behringer 404 and reaper-this is not latency right?

uglijimus · 11-17-2018, 02:00 PM

I just bought the Behringer 404. I've been using it to record into my laptop using reaper for the purpose of re-amping later.

My problem, which I am not sure is latency or not, seems unusual to me and I'll explain in a little bit.

I set up a basic skank drum beat in reaper using just a kick and snare sample. The samples are lined up PERFECTLY to the grid in reaper.
then I put a distortion plug-in on my guitar (just to get a feel as if i was playing with my amp). so as I begin to record I started hearing some weird things

the first YT link is just what I recorded coming out of my monitors as I was recording in reaper. listen to around the 3 second mark and 17 mark; the kick drum seems suddenly off even though it is perfectly lined up to the grid.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1J8E...ature=youtu.be

but as I was recording the monitors with a portable mic device, I was also recording in reaper. and this rendered version in reaper can be heard below

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pbHyWd4XiMI

is it me, or does the reaper rendered version sound more in time than the one coming out of the monitors?

I'm attaching a pic of my current set up of my audio system in reaper as well.

I am at my wit's end here trying to figure this out for the past week...any help would be appreciated!

Stella645 · 11-19-2018, 12:23 AM

Your pic is too small to be really readable here.... But pretty sure you don't have the Behringer ASIO driver selected?
That would be the first thing to try.

tonybeepbeep · 11-20-2018, 02:05 AM

I would definitely download their ASIO driver as suggested above and then take a look at the audio settings for both the input and output sample rate and buffer size in W10 control panel.

uglijimus · 11-20-2018, 02:27 PM

here is a better pic of the image:
https://www.mediafire.com/view/sdddv...inger.PNG/file

I do have ASIO installed but every 5 minutes for a duration fo 20 seconds or so, the audio becomes garbled and then returns to normal.

drumphil · 11-20-2018, 08:16 PM

Well, I can see one problem. You're using the behringer as the input device, and using the on board sound as the output device. This will not work properly. There is no wordclock link between the two audio devices to keep them in sync. Even with a wordclock link, using two devices at the same time is just asking for trouble.

If the behringer asio drivers don't work then you have other problems that need fixing. What buffer size were you using when using the behringer ASIO driver?

Get yourself set up so that you are using the asio drivers and then we can start looking for the root of the problem.

Do you definitely have the behringer ASIO driver installed, or are you trying to use ASIO4ALL?

uglijimus · 11-20-2018, 09:29 PM

ok, now we're cooking with gas!

here is my set-up
http://www.mediafire.com/view/0v9gvj...20set%20up.PNG

I had no problems with this at all. I prefer to listen out of my computer as opposed to the behringer unit, but if that's not possible I'm perfectly happy with this set-up!

I'm not sure why this didn't work out the first time i tried this. Perhaps I had the sample rate too high?

drumphil · 11-21-2018, 05:33 AM

Nope, you're using asio4all, not the asio driver from behringer.

asio4all is what you use if your sound device doesn't have asio drivers and the wasapi drivers it does have don't work well.

As well as not using the behringer asio driver, you're also only using 2 of the 4 inputs and outputs. Look where it says first and last on the inputs and outputs.

https://www.musictribe.com/Categorie...0BK1/downloads

Windows driver 4.38

uglijimus · 11-21-2018, 08:24 PM

so I actually have had that driver installed and it looks like this:

https://www.mediafire.com/view/ota6o...river.PNG/file

sounds good, except that I cannot hear my distortion plug-in on the track. it's just clean. doesn't work so well when you are trying to play death metal/thrash (^_^)

I wish i could have the input as the UMC driver and the output coming out of the laptop...

drumphil · 11-21-2018, 08:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by uglijimus

so I actually have had that driver installed and it looks like this:

https://www.mediafire.com/view/ota6o...river.PNG/file

sounds good, except that I cannot hear my distortion plug-in on the track. it's just clean. doesn't work so well when you are trying to play death metal/thrash (^_^)

Sounds to me like you are monitoring dry directly through the umc404. There is a mix knob that lets your hear the dry input directly, or if turned the other way just lets you hear what is coming back from the DAW software.

You have to enable monitoring on the track in question in reaper. If you have monitoring turned on in reaper and direct monitoring enabled on the interface you will now hear both at the same time, the dry signal, and the processed signal from reaper. You want to avoid this. It pretty much has to be one or the other.

Quote:

I wish i could have the input as the UMC driver and the output coming out of the laptop...

Nope, it doesn't work like that. Get yourself some headphones if you can't afford or don't have space for some small speakers. However once you've finished recording there is nothing to stop you switching back to the on board sound.

The next thing you might need to look at is the asio buffer size, which you set by hitting the ASIO Configuration button in the reaper audio preferences. Too big and there will be a delay in what you hear coming back from the computer. Too small and you will start getting glitches.

uglijimus · 11-23-2018, 12:46 PM

that did it thank you! everything seems good now. I can hear the wet signal and can't notice any kind of glitches (if there any?) and no latency that I can detect! They should have put your advice in the manual (^_^).

drumphil · 11-24-2018, 09:44 AM

Glad to hear you got it all working. Out of curiosity, what AISO buffer size are you using?

uglijimus · 11-24-2018, 11:09 AM

256 samples. i think the default is set to 512? but I really couldn't hear a difference between the two sample rates, so maybe i should go back to 512...

drumphil · 11-24-2018, 11:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by uglijimus

256 samples. i think the default is set to 512? but I really couldn't hear a difference between the two sample rates, so maybe i should go back to 512...

In general as small as works reliably is best, as it gives the shortest latency. I've had good luck with those units at low buffer sizes. It's worth experimenting with.

If it's unstable at lower buffer sizes, then never mind. But if it's running stable, and you have CPU power to spare, why not have lower latency?

In general, the smaller the buffer size the higher the CPU load for a given reaper project, and the further away from 100% CPU usage you will start to get glitches. The larger the buffer size, the lower the CPU load for a given project, and the closer to actually being able to use 100% of your CPU you will get.

It's certainly worth experimenting to see exactly how low you can get your latency, and how much load you can put on the CPU before you have to back off to a larger buffer size, and how much larger the buffer needs to be to get back to stability.