Which Would You Buy?

[Toft]

Good choice Jeff. You know you aren't going to regret getting a DR.

Youtube clips are great, but I find the actual amp with my guitar and my playing is a very different beast to what you hear online. So going with what you know is a good plan.

FWIW I would also have recommended the Princeton, for sweetness at sensible volumes, but you are going to be happy with a DRRI even if your neighbours are not!

[Jeffsounds]

Originally Posted by Toft

Good choice Jeff. You know you aren't going to regret getting a DR.

Youtube clips are great, but I find the actual amp with my guitar and my playing is a very different beast to what you hear online. So going with what you know is a good plan.

FWIW I would also have recommended the Princeton, for sweetness at sensible volumes, but you are going to be happy with a DRRI even if your neighbours are not!

I'm pretty sure I'm going to love it. Maybe I'll save the Princeton for next year.

[Jeffsounds]

Originally Posted by karbomusic

I thought the deluxe was 22 watts? I know that can still be loud just confirming. I've been contemplating picking one up, maybe the brown one.

Ordering mine this evening, along with a few other toys. I'll let you know how it sounds when it gets here. Probably going to have to play it for a few hours just to let the neighbors know I have a new toy.

Wonder how long it will take to break the speaker in...

[karbomusic]

Originally Posted by Jeffsounds

Ordering mine this evening, along with a few other toys. I'll let you know how it sounds when it gets here. Probably going to have to play it for a few hours just to let the neighbors know I have a new toy.

Wonder how long it will take to break the speaker in...

Excellent, let me know!

[grinder]

Takes a while depends on how much you play of course.
Over the last 6 years I purchased new speakers the first new speakers I have ever owned like most having purchased 2nd hand amp and speakers due to money constraints.
When they break in in my case it just happened in an instant they just came on fire for some reason.

Enjoy your tools.

Grinder

[Jeffsounds]

Damn! Didn't get to order because the wife worked late and I didn't get to the bank to transfer the money. She works all day tomorrow as well so it won't be until Monday.

And here I was, gettin' all anxious and excited...

[ivansc]

Originally Posted by karbomusic

I thought the deluxe was 22 watts? I know that can still be loud just confirming. I've been contemplating picking one up, maybe the brown one.

The later fixed bias ones with 6L6s are/were 22 watts but the earlier cathode biased 6V6 tweed ones can only manage about 11 watts like I said.
But they are LOUD Fender valve/tube watts! I have only found one drummer who played too loud for that amp in the pubs I work these days. And I only ever used him that once....

[Jeffsounds]

Ran across THIS today. Another in a LONG list of mods that can be done to the DRRI.

[karbomusic]

Nice, I just happen to have an EVM12L I bought in the '90s. Not sure if the article mentions all the extra weight it's gonna add.

[Jeffsounds]

Originally Posted by karbomusic

Nice, I just happen to have an EVM12L I bought in the '90s. Not sure if the article mentions all the extra weight it's gonna add.

It did mention that extra weight, Karbo. Probably would be okay for the studio if you're not lugging it around for gigs or rehearsals.

I also found this mod:

"Put Stevie Ray's fave 5751 in V1 and V2 (This immediately got rid of the "too bright" sound and warmed the overall tone.)"

And continued with this:

"Stuck balanced NOS Mullard 12AT7s in V3 (reverb driver) and V6 (Phase Inverter). Also replaced V4 (reverb return) with a better version of what was in there. Didn't touch V5. Also didn't touch power tubes or rectifier."

I also read that some people are clipping the leads on a certain cap that cures the "brightness" problem. Not sure which cap that is though. I'd prolly fry myself.

I also saw a mod that just removes a tube from the normal channel and that gives more power or something to the second channel. I'll have to dig up that email.

[karbomusic]

Originally Posted by Jeffsounds

It did mention that extra weight, Karbo. Probably would be okay for the studio if you're not lugging it around for gigs or rehearsals.

I used to lug it around in my Boogie DC5 combo. It's heavy but not undoable. I ended up ordering a DC5 head cab from Boogie a few years ago which I put the amp from the combo cabinet into; which is why the 12L is "available" for use.

[Jeffsounds]

Zzounds sells them for $249! I see one on eBay for $99. Something to keep in the back pocket for a rainy day. But my curiosity is rising!

