Old 12-12-2020, 04:05 AM   #1
Beginner
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 26
Default Rendering Problem

Hello,

I have the following problem when rendering my audio tracks.

The rendered file is 6 DB quieter than my original.

All plugins are disabled.

What can be the reason for this? I have checked the settings several times and found nothing.

Do I have to render everything with +6DB at the master output at the end?
Surely that can't be it?

Thanks a lot for your help.
Beginner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-12-2020, 06:32 AM   #2
valy
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Jan 2020
Posts: 1,770
Default

View > Monitoring FX

Is anything in there?
valy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-12-2020, 08:42 AM   #3
Beginner
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 26
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by valy View Post
View > Monitoring FX

Is anything in there?
NOPE ...NO Monitoring FX
Beginner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-12-2020, 09:15 AM   #4
pepe44
Human being with feelings
 
pepe44's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Portugal
Posts: 1,458
Default

It would help if you post a screenshot of the render menu so we can see whats going on.
__________________
Intel core i7 6700K - socket 1151 LGA - Chipset z170 - 16G DDR4 - Nvidia GTX 1060 -Merging Anubis converter
pepe44 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-12-2020, 12:15 PM   #5
Beginner
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 26
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pepe44 View Post
It would help if you post a screenshot of the render menu so we can see whats going on.
Here is a screeenshot of my Render Settings:
Attached Images
File Type: png 2020_12_12_20_10_53_Window.png (46.6 KB, 25 views)
Beginner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-12-2020, 12:40 PM   #6
pepe44
Human being with feelings
 
pepe44's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Portugal
Posts: 1,458
Default

Nothing leads to sound changes. Try opening a blank new project , importing some audio and render it to see if if drops the same 6dB. If not is a project related issue.
__________________
Intel core i7 6700K - socket 1151 LGA - Chipset z170 - 16G DDR4 - Nvidia GTX 1060 -Merging Anubis converter
pepe44 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2020, 12:38 AM   #7
Beginner
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 26
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pepe44 View Post
Nothing leads to sound changes. Try opening a blank new project , importing some audio and render it to see if if drops the same 6dB. If not is a project related issue.
New blank Project, same Problem:

Here are my Settings:

https://forum.cockos.com/attachment....1&d=1607842638

Here you can see the Differences:
https://forum.cockos.com/attachment....1&d=1607844848

Mixerview
https://forum.cockos.com/attachment....1&d=1607844899

Here are my UAD Recording Asio Settings
https://forum.cockos.com/attachment....1&d=1607851605

..and my UAD Console
https://forum.cockos.com/attachment....1&d=1607852364
Attached Images
File Type: gif settings.gif (48.2 KB, 20 views)
File Type: gif View14.gif (48.8 KB, 20 views)
File Type: png Mixerview.png (39.7 KB, 23 views)
File Type: jpg UADSET~1.jpg (59.3 KB, 21 views)
File Type: jpg UAD Console.jpg (61.7 KB, 20 views)

Last edited by Beginner; 12-13-2020 at 02:40 AM.
Beginner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2020, 07:01 AM   #8
pepe44
Human being with feelings
 
pepe44's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Portugal
Posts: 1,458
Default

Can you install a portable version of reaper, on a different disl location and make the same test ?
If it happens in a blank session that leads to some configuration within Reaper that might cause the issue.

https://lacinato.com/cm/blog/25-reaperportable

https://forum.cockos.com/showpost.ph...45&postcount=4
__________________
Intel core i7 6700K - socket 1151 LGA - Chipset z170 - 16G DDR4 - Nvidia GTX 1060 -Merging Anubis converter
pepe44 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2020, 09:21 AM   #9
Beginner
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 26
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pepe44 View Post
Can you install a portable version of reaper, on a different disl location and make the same test ?
If it happens in a blank session that leads to some configuration within Reaper that might cause the issue.

https://lacinato.com/cm/blog/25-reaperportable

https://forum.cockos.com/showpost.ph...45&postcount=4
I have now tested it on a portable version.
There everything works as it should. Thanks for the hint.
But how do I get further now?
Do I have to reinstall Reaper completely from my computer?
Beginner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2020, 09:57 AM   #10
valy
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Jan 2020
Posts: 1,770
Default

What is your pan law
valy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2020, 10:03 AM   #11
pepe44
Human being with feelings
 
pepe44's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Portugal
Posts: 1,458
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Beginner View Post
I have now tested it on a portable version.
There everything works as it should. Thanks for the hint.
But how do I get further now?
Do I have to reinstall Reaper completely from my computer?

There might be some issue with the pan law of your reaper project settings.
6dB is a value that can make it happen. ALT + P will give you access to the project settings. under the Advanced menu check your sttings.

I Use everytime PAN LAW -3dB with gain compensation ON and Stereo Pan.

Those are present every project i create or mix.
__________________
Intel core i7 6700K - socket 1151 LGA - Chipset z170 - 16G DDR4 - Nvidia GTX 1060 -Merging Anubis converter
pepe44 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2020, 12:02 PM   #12
Beginner
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 26
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pepe44 View Post
There might be some issue with the pan law of your reaper project settings.
6dB is a value that can make it happen. ALT + P will give you access to the project settings. under the Advanced menu check your sttings.

