Control Surface Integration (CSI) Technical Feature Discussion

[Carlos_ring]

Hey guys, sry i asked that question a year ago i think, i have a chain of Ext1>Ext2>Xtouch

If i go into the plugin section on the xtouch i wanted to use all surfaces to control plugins (24 controls) instead of using only xtouch with 8.

Is it possible today? i havent found an information about that.

[Geoff Waddington]

Originally Posted by Carlos_ring

Hey guys, sry i asked that question a year ago i think, i have a chain of Ext1>Ext2>Xtouch

If i go into the plugin section on the xtouch i wanted to use all surfaces to control plugins (24 controls) instead of using only xtouch with 8.

Is it possible today? i havent found an information about that.

Not easily.

However, just now working on a new Learn mode that will allow this.

Probably a month or so away.

[Geoff Waddington]

As you know, Roy has been working hard on an X32 solution using CSI.

He came up with a great idea.

Because the X32 requires a lot of setup, he has a ton of OnInitialization calls in the Home Zone.

He suggested an external file.

So, here's the pitch...

The Zone folder may contain Config.zon.

If it is found, CSI parses it and initializes the device in the context of this Zone folder -- you might want different device settings for another page, therefore this is at a Zone level.

We need, at a minimum, a way to send messages, and properties:

Zone Config
     SendMIDIMessage
     SendOSCMessage

     PropertyName=PropertyValue

Do we need anything else ?

[Funkybot]

Would that be the zone for other common OnInitialization actions too (like the various toggles)? Or is the idea that this would be more limited to the messages above?

[Geoff Waddington]

Originally Posted by Funkybot

Would that be the zone for other common OnInitialization actions too (like the various toggles)?

Yup, the toggles would be properties, here are a few examples:

MaxTextLength=7
EnableFocusedFXMapping=true
UseLocalModifiers=true
LatchTime=100

etc.

[Funkybot]

We'll still retain the actions to dynamically toggle things on/off via widgets+actions right? Example: FocusedFX mapping. If yes, then sounds good to me!

[Geoff Waddington]

Originally Posted by Funkybot

We'll still retain the actions to dynamically toggle things on/off via widgets+actions right? Example: FocusedFX mapping. If yes, then sounds good to me!

Yup, this is just a way to reduce Home Zone clutter if you have a surface that requires a lot of setup, like an X32.

[MT4U]

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

Yup, this is just a way to reduce Home Zone clutter if you have a surface that requires a lot of setup, like an X32.

The switch to “properties” improves readability a lot too!

[UNdark]

Originally Posted by MixR

FWIW I use shift in a latched way all the time, too.

I'd be really interested to hear how you use this - might be able to add/change how I'm working ..

[MixR]

Originally Posted by UNdark

I'd be really interested to hear how you use this - might be able to add/change how I'm working ..

Hmmm. I have watched your TY tutorials with great interest. Your knowledge and proficiency of CSI is miles ahead of mine so am unsure whether anything I am doing will be of actual interest to you.

Having said that my journey into CSI started before SSL opened up the 360 software (the backbone for their controllers). Back then there was no Reaper profile and you needed to pick one that worked best considering none of the other DAW developers implement a like for like version of the MCU protocol.

For me that meant using the Studio One profile which incidentally uses the MCU solo button for Shift. As this is a backlit button on the Mackie MCU it's also backlit on the SSL UF8. So when I started out Shift would always stay lit when toggled and I assumed that was expected behaviour.

As I was figuring out CSI I started using Shift to toggle a layer of secondary functions.

When SSL introduced the Reaper profile with it's vanilla MCU implementation I scratched my head as to why the Shift key didn't light up anymore.
That got me onto figuring out alternative assignments for the other modifier keys Ctrl, Alt, and Option in order for them to remain lit when toggled.

