Reaper is terrible with MIDI

[Cloudswim]

Originally Posted by EvilDragon

I very much agree with point #1 that the MIDI devices page is abysmal. In fact the whole Preferences dialog should really be updated to be resizable, or at least increase in size so that stuff can actually breathe and not feel so cramped.



Really, though? No support for MIDI channels, sysex, 14-bit CCs, cannot send program changes anywhere in the clip only at beginning of the clip, and it's really just a painfully slow MIDI editing experience... it's one of the worse MIDI editors out there IMHO. Once you get into mouse modifiers and actions in Reaper, MIDI editor becomes extremely fast and, for lack of better word, pleasant to use.



Welcome to class-compliant USB. This is not Reaper's fault.



Nope, Reaper doesn't do MIDI thru, it has to pass through Reaper's processing buffer.

Thanks I will try out your tips for midi editing!

[Cloudswim]

Originally Posted by nachbelichtet.com

... or "Maslow's hammer" comes to mind: "I suppose it is tempting, if the only tool you have is a hammer, to treat everything as if it were a nail."

If your focus is on MIDI, why not using Ableton? I use Ableton Live to develop song ideas, programming drums etc. It's a great tool for that because of its non-linear approach. After that, I mostly keep the MIDI-Parts (and some audio tracks) and move them to Reaper for (re-)recordings other parts, mixing and mastering. This is the area where Ableton is not that good but where Reaper is the perfect tool (IMHO).

I even use Ableton Push II, even though I make rock music. It's an instrument by itself and a great remote controller, even if you are not using samples, loops etc. to produce "phatt beats" :-)

I'm happy with my setup because I can choose the right tool for the specific task.

MD

Good idea, was thinking that but again it will make things more complicated. I will think about it.

[Cloudswim]

Originally Posted by EvilDragon

I very much agree with point #1 that the MIDI devices page is abysmal. In fact the whole Preferences dialog should really be updated to be resizable, or at least increase in size so that stuff can actually breathe and not feel so cramped.



Really, though? No support for MIDI channels, sysex, 14-bit CCs, cannot send program changes anywhere in the clip only at beginning of the clip, and it's really just a painfully slow MIDI editing experience... it's one of the worse MIDI editors out there IMHO. Once you get into mouse modifiers and actions in Reaper, MIDI editor becomes extremely fast and, for lack of better word, pleasant to use.



Welcome to class-compliant USB. This is not Reaper's fault.



Nope, Reaper doesn't do MIDI thru, it has to pass through Reaper's processing buffer.

In regards to all the function listed, I think its not very important for ne.
I actually don't get why notes have their own MIDI channel on Reaper, sometimes when I record with channel x and move that clip to another track to trigger a different ext instrument on a different MIDI channel I would than have to adjust the midi NOTES to the correct channel accordingly. How do you guys usually send the same MIDI item to different channels? I'm probably doing this wrong.

Ableton was good in that the UI was very smooth, like inserting, copying, moving and dragging notes etc. Feels like it was designed properly. On reaper it just feels Clunky? Packed with features but not thought out well imo, but I'm slowly getting the hang of it,,,,,

[thevisi0nary]

Originally Posted by Cloudswim

In regards to all the function listed, I think its not very important for ne.
I actually don't get why notes have their own MIDI channel on Reaper, sometimes when I record with channel x and move that clip to another track to trigger a different ext instrument on a different MIDI channel I would than have to adjust the midi NOTES to the correct channel accordingly. How do you guys usually send the same MIDI item to different channels? I'm probably doing this wrong.

Ableton was good in that the UI was very smooth, like inserting, copying, moving and dragging notes etc. Feels like it was designed properly. On reaper it just feels Clunky? Packed with features but not thought out well imo, but I'm slowly getting the hang of it,,,,,

Per note midi channel is amazingly useful for any sampler with different instruments on each channel. For kontakt instruments that have the articulations split among different patches, I just load them in kontakt and all I have to do in the midi editor is hit one key to change a note channel with the patch/articulation I want.

I hate to repeat what is commonly said, but the strength of Reaper REALLY is in it's customization, and I approach any problem / inconvenience with the idea of customizing around it.

