Old 05-14-2019, 05:37 AM   #41
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this is also why stuff stays broken and mainly unusable..users not honestly feeding back on problematic programming or devices.
i'm slowly comming to the conclusion that cockos has been winging it for years--and their dsp knowledge is clearly lacking..or clearly not showing in it's fullest potential or glory just yet.
yay--let's all lurk.
Your input is not actually worth a response, but just to be clear, what you say is almost always wrong on all the meta, and sometimes on point on actual technical details. But the overall style and the terrible meta narrative / bias / call it what you will... is so unconstructive that the best way to deal with it is just to ignore it completely. Which I usually do, and I get the impression so do most people around here. And this is coming from someone who actually agrees with you on the functionality of this wiring view feature, hah.

That being said, note how all the posts right at the beginning of this thread were critical of the view (from mccrabney, EvilDragon, ReaDave and me), even very critical at that -- I called it terrible to navigate and impossible to use in larger projects, mccrabney said it's unusable, ED agreed, and so on. It was criticized, and also detailed why. And yet absolutely nobody jumped in and did anything of this sort:

"look at how the "good guy reaperite forum fan club" gangs together,regular--to try bash innocent posters..who dare step over an imaginary forum line..who dare be different in the methods..who dare be different to the 'bs narrative' ...the atomists.....the robods actually worship this crap.. lol-- some users are actually finding+ see faults or weaknesses in this reaper programme-- and get shot down.totally ignored,or bullied by these a.h. for pointing things out."

It's not pointing out flaws that is the issue. It's your tone and how you present your posts, always lining it with this extremely bitter meta stuff about other people and how this and that is so unfair. The thing is, it's self fulfilling prophecy in full effect, of course people are going to react negatively to such terrible input. Excluding completely random trolls, your kinds of posts ^ are at the bottom of the barrel anywhere, it's not a Reaper specific thing.
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Old 05-14-2019, 06:37 AM   #42
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Your input is not actually worth a response,.

yet-here you are,responding--why,thankyou..obviously what is posted,is legible to some degree..
ok..my 'posting' style may seem erratic,not fully fitting others usual methods-- but look,if i choose to drop capital letters that should not really be seen as a crime,or,be judged unfairly..we are all heavily programmed to some degrees,so that's my choice to try de_programming a little,try to bear with it.


the topic here is track wiring--and clearly although i may seem to be comparing apples to oranges--(maybe a little heavily critical) but,the purpose still serves--to give inspiration to cockos,if they need it+ let others know what is already available..to use,right now...no need to keep waiting all the time..
reason can be rewired today,without much fail--to give users all this jazz--but this is not reaper doing the work is it...because right now,it's a w.i.p. and who knows just how long this will take to finally nail for proper production uses..

any new user looking at this currently might have nightmares--and i can see why-- it has to be clear,logical,practical+ visually pleasing for ALL users--all level of skill....but levels of skill,can sometimes only be defined in terms of knowledges/wisdom...not actual physical skills..
so more wisdom on the subjects-give more users chances to become more skillfull with the tools they use to create..right m8's?


the thread title was "your use of track wiring view" - but how can anybody actually give credible feedbacks on broken+unfinished projects??
makes 0 sense tbh..
+oh btw Jack Winter> are you actually male,or female? the pic does no justice to gender tbh.
luvzya.

Last edited by Bri1; 05-14-2019 at 06:44 AM. Reason: 1xtra
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Old 05-14-2019, 06:44 AM   #43
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- but how can anybody actually give credible feedbacks on broken+unfinished projects??
makes 0 sense tbh..
Eh, feedback on works in progress makes a lot of sense. It's much better to find out halfway through that all your customers like things differently rather than at the very end.