I Use everytime PAN LAW -3dB with gain compensation ON and Stereo Pan.

Those are present every project i create or mix.
Thank you very much, I think that's it.

Here are my old Pan Law settings:
https://forum.cockos.com/attachment....1&d=1607885736

Here are the new ones:
https://forum.cockos.com/attachment....1&d=1607885791

I am now a bit confused.
Can you please tell me possibly still,
what is the meaning of this?

Many greetings

Last edited by Beginner; 12-13-2020 at 12:22 PM.
Beginner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2020, 12:21 PM   #13
valy
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Jan 2020
Posts: 1,770
Default

Can't see the images, but

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pan_law
valy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2020, 12:30 PM   #14
Beginner
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 26
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by valy View Post
Can't see the images, but

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pan_law
Thanks a lot...learned something again :-)

I do not want to know how many have this problem...
..and do not notice it..

Many greetings
Beginner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2020, 12:39 PM   #15
valy
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Jan 2020
Posts: 1,770
Default

Seems to be a pretty common issue, especially when switching from another DAW or moving projects between DAWs.
valy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-14-2020, 01:24 AM   #16
Beginner
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 26
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by valy View Post
Seems to be a pretty common issue, especially when switching from another DAW or moving projects between DAWs.
Hello again,

after adjusting the Pan Laws in my Reaper project.
the rendering works as it should be,
but my mixes now sound very strange, the volumes of the individual tracks are very differentiated.

Especially the drums sound very flat.

How does the application of the Pan Laws affect integrated drum engines like Superior or Ez Drummer? I only mix the drums within the Superior mixer.

Taking into account the Pan Laws, in a way, a world has changed for me.

Do I have to remix all my projects ( about 40 tracks) when changing the Pan Laws?... Stereo effects and volume/pan automations included.
Or is it enough to apply the Pan Laws only for rendering various tracks?

How do you guys handle this?

First and foremost, I've been reading up on the subject a bit. The mono compatibility can suffer enormously with wrong settings if I understood correctly.

I am now still trying to figure out what the optimal settings are for my environment.

I also use Neve and SSL console plugins from UAD, among others. According to the known information these manufacturers rely on different Pan Laws ( SSL 4.5 DB e.g.)
Is it necessary to provide the Reaper "SSL tracks" with 4.5DB Pan Laws?
Related also to other tracks with individual settings?


Thanks again.

Last edited by Beginner; 12-14-2020 at 01:30 AM.
Beginner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-14-2020, 05:00 AM   #17
pepe44
Human being with feelings
 
pepe44's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Portugal
Posts: 1,458
Default

Im sorry to say but you´ll need to do the mix again. Changing the PAN laws changes the all stereo placement. Take it as a learned thing for the future.
All the best.
__________________
Intel core i7 6700K - socket 1151 LGA - Chipset z170 - 16G DDR4 - Nvidia GTX 1060 -Merging Anubis converter
pepe44 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-14-2020, 06:39 AM   #18
valy
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Jan 2020
Posts: 1,770
Default

Yes. If you change the pan law, it will change everything.

However, for the mixes you've already completed, you could just boost their output gain before render by 3 dB or 6 dB or whatever.

When you start mixing new projects with the new pan law settings, you will naturally adjust the volumes of panned instruments to where you want them to be, so you don't really need to worry about the changes.

Basically, pan law only truly matters when altering it in the middle of a mix, or when moving projects between DAWs that have different pan law settings. Otherwise, you can more or less ignore it.
valy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-14-2020, 11:58 AM   #19
Beginner
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 26
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by valy View Post
Yes. If you change the pan law, it will change everything.

However, for the mixes you've already completed, you could just boost their output gain before render by 3 dB or 6 dB or whatever.

When you start mixing new projects with the new pan law settings, you will naturally adjust the volumes of panned instruments to where you want them to be, so you don't really need to worry about the changes.

Basically, pan law only truly matters when altering it in the middle of a mix, or when moving projects between DAWs that have different pan law settings. Otherwise, you can more or less ignore it.
Whew!! ok thank you so much for pointing that out.
I know very much to take to heart :-)
Thanks for the support to all of you
Beginner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-03-2021, 12:08 PM   #20
major_mixing
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Feb 2021
Location: Ukraine
Posts: 2
Default Thank you!

Quote:
Originally Posted by valy View Post
Yes. If you change the pan law, it will change everything.

However, for the mixes you've already completed, you could just boost their output gain before render by 3 dB or 6 dB or whatever.

When you start mixing new projects with the new pan law settings, you will naturally adjust the volumes of panned instruments to where you want them to be, so you don't really need to worry about the changes.

Basically, pan law only truly matters when altering it in the middle of a mix, or when moving projects between DAWs that have different pan law settings. Otherwise, you can more or less ignore it.

Thank you so much! Now it works! I had the same problem
__________________
Max from Major Mixing
major_mixing is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 07:05 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions Inc.