Control Surface Integration (CSI) Technical Feature Discussion - Page 553

MixMonkey · 01-26-2023, 06:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

Is anyone using local modifiers ?

Yes

Quote:

Thinking about this a bit more, maybe it is best to keep the old way as well as allow for the new way.

At this point in CSI's development, this is always the best idea

Funkybot · 01-26-2023, 06:37 PM

I'm not using LocalModifiers, but I can see why someone with a C4 would and would want to keep that. Wouldn't make sense on my particular setup though. I can definitely see where they would present a challenge in this advanced mode where everything's happening on the page level and the C4 may be part of a send zone along with an MCU where maybe LocalModifiers make sense, and the C4 may be used in an FXZone where LocalModifiers totally make sense.

Conceptually, I love everything being proposed. I'd love to find something to pushback or pontificate on but I'm coming up short.

The only thing I can think of is: would anyone want to exclude a surface from this Page Level method and have it operate as a standalone surface?

Will we still have individual home.zon files for each surface? Or would those move up to the page level? Example let's say I wanted to dedicate my Steinberg CMC-QC2 to SelectedTrackTCPFX and global modifiers, then have my X-Touch One as a SelectedTrack surface, my FXTwister for various things from FX to Sends/Receives with of course the iPad for displays, and then maybe even bring in my Artist Mix for the Track.zon in MCU mode...just trying to think of...where do we coordinate all that at the page-level?

But I think page-level makes the most sense for CSI and how I want to use it. It's all just "one big surface" and I'm directing displays there to match up with controls here, and these other surfaces are augmenting this and that. Dig it!

I do agree that keeping the current-state is important. Probably not what anyone wants, but what if "CSI Advanced" was a standalone extension and CSI basic was maintained basically as-is? If a new feature came along, it could be pushed to both where it makes sense, but these could be different things entirely? You could even run CSI basic in parallel with CSI Advanced if you wanted. Probably an awful idea but just brainstorming.

See? I said I couldn't find anything to pontificate on, and there I went! My brain works either through my fingers or mouth. It doesn't operate in standalone mode.

BPBaker · 01-26-2023, 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MixMonkey

It's probably worth pointing out that the MM_iPad_Mixer is more orientated toward an FXMenu workflow that a FocusedFX one.

Thanks--I'm continuing to refine here but this is getting much closer.

One other problem I'm running into is that I often want to keep discrete FX Windows floating, even as I work on other tracks/FX.

It seems as if this setup auto-hides any floating windows when I switch tracks in Reaper. Is there a way to prevent that from happening? Just to have the C4 interface follow the focus of whichever FX window has focus in Reaper?

MixMonkey · 01-26-2023, 07:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BPBaker

Thanks--I'm continuing to refine here but this is getting much closer.

One other problem I'm running into is that I often want to keep discrete FX Windows floating, even as I work on other tracks/FX.

It seems as if this setup auto-hides any floating windows when I switch tracks in Reaper. Is there a way to prevent that from happening? Just to have the C4 interface follow the focus of whichever FX window has focus in Reaper?

Just comment out or delete the line:

Code:

OnTrackSelection Reaper _S&M_WNCLS3

If you don't need the mixer, the C4 page can probably be separated to work standalone.

BPBaker · 01-26-2023, 07:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MixMonkey

Just comment out or delete the line:

Code:

OnTrackSelection Reaper _S&M_WNCLS3

If you don't need the mixer, the C4 page can probably be separated to work standalone.

Oh, wonderful--right under my nose.

I'm still getting used to it but I think I like the mixer? I had been using LogicPad for a while, too--I just wanted it to work better with Reaper, which is what lead me here!

MT4U · 01-26-2023, 08:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MixMonkey

Here's what those lines do:

OnInitialization ToggleEnableFocusedFXMapping : Turns off FocusedFXMapping when CSI starts up. The default is "on", so toggling it turns it off. FocusedFXMapping means you click on an FX window to make it map to the surface. Personally, I can't stand it, so I turn it off and use the FX Menu instead.

OnInitialization ToggleAutoFocusedFXMapping : Turns off auto creation of FX Zones when an FX is focused. The default is "on", so toggling it turns it off.

OnInitialization ToggleAutoFXMapping : Turns off auto creation of FX Zones when an FX is added to a selected track.

What if you have like 3 surfaces?

Should you have this:

Code:

    OnInitialization ToggleAutoFocusedFXMapping
    OnInitialization ToggleAutoFXMapping

on each and every surface?

Just thinking out loud here...

Geoff Waddington · 01-27-2023, 12:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Funkybot

I'm not using LocalModifiers, but I can see why someone with a C4 would and would want to keep that. Wouldn't make sense on my particular setup though. I can definitely see where they would present a challenge in this advanced mode where everything's happening on the page level and the C4 may be part of a send zone along with an MCU where maybe LocalModifiers make sense, and the C4 may be used in an FXZone where LocalModifiers totally make sense.

Conceptually, I love everything being proposed. I'd love to find something to pushback or pontificate on but I'm coming up short.

The only thing I can think of is: would anyone want to exclude a surface from this Page Level method and have it operate as a standalone surface?