[Jeffsounds]

Just an update... Tracking info yesterday said delivery by Tuesday, end of day. This evening it was updated to tomorrow by end of day... but that's only the DRRI. All the other stuff is slated for Wednesday.

Getting excited...

[karbomusic]

And...... ?

[Jeffsounds]

Originally Posted by karbomusic

And...... ?

And... I haven't really had a chance to play with it much. Only once, in fact. For about 30 minutes. Plugged into channel 2, input 1, volume, bass and treble all on 4. No pedals, just my Tele straight in. It sounded a bit harsh to me in the mid-hi range but I figured that is just because the speaker isn't broken in. Thought I'd take some time today and see how it reacts with a few pedals. I'm really loving that awesome Fender clean sound!

More later...

[grinder]

It will take about year depending on how much the speakers are used only
then will you hear the real sound it can take a while do not get down about it
Jeffsounds.

Grinder

[Jeffsounds]

Originally Posted by grinder

It will take about year depending on how much the speakers are used only
then will you hear the real sound it can take a while do not get down about it
Jeffsounds.

Grinder

Thanks for that. I plan to use it quite a bit after the 1st of the year. Just too much going on right now but I had some fun with it again this afternoon. I still didn't get to use any pedals though. Maybe tomorrow...

[karbomusic]

Originally Posted by Jeffsounds

It sounded a bit harsh to me in the mid-hi range but I figured that is just because the speaker isn't broken in.

2 cents....

I don't typically trust my ears fully during such times of new gear and the joy of testing it out. One's ears are usually not in a musical perspective as much as a clinical one and listening for "good" while overlooking musical. Once you spend some time you'll adapt and hear the goodness. That being said...

I have a bit of a hard time swallowing the idea of longer break in times before a speaker sounds again "good", for one as above, your ears and perception also adapts more than the speaker actually changes and there are many who feel that any break-in time that does matter, is likely within minutes or a handful of hours. I re-coned speakers for a living for about 5 years and I still don't fully buy the idea. The spider etc. will loosen a tad but I don't equate that with anything one truly notices in an objective fashion.

So, the short version, is play that damn thing mang.

[Lowell Mather 5150]

Edit: See the OP has his heart set on the DRRI. Good luck to you.

[Glennbo]

Originally Posted by karbomusic

2 cents....

The spider etc. will loosen a tad but I don't equate that with anything one truly notices in an objective fashion.

I could see varnish filled linen edge material loosening up on the cone over some period of time. How much time I don't know, but I would think it might take some time. That said, I would suspect that bass frequencies would be most affected for that type of edge material.

[Philbo King]

I usually don't reply to these kinds of threads because it's a lot like asking "what sort of girl should I marry?"....

But I can recommend this amp: Fender Champion 20

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/ampli...itar-combo-amp

It doesn't look like much, I admit. But it has some really great amp emulations and effects on board.

I disliked the speaker it comes with, and changed it to a Jensen Special Design, which is better, but how good can you expect an 8" speaker with 20 Watts to sound? I've considered converting the open-backed cabinet to a closed-back one to reduce the 'honk' of it a bit.
Most of the time, though, I run it through the PA.

(1/8" to 1/4" cord from headphone jack to Radial direct box, then XLR to the PA)

It sounds really great this way, and the on-board FX and amp emulations are generally enough so I don't need pedals in most situations.

It weighs about 4-5 lbs and costs $100. Hard to go wrong (if you have a soundman on the PA who knows what he's doing...)

[Jeffsounds]

Originally Posted by karbomusic

2 cents....

I don't typically trust my ears fully during such times of new gear and the joy of testing it out. One's ears are usually not in a musical perspective as much as a clinical one and listening for "good" while overlooking musical. Once you spend some time you'll adapt and hear the goodness. That being said...

I have a bit of a hard time swallowing the idea of longer break in times before a speaker sounds again "good", for one as above, your ears and perception also adapts more than the speaker actually changes and there are many who feel that any break-in time that does matter, is likely within minutes or a handful of hours. I re-coned speakers for a living for about 5 years and I still don't fully buy the idea. The spider etc. will loosen a tad but I don't equate that with anything one truly notices in an objective fashion.

So, the short version, is play that damn thing mang.

I tend to agree with you here. I think a lot of it just getting used to it, which I intend to do as quickly as possible.

Originally Posted by Lowell Mather 5150

Edit: See the OP has his heart set on the DRRI. Good luck to you.

