Old 04-08-2018, 04:10 PM   #1
vdubreeze
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Default Midi inline editor

If the Midi inline editor doesn't need an overhaul then the manual's information about it does. Exactly one time is the word "inline" in the manual, and it's just a mention of it, not followed by any info.

For a lot of folks, the inline editor is the only way any midi editing can be done. But it feels like it's the ignored stepchild. I'm not talking about the power of Reaper's midi editing, it's the other things. If you work on arrangements with just 8 midi instruments and 8 tracks of live instruments and need to work on them as a whole picture, changing a note here and there as it hits you, it's not a mature environment to be in. The losing of v and h note positioning in tracks is a big deal but not the only one. I hate having to export over to other DAWs just to tweak piano parts in an arrangement as it relates to other things happening on other tracks, but I still find I have to.

I think Reaper would benefit from interface improvements to the inline editor, to have someone who does detailed midi editing (not EDM or quantized loop music) give it a critical once over and bring it up to speed.

Are there hidden aspects to the inline editor that I haven't discovered? Or is there better coverage that I've missed?
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Old 04-15-2018, 09:50 AM   #2
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With you o this one. I generally ignore it because of these reasons. Would be nice if it got some love....
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Old 04-15-2018, 11:03 AM   #3
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Are there hidden aspects to the inline editor that I haven't discovered? Or is there better coverage that I've missed?
There is a section "Inline MIDI editor" in Actions. If you have any questions, I'll try to answer them.
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Old 04-15-2018, 11:37 AM   #4
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Honestly, if I need "detailed MIDI editing", I go to the actual MIDI editor (which CAN work on the whole project as a whole picture, showing multiple tracks and items at the same time, the whole nine yards). Haven't used an inline MIDI editor which didn't get on my nerves in one minute flat.
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Old 04-15-2018, 03:20 PM   #5
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Honestly, if I need "detailed MIDI editing", I go to the actual MIDI editor (which CAN work on the whole project as a whole picture, showing multiple tracks and items at the same time, the whole nine yards). Haven't used an inline MIDI editor which didn't get on my nerves in one minute flat.
Try as I might, it's the actual midi editor that I find more frustrating to use. Even setting it up for a few tracks of keyboards to view as a whole (for a jazz piece, not dance music, full range of keyboards) I find it an unproductive place to be. It just doesn't behave visually and focus-wise without me constantly having to adjust something simply to get it back to my visual. Switching between playing while listening, stopping and tweaking a few things at the top octave of one track and the bottom of another, then going back to listening - it's not a transparent enough workflow. The two modes don't lock to each other, and if they can I'd love to know how and I can just chalk it up to Reaper's baffling defaults.But it isn't for lack of poring over the manual. As I mention, the word "inline" appears just once, and it doesn't lead to any info. I eventually figured out what the tool does in the upper right of the inline editor are, but believe me, the manual doesn't even acknowledge their existence : )

I need to watch the midi tracks not in edit mode because they have to be visually in context with audio, and when I click on a midi track to edit a note I don't want it to totally change what's in front of me, where the track doesn't go directly to the note I clicked on with the same zoom and scroll context, clearly shown with the whole range of the part visible, and a sensibly small amount of bars before and after. I can't put my finger enough on what Reaper is specifically doing that I don't want to have found a solution in the prefs. But if I need to view the big picture of midi and audio, and see the entire range of the parts, when I use the midi editor I spend too much time unnecessarily rescrolling and rezooming the editor windows when entering and leaving them. If there's a way to have it work more sensibly I'd love to know, but all of the Reaper midi editing insight I've found hasn't related to this issue of going in and out of the midi editor while not feeling like I'm switching programs. It's an oddity, this strict lack of congruity between the two modes (track view and edit mode) that doesn't exist in other DAWs that I do mixed audio/midi in, so its not flowing naturally, or natively, is a frustration for me, no matter how powerful the editor is.

If someone can lay out exactly which defaults to change to make midi editing not such a separate environment from the general tracks I'll be quite a happy camper : ) and very appreciative. I'd love to hear from those who are doing mixed audio/midi projects in Reaper, where the midi is used to capture a musician's performance and (not for quantized EDM and not speaking of drum parts), with editing of notes done as desired, I'd be interested to find out how they made Reaper work for them in the context of this issue I have with Reaper and midi editing, as I think I've taken it about as far as I can poking around, and it's still a nit to me.

Thanks : )
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Old 04-16-2018, 12:40 AM   #6
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Are there hidden aspects to the inline editor that I haven't discovered? Or is there better coverage that I've missed?
Something I didn't know until EvilDragon pointed it out to me: Right click on the inline editor's CC lane dividers to change or add CC lanes.

Most of my MIDI editing scripts should work in the inline editor** (and should automatically install into that section of the Actions list), and there are also scripts for changing active channel and CC lanes.

EDIT: ** Except that mousewheel shortcuts don't work in the inline editor.

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Old 04-19-2018, 12:10 AM   #7
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I really SHOULD get to grips with that mega laundry list that is the Actions list....

Maybe what we SHOULD be asking for is a more user-friendly equivalent to the Actions List?

As it is right now I find the need to know what you are looking for in advance AND guessing the correct terminology for your search just makes the whole thing a nightmare.

Maybe I should do a FR?....
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Old 04-19-2018, 01:13 AM   #8
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As it is right now I find the need to know what you are looking for in advance AND guessing the correct terminology for your search just makes the whole thing a nightmare.

Maybe I should do a FR?....
But how the devs can change it? Yes, it is very annoying to find the right words.
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Old 04-19-2018, 06:47 AM   #9
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Originally Posted by juliansader View Post
Something I didn't know until EvilDragon pointed it out to me: Right click on the inline editor's CC lane dividers to change or add CC lanes.

Most of my MIDI editing scripts should work in the inline editor** (and should automatically install into that section of the Actions list), and there are also scripts for changing active channel and CC lanes.

EDIT: ** Except that mousewheel shortcuts don't work in the inline editor.

Thanks, juliansader. Unfortunately, my need isn't one of how to access CC info. Only to be able to edit note pitches and placement (and the occasional velocity) of any given track in as direct and few mouse moves while remaining in full tracks view and not switching modes, or at least visuals, as is possible in other DAWs.

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As it is right now I find the need to know what you are looking for in advance AND guessing the correct terminology for your search just makes the whole thing a nightmare.
.

That's one issue. Another is that due to the way Reaper just is, some solutions are not available to be reasoned out by those with their brains not wired a certain way. For example, there are functions that Reaper can achieve on a track but only after "Take: *function* on takes as items/Select first take in selected item/delete active take from item", all to do what is done as a single click elsewhere. Now, this isn't the problem at all, as long as you can get it in the end, but there's just no way in heck that 80% of folks who want a DAW can figure out, by poring over the action list and the manual, that what you need to do is put a function on a 'take' (when there are no other 'takes') instead of item, and then process and delete the 'first take', in order to get a very standard function to happen (in this case it's "paste (buffer) to fill selection". No way.
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