Will we still have individual home.zon files for each surface? Or would those move up to the page level? Example let's say I wanted to dedicate my Steinberg CMC-QC2 to SelectedTrackTCPFX and global modifiers, then have my X-Touch One as a SelectedTrack surface, my FXTwister for various things from FX to Sends/Receives with of course the iPad for displays, and then maybe even bring in my Artist Mix for the Track.zon in MCU mode...just trying to think of...where do we coordinate all that at the page-level?

But I think page-level makes the most sense for CSI and how I want to use it. It's all just "one big surface" and I'm directing displays there to match up with controls here, and these other surfaces are augmenting this and that. Dig it!

I do agree that keeping the current-state is important. Probably not what anyone wants, but what if "CSI Advanced" was a standalone extension and CSI basic was maintained basically as-is? If a new feature came along, it could be pushed to both where it makes sense, but these could be different things entirely? You could even run CSI basic in parallel with CSI Advanced if you wanted. Probably an awful idea but just brainstorming.

See? I said I couldn't find anything to pontificate on, and there I went! My brain works either through my fingers or mouth. It doesn't operate in standalone mode.

Good points all.

I did consider two flavours of CSI, but dismissed it as too confusing for users, and too much maintenance work on my part, keeping features up to date, 4 builds (Win/Mac, CSI/CSI advanced), etc.

Upon further consideration, I think CSI advanced is too ambitious at this point, but let's not throw the baby out with the bathwater.

First off, I'd like to reduce some Action bloat, as well as allow for easy future expansion, e.g. TrackTCPFX.

I propose we reduce all of this:

Code:

    GoMasterTrack
    GoTrackSend
    GoTrackReceive
    GoTrackFXMenu
    GoSelectedTrack
    GoSelectedTrackSend
    GoSelectedTrackReceive
    GoSelectedTrackFXMenu
    GoMasterTrackFXMenu
    GoSelectedTrackTCPFX

to

Code:

    GoAssociatedZone TrackFXMenu

etc.

and this:

Code:

    TrackBank
    VCABank
    FolderBank
    TrackSendBank
    TrackReceiveBank
    TrackFXMenuBank
    SelectedTrackBank
    SelectedTrackSendBank
    SelectedTrackReceiveBank
    SelectedTrackFXMenuBank
    MasterTrackFXMenuBank

to

Code:

    Bank Track

etc.

Let's talk Broadcast/Receive.

Can we move this up to Page level, and make it automatic.

I think it depends on the answer to one question.

Is there any workflow that includes the existence of an Associated Zone on a particular Surface, that we would want to exclude from GoAssociatedZone ?

Seems like a very strange use case.

I mean, why would you have an Associated Zone defined that you only want to activate at a Surface level ?

If you had Send Zones defined on both an MCU and Extender, seems like GoAssociatedZone should activate both.

Maybe there is an OSC or C4 type use case that would require this, dunno...

Broadcast/Receive is messy from a user perspective and incredibly messy internally -- ask MT4U

Would be nice to be able to dump it.

Finally, from a non Page aspect, I think we should still implement the concept of FXTemplates and FXLayout:

Code:

Zone "FXTemplate"
    Rotary FXParam
    DisplayUpper FixedTextDisplay
    DisplayLower FXParamValueDisplay
    RotaryPush ToggleFXParam
ZoneEnd

Code:

Zone "FXLayout"
    FXTemplate 8
    FXTemplate Shift 8
    FXTemplate Option 8
    FXTemplate Control 8
    FXTemplate Alt 8
ZoneEnd

and not too far down the road, we could venture into a Page version with this:

Code:

Zone "FXLayout"
    "X-Touch" FXTemplate 8
    "X-Touch" FXTemplate Shift 8
    "X-Touch" FXTemplate Option 8
    "X-Touch" FXTemplate Control 8
    "X-Touch" FXTemplate Alt 8
ZoneEnd

Thoughts ?

MixR · 01-27-2023, 02:28 AM

I think there may be a bug in the EXP builds related to Rotary1.
Let me explain:
I created an FX Zone for XLN XO and the function assigned to Rotary1 (Pan in this case) works as expected. However, when I engage the Shift modifier and turn Rotary1 the assigned control snaps to the minimum value as soon as I touch it and stays there.

Previously, the FX Zone worked as expected and when I roll back to CSI 2.0 all is well. The problem seems to have crept in with the EXP release from 17 January and is still there in the 23 January release.

MixMonkey · 01-27-2023, 07:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

I did consider two flavours of CSI, but dismissed it as too confusing for users, and too much maintenance work on my part, keeping features up to date, 4 builds (Win/Mac, CSI/CSI advanced), etc.

Agree with this, let's stick to a single version. Two versions would be a nightmare for everyone.

Quote:

First off, I'd like to reduce some Action bloat, as well as allow for easy future expansion, e.g. TrackTCPFX.

