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07-13-2019, 09:31 AM
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#1
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 3,127
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Melodyne ARA Corruption (Findings)
Gonna split off from the other threads so that it's not messing with other people's bug reports.
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07-13-2019, 11:56 AM
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#2
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 3,127
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Here I'm demonstrating:
1. A working .RPP, then hitting Save.
2. Notice the .RPP-bak is generated.
3. Open the newly-saved .RPP
4. Melodyne reanalyses. Open/Close the FX and you get the actual error displayed.
5. Open the .RPP-bak, everything is fine.
What is happening during save that is corrupting?
Last edited by ferropop; 07-13-2019 at 12:22 PM.
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07-13-2019, 12:22 PM
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#3
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 3,127
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Oh and if instead of SAVE I choose SAVE NEW VERSION OF PROJECT, that new file is completely fine.
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07-13-2019, 12:33 PM
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#4
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 3,127
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Note: I cannot reproduce this in fresh Reaper Portable. Is there anything I can provide that might shed some light?
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07-13-2019, 12:40 PM
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#5
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Administrator
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: NY
Posts: 15,821
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If you can't reproduce it in a portable install, could you run the action "File: Export configuration" and mail the config file to support at cockos?
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07-13-2019, 02:36 PM
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#6
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 3,127
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07-13-2019, 02:53 PM
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#7
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Administrator
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: NYC
Posts: 15,746
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Any scripts running? Same sws version installed for portable vs your main install?
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07-13-2019, 04:41 PM
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#8
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 3,127
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin
Any scripts running? Same sws version installed for portable vs your main install?
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Same SWS version yeah, 2.10.0 #1.
I'm going through all the actions to see if any scripts are running, but so far nothing.
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07-13-2019, 04:49 PM
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#9
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 3,127
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Backed up, doing a Reset Configuration to Factory Defaults, and testing. Then I'll reintroduce one old Configuration item at a time and see what happens...
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07-13-2019, 07:47 PM
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#10
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 3,127
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Justin/Schwa:
Starting with a fresh unsaved project, adding a .WAV file, adding Melodyne to that track, then Save with the "Copy all media to project directory"... is it possible that there's discrepancy between the new "copied" .wav source in the .RPP and the location Melodyne is expecting to find that same WAV?
...when you haven't saved yet, Reaper will put that .WAV file in the root/temp folder and that's where Melodyne is analyzing it. Upon Saving with Copy all Media to Project Directory, it's then physically copying that WAV file to a new location, and I'm wondering whether that's why Melodyne is freaking out and reanalyzing the file? Does it for some reason see it as a new sourcefile (because it's technically in a new location) and then resets the edits?
Last edited by ferropop; 07-13-2019 at 07:56 PM.
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07-13-2019, 08:35 PM
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#11
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ferropop
Justin/Schwa:
Starting with a fresh unsaved project, adding a .WAV file, adding Melodyne to that track, then Save with the "Copy all media to project directory"... is it possible that there's discrepancy between the new "copied" .wav source in the .RPP and the location Melodyne is expecting to find that same WAV?
...when you haven't saved yet, Reaper will put that .WAV file in the root/temp folder and that's where Melodyne is analyzing it. Upon Saving with Copy all Media to Project Directory, it's then physically copying that WAV file to a new location, and I'm wondering whether that's why Melodyne is freaking out and reanalyzing the file? Does it for some reason see it as a new sourcefile (because it's technically in a new location) and then resets the edits?
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Interesting.
After moving my problem projects to a different folder, re-editing, cleaning up my directory to just what is used in that specific project, everything then stays BUT you’re right as soon as saving takes place in any other way, it’s totally screwed.
The way I know my project is going to fail is this:
As soon as my project opens - if the “ARA analysis” taskbar comes up - I know with certainty that my edits in melodyne will be gone when I open the plugin.
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07-13-2019, 09:41 PM
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#12
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 3,127
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Chris do you use a custom temp directory? I do, a folder called Incomplete so the pre-save working files don't clog up my project folder. Connected?