Just for example, if you find yourself needing to change midi note channels often and you want to do it quickly, you could either A. Bind a channel note action to a key (set selected notes to channel X), or B. Add it to the context menu (the menu when you right click on a note) if you don't do it often enough to warrant a short cut.

You can customize almost anything this way, and for more complicated things you can make really complex custom actions for things that would normally take 20 clicks.

[Cloudswim]

Originally Posted by thevisi0nary

Per note midi channel is amazingly useful for any sampler with different instruments on each channel. For kontakt instruments that have the articulations split among different patches, I just load them in kontakt and all I have to do in the midi editor is hit one key to change a note channel with the patch/articulation I want.

I hate to repeat what is commonly said, but the strength of Reaper REALLY is in it's customization, and I approach any problem / inconvenience with the idea of customizing around it.

Just for example, if you find yourself needing to change midi note channels often and you want to do it quickly, you could either A. Bind a channel note action to a key (set selected notes to channel X), or B. Add it to the context menu (the menu when you right click on a note) if you don't do it often enough to warrant a short cut.

You can customize almost anything this way, and for more complicated things you can make really complex custom actions for things that would normally take 20 clicks.

yes I agree, but sometimes there needs to be fine line between customization and use-ability.

I understand binding a channel to a shortcut.. but ... I would still have to make channel settings to on the track level to send to a different MIDI output. Just a lot of distraction for a seemingly simple task.

[thevisi0nary]

Originally Posted by Cloudswim

yes I agree, but sometimes there needs to be fine line between customization and use-ability.

I understand binding a channel to a shortcut.. but ... I would still have to make channel settings to on the track level to send to a different MIDI output. Just a lot of distraction for a seemingly simple task.

Could you give a detailed summary of what you are currently trying to achieve

[juliansader]

I understand binding a channel to a shortcut.. but ... I would still have to make channel settings to on the track level to send to a different MIDI output. Just a lot of distraction for a seemingly simple task.

If I understand correctly what you want to do, you can add a MIDI CC mapper JSFX to the track, and link the CC parameter to a TCP control:

(This is from an old version of REAPER.)


REAPER has advanced multi-channel editing features. If track routing or a JSFX is used to force all MIDI playback into a single channel (or if your VSTi does not care about MIDI channels), then the MIDI inside the track can freely be assigned to any channel, and channels can be employed as 16 all-purpose groups that can be independently edited, similar to FL Studio's "color groups". The notation "voices" can be used similarly.

[barbaroja]

I actually think Ableton MIDI is as limiting as possible.

The only thing I miss in FL studio is the propietary slides.

[3mph]

Originally Posted by EvilDragon

Nope, Reaper doesn't do MIDI thru, it has to pass through Reaper's processing buffer.

But isn't MIDI-thru a function in hardware-devices? I mean, if I want to play a sampler from a keyboard, I would set the keyboard as input and the sampler as output on a track in reaper. If I need to play a second sampler with the same keyboard, I connect the samplers using MIDI Thru and assign MIDI-channels on the samplers and in reaper accordingly.

(I could be missing the point)

[EvilDragon]

"MIDI thru" in software world means that a DAW can just pass the incoming MIDI directly through to an external MIDI device, without any added latency. This would also mean you wouldn't be able to transform the MIDI data with JS FX - but that's the price of not adding an audio buffer's worth of latency to it.

[Phazma]

Originally Posted by Cloudswim

Ableton was good in that the UI was very smooth, like inserting, copying, moving and dragging notes etc. Feels like it was designed properly. On reaper it just feels Clunky? Packed with features but not thought out well imo, but I'm slowly getting the hang of it,,,,,

In my opinion what makes moving and dragging notes clunky in Reaper's MIDI editor is the grid and snapping behaviour.

The arrange window for example has a snap to visible grid option and you can configure how many pixels there are between grid lines. So you can set your grid/snapping to something high like 1/64 or even 1/128 and always leave it there. And when you zoom in you can move items precisely to 1/128 subdivisions and when you zoom out grid lines disappear and, depending on how far you zoom out, it snaps to 1/8, 1/4, bars... all at a grid spacing that you can set yourself and feel comfortable mousing around.