I propose we reduce all of this:

Code:

    GoMasterTrack
    GoTrackSend
    GoTrackReceive
    GoTrackFXMenu
    GoSelectedTrack
    GoSelectedTrackSend
    GoSelectedTrackReceive
    GoSelectedTrackFXMenu
    GoMasterTrackFXMenu
    GoSelectedTrackTCPFX

to

Code:

    GoAssociatedZone TrackFXMenu

etc.

and this:

Code:

    TrackBank
    VCABank
    FolderBank
    TrackSendBank
    TrackReceiveBank
    TrackFXMenuBank
    SelectedTrackBank
    SelectedTrackSendBank
    SelectedTrackReceiveBank
    SelectedTrackFXMenuBank
    MasterTrackFXMenuBank

to

Code:

    Bank Track

etc.

Great idea!

Quote:

Let's talk Broadcast/Receive.

Can we move this up to Page level, and make it automatic.

I think it depends on the answer to one question.

Is there any workflow that includes the existence of an Associated Zone on a particular Surface, that we would want to exclude from GoAssociatedZone ?

I can't immediately see a problem here (famous last words

)

Quote:

Finally, from a non Page aspect, I think we should still implement the concept of FXTemplates and FXLayout:

Code:

Zone "FXTemplate"
    Rotary FXParam
    DisplayUpper FixedTextDisplay
    DisplayLower FXParamValueDisplay
    RotaryPush ToggleFXParam
ZoneEnd

Code:

Zone "FXLayout"
    FXTemplate 8
    FXTemplate Shift 8
    FXTemplate Option 8
    FXTemplate Control 8
    FXTemplate Alt 8
ZoneEnd

and not too far down the road, we could venture into a Page version with this:

Code:

Zone "FXLayout"
    "X-Touch" FXTemplate 8
    "X-Touch" FXTemplate Shift 8
    "X-Touch" FXTemplate Option 8
    "X-Touch" FXTemplate Control 8
    "X-Touch" FXTemplate Alt 8
ZoneEnd

Sounds good

Funkybot · 01-27-2023, 07:11 AM

That mostly sounds good to me Geoff. With Broadcast/Receive, the only thing that gives me some initial pause with moving it up to the page level is "GoHome". I can see the potential for workflows where a user is using GoHome locally. Example: I've got an FX map active on one C4-style device, but I'm editing sends on my MCU-style device and now I want to GoHome on the MCU while keeping my FXMap active.

MixMonkey · 01-27-2023, 07:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Funkybot

That mostly sounds good to me Geoff. With Broadcast/Receive, the only thing that gives me some initial pause with moving it up to the page level is "GoHome". I can see the potential for workflows where a user is using GoHome locally. Example: I've got an FX map active on one C4-style device, but I'm editing sends on my MCU-style device and now I want to GoHome on the MCU while keeping my FXMap active.

What would happen if you went GoTrack on the MCU? (assuming the C4 device doesn't have a Track Zone)

Funkybot · 01-27-2023, 07:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MixMonkey

What would happen if you went GoTrack on the MCU? (assuming the C4 device doesn't have a Track Zone)

I'm sure it could be worked around. But another similar use-case, on my X-Touch One, the FocusedFXParam is assigned to F2 and activates that function on Fader1. F1 was always GoHome, which is a SelectedTrack zone. I'm sure I could assign F1 to GoSelectedTrack in the FocusedFXParam zone, but it's easier to just keep F1 as GoHome in the buttons zone this way no matter what I'm doing, it's a quick way back.

Not a total dealbreaker, but something I thought might be worth mentioning since Home is a broadcast/receive zone and that use-case may be a little different than the Send/Receive/FXMenu ones.

MixMonkey · 01-27-2023, 07:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Funkybot

Not a total dealbreaker, but something I thought might be worth mentioning since Home is a broadcast/receive zone and that use-case may be a little different than the Send/Receive/FXMenu ones.

I think that's a good point. It does turn GoHome into something of a "nuclear" option as the whole setup will GoHome when it's activated.

Funkybot · 01-27-2023, 07:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MixMonkey

I think that's a good point. It does turn GoHome into something of a "nuclear" option as the whole setup will GoHome when it's activated.

It was fresh on my mind because at the moment, I can't get GoHome to broadcast from the X-Touch One and get received by the Twister at all. So where I wanted a semi-nuclear option (for those two surfaces anyway), it was only working locally. Which has benefits in other use-cases.

MT4U · 01-27-2023, 08:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Funkybot

It was fresh on my mind because at the moment, I can't get GoHome to broadcast from the X-Touch One and get received by the Twister at all. So where I wanted a semi-nuclear option (for those two surfaces anyway), it was only working locally. Which has benefits in other use-cases.

I see your point. The Extender, for example, has only Tracks, so the most logical course of action would be to have it as a slave of the main MCU. Add an XT-One to the equation, with its many buttons, and it would be desirable to have it go some other zone to do a different task.

A SurfaceSync2PageToggle magical option would do, but then again, wouldn’t it be nice to direct a surface to a Zone or FX SubZone from another Surface? Let’s say I’m on the track zone on the MCU and I press a button to have the Extender show the FXMenu while the MCU stays on the track Zone? Like sending a “message” to another surface.