Unfortunately, there aren't many buttons from the Mackie MCU implementation I could repurpose in that way but I just about managed it:

Global        Control
Cycle        Alt
Click        Option
Replace        ToggleFocusedFxMapping

As you can see I gave up on Shift being backlit in my current setup because I now have thee adjacent buttons for Control, Alt, Option that are backlit (and I preferred to keep ToggleFocusedFxMapping). That also means I can quickly access more layers by activating a combination of them.

My CSI setup is always in flux and I think I decided to go down the route of dropping Shift in favour of combinations of the other modifiers because the Shift key is on the other side of the UF8. But I have also now assigned the auto OFF button to Shift so who knows.

I tend to get into CSI, set up some stuff, and leave it if it's good enough because thinking about a concise, repeatable button assignment keeps blowing my mind - which is of course exactly what you have done! I then have to come back and it's a mess and everything gets too much.

[Geoff Waddington]

New Exp build is up.

https://stash.reaper.fm/v/42044/CSI%20Exp.zip

Possible fix for Cragster's crash.

[UNdark]

Originally Posted by MixR

Hmmm. I have watched your TY tutorials with great interest. Your knowledge and proficiency of CSI is miles ahead of mine so am unsure whether anything I am doing will be of actual interest to you.

Having said that my journey into CSI started before SSL opened up the 360 software (the backbone for their controllers). Back then there was no Reaper profile and you needed to pick one that worked best considering none of the other DAW developers implement a like for like version of the MCU protocol.

For me that meant using the Studio One profile which incidentally uses the MCU solo button for Shift. As this is a backlit button on the Mackie MCU it's also backlit on the SSL UF8. So when I started out Shift would always stay lit when toggled and I assumed that was expected behaviour.

As I was figuring out CSI I started using Shift to toggle a layer of secondary functions.

When SSL introduced the Reaper profile with it's vanilla MCU implementation I scratched my head as to why the Shift key didn't light up anymore.
That got me onto figuring out alternative assignments for the other modifier keys Ctrl, Alt, and Option in order for them to remain lit when toggled.

Unfortunately, there aren't many buttons from the Mackie MCU implementation I could repurpose in that way but I just about managed it:

Global        Control
Cycle        Alt
Click        Option
Replace        ToggleFocusedFxMapping

As you can see I gave up on Shift being backlit in my current setup because I now have thee adjacent buttons for Control, Alt, Option that are backlit (and I preferred to keep ToggleFocusedFxMapping). That also means I can quickly access more layers by activating a combination of them.

My CSI setup is always in flux and I think I decided to go down the route of dropping Shift in favour of combinations of the other modifiers because the Shift key is on the other side of the UF8. But I have also now assigned the auto OFF button to Shift so who knows.

I tend to get into CSI, set up some stuff, and leave it if it's good enough because thinking about a concise, repeatable button assignment keeps blowing my mind - which is of course exactly what you have done! I then have to come back and it's a mess and everything gets too much.

Thank you MixR - I'm very grateful that you took the time to show the evolution of your method. The unlit shift was a bit of a problem and I copied a similar work around from Mixmonkey until I sat with pen and paper and worked through the potential configs of the modifiers. I had to apply that simple : CTRL - Tracks and ALT items to initial a simple repeatable application in as many aspects as I use.. I haven't had the time or capacity to make vids explaining the way I use it for midi.. or many other things as envelopes become such a focus ( probably the most crappy thing to deal with using a mouse)
In version 1 I did exactly as you just explained - it's amazing what CSI can do but it often left me unable to use what I had set up as I couldn't apply the logic to advanced ideas due to variable method of modifiers. Thats the I went back to using the actual modifiers and choosing a way to use them through any process.
Fun though isn't; it to peep into the ways each other use these things
Thank you

[Cragster]

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

New Exp build is up.

https://stash.reaper.fm/v/42044/CSI%20Exp.zip

Possible fix for Cragster's crash.

Hey thanks Geoff. Gave a go and no crashes when focusing FX

I dont know whats all supposed to work . I focus an FX i already have a generated map for then hit the learn button. Learn window opens up and i can see the parameters in the list on the right. On the left where the graph is i see 1-8 columns. Rotary8 and RotaryPush8 in the first 2 boxes on the right. Is this correct ?