A lot of software development moves in this direction actually. Trying to involve the customer in the development process as early and as often as possible. It's much more robust to disappointment rather than making some huge plan, following through on it, and then having a product nobody wants.
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Old 05-14-2019, 06:45 AM   #44
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I deleted a couple of posts from this thread. Moderating the forum is my least favorite thing. Please help us focus on our work by not posting things that we need to delete.
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Old 05-14-2019, 06:49 AM   #45
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Eh, feedback on works in progress makes a lot of sense. It's much better to find out halfway through that all your customers like things differently rather than at the very end.

eh- sai'ke- i totally agree-- but let's be honest...if the coders cannot get it right 1st time and keep releasing broken rubbish to the public--what impression does that give about the devs?
does it say "look,i need help here to develop our ideas" -or,does it say " we really do not know how to code this properly..yet"??
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Old 05-14-2019, 06:57 AM   #46
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yet-here you are,responding--why,thankyou..
Yep, that was the whole point. In the majority of cases I don't, and now I did.

Quote:
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but how can anybody actually give credible feedbacks on broken+unfinished projects??
makes 0 sense tbh..
That is also a strange view to hold, in my opinion, as feedback can be so vital to unfinished features and projects. Work in progress benefits from constructive feedback.

Back to the wiring view, and not entertaining this useless attention seeking any longer than necessary. So yeah, I think it's been established and oft repeated that navigation and control over visibilty is the main thing to improve. A graphical way of patching loses its strongest point of visual intuition when you literally don't see where a signal is coming from and where it is going, and instead only see wires crisscrossing with no manageable overview of start and end points. I can definitely see myself using this if it becomes realistically possible to navigate.
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Old 05-14-2019, 07:11 AM   #47
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Sorry everyone, I'm not gonna feed the troll anymore
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Old 05-14-2019, 07:15 AM   #48
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For the record, it was me who gave Bri1 some forum vacation. I hope this thread can serve its purpose without more "losses".
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Old 05-14-2019, 01:52 PM   #49
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I could imagine that when this wiring view evolves a bit, I could use it for
-getting a quick overall view of routings (zoom needed and would love left to right signal flow)
-checking specific signal routings (say, click a track box and see the whole chain for only the given track or group)
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Old 05-14-2019, 01:59 PM   #50
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Quote:
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I just tried to give you an honest feedback that the way you write might cause people to skip over the post. At least it really doesn't invite me to read more than a few words..
Sorry I know this is more noise, but everyone should be aware that this is far from the first time it's been pointed out to Bri1 that dense text full of made-up words and no punctuation is unnecessarily hard to read; always to the same defensive type of response. Temp ban probably won't solve it tho unfortunately.

No replies plz...just an FYI.
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Old 05-14-2019, 09:47 PM   #51
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dense text full of made-up words and no punctuation is unnecessarily hard to read;
... and rather impossible to read for non-native English speakers.

-Michael
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Old 06-07-2019, 01:09 AM   #52
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I don't know have you seen that or not but it's the free opensource engine from Tracktion:

https://github.com/Tracktion/trackti...3L7ChmctL1jj2o

And there're it has a routing:
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Old 06-08-2019, 09:40 AM   #53
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I was expecting from track wiring view to be something more like FLstudio Patcher for making complex fx routings within one track.

currently the routings views is pointless for me.
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Old 06-09-2019, 05:39 AM   #54
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Quote:
For the record, it was me who gave Bri1 some forum vacation. I hope this thread can serve its purpose without more "losses".

how.......intelligent? but=why?
lol- so,hows your wiring going m8?

Quote:
Temp ban probably won't solve it tho unfortunately.

^correct-it don't solve anything here. noise for the sake of noise--personal attack=ban this guy!
lol- so,hows your wiring going m8?


Quote:
... and rather impossible to read for non-native English speakers.

-Michael

well mr.micheal (has to repeat name to correct spelling) which sentances do not make sense to you?
i will gladly help clarify each sentance meaning-in depth if required.
lol- so,hows your wiring going m8?