Just brainstorming here

Geoff Waddington · 01-27-2023, 08:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Funkybot

That mostly sounds good to me Geoff. With Broadcast/Receive, the only thing that gives me some initial pause with moving it up to the page level is "GoHome". I can see the potential for workflows where a user is using GoHome locally. Example: I've got an FX map active on one C4-style device, but I'm editing sends on my MCU-style device and now I want to GoHome on the MCU while keeping my FXMap active.

Agree, should have been more clear that I was speaking of Associated Zones only.

Since that post I've been thinking of "GoHome".

I think we can solve the problem, or at least come sufficiently close, without resorting to Broadcast/Receive.

Just have two flavours:

Code:

    SomeButton  GoHome
    OtherButton GlobalGoHome // better name for the Action needed

Does this get us close enough ?

Funkybot · 01-27-2023, 08:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

Agree, should have been more clear that I was speaking of Associated Zones only.

Since that post I've been thinking of "GoHome".

I think we can solve the problem, or at least come sufficiently close, without resorting to Broadcast/Receive.

Just have two flavours:

Code:

    SomeButton  GoHome
    OtherButton GlobalGoHome // better name for the Action needed

Does this get us close enough ?

Looks like an elegant solution to me.

BPBaker · 01-27-2023, 09:28 AM

Okay after last night's successes, y'all have me hooked and I'm coming back for more. Any chance you could point me toward a pre-existing BCR2000 .MST? I'd love to start experimenting with it + ipad. :-)

Funkybot · 01-27-2023, 10:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BPBaker

Okay after last night's successes, y'all have me hooked and I'm coming back for more. Any chance you could point me toward a pre-existing BCR2000 .MST? I'd love to start experimenting with it + ipad. :-)

I found an old one called BCR2000EDIT.mst. Not sure who created it or why it says EDIT in the title (maybe it's incomplete). Looking at it, I don't know why it's using Fader7Bit instead of Encoder widgets but I don't own the device - I'm assuming it can be configured for relative encodes or absolute rotaries and someone decided fader7bit and absolute rotaries worked better.

Code:

Widget RotaryG1
	Fader7Bit b0 01 7f  
	FB_Fader7bit b0 01 7f
WidgetEnd

Widget RotaryG2
	Fader7Bit b0 02 7f
	FB_Fader7Bit b0 02 7f
WidgetEnd

Widget RotaryG3
	Fader7Bit b0 03 7f  
	FB_Fader7Bit b0 03 7f
WidgetEnd

Widget RotaryG4
	Fader7Bit b0 04 7f
	FB_Fader7Bit b0 04 7f
WidgetEnd

Widget RotaryG5
	Fader7Bit b0 05 7f
	FB_Fader7Bit b0 05 7f
WidgetEnd

Widget RotaryG6
	Fader7Bit b0 06 7f
	FB_Fader7Bit b0 06 7f
WidgetEnd

Widget RotaryG7
	Fader7Bit b0 07 7f
	FB_Fader7Bit b0 07 7f
WidgetEnd

Widget RotaryG8
	Fader7Bit b0 08 7f
	FB_Fader7Bit b0 08 7f
WidgetEnd

/

Widget RotaryPushG1
	Press 90 00 7f 90 00 00
WidgetEnd


Widget RotaryPushG2
	Press 90 01 7f 90 00 00
WidgetEnd


Widget RotaryPushG3
	Press 90 02 7f 90 00 00
WidgetEnd


Widget RotaryPushG4 
	Press 90 03 7f 90 00 00
WidgetEnd


Widget RotaryPushG5 
	Press 90 04 7f 90 00 00
WidgetEnd


Widget RotaryPushG6 
	Press 90 05 7f 90 00 00
WidgetEnd

Widget RotaryPushG7 
	Press 90 06 7f 90 00 00
WidgetEnd


Widget RotaryPushG8
	Press 90 07 7f 90 00 00
WidgetEnd

/

Widget UpperButton1
	Press 90 20 7f 90 20 00
	FB_TwoState 90 20 7f 90 20 00
WidgetEnd

Widget UpperButton2
	Press 90 21 7f 90 20 00
	FB_TwoState 90 21 7f 90 21 00
WidgetEnd

Widget UpperButton3
	Press 90 22 7f 90 20 00
	FB_TwoState 90 22 7f 90 22 00
WidgetEnd

Widget UpperButton4
	Press 90 23 7f 90 20 00
	FB_TwoState 90 23 7f 90 23 00
WidgetEnd

Widget UpperButton5
	Press 90 24 7f 90 20 00
	FB_TwoState 90 24 7f 90 24 00
WidgetEnd

Widget UpperButton6
	Press 90 25 7f 90 25 00
	FB_TwoState 90 25 7f 90 25 00
WidgetEnd

Widget UpperButton7
	Press 90 26 7f 90 26 00
	FB_TwoState 90 26 7f 90 26 00
WidgetEnd

Widget UpperButton8
	Press 90 27 7f 90 27 00
	FB_TwoState 90 27 7f 90 27 00
WidgetEnd

/

Widget LowerButton1
	Press 90 28 7f 90 28 00
	FB_TwoState 90 28 7f 90 28 00
WidgetEnd

Widget LowerButton2
	Press 90 2a 7f 90 2a 00
	FB_TwoState 90 2a 7f 90 2a 00
WidgetEnd