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07-13-2019, 10:49 PM
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#13
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ferropop
Chris do you use a custom temp directory? I do, a folder called Incomplete so the pre-save working files don't clog up my project folder. Connected?
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Well that, sir, is a good idea!
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07-14-2019, 08:06 AM
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#14
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 3,127
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Ok so you're not also doing that then? I thought maybe that could be connected. Devs?
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07-14-2019, 09:36 AM
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#15
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ferropop
Ok so you're not also doing that then? I thought maybe that could be connected. Devs?
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I was not doing that BUT it’s a great idea for me in general. Thanks!
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07-16-2019, 12:11 PM
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#16
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 3,127
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Hey guys, thought I'd chime in.
I've fixed my problem (as far as I can tell). The fact that it wasn't happening on a Portable install was a huge red flag, and implied it was something in my config. This is what I did:
1. Backed up my Reaper config.
2. Completely uninstalled reaper, and deleted the %appdata%\Reaper folder where ~10 years of configuration stuff resided.
3. Renamed the config backup to .zip and extracted.
4. Reinstalled Reaper
5. One by one (testing between each one), copied config files from the extracted backup into %appdata%\Reaper until my config was as close to normal as possible using the absolute minimum number of old config files. ie, I let the VST cache rebuild itself naturally but copied in Reaper.ini, swsautocolor config, custom mappings etc.
So far so good. Thank you for the time you've put into making ARA as seamless as possible.
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07-16-2019, 12:31 PM
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#17
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Administrator
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: NY
Posts: 15,821
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I'm happy you're not seeing the problem any more, but we'd sure like to know what part of the configuration was triggering it!
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07-16-2019, 12:40 PM
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#18
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 3,127
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Me too, I'm thinking of doing the same process on the Portable install and figuring out which file breaks it.
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07-16-2019, 09:46 PM
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#19
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ferropop
Me too, I'm thinking of doing the same process on the Portable install and figuring out which file breaks it.
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I did it. No luck for me. Nice to get a fresh install though!
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07-17-2019, 10:35 AM
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#20
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 3,127
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris7t6
I did it. No luck for me. Nice to get a fresh install though!
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Wow really, I wonder why this worked for me.
Chris7t6 did you try the portable install to compare?
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07-17-2019, 12:07 PM
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#21
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ferropop
Wow really, I wonder why this worked for me.
Chris7t6 did you try the portable install to compare?
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Yep. I did. However, the behavior isn't exactly the same now. I still get that stupid corrupt document message on some of my projects but it seems that the edits are all in the right places.
However, it doesn't inspire confidence that what I'm doing will be safe.
Of course I'll keep moving forward though and see if this shakes out to be an "old project" problem as I bring new clients in.
I will be keeping a very close eye on this issue.
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07-18-2019, 11:15 PM
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#22
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ferropop
Wow really, I wonder why this worked for me.
Chris7t6 did you try the portable install to compare?
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So I redid the procedure with the portable install per your suggestion.
It seems to have worked! For future and current sessions. Not past sessions unfortunately.
After I edit and save, everything is there and solid when I reopen. VERY VERY HAPPY!
One thing I've found; The "save minimal undo states" should never be used with Melodyne. It breaks your edits the first time you "undo" anything.
Last edited by Chris7t6; 07-19-2019 at 12:09 AM.
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07-19-2019, 08:51 AM
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#23
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 3,127
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris7t6
So I redid the procedure with the portable install per your suggestion.
It seems to have worked! For future and current sessions. Not past sessions unfortunately.
After I edit and save, everything is there and solid when I reopen. VERY VERY HAPPY!
One thing I've found; The "save minimal undo states" should never be used with Melodyne. It breaks your edits the first time you "undo" anything.
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That's amazing man, I wonder what is in both our configs that was messing things up? Hoping to put in some time this weekend to figure it out and give Cockos some meaningful results.
