Left and Right balance

[Jimmy James]

I am doing a audio master. All the songs are mixed and it is now in my hands. They don't want to do anything to the mix. They want me to do the best I can with what I have.

So far, so good. The song I am on right now. It has a electric dirt track on the left and a acoustic guitar on the left. The dirt guitar is to dang loud. It just messes everything up. It also seems it would be better panned a little more left.
The dirt left guitar sounds about 35% left and the right acoustic sounds about 40% right. This sounds like a last mix of the night mix.

My question. Should I copy the track into 2 tracks. Set one to left mono and the other as right mono. Tweak the levels and render it back into a stereo track?
I have done the above and it sounds much better. Is this the best way? Or is there a better way to get this song right?

[RDBOIS]

Originally Posted by Jimmy James

I am doing a audio master. All the songs are mixed and it is now in my hands. They don't want to do anything to the mix. They want me to do the best I can with what I have.

So far, so good. The song I am on right now. It has a electric dirt track on the left and a acoustic guitar on the left. The dirt guitar is to dang loud. It just messes everything up. It also seems it would be better panned a little more left.
The dirt left guitar sounds about 35% left and the right acoustic sounds about 40% right. This sounds like a last mix of the night mix.

My question. Should I copy the track into 2 tracks. Set one to left mono and the other as right mono. Tweak the levels and render it back into a stereo track?
I have done the above and it sounds much better. Is this the best way? Or is there a better way to get this song right?

Not sure I'm following all your steps.

YES they are both MONO ! Unless you want to open a can of tech-worms you cannot handle?

Yes copy both into two separate tracks.

No and yes = You can do a LEFT and RIGHT separation, but why? This is good, but very risky especially if your listeners will be listening in a single speaker (like a cell phone, a laptop, or even in a bar..)

Not sure how I can explain this in simple terms....

Left - Right is a stereo issue. You really need to know what you are doing.

If you don't... Then please start by keeping everything mono. Nothing left, nothing right. DO the BEST MIX you can !!!!!

Then, as you learn more about Stereo --- You can get fancy.

My INTUITION tells me you are not ready for mixing in stereo... I could be wrong.

Please keep it simple.

Best

[Heart Doctor]

Originally Posted by Jimmy James

Should I copy the track into 2 tracks. Set one to left mono and the other as right mono. Tweak the levels and render it back into a stereo track?

Too complicated. There is no need to split the stereo track.

If you have a stereo track and one side is too loud, simply adjust the panner until the track sounds more balanced.

[Jimmy James]

Originally Posted by RDBOIS

Not sure I'm following all your steps.

YES they are both MONO ! Unless you want to open a can of tech-worms you cannot handle?

Yes copy both into two separate tracks.

No and yes = You can do a LEFT and RIGHT separation, but why? This is good, but very risky especially if your listeners will be listening in a single speaker (like a cell phone, a laptop, or even in a bar..)

Not sure how I can explain this in simple terms....

Left - Right is a stereo issue. You really need to know what you are doing.

If you don't... Then please start by keeping everything mono. Nothing left, nothing right. DO the BEST MIX you can !!!!!

Then, as you learn more about Stereo --- You can get fancy.

My INTUITION tells me you are not ready for mixing in stereo... I could be wrong.

Please keep it simple.

Best

Dude, I am mastering, not mixing. And I have no control over the mix. He said he won't go back and changer anything in the mix. The guitar on the left is way to loud. I am trying to fix it. it is painful to loud.
I am currently using Mid/Side EQ and slight compression to try and fix it. I was trying to find the best way to handle this.
Had I mixed it, I would just go back and fix it and render it back out for mastering.

[Jimmy James]

Originally Posted by Heart Doctor

Too complicated. There is no need to split the stereo track.

If you have a stereo track and one side is too loud, simply adjust the panner until the track sounds more balanced.

I tried that as well. It sounds funny when I do. I tried using the pan right out of the gate. It just won't work. So far, using Mid/Side has been the best. It is still not perfect, but much better.
I am still open to ideas. I was worried about breaking the track into left and right. When I do this, I hear phase issues.

