Old 10-15-2018, 08:54 AM   #1
Neutronic
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Default v5.96+dev1015 - October 15 2018

v5.96+dev1015 - October 15 2018
  • + Notation: fix actions to insert note at nearest C, etc [p=2045279]
  • + ReaEQ: alt+click band to remove it
  • + ReaEQ: fix phase calculation error [t=193417]
  • + ReaEQ: improve phase display range
  • # VST3: fix channel names in IAttributeList
Changelog - Pre-Releases

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Old 10-15-2018, 09:08 AM   #2
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Quote:
+ ReaEQ: alt+click band to remove it
Wow, that was fast and it works like a charm. Thank you very much!
I hope the 2nd requested modifier for "adding a new band" either by double clicking spectrum or ctrl+clicking can be implemented with the same ease.
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Old 10-15-2018, 09:17 AM   #3
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Thanks for the fixes in the phase plot!


Oversampling option (up to 8x) would make this a really great stock EQ, by the way. The way things scrunch around Nyquist could be so completely avoided in that case...

Last edited by EvilDragon; 10-15-2018 at 09:29 AM.
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Old 10-15-2018, 10:46 AM   #4
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Please make adding FX the same behavior as pasting FX. It makes no sense to don't have an option to add FX inside the chain / right after the selected FX.

Just an example: Imaging having a bass with eq as first effect and a sidechain compressor at the end of the chain and then you want to try out different amps/effects etc. Every time you press "add" you have to drag the added fx from the end of the chain manually in the right position. That is really annoying. Selecting the first FX and choosing ADD should always put the chosen FX after the selected FX in chain.

Many thanks

Btw: There are many Kenny Gioa videos out there where this behavior just looks awkward.
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Old 10-15-2018, 10:52 AM   #5
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That is already possible by drag&dropping the plugin in the FX window left side frame. Wherever you drop an FX it will instantiate it.

Same thing works in extended MCP...

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Old 10-15-2018, 11:17 AM   #6
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Good to know. I never dragged FX in the list rather than choosing them. But it still makes no sense to "add" only at the end of the chain.

Many thanks for the hint.
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Old 10-15-2018, 11:25 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by Eliseat View Post
Good to know. I never dragged FX in the list rather than choosing them. But it still makes no sense to "add" only at the end of the chain.

Many thanks for the hint.
It doesn't add only in the end of the chain. Watch carefully the previous post example by EvilDragon.
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Old 10-15-2018, 11:27 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by Eliseat View Post
Good to know. I never dragged FX in the list rather than choosing them. But it still makes no sense to "add" only at the end of the chain.

Many thanks for the hint.
How would Reaper know where you want to drop the FX if all it has is your click on "Add" button? It can't. I guess only by seeing which FX is currently selected, if any. But at that point, just drag&drop the FX where you want?


What I would want to see, though, is being able to REPLACE an FX when holding a modifier and dropping a different FX over it. That doesn't seem to work now. Like hold Ctrl while dropping an FX and boom, it replaces whatever you dropped it over. Easy!
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Old 10-15-2018, 11:32 AM   #9
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Originally Posted by EvilDragon View Post
...
What I would want to see, though, is being able to REPLACE an FX when holding a modifier and dropping a different FX over it. That doesn't seem to work now. Like hold Ctrl while dropping an FX and boom, it replaces whatever you dropped it over. Easy!
That would be awesome!
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Old 10-15-2018, 11:36 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Neutronic View Post
v5.96+dev1015 - October 15 2018
[list][*]+ Notation: fix actions to insert note at nearest C, etc [p=2045279]
Thank you!

While we are on the subject, an action like:

"insert note at C1", for example.

I mean all the specific notes, not near a note. It would allow for more custom actions (like inserting keyswitches and specific chords).
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Old 10-15-2018, 11:50 AM   #11
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I guess only by seeing which FX is currently selected, if any.
Of course. Add means add. If i press add with a selected FX it doesn't mean put it on the end of the list. It means add it right here!

At least for me.
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Old 10-15-2018, 11:51 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by EvilDragon View Post
That is already possible by drag&dropping the plugin in the FX window left side frame.
My FX window is docked and I just drag and drop any time I need an FX on MCP, TCP, Items etc..