Surface is C4

FX i have maps for ...Auto generated and old manual style are only working 1 way.
Meaning turning controls on the surface dont work but moving them on screen with the mouse works and moves the surface controls

Tried to learn an FX i have no map for but no go.

As i said i dont know if anything is working yet or you just trying to stop the crashes which was successful. I got no crashes.

[Geoff Waddington]

Originally Posted by Cragster

Hey thanks Geoff. Gave a go and no crashes when focusing FX

Excellent news !!

Originally Posted by Cragster

I dont know whats all supposed to work . I focus an FX i already have a generated map for then hit the learn button. Learn window opens up and i can see the parameters in the list on the right. On the left where the graph is i see 1-8 columns. Rotary8 and RotaryPush8 in the first 2 boxes on the right. Is this correct ?

Surface is C4

FX i have maps for ...Auto generated and old manual style are only working 1 way.
Meaning turning controls on the surface dont work but moving them on screen with the mouse works and moves the surface controls

Tried to learn an FX i have no map for but no go.

As i said i dont know if anything is working yet or you just trying to stop the crashes which was successful. I got no crashes.

Learn mode is definitely a work in progress, so it doesn't work as of yet.

Was just trying to squash that nasty bug before moving on.

Thanks for testing !!

Now back to completing Learn...

[MixR]

Originally Posted by UNdark

or many other things as envelopes become such a focus ( probably the most crappy thing to deal with using a mouse

Now you have my undivided attention...very interested to hear about this.

I should probably do the exact same thing and sit down with pen and paper and get methodical about it.

[UNdark]

Originally Posted by MixR

Now you have my undivided attention...very interested to hear about this.

I should probably do the exact same thing and sit down with pen and paper and get methodical about it.

ok - you really could help me here... I only use a Mac and as such, transferring hotkeys including modifiers to MCU.
So I have Contrl/Shift/Alt/ Command... the Command key is equivalent to the windows key I think? If not, what 4 modifiers do you have on the key board (to start with)
Confusingly, the "Option" on MCU key is the Alt key on keyboard and the Command or "Apple" key on the keyboard is the Command/ALT key on the controller!!
To clarify the basics first:

CTRL is same on MCU and keyboard
SHFT is same on MCU and keyboard
ALT. is same on MCU and keyboard
OPTION on MCU is COMMAND or APPLE key on keyboard

I worked out the keyboard before the MCU.
As a rule - nothing destructive on MCU (to easy!!) Save that for keyboard, or : I have a midi foot switch with 8 select pedals and god knows how many banks. I save destructive and bounce macros for this. I also have 2 expression pedals for zoom horizontal and vertical. Its INSTANT full zoom in and out with that unlike key controls...

I do a lot of mixing and more mastering so to see the individual instruments in a mix I use the numbers 1-0
1 - BASS
2 - DRUMS
3 - AC guitar
3 - Elec guitar
5 - keys
6 - samplers
7 - BVX
8 - LVX
9 - FX rack
0 - master track

I have vids explaining how to do this with track names. You can have any track names - so you could segment up a midi orchestra the same way..etc

To really focus on individual drum tracks I use the keypad numbers:
1 - BD
2 - SNR
3 - H/H
4 - TOMS
5 - don't use for drums
6 - RIDE
7 - OHD
8 - ROOMS
9 - midi drum machine plugin window


All the above auto zoom to fit window auto zoom the selection id there is one, how ever many tracks you have of each name.

MODIFIERS:

CONTROL = anything to do with tracks
ALT = anything to do with items
SHIFT. = multi select/ also as removal or to invert a hot key and make it do the opposite
OPTION. = Selects/shows only buss tracks when numbers used select track. Used as a master type button in combination with the others..

This is where I began.

The most proficient thing CSI makes possible is instant views of specific tracks. More importantly - ALSO envelopes.All "zoomed" to full screen..