And that's what I got!

Originally Posted by Philbo King

I usually don't reply to these kinds of threads because it's a lot like asking "what sort of girl should I marry?"....

But I can recommend this amp: Fender Champion 20

It may be a great amp but one of my criteria for this was that it not be a modeling type amp. In the end I went with the DRRI because that's what my heart wanted and I followed my heart. And so far, I'm loving it!

[grinder]

Here you are just one of many
Enjoy your Amp Jeffsounds regardless of what you believe.
You have a real amp.

https://thestateofsound.net/2014/02/...-new-speakers/

Grinder

[karbomusic]

Originally Posted by grinder

Here you are just one of many
Enjoy your Amp Jeffsounds regardless of what you believe.
You have a real amp.

https://thestateofsound.net/2014/02/...-new-speakers/

Grinder

Yep saw that one and can provide articles to the contrary - I don't want to believe something, I want to know. I'm not saying spiders don't loosen, they do and for the entire life of their existence, I'm saying it likely occurs fairly quickly and the tonal difference isn't that objectively huge - "good" is subjective so it's as possible it will sound worse over time.

If someone has test charts showing just how many of which frequencies by how many ~dB, I'm on board but people don't seem to provide those - I'm happy to be wrong but I need more than the passed around info that I've been seeing all my life. I used to be warranty certified by EV, maybe they had charts but don't remember as it's been about 20 years. It's not that I don't think they break in, it's that I don't think its the life-changing moment people think it is.

[Glennbo]

Originally Posted by karbomusic

Now if someone has test charts showing just how many of which frequency changed and by how many dB, I'm on board

Funny you should mention that, because I went looking to see if I could find any comparison tests with measurable differences, and came up dry.

[karbomusic]

Originally Posted by Glennbo

Funny you should mention that, because I went looking to see if I could find any comparison tests with measurable differences, and came up dry.

Even the manufacturers mention break in if memory serves; just trying to un-blur the line between something breaking in and some panacea of tone explosion once it does. Even my very expensive (to me) Dynaudio monitors state it but they also state "within the first hours" and any explanation of how better is vague. I've got a 100+ hours on them by now, don't remember much changing.

This would be easier to swallow if I weren't so jealous I don't own a DDRI.

[grinder]

In the last three years I have purchased new Eminence and Celestion speakers
for my Fender twin Reverb and for my Bruno.
I noticed a huge difference when they came right.
Most of my life I had second hand speakers except a couple of 150 watt Fane rock speakers.

Well I noticed the Celestions break in, the Eminence speakers well I use my Bruno Underground mostly so they have not broken in yet
I never read about "breaking in" speakers before I actually heard it for my self I noticed the sound then looked it up.... today.

Grinder

[Reason]

How do you break em in? Longer durations, or higher volume?

[karbomusic]

Originally Posted by grinder

In the last three years I have purchased new Eminence and Celestion speakers
for my Fender twin Reverb and for my Bruno.
I noticed a huge difference when they came right.

Replaced guitar speakers in a cab a few months back, the before/after test recordings were basically the same and they weren't even the same brand - I couldn't find much reason why I even replaced them, but who knows what I'd have thought minus that test. To be clear, I at first thought the new ones sounded like crap in comparison, until I compared the recordings.

So yes, I'm open to anyone demonstrating 'huge difference'.

[Jimmy James]

Originally Posted by Jeffsounds

I'm going to get a new amp. It's for RECORDING INTO REAPER and I will be using a mic so I don't want a modeller and I don't want solid state.

I want TOOBS!

Ok, what I'd REALLY like to get is the '65 Fender Deluxe Reverb but it's just a tad out of my price range. I want that Fender clean sound and will get dirty with pedals. Uh... don't read that wrong...

So I've checked out the Blues Deluxe Reissue and it has possibilities. I've also checked out the Hot Rod Deluxe III and I kind of like the fact that I can get 40 watts or get 15 watts and still have a 12 inch speaker, which is a must. Gotta have a 12 and preferably a Celestion. I'm really liking all 3 of these and am having a hard time deciding. And to top it off...

I also have my eye on a Vox AC 15 C1...

I probably will never use the amp live outside of the studio so the smaller wattage of the Vox and Hot Rod Deluxe III appeals to me.