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Old 10-15-2018, 12:06 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by EvilDragon View Post
How would Reaper know where you want to drop the FX if all it has is your click on "Add" button? It can't. I guess only by seeing which FX is currently selected, if any. But at that point, just drag&drop the FX where you want?
it's pretty easy, no? Just to locate, where mouse click was done, when right click menu was open, and then whatever you choose in fx browser will be added to that place, that' s how i did in my script. Or i misunderstood something?

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Old 10-15-2018, 12:07 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Neutronic View Post
v5.96+dev1015 - October 15 2018[*]+ ReaEQ: fix phase calculation error [t=193417][*]+ ReaEQ: improve phase display range
I think this is still not correct. Images coming soon.
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Old 10-15-2018, 12:53 PM   #15
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I think this is still not correct. Images coming soon.
ReaEQ at 1k, 0.49 bandwidth. 12.0dB gain.

Using HP and LP filters. Frequency response is dead on...



But the phase response graph comparatively:



I thought maybe my tooling was being dumb. I checked this with REW, Fuzz Measure and a simple Octave script.

I tested against DMG Equlibrium (which has a phase graph) and MFreeformPhase. My tooling matched these products perfectly. I also matched a simple octave script with an ultra basic RC-style low pass.

So I assume my tooling is correct. The rotation to ∞ on the low pass makes sense as well (which is not shown in ReaEQ).

Compare the phase response of MEqualizer with the same settings:



The graphs are unwrapped.

It's that phase ripple not being shown that's the "big" issue. The transition to ∞ phase rotation doesn't matter (too much, it'd be nice if it was correct though).

I assume that the bandpass is wrong for the same reasons...



Anyway... this is all really nitpicky, but hopefully it's somewhat helpful.
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Old 10-15-2018, 12:56 PM   #16
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HUGE thanks for the larger band handles. I have hand tremors and things like this are a massive QoL improvement.
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Old 10-15-2018, 01:44 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by Neutronic View Post
Wow, that was fast and it works like a charm. Thank you very much!
I hope the 2nd requested modifier for "adding a new band" either by double clicking spectrum or ctrl+clicking can be implemented with the same ease.
Seconded. Double clicking to create new bands is fairly standard across lots of different eq-plugins.
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Old 10-15-2018, 02:02 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Randolph View Post
ReaEQ at 1k, 0.49 bandwidth. 12.0dB gain.

Using HP and LP filters. Frequency response is dead on...
But the phase response graph comparatively:
...

It's that phase ripple not being shown that's the "big" issue. The transition to ∞ phase rotation doesn't matter (too much, it'd be nice if it was correct though).

I assume that the bandpass is wrong for the same reasons...

Anyway... this is all really nitpicky, but hopefully it's somewhat helpful.

The phase response graphs that ReaEQ is generating appear to match the theoretical graphs for the filters. Maybe there's some other methodology issue, but I wrote some code to generate the graph brute force via FFT, and it produces almost identical results (there are some small differences very close to nyquist and DC due to FFT limitations and whatnot), so hmm.

p.s. those retina images are difficult for people who've accidentally switched away from the REAPER 5 forum theme
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Old 10-15-2018, 02:22 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin View Post
The phase response graphs that ReaEQ is generating appear to match the theoretical graphs for the filters. Maybe there's some other methodology issue, but I wrote some code to generate the graph brute force via FFT, and it produces almost identical results (there are some small differences very close to nyquist and DC due to FFT limitations and whatnot), so hmm.
Well, the phase ripple in the low pass definitely appears to be there. I can even confirm this with just a stereo goniometer and a sine sweep.

ReaEQ isn't showing that at all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin View Post
p.s. those retina images are difficult for people who've accidentally switched away from the REAPER 5 forum theme
Ah shit. Sorry I need to setup fswatch to resize stuff for me.
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Old 10-15-2018, 02:32 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by Robert Randolph View Post
Well, the phase ripple in the low pass definitely appears to be there. I can even confirm this with just a stereo goniometer and a sine sweep.