For example:
1 - shows me the bass tracks - "all" including the buss routing right down to the master output
CTRL+1 - shows me the bass tracks only with and without items on - no buss routing
ALT+1 - shows me only the bass tracks with audio/items on, nothing else

CMND+1 - shows me the BASS BUSSES ONLY including any other busses they're routed to.

Same for drums/guitar/keys etc.

This alone, saves me a HUGE amount of time drawing tracks up and down...

[MixR]

Originally Posted by UNdark

ok - you really could help me here... I only use a Mac and as such, transferring hotkeys including modifiers to MCU.
So I have Contrl/Shift/Alt/ Command... the Command key is equivalent to the windows key I think? If not, what 4 modifiers do you have on the key board (to start with)
Confusingly, the "Option" on MCU key is the Alt key on keyboard and the Command or "Apple" key on the keyboard is the Command/ALT key on the controller!!
To clarify the basics first:

CTRL is same on MCU and keyboard
SHFT is same on MCU and keyboard
ALT. is same on MCU and keyboard
OPTION on MCU is COMMAND or APPLE key on keyboard

I worked out the keyboard before the MCU.
As a rule - nothing destructive on MCU (to easy!!) Save that for keyboard, or : I have a midi foot switch with 8 select pedals and god knows how many banks. I save destructive and bounce macros for this. I also have 2 expression pedals for zoom horizontal and vertical. Its INSTANT full zoom in and out with that unlike key controls...

I do a lot of mixing and more mastering so to see the individual instruments in a mix I use the numbers 1-0
1 - BASS
2 - DRUMS
3 - AC guitar
3 - Elec guitar
5 - keys
6 - samplers
7 - BVX
8 - LVX
9 - FX rack
0 - master track

I have vids explaining how to do this with track names. You can have any track names - so you could segment up a midi orchestra the same way..etc

To really focus on individual drum tracks I use the keypad numbers:
1 - BD
2 - SNR
3 - H/H
4 - TOMS
5 - don't use for drums
6 - RIDE
7 - OHD
8 - ROOMS
9 - midi drum machine plugin window


All the above auto zoom to fit window auto zoom the selection id there is one, how ever many tracks you have of each name.

MODIFIERS:

CONTROL = anything to do with tracks
ALT = anything to do with items
SHIFT. = multi select/ also as removal or to invert a hot key and make it do the opposite
OPTION. = Selects/shows only buss tracks when numbers used select track. Used as a master type button in combination with the others..

This is where I began.

The most proficient thing CSI makes possible is instant views of specific tracks. More importantly - ALSO envelopes.All "zoomed" to full screen..

For example:
1 - shows me the bass tracks - "all" including the buss routing right down to the master output
CTRL+1 - shows me the bass tracks only with and without items on - no buss routing
ALT+1 - shows me only the bass tracks with audio/items on, nothing else

CMND+1 - shows me the BASS BUSSES ONLY including any other busses they're routed to.

Same for drums/guitar/keys etc.

This alone, saves me a HUGE amount of time drawing tracks up and down...

Just a quick thank you, this looks brilliant. I'm away from the studio for a few days and will edit this post when I'm back.

[UNdark]

To carry on from that - this is a vid, quite old now but the principle remains.
Showing the idea on hotkeys. This was what I then transferred to the MCU..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gk1RAnA-Nnw

[Geoff Waddington]

Just an FYI, there is nothing broken and nothing will break

Old Zone files will work just fine.

If you use Learn to modify a Zone and save it, it will save in the new format.

It's just a reformat that makes sense with the new Learn Window.

It now reads row1, column1, column2 ... column8, then row 2 , column1, column2 ... column8, etc.