Widget LowerButton3
	Press 90 2b 7f 90 2b 00
	FB_TwoState 90 2b 7f 90 2b 00
WidgetEnd

Widget LowerButton4
	Press 90 2c 7f 90 2c 00
	FB_TwoState 90 2c 7f 90 2c 00
WidgetEnd

Widget LowerButton5
	Press 90 2d 7f 90 2d 00
	FB_TwoState 90 2d 7f 90 2d 00
WidgetEnd

Widget LowerButton6
	Press 90 2e 7f 90 2e 00
	FB_TwoState 90 2e 7f 90 2e 00
WidgetEnd

Widget LowerButton7
	Press 90 2e 7f 90 2e 00
	FB_TwoState 90 2e 7f 90 2e 00
WidgetEnd

Widget LowerButton8
	Press 90 2f 7f 90 2f 00
	FB_TwoState 90 2f 7f 90 2f 00 
WidgetEnd

/

Widget RotaryA1
     Fader7bit b0 21 7f
     FB_Fader7bit b0 21 7f
WidgetEnd

Widget RotaryA2
     Fader7bit b0 22 7f
     FB_Fader7bit b0 22 7f
WidgetEnd

Widget RotaryA3
     Fader7bit b0 23 7f
     FB_Fader7bit b0 23 7f
WidgetEnd

Widget RotaryA4
     Fader7bit b0 24 7f
     FB_Fader7bit b0 24 7f
WidgetEnd

Widget RotaryA5
     Fader7bit b0 25 7f
     FB_Fader7bit b0 25 7f
WidgetEnd

Widget RotaryA6
     Fader7bit b0 26 7f
     FB_Fader7bit b0 26 7f
WidgetEnd

Widget RotaryA7
     Fader7bit b0 27 7f
     FB_Fader7bit b0 27 7f
WidgetEnd

Widget RotaryA8
     Fader7bit b0 28 7f
     FB_Fader7bit b0 28 7f
WidgetEnd

/

Widget RotaryB1
     Fader7bit b0 29 7f
     FB_Fader7bit b0 29 7f
WidgetEnd

Widget RotaryB2
     Fader7bit b0 2a 7f
     FB_Fader7bit b0 2a 7f
WidgetEnd

Widget RotaryB3
     Fader7bit b0 2b 7f
     FB_Fader7bit b0 2b 7f
WidgetEnd

Widget RotaryB4
     Fader7bit b0 2c 7f
     FB_Fader7bit b0 2c 7f
WidgetEnd

Widget RotaryB5
     Fader7bit b0 2d 7f
     FB_Fader7bit b0 2d 7f
WidgetEnd

Widget RotaryB6
     Fader7bit b0 2e 7f
     FB_Fader7bit b0 2e 7f
WidgetEnd

Widget RotaryB7
     Fader7bit b0 2f 7f
     FB_Fader7bit b0 2f 7f
WidgetEnd

Widget RotaryB8
     Fader7bit b0 30 7f
     FB_Fader7bit b0 30 7f
WidgetEnd

/

Widget RotaryC1
     Fader7bit b0 31 7f
     FB_Fader7bit b0 31 7f
WidgetEnd

Widget RotaryC2
     Fader7bit b0 32 7f
     FB_Fader7bit b0 32 7f
WidgetEnd

Widget RotaryC3
     Fader7bit b0 33 7f
     FB_Fader7bit b0 33 7f
WidgetEnd

Widget RotaryC4
     Fader7bit b0 34 7f
     FB_Fader7bit b0 34 7f
WidgetEnd

Widget RotaryC5
     Fader7bit b0 35 7f
     FB_Fader7bit b0 35 7f
WidgetEnd

Widget RotaryC6
     Fader7bit b0 36 7f
     FB_Fader7bit b0 36 7f
WidgetEndRotary

Widget RotaryC7
     Fader7bit b0 37 7f
     FB_Fader7bit b0 37 7f
WidgetEnd

Widget RotaryC8
     Fader7bit b0 38 7f
     FB_Fader7bit b0 38 7f
WidgetEnd

/

Widget UserButton1
	Press 90 30 7f 90 30 00
	FB_TwoState 90 30 7f 90 30 00
WidgetEnd

Widget UserButton2
	Press 90 31 7f 90 31 00
	FB_TwoState 90 31 7f 90 31 00
WidgetEnd

Widget UserButton3
	Press 90 32 7f 90 32 00
	FB_TwoState 90 32 7f 90 32 00
WidgetEnd

Widget UserButton4
	Press 90 33 7f 90 33 00
	FB_TwoState 90 33 7f 90 33 00
WidgetEnd

Maybe also check the Stash and see if there are any there. Otherwise, if you want help rolling your own, please check the wiki and/or post in the CSI device setup help thread:

https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=245280

We try to keep this thread for CSI development-related topics, bug reports, FR's, etc. The CSI device thread is really the best place for help on getting a device up and running.

BPBaker · 01-27-2023, 10:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Funkybot

We try to keep this thread for CSI development-related topics, bug reports, FR's, etc. The CSI device thread is really the best place for help on getting a device up and running.