I've got a few days to mull it over so what do you think? Anybody heard anything bad about any of these amps? Anything I should be aware of or think about when choosing? What about brands other than Fender or Vox?

I own or have owned every amp in your list (tube guy since the 80's). The Carvin Vintage 16 is the best amp I have ever owned. It also caused me to sell a few of the amps I owned.
It is American made. It has Epic tone. And they are dirt cheap. Think "Matchless". I even use it in 5 watt mode at gigs.

[grinder]

Reason
I just played and recorded
In my case my recording sound did noticeably improve to my ears anyway.
I work my guitar from bottom to top all the time so full range (6 strings)
The Bruno Underground is a very large volume amp as soon as you turn up the volume knob. I did not play anything over a quarter turn you can still hear it up the street from outside a treated room!

Grinder

[Glennbo]

Originally Posted by Jimmy James

I own or have owned every amp in your list (tube guy since the 80's). The Carvin Vintage 16 is the best amp I have ever owned. It also caused me to sell a few of the amps I owned.
It is American made. It has Epic tone. And they are dirt cheap. Think "Matchless". I even use it in 5 watt mode at gigs.

I'm partial to my HoneyTone.

It sounds great when you put a mic that's as big as the whole amp on it! (I broke the speaker in for a while first)

[Ampfixer]

I do a lot of custom stuff. For studio use the amps I build in the style of a Champ or Vox AC4 are by far the most popular. It depends a lot on the style of music you want to work with. The little ones will do clean quite well but shine when you need dirt.

By using different cabs with little amps you can get a lot of different tones. I never cared for the sound of an 8" speaker. Weber and WGS make the best 8's but I like a 12" as a minimum if you want any real thump.

[Glennbo]

Originally Posted by Ampfixer

12" as a minimum if you want any real thump.

I actually use a pair of 1960s blue Jensen 12" speakers in an open back Gretsch 6159 combo amp as my recording speaker cab.

It's like this one, http://www.kilback.net/pics/6159_2.jpg

[Jeffsounds]

Nothing sounds like a 12" speaker and nothing sounds as good as a 12" speaker except maybe 2 or 4 or 8 12" speakers...

I figure I'll just keep on playing and have fun with the DRRI and eventually it will just become something I'm used to and will sound incredible to me and maybe someone else. If that time spent is a breakin period or just my getting used to it or whatever, so be it. It will be fun.

In the meantime, Karbo, you're welcome to come by anytime and jam away on it.

[ivansc]

The biggest difference I have noticed over the years is the difference between fixed and cathode biassed amps and of course the design of the tone stack. Er and 6v6/6l6 or el84/el54 or... or.....

Never seen a huge difference in terms of speakers once you get the right sensitivity for the amp in question.
I lucked into an old Celestion 12" 20 watter that had spent its life in a Marshall 4x12 mostly doing nothing but holding another 4x12 off the floor! 5 UK pounds on ebay!

[richie43]

Originally Posted by ivansc

.... Er and 6v6/6l6 or el84/el54 or... or.....

EL54? Things are weird across the pond.....

[JeffreyET]

Watch out, some brands like Blackstar and Tubeworks are not full tube amps, i.e. they have solid state preamps or power sections. There are good deals to be had out there, VHT, Valve Jr, some Peaveys, Carvins, etc. Even Marshall is on the tube mini-amp bandwagon with their DSL 20. Just do your research & narrow down what power tube types you want in an amp, e.g. EL-84, EL-34, 6V6, 6L6 since the main tonal character differences are due to them. (Preamp tubes are a swappable factor, and in cheap amps the rectifier is diodes across the board)If you're a Fender Jones you might like a 6V6 amp like the DSL20, but they need a minor preamp mod according to some. You will find other examples of commonality e.g. some Boogies, Vox ACs, Valve Jr all use EL-84 power tubes. It is not hard to get a cheapo and improve with tweaks found online and they make great recording amps. Better yet find a VHT or VJ that already has mods, tweakers seldom recoup the cost when selling.

BTW I went full mod route with a Valve Jr, was quite happy, then got a second hand Emery which is a freakin' tube laboratory!

[Steve36]

Nice choice Jeffsounds.
Congratulations and enjoy.

[karbomusic]

Originally Posted by Jeffsounds

In the meantime, Karbo, you're welcome to come by anytime and jam away on it.

Well I would but..........




I caved and ordered a 68 Deluxe.