Old 02-25-2018, 08:58 AM   #1
dsealer
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Default Microphone Advice

I’d like to ask for some mic advice. I’m planning on making a purchase of a new studio recording mic and was hoping for some feedback. I realize that mics will sound different depending on who is singing into the mic. I also know equipment and room treatment can have an effect on how a mic will sound. But I thought maybe some of you may have experience using these mics or some knowledge on the quality of these mics.
I currently use a TLM 103 that I bought about 20 years ago. It’s never been out of my studio and has never been dropped or abused. I will say that it has spent lots of time outside its box just on a mic stand waiting to be used.
My studio walls have been treated with thick “carpet padding” and the room is very quiet. I also usually run my 103 into an Art Pro MPA preamp, bought about 20 years ago. Sometimes from there into a dbx processor to get some compression etc which I also bought about 20 years ago. I’ve recently bought the Behringer XR18 and use that as an interface into my laptop and I record using Reaper.
I haven’t been happy with my vocal sound for some time and I’ve been asking on different forums for suggestions and ideas. All this could be that my voice isn’t what it used to be but I’ve been thinking about trying a tube mic and a ribbon mic to see if I can find something that makes me feel good once again with my vocals.
So with that in mind below is a list of mics that have gotten my interest for one reason or another. Some are cheap in price while others are a bit more expensive. If things work out I may buy both a tube and ribbon mic at the same time. And then again maybe I won’t, just not sure. If you have some knowledge on any of these mics, either you’ve used them or know something about them I’d be very interested in your opinion.

Thanks and here’s my shortlist,
Don……

Tube Mics:
Avantone Pro CV-12
MXL Genesis Flagship Tube
MXL V67G
AKG Pro C214
Rode NTK Tube

Ribbon Mics:
Avantone Pro CR-14
MXL R144 HE Heritage Edition
Cascade 98-G-A Fat Head
MXL R40 Ribbon
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Old 02-25-2018, 10:20 AM   #2
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It would help if you could describe what sound you're going for.

Out of all the mics you listed, the only one I personally own and have used is the MXL V67G. It's a great mic, but probably wouldn't be my first pick for vocals. It tends to sound somewhat thin and detailed to my ears, reminding me of an early Beatles type sound. It's great on acoustic guitar, tambourine, bells, etc...but not a go-to mic for vocals unless the singer had a very bassy muffled voice and you wanted to bring out some clarity.
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Old 02-25-2018, 10:25 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rmole View Post
It would help if you could describe what sound you're going for.

Out of all the mics you listed, the only one I personally own and have used is the MXL V67G. It's a great mic, but probably wouldn't be my first pick for vocals. It tends to sound somewhat thin and detailed to my ears, reminding me of an early Beatles type sound. It's great on acoustic guitar, tambourine, bells, etc...but not a go-to mic for vocals unless the singer had a very bassy muffled voice and you wanted to bring out some clarity.
I think My TLM sounds a bit to High Endish. I'd like something with a little more warmth and more bottom to it. Could just be me I know. Thanks for the feedback the MXL V67G is priced low enough that it just might be worth a buy as an option mic for some instruments.
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Old 02-25-2018, 10:46 AM   #4
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Imo Go ribbon, even a budget one is a great addition.

Instant warmly, analoguey and takes eq nicely. Fig8 pattern also a useful tool.

Any source with a hint of harshness a (some voices, the 'less trained' variety especially, brass, overheads etc) benefit.

I am recording myself at the moment and tested all my mics for vocal , various condensers, dynamics and patterns etc and budget ribbon won out.
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Old 02-25-2018, 11:24 AM   #5
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Quote:
I think My TLM sounds a bit to High Endish.
You could get a mic with a more rolled-off high end, or you can use equalization...

Most of the "sound quality" difference you hear between mics is frequency response and that can be adjust more-cheaply, and more easily, with EQ.

Antares has Mic Modeling Software that attempts to make one mic sound like another. Your mic is on the list so it can sound like any other mic on the list. (I'm sure it's not perfect.)

