACs at the master -- you can just reduce the level at the master in that case and you haven't lost anything. Thanks 64-bit floating point mixing engine!).

What's confusing in this case is just that the volume label then uses 0dB to indicate unity, and then shows a relative dB increase or decrease of amplitude.

The meter scale, although it's right next to the volume fader, is actually completely decoupled from what that fader does. The meter is showing the track's output in dbFS. The volume fader/label show merely a relative dB increase/decrease from unity. As long as your levels are hot enough for recording and not clipping at output after mixing, the numbers shouldn't matter. I find the volume label indicator more useful, in fact, since I know what +-6dB is going to do to my audio, whereas the metering doesn't help me much beyond showing that my levels are very hot or quiet.

From a theming perspective, you can position the volume fader anywhere, it doesn't have to be right next to the meter, that's just how most people do it. I understand why the conceptual disconnect is confusing, but that's just the way it's designed. This is pretty much the same across all themes I have tried -- when the volume fader is directly next to the meter scale label and approximately the same height, unity gain's fader position is close to the -18dB reference level -- but once again, they actually have nothing to do with one another.
It's not a problem at all with the hotness of the levels, as you say, thanks to floating point...
But I've also quickly checked some old/other themes, you're right, it was designed that way, maybe it has just become more obvious through the design that he did, the number scale being more prominent.

Much appreciate your answer
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Old 05-05-2022, 12:20 PM   #59
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Originally Posted by sockmonkey72 View Post
Here is an updated modification with the reorganized elements as shown above, in case you prefer that. Let me know if you run into any problems!
This is great, FX much easier to read.

I think my only issue with this theme is the unused space either side of the TCP elements. I find it annoying that it gets wider as you increase the column width, I'd rather that space was fixed width and the FX slots got larger if anything. Stretching them out to a decent size can leave a lot of empty space which is a bit wasteful on a smaller, laptop screen.

Thanks for the mods, I'll have a poke at the anchoring of the elements and tweak accordingly.
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Old 05-06-2022, 12:18 AM   #60
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I think my only issue with this theme is the unused space either side of the TCP elements. I find it annoying that it gets wider as you increase the column width, I'd rather that space was fixed width and the FX slots got larger if anything. Stretching them out to a decent size can leave a lot of empty space which is a bit wasteful on a smaller, laptop screen.
Agreed! I think that the other TCP elements, besides FX slots, could be move to the left or right side. That way the FX slots and possible embedded FX UI would have enough room without streching the TCP too wide. I also think the FX slots should get a proper background, similar to other elements in the theme.

Anyone (with better grasp on WALTER than me) up for this mod?
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Old 05-06-2022, 12:32 AM   #61
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Agreed! I think that the other TCP elements, besides FX slots, could be move to the left or right side. That way the FX slots and possible embedded FX UI would have enough room without streching the TCP too wide. I also think the FX slots should get a proper background, similar to other elements in the theme.

Anyone (with better grasp on WALTER than me) up for this mod?
The background isn't a big deal, and while I was writing this, I figured out how to make the horizontal scaling work properly. I'll post an update in a little bit.

EDIT: posted to the same location on Dropbox. There are a ton of subtle changes to the graphics (mostly some unsharp masking to improve legibility), and then some tries to improve the TCP fx parameter/send lists. Let me know how it works for you.
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Old 05-06-2022, 08:45 AM   #62
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Originally Posted by sockmonkey72 View Post
The background isn't a big deal, and while I was writing this, I figured out how to make the horizontal scaling work properly. I'll post an update in a little bit.

EDIT: posted to the same location on Dropbox. There are a ton of subtle changes to the graphics (mostly some unsharp masking to improve legibility), and then some tries to improve the TCP fx parameter/send lists. Let me know how it works for you.
It's great you got the scaling working!

Here's what I had in mind:



Now that would be something! But also a lot of work! Especially if everything is scalable (as it should be, IMHO)...

Edit: And of course the gap between the volume and width buttons (etc.) and those above them should be consistent with the FX list...

Edit edit: Perhaps even the embedded UI should have a similar background that also stretches so that everything shares the same design idea?

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Old 05-06-2022, 09:29 AM   #63
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I think the classical response here is "feel free". 🤣

I might take a look, in order to learn how to do the embedded UI, but no promises!
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Old 05-06-2022, 09:49 AM   #64
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keep it going boys and girls
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Old 05-06-2022, 10:11 AM   #65
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I think the classical response here is "feel free". 🤣
Yes! As it should be!
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Old 05-07-2022, 01:45 AM   #66
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The background isn't a big deal, and while I was writing this, I figured out how to make the horizontal scaling work properly. I'll post an update in a little bit.
Thanks a lot, this is a workable theme for me now.

Just so I'm not missing something, was the space between the tcp elements and the meters still intended to resize? I've had a look at the code but goes a bit beyond me walter fu...
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Old 05-07-2022, 02:45 AM   #67
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Thanks a lot, this is a workable theme for me now.

