Problem with MIDI CC64 (Sustain-Pedal)

[riffboy]

Hi all!

This is my first post here as I'm quite new to Reaper.

I'm coming from Ableton Live (bought Live 9 /Push (1)-Bundle), but lately I've been working a lot with Audio-Tracks and for that, I'd like to try another DAW.

This is why I'm currently demoing Reaper 5.78 on Win7, latest updates, 64-bit.

Already made a demo-song with it (all Audio) and especially CPU-performance and the comping-workflow is much better compared to Ableton.

Then I tried to work with MIDI and I ran into a problem with MIDI CC64 (Sustain Pedal).

I have an M-Audio-Pedal connected to Push (working fine in Ableton) and I use the "Transformator 1.2"-Script to connect Push to Reaper: http://www.mossgrabers.de/Software/Push/Push.html.
It supports the sustain pedal.

I already checked this thread: https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=166502
And this thread: https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=138243

Nothing that was suggested worked for me.

Then I added ReaControlMIDI to the track to monitor incoming MIDI.
I just get "Note on" and "Note off"-messages for every key I press, but no feedback at all from the sustain pedal?

At first I thought it might be a problem with the Transformator-Script, but I've found no reports about problems with the pedal.

So after checking the Reaper Forum and seeing these other threads about MIDI CC64-Problems, I'm starting to believe it's a "Reaper-Problem"?
And it's not just a problem with pedals, it looks more like a general problem with MIDI CC64 in Reaper.

For example, I tried to manually draw some data into the CC64-lane (4-bar-Midi-Item, one chord for each bar).
And the manual sustain-data was just drawn under the first chord. The three following chords had no sustain (value=0).
The sustain-pedal started picking up for the first chord, but then it never stops. Sustains the whole MIDI-clip.

This happened with various Native Instruments-Plugins, after a while I switched to EZKeys (as it gives you visual feedback for the sustain pedal), still the same result.
Pedal not working and drawing in data manually not really working, too.

MIDI CC64 is something very basic, and something very "old" so I'd like to believe that I've missed something because I'm new to Reaper?

Sunny greetings!

[Stella645]

If you load midilogger plugin what messages do you see when using sustain?
Last column is probably all that's required.

[Philbo King]

A sustain pedal event is a one time event. If a synth encounters a pedal-down event, it will assume the pedal is held down, and sustain all new notes, until it sees a pedal-up event.

Try using a value of 1 or 2 for your pedal-up event. Anything below 63 would work.

As for why your hardware pedal doesn't show up, I'd start by checking whether the midi port and midi channel number it uses matches the midi you are editing. And, of course, you need to arm a track to do midi recording to get that pedal midi into your midi item

[riffboy]

Hi and thanks for your help.

"If you load midilogger plugin what messages do you see when using sustain?"

I downloaded and installed the Midilogger by Darkstar, gives the same results as the ReaControlMIDI: Note On and Note Off-Messages for every key I press, but absolutely no feedback from the Sustain-Pedal at all.

It's like the Pedal is invisible for Reaper.

Well, as long as it's supposed to send Midi CC64-messages.

There are two slots at the back of Push, named "1" and "2".

"1" is for Midi CC64, "2" is for "hands-free-recording", which means the first time you press the pedal, it starts recording, the second time you press it, it stops recording.

If I connect the pedal to the second slot, it works for "hands-free-recording", if I put it back into slot 1, it's dead again.

Back in Ableton it works again (on both slots), so I'd like to think that neither the pedal nor Push are "broken"?

"As for why your hardware pedal doesn't show up, I'd start by checking whether the midi port and midi channel number it uses matches the midi you are editing. And, of course, you need to arm a track to do midi recording to get that pedal midi into your midi item"

Midi Channel is always set to "All Midi Inputs, All Channels" (I think that's the setting that's recommended when using "Transformator").

This setting seems to work , I can play notes and I hear them through every VSTi I tried, the only thing that's missing is Midi CC64.

Actually I've always tried to record Midi Notes and CC64 at the same time, so Channel-Input-Settings are always the same for both actions?

Track is armed, of course.

Not sure about the "Midi Port", couldn't find anything like that in Reaper?

"Try using a value of 1 or 2 for your pedal-up event. Anything below 63 would work."

Thanks this seems to work for manually drawing in data. It's a workaround as long as I don't get the pedal to work.

Of course it would be much better to be able to record Midi CC64 in real-time, so I'll be thankful for any ideas.

Sunny greetings!

[juliansader]

I wonder whether this problem is limited to CC64 or whether it affects all CCs. Could you perhaps tweak Push/Transformator to send the pedal data to another CC such as modwheel?

Also, to check whether the problem lies with the pedal or with REAPER, try to send CC64 (or any other CCs) via Push to REAPER in any way that doesn't involve the pedal.

[riffboy]

Hi Juliansader,

thanks for your help.

I have found no way to make the pedal send other CC-data than CC64. Perhaps it could be done with some plugin?

But it's possible to tweak Transformator so that the Pitchbend-Touchstrip sends Midi CC64.

This works, I can play it in real-time and record it and the data is in the Midi-Item.

It's not as accurate as playing with a pedal, but at least I have two workarounds now.
Use the Pitchbend or manually draw in data.

I think the problem with the pedal and Midi CC64 might be the special combination of my M-Audio-Pedal and Transformator.
I'm trying to talk to the developer about it.

If all fails, I'm willing to buy a pedal that works in this combination as the one I'm using right now wasn't really expensive.

Thanks again to all of you and have a sunny week!