In the Midi editor these options are absent which makes it feel very awkward. If you have the snapping set to 1/128 it works well to edit precisely when you zoom far in, but when you zoom out somewhat at a certain point you see only 1/16 grid lines but it keeps snapping to 1/128 (so it snaps to invisible grid lines). You then have to set your grid/snapping to 1/16 to snap to the grid lines (and change again if you zoom in). And even if constantly switching snapping settings wouldn't bother you, you still can not decide for example to have less pixels between gridlines and seamlessly edit in 1/32 notes at a zoom level where,as of now, by (unchangable) default only 1/8 grid is shown.

I hope this explanation isn't too confusing but I am sure if they one day fix this, the midi editor will feel way smoother for many people. Not in terms of capability but just the overall feeling of precision and smoothness.

[3mph]

Originally Posted by EvilDragon

but that's the price of not adding an audio buffer's worth of latency to it.

Well, I guess there could be all sorts of timing issues as well, audio not lining up with MIDI correctly and such.

Thanks for clarifying this. I still can't wrap my head around why OP can't connect devices directly though. He stated the fault was in the way reapers handle MIDI-devices, but the MIDI thru on his devices takes care of exactly this.

(sorry if I'm derailing the discussion, I have no problem being told to STFU)

[Cloudswim]

Originally Posted by barbaroja

I actually think Ableton MIDI is as limiting as possible.

The only thing I miss in FL studio is the propietary slides.

sometimes limitation is good

[Cloudswim]

Originally Posted by Phazma

In my opinion what makes moving and dragging notes clunky in Reaper's MIDI editor is the grid and snapping behaviour.

The arrange window for example has a snap to visible grid option and you can configure how many pixels there are between grid lines. So you can set your grid/snapping to something high like 1/64 or even 1/128 and always leave it there. And when you zoom in you can move items precisely to 1/128 subdivisions and when you zoom out grid lines disappear and, depending on how far you zoom out, it snaps to 1/8, 1/4, bars... all at a grid spacing that you can set yourself and feel comfortable mousing around.

In the Midi editor these options are absent which makes it feel very awkward. If you have the snapping set to 1/128 it works well to edit precisely when you zoom far in, but when you zoom out somewhat at a certain point you see only 1/16 grid lines but it keeps snapping to 1/128 (so it snaps to invisible grid lines). You then have to set your grid/snapping to 1/16 to snap to the grid lines (and change again if you zoom in). And even if constantly switching snapping settings wouldn't bother you, you still can not decide for example to have less pixels between gridlines and seamlessly edit in 1/32 notes at a zoom level where,as of now, by (unchangable) default only 1/8 grid is shown.

I hope this explanation isn't too confusing but I am sure if they one day fix this, the midi editor will feel way smoother for many people. Not in terms of capability but just the overall feeling of precision and smoothness.

spot on ! yes the grid! YES what you see is what you get! on reaper even if you set the grid to a certain value your note input is still based on the note input note length value.

[Cloudswim]

Originally Posted by thevisi0nary

Could you give a detailed summary of what you are currently trying to achieve

Say I have 5 different ext synth, set to MIDI CH 1-5.

If I record a midi item with Synth 1 set to midi ch 1. The notes will be CH1.

Now if I want to use this clip to trigger Synth 5, on Midi CH5 what do I do?

In my experience or logic, it would make sense to just move that clip to a track corresponding to the Synth I would like to trigger. In this case if I simply move the same clip to a different track I would have to change the note midi ch to the corresponding synth midi channel, in this case MIDI CH 5. Things like this is not good for the creative flow and trying out different ideas quickly.

Maybe I'm doing something wrong, where I should just set all my synth to the same MIDI CH? but this was not how I have been setting up external gear, which was that every instrument had its own specified MIDI CHANNEL so I won't get it mixed up.

[beingmf]

Why does each synth get a different channel? Rather than plugging each into a dedicated port/output???

[Cloudswim]

Originally Posted by beingmf

Why does each synth get a different channel? Rather than plugging each into a dedicated port/output???