I think it's a lot cleaner too:

Zone "VST: UAD Fairchild 660 (Universal Audio, Inc.)" "Fairchild 660"
	OnZoneActivation SetXTouchDisplayColors Cyan
	OnZoneActivation ToggleUseLocalModifiers
	Plugin ClearFXSlot

#Begin auto generated section
	Rotary1 FXParam 0 [ 0 0.5 1 ] RingStyle=Dot
	DisplayUpper1 FixedTextDisplay "Meter" 
	DisplayLower1 FXParamValueDisplay 0 

	Rotary2 FXParam 1 [ 0 0.05 0.1 0.15 0.2 0.25 0.3 0.35 0.4 0.45 0.5 0.55 0.6 0.65 0.7 0.75 0.8 0.85 0.9 0.95 1 ] RingStyle=Dot
	DisplayUpper2 FixedTextDisplay "Input" 
	DisplayLower2 FXParamValueDisplay 1 

	Rotary3 FXParam 2 RingStyle=Dot
	DisplayUpper3 FixedTextDisplay "Thresh" 
	DisplayLower3 FXParamValueDisplay 2 

	Rotary4 FXParam 3 [ 0 0.2 0.4 0.6 0.8 1 ] RingStyle=Dot
	DisplayUpper4 FixedTextDisplay "Time Const" 
	DisplayLower4 FXParamValueDisplay 3 

	Rotary5 FXParam 4 RingStyle=Dot
	DisplayUpper5 FixedTextDisplay "SC Filt" 
	DisplayLower5 FXParamValueDisplay 4 

	Rotary6 FXParam 5 RingStyle=Dot
	DisplayUpper6 FixedTextDisplay "Bal" 
	DisplayLower6 FXParamValueDisplay 5 

	Rotary7 FXParam 6 RingStyle=Dot
	DisplayUpper7 FixedTextDisplay "DC Thr" 
	DisplayLower7 FXParamValueDisplay 6 

	Rotary8 FXParam 7 RingStyle=Dot
	DisplayUpper8 FixedTextDisplay "Output" 
	DisplayLower8 FXParamValueDisplay 7 

	RotaryPush1 NoAction
	DisplayUpper1 NoAction NoFeedack
	DisplayLower1 NoAction NoFeedack

	RotaryPush2 NoAction
	DisplayUpper2 NoAction NoFeedack
	DisplayLower2 NoAction NoFeedack

	RotaryPush3 NoAction
	DisplayUpper3 NoAction NoFeedack
	DisplayLower3 NoAction NoFeedack

	RotaryPush4 NoAction
	DisplayUpper4 NoAction NoFeedack
	DisplayLower4 NoAction NoFeedack

	RotaryPush5 NoAction
	DisplayUpper5 NoAction NoFeedack
	DisplayLower5 NoAction NoFeedack

	RotaryPush6 NoAction
	DisplayUpper6 NoAction NoFeedack
	DisplayLower6 NoAction NoFeedack

	RotaryPush7 NoAction
	DisplayUpper7 NoAction NoFeedack
	DisplayLower7 NoAction NoFeedack

	RotaryPush8 NoAction
	DisplayUpper8 NoAction NoFeedack
	DisplayLower8 NoAction NoFeedack

	Fader1 NoAction
	DisplayUpper1 NoAction NoFeedack
	DisplayLower1 NoAction NoFeedack

	Fader2 NoAction
	DisplayUpper2 NoAction NoFeedack
	DisplayLower2 NoAction NoFeedack

	Fader3 NoAction
	DisplayUpper3 NoAction NoFeedack
	DisplayLower3 NoAction NoFeedack

	Fader4 NoAction
	DisplayUpper4 NoAction NoFeedack
	DisplayLower4 NoAction NoFeedack

	Fader5 NoAction
	DisplayUpper5 NoAction NoFeedack
	DisplayLower5 NoAction NoFeedack

	Fader6 NoAction
	DisplayUpper6 NoAction NoFeedack
	DisplayLower6 NoAction NoFeedack

	Fader7 NoAction
	DisplayUpper7 NoAction NoFeedack
	DisplayLower7 NoAction NoFeedack

	Fader8 NoAction
	DisplayUpper8 NoAction NoFeedack
	DisplayLower8 NoAction NoFeedack

[Geoff Waddington]

Turns out the Grid is a beast to code.