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07-20-2019, 10:47 PM
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#24
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ferropop
That's amazing man, I wonder what is in both our configs that was messing things up? Hoping to put in some time this weekend to figure it out and give Cockos some meaningful results.
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Yeah. I have no idea. I know what I DIDN’T use from my old config but that’s about it. I have all the successful config saved along with what was added in the name. Once I got enough of my settings back, I stopped restoring and just finished by setting some preferences. I saved that config and it seems to be fine.
And I DO know that if I use my old config now it breaks everything. As long as I don’t save under that config, everything is fine. As soon as I put my new working config back, everything works again.
If anybody at Cockos is interested in my old and new config to compare, lemme know.
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07-21-2019, 05:28 AM
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#25
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Administrator
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: NY
Posts: 15,821
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Yes of course! The old config files, along with steps to reproduce the problem, would be much appreciated.
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07-21-2019, 11:02 PM
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#26
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by schwa
Yes of course! The old config files, along with steps to reproduce the problem, would be much appreciated.
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Ok, Schwa. I'll get that packed up in the next day and sent to you.
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07-21-2019, 11:21 PM
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#27
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris7t6
Yeah. I have no idea. I know what I DIDN’T use from my old config but that’s about it. I have all the successful config saved along with what was added in the name. Once I got enough of my settings back, I stopped restoring and just finished by setting some preferences. I saved that config and it seems to be fine.
And I DO know that if I use my old config now it breaks everything. As long as I don’t save under that config, everything is fine. As soon as I put my new working config back, everything works again.
If anybody at Cockos is interested in my old and new config to compare, lemme know.
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AND MY BLISS HAS ENDED!! The project I'm working on has been performing wonderful. Bout 15 minutes ago, Melodyne started the same crap. Corrupt. I just don't understand. I'm going to try ANOTHER reinstall of Reaper and throw that working config in to see what happens.
SUPER BUMMER.
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07-21-2019, 11:47 PM
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#28
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 90
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Ok. After clearing my machine of the last install, I opened my rpp in the initial reaper config state, saved and closed.
I then reopened to make sure Melodyne was going to "stick"
It did save correctly, so I saved again and then imported my latest problem free config. Saved, blah, blah...
Anyways, now everything seems to be fine again.
Guys, I'm not kidding when I say i did nothing to my program or data folder between my last fresh install and this latest failure.
What I DID do however was install the 5.981 x64 from the pre release directory.
I'm now back at 5.80.
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07-22-2019, 04:34 AM
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#29
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: South, UK
Posts: 14,218
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Wanted to say , feel sorry for you trouble guys but thanks for documenting it and working through it with Schwa so that others here will benefit too.
Hope it gets sorted out asap!
__________________
subproject FRs click here
note: don't search for my pseudonym on the web. The "musicbynumbers" you find is not me or the name I use for my own music.
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07-22-2019, 08:04 AM
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#30
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 227
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Just to say I'm having the same problems...that error about the document structure or whatever, and then all my edits are lost. I've resorted to basically just rendering the edits as soon as they're done. Unfortunately I can't dive into to this deeply at the moment, but I'm keeping a keen eye on this. Thanks for your efforts.
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07-22-2019, 10:53 AM
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#31
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 4,820
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris7t6
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I wonder if making backup (ex: with timestamp) more frequently and then when it's broken and comparing the good and the bad might help figuring out what trigger it? Sorry Just a thought I had
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07-22-2019, 10:58 AM
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#32
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deeb
I wonder if making backup (ex: with timestamp) more frequently and then when it's broken and comparing the good and the bad might help figuring out what trigger it? Sorry Just a thought I had
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That is a good idea.
I'll try that. Some projects still just won't work. Wearing a bald spot on my chin at this point!!
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07-22-2019, 12:45 PM
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#33
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by schwa
Yes of course! The old config files, along with steps to reproduce the problem, would be much appreciated.
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Ok. I have two sessions by the same artist. One reliably works. One reliably doesn't despite changes made.