[ErBird]

Originally Posted by Heart Doctor

If you have a stereo track and one side is too loud, simply adjust the panner until the track sounds more balanced.

But then you also pan the other elements in the mix...

Originally Posted by Jimmy James

Had I mixed it, I would just go back and fix it and render it back out for mastering.

What's the absurd reason they won't fix the mix? Seems like that's the obvious solution.

[poetnprophet]

Well, sounds like you should just master it the way it is. If that's what the customer really wants....

Perhaps you could collapse it all to mono, then use a little bit of stereo widening?

[SonicAxiom]

Originally Posted by Jimmy James

My question. Should I copy the track into 2 tracks. Set one to left mono and the other as right mono. Tweak the levels and render it back into a stereo track?
I have done the above and it sounds much better. Is this the best way? Or is there a better way to get this song right?

processing the mix in mid-side stereo is probably the best way to get an improvement if you can't get a better mix to work with. Put an MS encoding plugin on the track followed by a compressor plugin which is set to act on the side signal only via its pin routing. You can then compress only the side part of the stereo field (incl. both guitars) and maybe achieve a better balance between them while keeping the signals in the centre of the stereo field more or less unaffected. You may add an eq, also acting on the side signal only. This may also help a bit. Finally, put an MS decoding plugin behind the MS processing plugins to convert the signal back to LR stereo.

.

[ivansc]

If this was my client & I had access to the multitracks I would do one master "as instructed" & another how you feel it should have been mixed.

Sit client down and ask him if he would mind listening without pre-judging to what you did.
I am in the reverse situation now, as the guy who did the (excellent) recording of some of my stuff sent me rough mixes as he wants to mix aswell. Unfortunately the balance of instruments tells me that he really doesnt "get" what should be happening. I dont want to upset him, as he is a very good, very sympathetic engineer, but...
FWIW I have bad comments from two band members saying the same thing.
So there you have it from both sides. Good luck! You have to be something of a diplomant to run a studio, dont you?

[serr]

Originally Posted by ivansc

You have to be something of a diplomant to run a studio, dont you?

Clairvoyant sometimes too!

Drummer from recent client. "The drums just sound thin and terrible! WTF!?"
After a few leading questions I made them a volume war level copy of the very exact same mix...
"I love the drum mix so much now!!!"

Dude had a volume war CD collection. All he ever knew. -12 LUFS (already pushing hot IMHO because it's noisy rockin' music and seemed appropriate) just didn't compute!

Make sure you properly translate what your client is really trying to tell you!

[Jimmy James]

Originally Posted by ErBird

But then you also pan the other elements in the mix...



What's the absurd reason they won't fix the mix? Seems like that's the obvious solution.

He said he worked to hard and to long on it. And it is so obvious it is mis balanced. The mix itself, sound about 75% as the other mixes as well. I am working way to hard to try and make this sound as good as the other songs.
It just isn't mixed as well. And that statement is being very nice....

[Jimmy James]

Originally Posted by poetnprophet

Well, sounds like you should just master it the way it is. If that's what the customer really wants....

Perhaps you could collapse it all to mono, then use a little bit of stereo widening?

I have tried that as well. its not bad, but it sounds a little phasy. There are phase problems with the stereo tracks to begin with.

I think I just have to say "I have done all I can". And just move on.... Thank you to everyone. You have reminded me that we can only do so much. And we can only work with what we got

[Jimmy James]

Originally Posted by SonicAxiom

processing the mix in mid-side stereo is probably the best way to get an improvement if you can't get a better mix to work with. Put an MS encoding plugin on the track followed by a compressor plugin which is set to act on the side signal only via its pin routing. You can then compress only the side part of the stereo field (incl. both guitars) and maybe achieve a better balance between them while keeping the signals in the centre of the stereo field more or less unaffected. You may add an eq, also acting on the side signal only. This may also help a bit. Finally, put an MS decoding plugin behind the MS processing plugins to convert the signal back to LR stereo.

.

This is what I ended up doing. It isnt as good as the other songs. But it is the best I can do with what I have to work with.