Wondering what value it provides.

We can select a param from the list.

We can move a control on the Gui to select a param from the list.

We can move an unmapped control, it will map to the currently selected param.

We can move a mapped control to edit params.

Am I missing any functionality ?

Pretty simple and straightforward.

[fourdogslong]

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

Turns out the Grid is a beast to code.

Wondering what value it provides.

We can select a param from the list.

We can move a control on the Gui to select a param from the list.

We can move an unmapped control, it will map to the currently selected param.

We can move a mapped control to edit params.

Am I missing any functionality ?

Pretty simple and straightforward.

I stopped following a little while ago, too many changes for the time I had... What is grid?

[Geoff Waddington]

Originally Posted by fourdogslong

I stopped following a little while ago, too many changes for the time I had... What is grid?

It's the spreadsheet looking part that shows the layout on the GUI.

Older versions used it for selection, etc., but now it is just a visual.

IMHO, it takes up way too many resources for just a visual

[fourdogslong]

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

It's the spreadsheet looking part that shows the layout on the GUI.

Older versions used it for selection, etc., but now it is just a visual.

IMHO, it takes up way too many resources for just a visual

I never felt like I'd need that so I agree with you that it's probably not a necessity.

[MixMonkey]

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

Turns out the Grid is a beast to code.

Wondering what value it provides.

We can select a param from the list.

We can move a control on the Gui to select a param from the list.

We can move an unmapped control, it will map to the currently selected param.

We can move a mapped control to edit params.

Am I missing any functionality ?

Pretty simple and straightforward.

Flat lists are fine, better in fact, because they aren't tied to a specific surface layout. The killer functionality is the automatic selection of a mapped control by turning it, not having to find it in the list by sight.

[MixR]

Originally Posted by UNdark

To carry on from that - this is a vid, quite old now but the principle remains.
Showing the idea on hotkeys. This was what I then transferred to the MCU..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gk1RAnA-Nnw

This is brilliant and I remember watching it when I started getting to grips with CSI. It's a great idea to have this set up and although I have gone down a different route I may come back to adapt this sort of approach.

For me personally I am happy with using mouse and keyboard for some things and have therefore only taken a bite sized approach with the things I wanted to go there and then.

Since my project nomenclature follows a strict pattern it should be fairly easy to implement this workflow. Having said that, I really got into the Track Manager and quite like navigating projects that way.

Now that I know CSI better I will re-watch your videos. I think I can get a lot more out of them now than when I started.

[Geoff Waddington]

If you move a surface control and it is mapped, the appropriate item gets selected in the params list, and the values are presented for editing.

It's a bit trickier if you select by clicking the mouse on the list, or use the mouse to move a GUI control.

CSI can search for the appropriate control just fine.

But what if there is more than one control mapped to that parameter ?

CSI will stop when it finds the first one.

I think this about the best we can do for workflow.

After all, a multiple map will likely occur fairly rarely, and if it does, you can always fall back to selecting by surface control.

What do you think ?

[Freex]

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

If you move a surface control and it is mapped, the appropriate item gets selected in the params list, and the values are presented for editing.

It's a bit trickier if you select by clicking the mouse on the list, or use the mouse to move a GUI control.

CSI can search for the appropriate control just fine.

But what if there is more than one control mapped to that parameter ?

CSI will stop when it finds the first one.

I think this about the best we can do for workflow.

After all, a multiple map will likely occur fairly rarely, and if it does, you can always fall back to selecting by surface control.

What do you think ?

Sounds great, and realisticaly a double map has probably been done manually anyway, by an advanced user
"click and/or turn" will be fantastic for almost everyone for almost every plugin.
If memory serves Studio One had something similar for mapping.

[MixMonkey]

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

But what if there is more than one control mapped to that parameter ?

CSI will stop when it finds the first one.