Thanks so much; I will turn my attention there for that kind of stuff!

Geoff Waddington · 01-27-2023, 03:55 PM

CAUTION CAUTION CAUTION CAUTION CAUTION CAUTION CAUTION

MAJOR BREAKING CHANGES MAJOR BREAKING CHANGES MAJOR BREAKING CHANGES

New build is up.

CSI Support Files.zip

CSI Exp.zip

Broadcast and Receive have been removed.
GoAssociatedZone, GoFXSlot, and Bank now affect every Surface on a Page automatically.

Removed EWidgets.

Removed over 750 lines of dead code, so please check everything to make sure I wasn't overzealous

Added a global GoHome Action

Code:

   AllSurfacesGoHome

Major revisions to Associate Zone handling.

See the X-Touch files in the Supported files for examples.

The following Actions have been removed:

Code:

    GoVCA
    GoFolder
    GoMasterTrack
    GoTrackSend
    GoTrackReceive
    GoTrackFXMenu
    GoSelectedTrack
    GoSelectedTrackSend
    GoSelectedTrackReceive
    GoSelectedTrackFXMenu
    GoMasterTrackFXMenu
    GoSelectedTrackTCPFX

and replaced by GoAssociatedZone plus the Associated Zone name:

Code:

    GoAssociatedZone TrackFXMenu

The following Actions have been removed:

Code:

    TrackBank
    VCABank
    FolderBank
    TrackSendBank
    TrackReceiveBank
    TrackFXMenuBank
    SelectedTrackBank
    SelectedTrackSendBank
    SelectedTrackReceiveBank
    SelectedTrackFXMenuBank
    MasterTrackFXMenuBank

and replaced by Bank plus the Associated Zone name plus the amount:

Code:

    Bank Track -1

MT4U · 01-27-2023, 04:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

CAUTION CAUTION CAUTION CAUTION CAUTION CAUTION CAUTION

MAJOR BREAKING CHANGES MAJOR BREAKING CHANGES MAJOR BREAKING CHANGES

New build is up.

CSI Support Files.zip

CSI Exp.zip

Broadcast and Receive have been removed.
GoAssociatedZone, GoFXSlot, and Bank now affect every Surface on a Page automatically.

Removed EWidgets.

Removed over 750 lines of dead code, so please check everything to make sure I wasn't overzealous

Added a global GoHome Action

Code:

   AllSurfacesGoHome

Major revisions to Associate Zone handling.

See the X-Touch files in the Supported files for examples.

The following Actions have been removed:

Code:

    GoTrack
    GoVCA
    GoFolder
    GoMasterTrack
    GoTrackSend
    GoTrackReceive
    GoTrackFXMenu
    GoSelectedTrack
    GoSelectedTrackSend
    GoSelectedTrackReceive
    GoSelectedTrackFXMenu
    GoMasterTrackFXMenu
    GoSelectedTrackTCPFX

and replaced by GoAssociatedZone plus the Associated Zone name:

Code:

    GoAssociatedZone TrackFXMenu

The following Actions have been removed:

Code:

    TrackBank
    VCABank
    FolderBank
    TrackSendBank
    TrackReceiveBank
    TrackFXMenuBank
    SelectedTrackBank
    SelectedTrackSendBank
    SelectedTrackReceiveBank
    SelectedTrackFXMenuBank
    MasterTrackFXMenuBank

and replaced by Bank plus the Associated Zone name plus the amount:

Code:

    Bank Track -1

This looks very very smart. Great work Geoff!!!

Will make a backup of my CSI folder and start migration right away.

I’ll report back.

MixMonkey · 01-27-2023, 04:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

and replaced by GoAssociatedZone plus the Associated Zone name:

Code:

    GoAssociatedZone TrackFXMenu

If Track is not an Associated Zone but and IncludedZone, do we still use:

Code:

GoAssociatedZone Track

?

Geoff Waddington · 01-27-2023, 04:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MixMonkey

If Track is not an Associated Zone but and IncludedZone, do we still use:

Code:

GoAssociatedZone Track

?

Included Zones are made active by their enclosing Zone, so you don't have to do anything.

For instance, Track is usually included in Home, so it activates whenever Home activates, no need for GoAssociatedZone.

MixMonkey · 01-27-2023, 04:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

Included Zones are made active by their enclosing Zone, so you don't have to do anything.

For instance, Track is usually included in Home, so it activates whenever Home activates, no need for GoAssociatedZone.

So no GoTrack with GoAssociatedZone VCA / GoAssociatedZone Folder, now it's GoHome?

Geoff Waddington · 01-27-2023, 05:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MixMonkey

So no GoTrack with GoAssociatedZone VCA / GoAssociatedZone Folder, now it's GoHome?

Just checked the old code, there never actually was a GoTrack Action, it was implied by GoHome.

MT4U · 01-27-2023, 05:35 PM

This is the home zone for the MCU Extender in the Support Files.