Just so I'm not missing something, was the space between the tcp elements and the meters still intended to resize? I've had a look at the code but goes a bit beyond me walter fu...
I haven't looked at that yet. So "intended" isn't exactly accurate, but "expected"? I'll check it out when I have a sec. I personally find a good width and then leave it alone, so this wasn't a big priority for me so far.
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Old 05-07-2022, 04:34 AM   #68
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I haven't looked at that yet. So "intended" isn't exactly accurate, but "expected"? I'll check it out when I have a sec. I personally find a good width and then leave it alone, so this wasn't a big priority for me so far.
Thanks but please understand this is really just me talking out loud too, not expecting you to react to every suggestion

Also, for context, I'm trying this theme on my old 768x1366 laptop which I use for rough audio stuff. It's all a nice size but as you can see that blank area could be better used for the actual arrangement etc. if it was 1920x... then yeah, set and forget.

Thanks for your time on this.
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Old 05-07-2022, 10:30 AM   #69
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First off, the promo video is terrific fun. Does a great job of "selling" the theme.

Indeed this is as close to a perfect theme *to my tastes* as I can imagine someone creating. So well done Ice Cold Milk (if that is indeed your real name!)

In the end I'll think I'll just try to incorporate the things I like into my current or future custom theme. At the moment I'm primarily using sockmonkey72's revision, because the lack of a time-signature control is a deal-breaker. But for me, I like Milk's approach to the volume and width.

But, like I said, I'll probably stick with mine if I can just figure out how to fix a few things. This is super inspiring though.
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Old 05-08-2022, 03:41 AM   #70
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Getting close...

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Old 05-08-2022, 04:24 AM   #71
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Getting close...

amazing
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Old 05-08-2022, 09:04 AM   #72
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just stumbled upon this. this is actually the first theme i feel i could work with other than classic 1.x. yes, i still use classic 1.x. it just works for me.

is it true the orig developer has abandoned it? it really is very nice.
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Old 05-08-2022, 01:49 PM   #73
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Originally Posted by sockmonkey72 View Post
Here is an updated modification with the reorganized elements as shown above, in case you prefer that. Let me know if you run into any problems!

UPDATE: theme updated in-place (fix some niggles)
UPDATE AGAIN: theme updated in-place again (fix some more niggles, some MCP work) -- now there's only a single version with the reorganized elements, which is what I'll work from moving forward.
Thanks for this!! Well done
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Old 05-08-2022, 03:02 PM   #74
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thanks for adding in the time sig on the transport. however, IMO it should be located next to the BPM info as it is all similar info (i.e. tempo markers and time sig markers)

also agree with upthread comment that you can't even tell if tracks are grouped in the MCP. is there way to correct?
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Old 05-09-2022, 04:03 AM   #75
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UPDATE:
- moved time signature to be next to bpm indicator
- updated TCP anchoring to maximize space usage at different track/tcp sizes

same place: here

Sorry to be a dreamkiller, but I'm not going to implement folder indentation in the MCP, at least not any time soon. It's a pain, and it's kind of a hack. See this thread for more info. We all have the source code, so if you want to add it, or can convince someone to do so, I hope you'll share the results here.

Quote:
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is it true the orig developer has abandoned it? it really is very nice.
I don't know if it's true, but he joined the forum to post the original post in this thread and hasn't been back since. He isn't responding to DMs, and his last note on YT was (in response to a feature request regarding 200% support: "it requires a lot of time and labor but does not bring income. I don't have the ability or desire to do it again. sorry. thanks for the feedback". That was three weeks ago, and there's been no activity since. Draw your own conclusions...

Once again, a HUGE thanks to Ice Cold Milk for this lovely theme.
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Old 05-09-2022, 04:48 AM   #76
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UPDATE:
- moved time signature to be next to bpm indicator

Sorry to be a dreamkiller, but I'm not going to implement folder indentation in the MCP, at least not any time soon. It's a pain, and it's kind of a hack.
thanks for the time sig move!

re: MCP folders tracks.
They don't have to be indented, they just aren't indicated in any visible way that i can find. FWIW, they aren't indented in the theme i use either (classic 1.x...check it out), but it is very easy to see. ugly? laughably so, but at least there's easy visible indication.

similarly, perhaps the little tiny diagonal ticks used to indicate VCA tracks could be a color that stands out more? i.e. not grey?
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Old 05-09-2022, 04:56 AM   #77
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Just so we're talking about the same thing. Above, indicated with fashionable magenta arrows, are the three folder indicators in the existing theme. I guess you're talking about the track in the middle, though, and that there's no visual indication on _it_ that it's inside of a folder? That seems like something which could be improved, maybe with a simple extra stripe or something... Not sure, will have a think.

Can you please send a screenshot of the ticks you're talking about? You might be able to change that color in the Tweaks dialog, but if it's illegible, it probably makes sense to change it in the base theme file.
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Old 05-09-2022, 04:59 AM   #78
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I love this theme. Thank you Ice Cold Milk for creating it and sockmonkey72 for improving it.

Edit: How can I enable the tinting as it is in your screenshots, sockmonkey72? I downloaded the latest version from your Drobox, but I only see the minimal track name tinting.

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Old 05-09-2022, 05:31 AM   #79
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Quote:
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re: MCP folders tracks.
They don't have to be indented, they just aren't indicated in any visible way that i can find. FWIW, they aren't indented in the theme i use either (classic 1.x...check it out), but it is very easy to see. ugly? laughably so, but at least there's easy visible indication.
is this too subtle?

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Old 05-09-2022, 06:08 AM   #80
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that's fine. i think the only issue was/is when the track isn't colored, it's grey/grey.

here's the VCA ticks with classic 1x to compare:
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