Well, if I have an external sequencer and I want it to send part of the message to CH1 and part of the message to Ch2 than this will not be possible to set everything to the same channel. Becuase many hardware sequencers won't be able to configure midi output to a particular port, but rather only in seperate midi channels.

Any ideas?

EDIT: So maybe I should just route everything into REAPER, and route this out accordingly? complicated... ahhh

[EvilDragon]

Originally Posted by Cloudswim

Say I have 5 different ext synth, set to MIDI CH 1-5.

If I record a midi item with Synth 1 set to midi ch 1. The notes will be CH1.

Now if I want to use this clip to trigger Synth 5, on Midi CH5 what do I do?

You can set the hardware MIDI output to send over whatever channel you want.

[Cloudswim]

Originally Posted by EvilDragon

You can set the hardware MIDI output to send over whatever channel you want.

yes thats correct, but if the Item's midi notes' were recorded on a different MIDI Channel will still send message out with the channel where the midi was recorded initially. And I can't keep track which was recorded from what during a session, items could be all over the place. Does this make sense?

[swiiscompos]

Originally Posted by Cloudswim

yes thats correct, but if the Item's midi notes' were recorded on a different MIDI Channel will still send message out with the channel where the midi was recorded initially. And I can't keep track which was recorded from what during a session, items could be all over the place. Does this make sense?

You can use the JS MIDI CC Channel Router

[vdubreeze]

Originally Posted by Coachz

In my opinion Reaper is a daw for coders and the defaults are very poorly thought out and non-intuitive. 10 years in I'm still coding many actions to get my workflow to be good. I'm thrilled with the results but it takes a lot of time.

This is pretty much what it comes down to. (I mean, on what planet's defaults does the act of clicking on a midi note make it disappear? ) My problem is I can cobble together actions created by others but can't code if you held a gun to my head, not that I don't give it another try every year.

Bottom line for me is that I find controllers and recording in to Reaper never any problem. Nothing's ever stopped me from recording midi in Reaper. But if subtle tweaking of performance is in the cards it's not the tool for me.. Similarly I midi edit in it every once in a while to see if anything suddenly clicks, but in 10 years (same as Coachz) but it hasn't. If the tracks are to be quantized and looped, or have that quality, I do it in Reaper. It works great for the kind of midi tracks in the youtube tutorials.
Otherwise I do it elsewhere, or export, edit and re-import, which, for me, still takes less time and effort for the desired result.

I still find that it has and gains many midi functions/actions I'd never use and falls short in the meat and potatoes dept.

We're all different with a whole spectrum of what we respond to and what we need.

[EvilDragon]

Originally Posted by Cloudswim

yes thats correct, but if the Item's midi notes' were recorded on a different MIDI Channel will still send message out with the channel where the midi was recorded initially. And I can't keep track which was recorded from what during a session, items could be all over the place. Does this make sense?

Nope, I cannot confirm that.

So I have my JD-990 receiving over MIDI channel 2, I put some MIDI events in piano roll that are on channel 6, then in the above routing dialog I tell it to "Send to channel 2" and all events are converted to that channel and JD-990 responds nicely to them.

Originally Posted by vdubreeze

(I mean, on what planet's defaults does the act of clicking on a midi note make it disappear? )

Ummm that is certainly not the default behavior, that a single click is removing a MIDI note. The default mouse modifier for "MIDI note, left click" is "Select note and move edit cursor".

[DreamDisease]

Originally Posted by Coachz

Use autohotkey to do that. They also have great help on the Discord server under help-golf

We have a discord server? May I have the link please?

[Sora]

Hi guys! I sort of agree in the sense that UX with regards to MIDI and many other functions is not optimal. I believe software like Reaper is the reason why UX design exists in the first place: software made by smart people about their technical accomplishments with little understanding of how other people will use their software. It can be incredible intelligent and give 'hundreds of options', but it's exactly in that multiplicity of options that confusion lies.

For instance: Here's my problem with note off. After watching a lot of tutorials to have Reaper stop midi after playback, I got it to work: but it only works on the main playlist, and not within the pianoroll. Could anyone help me with this one?