Of course if you are working in a pro studio you can choose the perfect mic for every situation, but for home recording on a limited budget that's not practical.

Noise can also be a factor with the combination mic sensitivity, noise from the head amp (in a condenser), and noise from the preamp. If you use a dynamic or ribbon and EQ it to sound more like a condenser, you can end-up boosting the preamp noise.

Last edited by DVDdoug; 02-25-2018 at 11:34 AM.
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Old 02-25-2018, 01:51 PM   #6
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I bought 2 of these and for me they offer an insane bang for the buck.

http://cadaudio.com/products/product...ion/trion-8000
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Old 02-26-2018, 11:55 AM   #7
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hey there,
I just bought a new mic from MJE: http://www.oktavamod.com/
I only record vocals, so I asked for a recommendation, ended up with the Hulk 990. I was coming from the Rhode NT1A, which is already a good mic but a little too harsh on the top end, especially on female voices.

The Hulk 990 is smoother in the mids and the highs are nice and tame. Seems to take eqing well also. I've only had a few sessions with it, but it's a great addition for me.

Dave
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Old 02-27-2018, 05:24 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dsealer View Post
I think My TLM sounds a bit to High Endish. I'd like something with a little more warmth and more bottom to it...
Have you considered a dynamic mic? I went through a similar struggle looking for a mic for my voice and I have been very happy with the Electro-Voice RE20. To me the sound is somewhere between a condenser mic and what I would usually expect from a dynamic mic.
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Old 02-27-2018, 05:54 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dsealer View Post
I think My TLM sounds a bit to High Endish. I'd like something with a little more warmth and more bottom to it. Could just be me I know. Thanks for the feedback the MXL V67G is priced low enough that it just might be worth a buy as an option mic for some instruments.
The only other one on the list I've used is the Rode NTK. It seemed somewhat dull sounding not in a good way. I have a TLM103 and I use it on vocals a lot. If I think someone might be too bright on it I'll also put up a MD421 along side it. Phase lock them together in the DAW as needed and mix from there.
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Old 02-27-2018, 05:59 PM   #10
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This may be of interest:
https://www.soundonsound.com/techniques/vocal-mics
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Old 02-27-2018, 07:50 PM   #11
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I have the Cascade Fathead II Lundahl and it's an amazing mic...I just got a Royer 121 and need to do a comparison but the Cascade is great. I'm not sure it would be awesome on vocals but quite possibly could be. I used the Fathead for years with a 58 to get great guitar tones and loved them. Darker mics tend to be able to be EQ'd really hard and still sound fantastic which gives it a great smooth top end even with a lot of high end EQ. Which is a great lead-in to the 2nd mic...the AKG

I have 2 TLM103's but prefer an AKG 414xls to it because it is more useful in more situations and doesn't have the tendency to have sibilance. To me the 414 is the SM58 of condenser mics, it sounds great on some things and good on everything. I'm not sure how the 414 compares to the 214 but if it is the same without the extra features that would be awesome but I think it has more top end. The TLM103 is a great mic also though and is very clean and near noiseless which is pretty cool, it can be perfect on certain things and can be annoying on others because of the peaky spot in a bad frequency.

The Avantone gets amazing reviews and would definitely be the ones out of your tube mic list...in the direction of a c12 is never a bad thing. Sweetwater has a b-stock one for $349 which is a bangin good deal.

Good luck on your mic search, having mic choices is a great thing...
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Old 02-27-2018, 10:43 PM   #12
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Here's the thing, you have to keep searching and one day you'll find the perfect mic that suits your voice. I've tried bunches, a good friend brought down the TLM-103 one time and it just didn't suit me at all, although it was great on acoustic guitar. We tried it through an Avalon 737 and a Neve copy pre. He also has a Brauner VM-1 which is the best sounding mic I've ever sung through but they cost 5k last time I checked.

I'm not crazy about ribbons because they are fiddly in my experience, I had a Blue Woodpecker for awhile and loved it first impression, but it was really fussy about distance to it while singing so I ended up selling it.