Code:

Zone "Home"
    OnInitialization ToggleEnableFocusedFXMapping
    OnInitialization Receive Home SelectedTrackFXMenu TrackSend TrackReceive TrackFXMenu
        IncludedZones
            "Track"
        IncludedZonesEnd
        
        AssociatedZones
        	"SelectedTrackFXMenu"
            "TrackSend"
            "TrackReceive"
            "TrackFXMenu"
        AssociatedZonesEnd
ZoneEnd

It still has the Receive, and it had me thinking about the support files and people downloading CSI 2.0, maybe there should be some kind of Support Files EXP.

Going back to the Home Zone for the MCUXT, this is the one I'm using, not sure if everything is correct, but if it is, it could be an improvement to the support files.

Here it goes:

Code:

Zone Home
        IncludedZones
            Track
        IncludedZonesEnd
        
        AssociatedZones
          SelectedTrackSend
          SelectedTrackReceive
          SelectedTrackFXMenu
          TrackSend
          TrackReceive
          TrackFXMenu
          VCA
          Folder
          SelectedTrackTCPFX
          SelectedTrackTCPFXTemplate          
        AssociatedZonesEnd
ZoneEnd

Happy weekend, everyone!

Geoff Waddington · 01-27-2023, 06:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MT4U

This is the home zone for the MCU Extender in the Support Files.

Code:

Zone "Home"
    OnInitialization ToggleEnableFocusedFXMapping
    OnInitialization Receive Home SelectedTrackFXMenu TrackSend TrackReceive TrackFXMenu
        IncludedZones
            "Track"
        IncludedZonesEnd
        
        AssociatedZones
        	"SelectedTrackFXMenu"
            "TrackSend"
            "TrackReceive"
            "TrackFXMenu"
        AssociatedZonesEnd
ZoneEnd

It still has the Receive, and it had me thinking about the support files and people downloading CSI 2.0, maybe there should be some kind of Support Files EXP.

Going back to the Home Zone for the MCUXT, this is the one I'm using, not sure if everything is correct, but if it is, it could be an improvement to the support files.

Here it goes:

Code:

Zone Home
        IncludedZones
            Track
        IncludedZonesEnd
        
        AssociatedZones
          SelectedTrackSend
          SelectedTrackReceive
          SelectedTrackFXMenu
          TrackSend
          TrackReceive
          TrackFXMenu
          VCA
          Folder
          SelectedTrackTCPFX
          SelectedTrackTCPFXTemplate          
        AssociatedZonesEnd
ZoneEnd

Happy weekend, everyone!

Thanks, yup, missed some cleanup there.

It will actually be fine since CSI will never find a Receive Action and will assign NoAction instead.

But yeah, will clean it up.

MixMonkey · 01-27-2023, 06:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

Just checked the old code, there never actually was a GoTrack Action, it was implied by GoHome.

It was doing a pretty good job here for an Action that doesn't exist

New build and changes seem to be working (on the iPad mixer). Receive banking is working again

MixMonkey · 01-27-2023, 06:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MT4U

Here it goes:

Code:

Zone Home
        IncludedZones
            Track
        IncludedZonesEnd
        
        AssociatedZones
          SelectedTrackSend
          SelectedTrackReceive
          SelectedTrackFXMenu
          TrackSend
          TrackReceive
          TrackFXMenu
          VCA
          Folder
          SelectedTrackTCPFX
          SelectedTrackTCPFXTemplate          
        AssociatedZonesEnd
ZoneEnd

Is SelectedTrackTCPFXTemplate still a thing?

MT4U · 01-27-2023, 06:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MixMonkey

Is SelectedTrackTCPFXTemplate still a thing?

Well, I just copied the Zones from the MCU that didn’t involve buttons.

Geoff Waddington · 01-27-2023, 06:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MixMonkey

It was doing a pretty good job here for an Action that doesn't exist

Yeah, I suspect what was happening was it was assigned NoAction, but the Associated Zone logic first deactivates any active Associated Zones. You were then left with Home, which was still active (and so was Track, since it was included), so Track was now not "covered up" by the Associated Zone. Pretty convoluted, but there was no GoTrack in the code according to Github, unless I missed it somehow.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MixMonkey

New build and changes seem to be working (on the iPad mixer). Receive banking is working again

Great, thanks for testing !

Geoff Waddington · 01-27-2023, 06:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MT4U

Well, I just copied the Zones from the MCU that didn’t involve buttons.

SelectedTrackTCPFXTemplate has been removed from the logic, although you could probably still use a Zone named SelectedTrackTCPFXTemplate as long as it contained Actions that still exist, but why would you ?

MixMonkey · 01-27-2023, 06:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MT4U

Well, I just copied the Zones from the MCU that didn’t involve buttons.

It's probably best to copy the stuff from the X-Touch support files as that's what Geoff updates

The rest of us are responsible for the other files, but we can't keep up with Geoff

If you've got a lot of custom stuff going on, it can be less work to backup your CSI folder and use search and replace to make the changes to all the files in one go..

Geoff Waddington · 01-27-2023, 06:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MixMonkey

It's probably best to copy the stuff from the X-Touch support files as that's what Geoff updates

The rest of us are responsible for the other files, but we can't keep up with Geoff

Yeah, there's likely a fair bit of cleanup remaining, there were a lot of changes

MT4U · 01-27-2023, 08:33 PM

Geoff,

These are my initial test results on the latest Exp build and support files.
Windows 10 - X-Touch(ch. 8-15) + Extender(ch. 0-7)

All 16 tracks are mapped perfectly through the Extender and the X-Touch.