Oh, and I second the request for access to the discord server as these vBulletin boards from the 90s are very confusing and time consuming to go through. Thanks a lot!

[Malfunction]

Originally Posted by Phazma

In my opinion what makes moving and dragging notes clunky in Reaper's MIDI editor is the grid and snapping behaviour.

The arrange window for example has a snap to visible grid option and you can configure how many pixels there are between grid lines. So you can set your grid/snapping to something high like 1/64 or even 1/128 and always leave it there. And when you zoom in you can move items precisely to 1/128 subdivisions and when you zoom out grid lines disappear and, depending on how far you zoom out, it snaps to 1/8, 1/4, bars... all at a grid spacing that you can set yourself and feel comfortable mousing around.

In the Midi editor these options are absent which makes it feel very awkward. If you have the snapping set to 1/128 it works well to edit precisely when you zoom far in, but when you zoom out somewhat at a certain point you see only 1/16 grid lines but it keeps snapping to 1/128 (so it snaps to invisible grid lines). You then have to set your grid/snapping to 1/16 to snap to the grid lines (and change again if you zoom in). And even if constantly switching snapping settings wouldn't bother you, you still can not decide for example to have less pixels between gridlines and seamlessly edit in 1/32 notes at a zoom level where,as of now, by (unchangable) default only 1/8 grid is shown.

I hope this explanation isn't too confusing but I am sure if they one day fix this, the midi editor will feel way smoother for many people. Not in terms of capability but just the overall feeling of precision and smoothness.

The gridline should reflect the notesize. Or there is no purpose of having gridlines. Grid lines that are constantly changing is disorientating.

[Phazma]

Originally Posted by Malfunction

The gridline should reflect the notesize. Or there is no purpose of having gridlines. Grid lines that are constantly changing is disorientating.

Not sure if you are approving or disapproving what I wrote... gridlines appear/disappear automatically when you zoom. It has always been like that (otherwise you would have a screen full of only gridlines when you zoom far out).

I would rather say notesize (snap) should reflect gridline. It is frustrating if the note snaps to a grid that is not visible.

[Malfunction]

Originally Posted by Phazma

Not sure if you are approving or disapproving what I wrote... gridlines appear/disappear automatically when you zoom. It has always been like that (otherwise you would have a screen full of only gridlines when you zoom far out).

I would rather say notesize (snap) should reflect gridline. It is frustrating if the note snaps to a grid that is not visible.

It is.
Gridlines are the first thing that hits your eye.
If gridline lie about gridsize , its pretty pointless to have gridlines in the first place

[_Stevie_]

Well, one thing is for sure. The arrange has way more grid options than the ME. This is something that really needs some overhaul.

[Phazma]

Originally Posted by _Stevie_

Well, one thing is for sure. The arrange has way more grid options than the ME. This is something that really needs some overhaul.

I think it would be great if the ME had the same grid settings window like the arrange view, off course excluding those options that don’t make sense in the midi editor and perhaps including some ME-specific settings.. Can’t wait for un update cycle that targets the Midi editor to chime in with all of these suggestions.

[_Stevie_]

Yep, couldn’t agree more. Also looking forward to an ME update cycle.

[juliansader]

Originally Posted by Sora

For instance: Here's my problem with note off. After watching a lot of tutorials to have Reaper stop midi after playback, I got it to work: but it only works on the main playlist, and not within the pianoroll. Could anyone help me with this one?

The solution for the MIDI editor would depend on what exactly you do to stop MIDI after playback from the main playlist. Could you elaborate a little?

If you are simply running an Action via a keyboard shortcut in the Main section, you can run it from the MIDI editor too, by assigning that same shortcut to the Action "Misc: Pass through key to main window" in the MIDI editor section.

[Malfunction]

Another solution is to have a shadownote following the mouse cursor. This shadownote reflects the gridsize, not the gridlines

[Sora]

With regards to Note-Off, I found that my life saver was:

Pressing F3 - At least it sorted out the stuck notes. Also some tweaks I found on this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i83-f1smFyQ

As for the grid, I've change the colours of the subdivisions in order to see everything better. But there's the following very annoying issue I still can't sort:

Unfixable misaligned notes in the ME.