I've had an AKG 414 since the 80s (my first condenser) and I'll never part with it because it's perfect on anything in the room like mando or sax and it loves female and tenor male vocals, but it doesn't love my voice. Also, have a Sennheiser 441 which is surprisingly good on many sources and takes eq really well and I've used it for many lead vocal takes.

A crazy good tube mic that won't break the bank like the VM-1 is the Rode NTV. Find a Mullard or Telefunken tube and it outclasses many much more expensive tube mics. You'll have to find one used as they aren't made anymore.

My search finally ended when I tried the Brauner Phanthera. It just suits my voice perfectly because I finally realized it's all about the mids. It's easy to tailor the extreme highs and lows but find a mic that gets the mids right for your voice and you are golden.
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Old 03-01-2018, 11:59 AM   #13
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Thank you everyone. Your feedback is very welcomed. I'm not sure exactly what I'm going to do but when I do it I'll make sure I update you all on what I bought and how I find it's performance.

Thanks again,
Don.....
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Old 03-01-2018, 12:43 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David C View Post
Here's the thing, you have to keep searching and one day you'll find the perfect mic that suits your voice. I've tried bunches, a good friend brought down the TLM-103 one time and it just didn't suit me at all, although it was great on acoustic guitar. We tried it through an Avalon 737 and a Neve copy pre. .
My feelings are the same. I got a 103 as soon as they were released, tried it a bit on lots of voices. It's not that it sounded bad, it just did nothing for me. It seems to have a very blurry middle while having sharp highs, and its lows seem undefined, and eq never fixed it for me, as it didn't feel like strictly an eq thing. Still have it, it's pretty impressive for having such a high output with so little self noise. But it just doesn't make audio I like.

But before you do anything else, dsealer, get a pair of high quality tubes for the ART and let 'em burn in a day. The MPA will come alive and maybe change how you feel about the 103. Also can't discount that if you tried the 103 into another preamp that might be enough of a better match that it would take away your displeasure with it.

As far as ribbon mics, be ware that these are low output designs. You need a preamp with lots of clean gain that doesn't grit out at the upper range. A Cloudlifter or similar gain boost box can help this. But you should be certain that the ART preamp will present a ribbon or tube mic in its best light, or it's an exercise in futility. Being that the ART is tube I personally wouldn't consider a tube mic purchase unless it fell in my lap : )

I gotta say that the best mic purchase I've made in ages has been the Aston Spirit. Not to be confused with their Origin. I have both, and the less expensive Origin I would rate a notch under nothing special. But the Spirit sounds fantastic, everyone loves it. Beefy with presence.
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Old 03-01-2018, 06:35 PM   #15
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Aston Spirit got a steam punk look
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Old 03-06-2018, 02:31 AM   #16
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I don't like 'em
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Old 03-07-2018, 09:39 AM   #17
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The Cascade Fathead II L sounds amazing on some voices, and won out against a Blueberry and U47 FET in the last vox session I did. Nicely restrained but not subdued highs, and rich sound overall.

Dynamics are also an excellent choice when a LDC sounds harsh for your application. Lots of people are using SM7s for voice these days.
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Old 03-07-2018, 10:00 AM   #18
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I have a friend who works at Capitol. He said the guys in the studio there are really loving the Mojave MA-1000 tube mic... We did some recording with one and I was super impressed... And I've worked recently with the Blue Bottle which is a $4,000 mic... and loved it... but in comparison, I also really liked this Mojave, which is far more affordable.

Disclaimer: I only know what I know. I don't know what I don't know.. and in short, that means I am not a qualified microphone analyst.
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Old 03-07-2018, 11:34 PM   #19
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The Art Pro MPA preamp would be a (large) part of the reason you are not getting a great vocal sound.

I suggest get a really good preamp first, and then look at the Avantone mics - or even better, Advanced Audio c12 or c47 mics.

A very good inexpensive preamp (Neve style) is the GAP Pre-73 MKIII preamp.

http://www.goldenageproject.com/outb.../pre-73-mkiii/

https://www.soundonsound.com/reviews...project-pre-73

Last edited by ChristopherT; 03-07-2018 at 11:41 PM.
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