ReaEQ isn't showing that at all.
Can you give me steps to reproduce/analyze?
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Old 10-15-2018, 02:35 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin View Post
Can you give me steps to reproduce/analyze?
Already on it... I cut one of my fingers in half last night, so I'm a bit slow right now
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Old 10-15-2018, 02:35 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin View Post
p.s. those retina images are difficult for people who've accidentally switched away from the REAPER 5 forum theme
Confirmed.
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Old 10-15-2018, 02:57 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin View Post
Can you give me steps to reproduce/analyze?
Ok, here's a simple setup to show it:
  • Sine sweep
  • ReaEQ with lowpass
  • ReaEQ disabled output to channel 2
  • MStereoScope (since it shows the absolute correlation)

Should show phase correlation between channel 1 (processed) and channel 2 (unprocessed)

The ripple/wobble is pretty clear with the sine sweep.

Secondly:

Here's how I tested with Fuzz Measureand/or REW
  • Install SoundFlower (or Loopback)
  • Insert reaper track to take from input 1
  • Set Reaper to output to channel 3
  • Setup Fuzz/REW the opposite. Output to 1, input from 3.

Run the measurement and check phase plots. They both can give minimum phase computed, and actual (plus difference).

With octave, I just compared a unprocessod and processed wave, convert to transfer function, then bode() plotted. I didn't save the code, and I wouldn't post it anyway because I suck with this Octave garbage.
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Old 10-15-2018, 02:58 PM   #24
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That last post should have had this gif:

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Old 10-15-2018, 03:10 PM   #25
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Here's a comparison of FFT-based phase analysis vs the filter:



I also did a similar test using the goniometer JSFX. I see the same general shapes going through a sweep, not sure what the wobble you're referring to is. As the phase changes you'll see the width of the ellipse change smoothly, but there might be a perceived wobble as the length changes due to the volume change of the LPF, and the way that the phase/volume changes interact could look weird.

Finally -- ReaEQ uses very simple IIR filters, the phase response in the current version is consistent with everything online about what a filter of this type should be, that I can find. It was definitely incorrect in 5.96.
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Old 10-15-2018, 03:17 PM   #26
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One more thing regarding ReaEq mouse modifiers: can we get modifiers to restrict horizontal/vertical band movement at full speed? Currently we have modifiers that do only fine restricted adjustments which is too slow for most scenarios. So it'd be awesome if the current ones - "ctrl+mouse up/down" for vertical and "alt+mouse left/right" for horizontal - were turned to full speed restricted, but their shift modified versions (ctrl+shift+mouse up-down/left-right) added for fine restricted movements.

Of course, you could leave the current ones as is and make shift modified version full speed and it would also be a huge improvement, but the other way around feels more natural.

Thanks!
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Old 10-15-2018, 03:18 PM   #27
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The phase PLOT THICKENS.



(I guess if it's like that, then ok? Would still love to see oversampling added, though. If ReaComp/ReaXcomp can have it, why not our good friend ReaEQ? )
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Old 10-15-2018, 03:29 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by EvilDragon View Post
The phase PLOT THICKENS.



(I guess if it's like that, then ok? Would still love to see oversampling added, though. If ReaComp/ReaXcomp can have it, why not our good friend ReaEQ? )
ReaXcomp doesn't have it... and ReaComp's is pretty much considered pointless afaict.
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Old 10-15-2018, 03:37 PM   #29
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Ehhh... But it wouldn't be pointless in an EQ, absolutely not Would be able to deal with stuff around Nyquist much much more gracefully.


Also not sure why I thought ReaXcomp had it. Oops!
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Old 10-15-2018, 03:45 PM   #30
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Quote:
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I also did a similar test using the goniometer JSFX.
JS Goniometer doesn't show it for some reason. Signalizer and MStereoScope do. I am lost regarding this.

I assume at this point that the q/gain interaction is the issue. At a bandwidth of 2.0 or higher, everything looks kosher.

I'm giving up, because I suspect I'm simply missing some information or education here.

It's a big improvement over 5.96.
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Old 10-15-2018, 04:07 PM   #31
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Ok, I just had a moment with Melodyne and a project I have to work on. The performance is bad again, unfortunately. I had a lot of takes so I just cropped them all to keep just one per item but that didn't alleviate the problem so I just glued everything and kept only one item per track (5 tracks) and didn't work either, unfortunately. I really wished it could work but re-enabling the undo system for Melodyne really hits the performance badly.
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