I'm currently looking for a solution but still nothing.

[kaiestro]

Originally Posted by Coachz

In my opinion Reaper is a daw for coders and the defaults are very poorly thought out and non-intuitive. 10 years in I'm still coding many actions to get my workflow to be good. I'm thrilled with the results but it takes a lot of time.

I never really realized this until recently, when the ReaScript dev environment got an update in 6.02, on top of me doing more coding for school. It is the working man's DAW.

[kaiestro]

Originally Posted by Sora

With regards to Note-Off, I found that my life saver was:

Pressing F3 - At least it sorted out the stuck notes. Also some tweaks I found on this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i83-f1smFyQ

As for the grid, I've change the colours of the subdivisions in order to see everything better. But there's the following very annoying issue I still can't sort:

Unfixable misaligned notes in the ME.

I'm currently looking for a solution but still nothing.

Good grief, the stuck notes are my least favorite part of MIDI with reaper. It's been an issue for me since version 4 when I started using Reaper, with several different MIDI input devices. It makes me hesitant to use Reaper live, despite its great promise, when I could have a show ending bug like that happen at random. I've tried many fixes... none work.

[myfeltgood]

With all the programmers on this forum, I’m surprised no one is able to come up with an answer as to why the MIDI in REAPER is just so inferior.

[Quasar]

Originally Posted by valy

Could just buy an FL studio license and use it as a VSTi in REAPER.

Curious, as I've never used FL Studio, but what version level would you need to buy in order to take full advantage of its MIDI/Piano Roll capabilities within Reaper?

[sockmonkey72]

Originally Posted by kaiestro

Good grief, the stuck notes are my least favorite part of MIDI with reaper. It's been an issue for me since version 4 when I started using Reaper, with several different MIDI input devices. It makes me hesitant to use Reaper live, despite its great promise, when I could have a show ending bug like that happen at random. I've tried many fixes... none work.

So I've been having an ordeal with stuck notes, as well, and have determined a fix which is working for me, see this thread. Simply putting a ReaControlMIDI VST on the FX track is enough to fix the issue I've been seeing (no note-offs sent when seeking).

But yeah, it's not a documented solution, nor does it feel like it's a deliberate design choice. Because why would you force your users to manually add a VST plugin to a track just to use MIDI without getting stuck notes?

So maybe the devs will take a look someday -- the response on the thread hasn't been very confidence-inspiring, but hope springs eternal (although I realize that I've probably used up any goodwill by bitching about this every chance I get).

Until then, I'll just put an extra VST on every single f'ing track which generates MIDI output. Hope this helps you with your problem.

[SiddieNam]

Originally Posted by sockmonkey72

So I've been having an ordeal with stuck notes, as well, and have determined a fix which is working for me, see this thread. Simply putting a ReaControlMIDI VST on the FX track is enough to fix the issue I've been seeing (no note-offs sent when seeking).

But yeah, it's not a documented solution, nor does it feel like it's a deliberate design choice. Because why would you force your users to manually add a VST plugin to a track just to use MIDI without getting stuck notes?

So maybe the devs will take a look someday -- the response on the thread hasn't been very confidence-inspiring, but hope springs eternal (although I realize that I've probably used up any goodwill by bitching about this every chance I get).

Until then, I'll just put an extra VST on every single f'ing track which generates MIDI output. Hope this helps you with your problem.

I think I can speculate about a reason why you need to add ReaControlMIDI yourself and I reckon it IS a deliberate design choice. But I do have some sympathy with what you've written here.

I've got in the habit of using ReaControlMIDI on almost every MIDI track I use now too; I even have track templates to add my fave soft synths with a ReaControlMIDI on them. It started off when I wanted to add a sub-bass playing the same notes as a melody, just a couple of octaves lower. So I routed MIDI from the melody track to the new track and changed the MIDI note number by -24 using it. All good. Since then, I have found it also a killer way of stopping notes with no Note OFF (ie "Panic") for reasons such as you mention. And the logger makes it handy to see what's going on.