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Old 09-27-2019, 02:03 AM   #55
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It'd be really nice to see any tiny demo of that or some try or whatever on node routing at least.
Thank you.
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Old 10-01-2019, 06:53 PM   #56
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This view is completely useless, I hope they aren't wasting any useful development time on it, they have gotten it all back to front here, wasting a modular routing view on something as mundane as track routing that is literally one or two clicks then set and forget is totally wasted effort.
Wiring view with LFO & Parameter Mod with full audio and automation routing on a single track basis with all wiring of all loaded plugins on said track, then you have a useful modular tool (See racks in the Tracktion example above)
Global like this is completely pointless, it is a whole lot of amazing UI design wasted on as said, a simply mundane set and forget task.

All that being said, this is Reaper, they will do it wrong, leave it for five years, then do it properly better than any other software, so come back in five years, it will all be good
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Old 10-04-2019, 09:04 AM   #57
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All that being said, this is Reaper, they will do it wrong, leave it for five years, then do it properly better than any other software, so come back in five years, it will all be good
So, development time then. Cool. I can live with them taking their time to get it right in the end.

Thats the point of these pre release sneak peaks into what might eventually be included.

Too many posts seem to be coming from the point of view that this is finished and needs a scathing review. Bizarre.

You call it a waste of development time. If its perfect in five years time, like you think, then its valuable development time that leads to greatness. Which sounds like a good thing to me? Again, bizarre.

Each to their own I guess.
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Old 10-28-2019, 03:54 AM   #58
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Kushview Element Plugin Host is now Open Source

http://kushview.net/article/element-open-source/
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Old 11-28-2019, 04:30 AM   #59
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What for this thread was made at the first place?
For fun?
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Old 11-28-2019, 04:40 AM   #60
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Originally Posted by Ivannn Bennnettt View Post
I don't know have you seen that or not but it's the free opensource engine from Tracktion:
I am not sure what you are suggesting there? That the Cockos developers would take and use that code? There's at least a few problems with that :

- The Tracktion engine uses the Juce library, which the Cockos developers are never going to start using.
- The Tracktion engine code doesn't deal with the GUI anyway, it's just about audio and data manipulation.
- It's not free for use in closed source apps like Reaper.
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Old 11-28-2019, 09:00 AM   #61
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I am not sure what you are suggesting there? That the Cockos developers would take and use that code? There's at least a few problems with that :

- The Tracktion engine uses the Juce library, which the Cockos developers are never going to start using.
- The Tracktion engine code doesn't deal with the GUI anyway, it's just about audio and data manipulation.
- It's not free for use in closed source apps like Reaper.
Probably as reference it could be I don't know I'm not a programmer at all. It's just one of a few my suggestions on that. I saw one and thought It could be useful that's all.
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Old 11-28-2019, 09:53 AM   #62
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So after we spent all that time we spent months ago suggesting improvements to Track Wiring View, it looks like not one iota of that feedback influenced the development of this feature, eh? Pretty disappointing... Well O well.
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Old 11-28-2019, 05:37 PM   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivannn Bennnettt View Post
What for this thread was made at the first place?
For fun?
Read the first post. This thread was started by nicolas (AKA Geoffrey Francis, the author of the REAPER User Guide) because he wanted some feedback on the Track Wiring feature in order to help document information in his User Guide for REAPER 6.

A perfectly reasonable request IMV.
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Old 11-29-2019, 01:58 AM   #64
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Read the first post. This thread was started by nicolas (AKA Geoffrey Francis, the author of the REAPER User Guide) because he wanted some feedback on the Track Wiring feature in order to help document information in his User Guide for REAPER 6.

A perfectly reasonable request IMV.
It seems my bad. I misunderstood that. I should learn english harder and read carefully.
Thanks for clearing that up.
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Old 11-29-2019, 03:55 AM   #65
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It seems my bad. I misunderstood that. I should learn english harder and read carefully.
Thanks for clearing that up.
No worries. Good luck with your English language studies BTW. FWIW, I've been learning Polish for the last few years and one side effect of that has been to make me realize just how crazy the English language can be!
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Old 11-29-2019, 10:06 AM   #66
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No worries. Good luck with your English language studies BTW. FWIW, I've been learning Polish for the last few years and one side effect of that has been to make me realize just how crazy the English language can be!
Thanks, there's rather people see what they want to see (I mean myself)
btw good luck you too!
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