This sounds fine I'd say there was even a case to have "one control per parameter" enforced by default, so that mapping a new control to a parameter overwrites any previous mapping.

It could prevent things getting confusing in what is supposed to be a quick and simple process.

[Geoff Waddington]

Originally Posted by MixMonkey

This sounds fine I'd say there was even a case to have "one control per parameter" enforced by default, so that mapping a new control to a parameter overwrites any previous mapping.

It could prevent things getting confusing in what is supposed to be a quick and simple process.

Thought about doing that, but want some input from folks like Funkybot that use separate control/display combos, e.g. MFT and iPad, before putting in that restriction.

[Geoff Waddington]

WARNING EXPERIMENTAL DO NOT USE FOR PRODUCTION

New Exp build is up.

https://stash.reaper.fm/v/42044/CSI%20Exp.zip

Here's a sneak peak at the new Learn workflow.

You need at minimum these 2 Zones, MCU/X-Touch/etc. examples shown, your surface may vary:

Zone FXRowLayout
	"" ""
	"Shift+" ""
	"Control+" ""
	"Option+" ""
ZoneEnd

Zone FXWidgetLayout
	Rotary FXParam RingStyle=Dot
	DisplayUpper FixedTextDisplay
	DisplayLower FXParamValueDisplay
ZoneEnd

#WidgetTypes Rotary RotaryPush Fader
#DisplayRows DisplayUpper DisplayLower
#RingStyles Dot Fill BoostCut Spread

Focus an FX which has no map.

Hit the button mapped to enter Learn mode.

    Instrument   	LearnFocusedFX

Click on Auto Map.

Just to be sure at this early stage, exit Reaper and restart.

Focus the FX for which you just created the map.

Hit the button mapped to enter Learn mode.

Focus the FX by clicking on the FX Gui.

Turn a control on the surface to select the param from the list and enter edit mode for that param.

Now you can type in the name display edit box and see the results in real time on your surface.

Selecting RingStyle, the 2 Show checkboxes, and the steps dropdown also work right now, please give them a try and see if you like the workflow.

Nothing else works and it doesn't save yet.

Just want to hear what everyone thinks of the workflow.

[Funkybot]

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

Thought about doing that, but want some input from folks like Funkybot that use separate control/display combos, e.g. MFT and iPad, before putting in that restriction.

Sorry for not chiming in much, I've been extra absent from here the last week as I'm in a slow recovery process from a kidney stone blasting procedure that really kicked my ass. Definitely feels like a case of the cure being worse than the disease so far.

If I'm following all of this, I like Geoff's proposal around allowing for double mapping and focusing to edit. I imagine the same rule would apply where I'd likely end up learning from my iPad that has the display widgets, then saving the map, then being able to focus the controls on the hardware to edit via broadcast/listen (or equivalent)? That'd likely be my anticipated mapping/editing workflow. Wouldn't be a dealbreaker if I had to do it all from the surface with the displays.

I'll try to pick up on the latest Exp when I can but I'm mostly bed-ridden or on heavy drugs.

[Geoff Waddington]

Originally Posted by Funkybot

Sorry for not chiming in much, I've been extra absent from here the last week as I'm in a slow recovery process from a kidney stone blasting procedure that really kicked my ass. Definitely feels like a case of the cure being worse than the disease so far.

If I'm following all of this, I like Geoff's proposal around allowing for double mapping and focusing to edit. I imagine the same rule would apply where I'd likely end up learning from my iPad that has the display widgets, then saving the map, then being able to focus the controls on the hardware to edit via broadcast/listen (or equivalent)? That'd likely be my anticipated mapping/editing workflow. Wouldn't be a dealbreaker if I had to do it all from the surface with the displays.

I'll try to pick up on the latest Exp when I can but I'm mostly bed-ridden or on heavy drugs.

Wow, rest and be well my friend.

And enjoy the heavy drugs

[fourdogslong]

Originally Posted by Funkybot

Sorry for not chiming in much, I've been extra absent from here the last week as I'm in a slow recovery process from a kidney stone blasting procedure that really kicked my ass. Definitely feels like a case of the cure being worse than the disease so far.