With Focused FX Mapping turned On, all surfaces must have the FX-SubZone definition, if the SubZone definition is missing for some FX, you get a C++ Runtime error in Reaper.exe.

This does not happen if I GoFXSlot from the SelectedTrackFXMenu.

If both surfaces have their SubZones, they are both loaded correctly, either through FX focusing or via GoFXSlot on the X-Touch.

Then, GoHome takes only the X-Touch back to the track zone. Tried GlobalGoHome but it does nothing.

Something similar occurs with these actions:

Code:

GoAssociatedZone SelectedTrackSend 
GoAssociatedZone SelectedTrackFXMenu
GoAssociatedZone SelectedTrackReceive

They show the first 8 on the X-Touch displays while extender shows no change whatsoever.

Well... so far that's what I've got. Hope it helps.

-----------------EDIT--------------------------------
I tried disabling AutoMapping and got the same crash

Code:

    OnInitialization ToggleAutoFXMapping
    OnInitialization ToggleAutoFocusedFXMapping

I only added these toggles on the Home.zon for the
X-Touch. Is this enough?
-----------------EDIT--------------------------------

themathpotato · 01-27-2023, 09:46 PM

Is there any way to add common code to run before any FX zone no matter how you reach it?

As it stands with the X-Touch support files, the display colors for FX zones are carried over from the previous zone, so if I'm on track view with for example just one track, the first display is white, the rest are black/off. Now if I open an FX on that track using my mouse, only the first parameter is visible, because only the first display is on and I haven't gone through the TrackFXMenu to set all display colors to non-black.

Obviously I can simply add

Code:

OnZoneActivation	SetXTouchDisplayColors White
OnZoneDeactivation      RestoreXTouchDisplayColors

to the start of every FX zone, but I have hundreds of them and don't really want to do that. Is there anywhere I can place this line so it is always run before an FX zone, even if I reach that zone by opening the plugin with my mouse rather than using the control surface TrackFXMenu zone?

themathpotato · 01-28-2023, 01:10 AM

Also how does "OnZoneActivation" and "OnZoneDeactivation" work in general when focusing/selecting with the mouse and using subzones? For example using

Code:

 OnZoneActivation	SetXTouchDisplayColors Blue
OnZoneDeactivation      RestoreXTouchDisplayColors

within an FX zone works fine when accessing the FX through the control surface FX menu, but then I focus/click back to tracks and the Blue display colors remain the same, neither changing back to the FX menu colors nor track colors.

Similarly when I am in track view and click on an FX GUI, I enter the FX zone due to FocusedFXMapping and the display colors change to as specified in the FX zone. All is good until I then click off the FX back on a track, my surface controls return to track view as expected but the colors remain as in the FX, not track colors.

Things get even more unreliable and confusing when using FX with different subzones and trying to have different colors for each subzone. How does this work?

Geoff Waddington · 01-28-2023, 01:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by themathpotato

Is there any way to add common code to run before any FX zone no matter how you reach it?

As it stands with the X-Touch support files, the display colors for FX zones are carried over from the previous zone, so if I'm on track view with for example just one track, the first display is white, the rest are black/off. Now if I open an FX on that track using my mouse, only the first parameter is visible, because only the first display is on and I haven't gone through the TrackFXMenu to set all display colors to non-black.

Obviously I can simply add

Code:

OnZoneActivation	SetXTouchDisplayColors White
OnZoneDeactivation      RestoreXTouchDisplayColors

to the start of every FX zone, but I have hundreds of them and don't really want to do that. Is there anywhere I can place this line so it is always run before an FX zone, even if I reach that zone by opening the plugin with my mouse rather than using the control surface TrackFXMenu zone?

With the new Template style Zone definitions, this will be easy.

Will have to think about how to retrofit this to existing Zone definitions.

Geoff Waddington · 01-28-2023, 01:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by themathpotato

Also how does "OnZoneActivation" and "OnZoneDeactivation" work in general when focusing/selecting with the mouse and using subzones? For example using

Code:

 OnZoneActivation	SetXTouchDisplayColors Blue
OnZoneDeactivation      RestoreXTouchDisplayColors

within an FX zone works fine when accessing the FX through the control surface FX menu, but then I focus/click back to tracks and the Blue display colors remain the same, neither changing back to the FX menu colors nor track colors.

Similarly when I am in track view and click on an FX GUI, I enter the FX zone due to FocusedFXMapping and the display colors change to as specified in the FX zone. All is good until I then click off the FX back on a track, my surface controls return to track view as expected but the colors remain as in the FX, not track colors.

Things get even more unreliable and confusing when using FX with different subzones and trying to have different colors for each subzone. How does this work?

Focus has always been a challenge,

As you have noticed, determining when an FX receives focus is fairly easy, find out when it loses focus is not

When you say "but then I focus/click back to tracks" do you mean using the mouse ?

If so, that's expected, since you haven't told CSI to deactivate the Zone via some Surface control.