I'd like to upload my configs and the sessions.
How do I do this so that it gets to the right folks?
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07-22-2019, 01:59 PM
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#34
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 90
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https://forum.cockos.com/attachment....1&d=1563828998
UPDATE: The below info has also been confirmed in the portable install as well.
This one for instance gives me the "document corrupt" message, However, it's only that last guy in the track list that won't stay put.
I've run across this exact thing with other projects.
Last edited by Chris7t6; 07-22-2019 at 02:31 PM.
Reason: MORE FINDINGS
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07-23-2019, 03:18 AM
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#35
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2019
Location: France
Posts: 41
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I'm having the same problem for some time now and started a thread back in may about it.
https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=221137
This post to say that, I've always managed to find a working version (with all Melodyne data correct and not complaining) in the last backups (I have auto backup set to 2 minutes).
Which is why it seems unlikely that this problem is config related, as some RPP projects work and some don't including backups.
However, I did try to delete all my .ini files this morning, to no avail, I got the same error from Melodyne.
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07-23-2019, 10:36 AM
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#36
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by matnoir
I'm having the same problem for some time now and started a thread back in may about it.
https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=221137
This post to say that, I've always managed to find a working version (with all Melodyne data correct and not complaining) in the last backups (I have auto backup set to 2 minutes).
Which is why it seems unlikely that this problem is config related, as some RPP projects work and some don't including backups.
However, I did try to delete all my .ini files this morning, to no avail, I got the same error from Melodyne.
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Thanks for chiming in!!
At this point it still feels like a mystery to me. Melodyne is a huge part of my process. I’m now looking at other options besides Melodyne but there’s nothing out there that seems even close.
Pretty big bummer. We have put so much time into this problem and at this point there is really not even a reliable work around.
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07-24-2019, 05:41 AM
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#37
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2019
Location: France
Posts: 41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris7t6
Thanks for chiming in!!
At this point it still feels like a mystery to me. Melodyne is a huge part of my process. I’m now looking at other options besides Melodyne but there’s nothing out there that seems even close.
Pretty big bummer. We have put so much time into this problem and at this point there is really not even a reliable work around.
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Thank you for your input!
It reminds me that I forgot to say that I've noticed that "corrupted" RPP files sometimes have a significantly lighter filesize than correct ones. This helps me find a good candidate within the backups.
This is what led me to think that it's a save (or auto-save) problem rather than a config one.
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07-24-2019, 08:09 PM
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#38
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by matnoir
Thank you for your input!
It reminds me that I forgot to say that I've noticed that "corrupted" RPP files sometimes have a significantly lighter filesize than correct ones. This helps me find a good candidate within the backups.
This is what led me to think that it's a save (or auto-save) problem rather than a config one.
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UPDATE: The below seemed like it might have done the trick for a minute. However, it did not stick.
That's got me thinking. Should we disable auto saves for a while and see if something is happening there? Is that a dumb idea ( other than the obvious reason of course... )?
Last edited by Chris7t6; 07-24-2019 at 09:06 PM.
Reason: UPDATE:
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07-25-2019, 03:25 AM
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#39
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2019
Location: France
Posts: 41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris7t6
UPDATE: The below seemed like it might have done the trick for a minute. However, it did not stick.
That's got me thinking. Should we disable auto saves for a while and see if something is happening there? Is that a dumb idea ( other than the obvious reason of course... )?
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Yes, the fact that some backup files are ok and some aren't seems to point to a more general save issue.
I also tried to play with the plugins "compatibility settings" params but without success.
I also would be tempted to try and disable third party extensions (SWS and Eucon), but I can hardly work without them and currently have no time for testing.
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07-25-2019, 04:24 PM
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#40
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2018
Posts: 375
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When saving a project with "Move all media to project directory" ticked, while still having the Melodyne window open, Reaper gets stuck at the save progression box until the Melodyne window gets closed.
I guess this is expected behavior (or maybe it's just happening to me) but anyway I just wanted to make sure.
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