I know the feeling, I had a similar problem last january and the recovery was not fun to say the least. Take it easy it will get better.

[MT4U]

Sorry to hear that, FB. I hope you get well soon.

All the best!

[Geoff Waddington]

The Learn window is still too busy.

Anyone hate it if the following are in a dialog accessed via an "Advanced" button.

Delta
Range Min
Range Max
Accelerated Delta Values
Accelerated Tick Values
Custom Step Values

The main page will still have a dropdown for steps, if you just want stock as opposed to custom values.

[MixMonkey]

Best wishes to @funkybot for his recovery!

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

The Learn window is still too busy.

Anyone hate it if the following are in a dialog accessed via an "Advanced" button.

Delta
Range Min
Range Max
Accelerated Delta Values
Accelerated Tick Values
Custom Step Values

The main page will still have a dropdown for steps, if you just want stock as opposed to custom values.

Sounds good to me.

[Funkybot]

Thanks for the well wishes all!

Geoff, that stuff going in the advanced button makes sense to me.

[earlabs]

Originally Posted by fourdogslong

I know the feeling, I had a similar problem last january and the recovery was not fun to say the least. Take it easy it will get better.

same same

[Cragster]

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

WARNING EXPERIMENTAL DO NOT USE FOR PRODUCTION

New Exp build is up.

https://stash.reaper.fm/v/42044/CSI%20Exp.zip

Here's a sneak peak at the new Learn workflow.

You need at minimum these 2 Zones, MCU/X-Touch/etc. examples shown, your surface may vary:

Zone FXRowLayout
	"" ""
	"Shift+" ""
	"Control+" ""
	"Option+" ""
ZoneEnd

Zone FXWidgetLayout
	Rotary FXParam RingStyle=Dot
	DisplayUpper FixedTextDisplay
	DisplayLower FXParamValueDisplay
ZoneEnd

#WidgetTypes Rotary RotaryPush Fader
#DisplayRows DisplayUpper DisplayLower
#RingStyles Dot Fill BoostCut Spread

Focus an FX which has no map.

Hit the button mapped to enter Learn mode.

    Instrument   	LearnFocusedFX

Click on Auto Map.

Just to be sure at this early stage, exit Reaper and restart.

Focus the FX for which you just created the map.

Hit the button mapped to enter Learn mode.

Focus the FX by clicking on the FX Gui.

Turn a control on the surface to select the param from the list and enter edit mode for that param.

Now you can type in the name display edit box and see the results in real time on your surface.

Selecting RingStyle, the 2 Show checkboxes, and the steps dropdown also work right now, please give them a try and see if you like the workflow.

Nothing else works and it doesn't save yet.

Just want to hear what everyone thinks of the workflow.

Hi Geoff

Giving the new exp version a try. Im only getting one way communication ? If i move a param on screen with the mouse the surface control ring and param value move accordingly but when i move anything on the surface nothing happens ?

Any idea whats causing that ?

But the features seem to work . I was able to change the param name in real time . The show boxes work. I havnt tried the step drop down yet.

Also everyone should be aware that the old FXRowLayout doesnt work with this. I know it was said that the name of the zone changed from FXLayouts to the above mentioned but i wasnt aware that the contents of that zone changed as well. Took me a while to realize that after looking at your Xtouch zone. The number of channels after every line needs to be deleted.
Just thought id mention that in case someone else gets caught with that as it had me stuck for while.

Everything looks cool . Just need to figure out why its only working moving onscreen with the mouse ??

Thanks Geoff. its looking really cool though !!

Oh and thought id mention that the FXMenu display doesnt update when switching channels. If the slot is blank it will display the FXmenu that was there from the previous channel.It only updates if theres a new FX in that slot. If i explained that correctly.

[fourdogslong]

Has any new features been added, or bugs been resolved in this new release or is it still mostly to experiment with the new learn setup?