All of which begged the question to me about why not just build this functionality (and other stuff supplied by ReaControlMIDI) straight into any track with MIDI on it? You could leave it set to default values of course for when it's not needed. And when I was thinking about it, it made me realise that in Reaper, where a track is a track is a track, you probably can't stick stuff like this in automatically, because then a track ceases to be just a track, it becomes a MIDI track. So goes against that design principle. In other DAWs, where you have to add a MIDI track if you want some MIDI, you get controls a bit like this on those MIDI tracks. So I think it's a deliberate choice to have a VST plugin to do this type of thing in order to allow tracks to be tracks to be tracks.

Of course, adding it in as a VST is dead easy even if you don't have a track template. So y'know. I don't want to get too worked up about it. I don't think Reaper MIDI generally is bad at all, despite what I read from time to time. Personal preference of course. I find it pretty easy to use and it does what I need it to do very well -- managing both internal and external instruments. My personal view, of course -- and I'm a former Cubase user. Cubase has good MIDI management too, but it's not miles and miles better than Reaper as I sometimes see written. CC curves a tad easier in Cubase. Maybe.

[sockmonkey72]

Originally Posted by SiddieNam

I think I can speculate about a reason why you need to add ReaControlMIDI yourself and I reckon it IS a deliberate design choice. But I do have some sympathy with what you've written here.

I've got in the habit of using ReaControlMIDI on almost every MIDI track I use now too; I even have track templates to add my fave soft synths with a ReaControlMIDI on them too. It started off when I wanted to add a sub-bass playing the same notes as a melody, just a couple of octaves lower. So I routed MIDI from the melody track to the new track and changed the MIDI note number by -24 using it. All good. Since then, I have found it also a killer way of stopping notes with no Note OFF (ie "Panic") for reasons such as you mention. And the logger makes it handy to see what's going on.

All of which begged the question to me about why not just build this functionality (and other stuff supplied by ReaControlMIDI) straight into any track with MIDI on it? You could leave it set to default values of course for when it's not needed. And when I was thinking about it, it made me realise that in Reaper, where a track is a track is a track, you probably can't stick stuff like this in automatically, because then a track ceases to be just a track, it becomes a MIDI track. So goes against that design principle. In other DAWs, where you have to add a MIDI track if you want some MIDI, you get controls a bit like this on those MIDI tracks. So I think it's a deliberate choice to have a VST plugin to do this type of thing in order to allow tracks to be tracks to be tracks.

Of course, adding it in as a VST is dead easy even if you don't have a track template. So y'know. I don't want to get too worked up about it. I don't think Reaper MIDI generally is bad at all, despite what I read from time to time. Personal preference of course. I find it pretty easy to use and it does what I need it to do very well -- managing both internal and external instruments. My personal view, of course -- and I'm a former Cubase user. Cubase has good MIDI management too, but it's not miles and miles better than Reaper as I sometimes see written. CC curves a tad easier in Cubase. Maybe.

For me, REAPER has been approximately reliable now that I've added ReaControlMIDI to every track. I haven't done jitter/timing tests vs an established MIDI sequencer like Digital Performer, but it works for me. I'm not getting dropped notes or wacky timing.

First off, yes, I have it in my track templates, so it's added automatically whenever I create a new track. I am annoyed at the additional time it takes to open a project because of needing to create an instances of a (what should be unnecessary) plugin for every track, and any potential performance hits which result from that, but that's not my main beef.

My problem is: REAPER adds the note-offs when you stop. REAPER also blasts All Notes Off/All Sounds Off messages when you play, stop or seek (if configured to do so). The omission of note-offs on seek (unless ReaControlMIDI is present) is inconsistent and leads to users thinking that, to quote, "REAPER is terrible with MIDI" because their MIDI devices have stuck notes all the time.

Clearly, this workaround isn't documented, because the act of attempting to document this behavior and the associated workaround would lead any reasonable person to conclude that something is broken.

If it had anything to do with the generic track type, REAPER wouldn't send note-offs on stop either, and wouldn't auto-blast All Notes Off. This is simply a bug -- and it's probably a one-line fix.