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Old 12-04-2019, 01:18 AM   #121
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Originally Posted by Strange Ways View Post
the most ridiculous thread of all time - "Compression is for kids", then all of a sudden everyone is an expert and can set you straight.
I thought that compression thread was amazing... an in-depth discussion by working pros and other yes, expert-level types on how they use one of the most important tools in audio processing. I was going to write a thank you post but decided no one would give a rat's but now... Coachz and all participants, thanks for that awesome thread.

I'll take that over yet another complaint thread any day.
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Old 12-04-2019, 02:12 AM   #122
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I find the people here with the most posts, are usually the most negative, are hardly ever helpful, and it seems like they have nothing to do but argue / find a way of negating shortcomings and feature requests / attempt to sell cumbersome work arounds for all of the shortcomings / have an excuse for every improvement suggested...

Just mention a better workflow on another DAW - and watch them go in like vultures to attack.
( Usually drummers and guitarists )

I'm amazed that you guys have so much time for forum responses and relentless arguing - I now understand after dropping in here for the last few years that you guys probably don't make much music at all.
All puffed up with WAY too much spare time on your hands.

Back to your endless posturing posts !!!

PS - Robert is a gem !
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Old 12-04-2019, 02:49 AM   #123
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Originally Posted by mschnell View Post
I totally disagree.

A "-1" comment should be as valid as a "+1" comment.

Meaning: here is (exactly) one person who thinks that a prioritization of this issue vs others would (not) be welcome.

Feels like democracy .

-Michael
Haha yeah, no hard feelings at all, some people are more open to democratic conversation and after all we’re in the same boat
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Old 12-04-2019, 02:59 AM   #124
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Originally Posted by karbomusic View Post
I hope you see the irony there (sort of like punching someone in the face then saying 'see, they aren't very nice'), your jabs at the forum and it's members was an attack on real and living people - otherwise, I'd not have responded - proverbially blurring the faces of those people with via wording doesn't make it not a personal attack of sorts.



Any person who has disagreed with you in the past here potentially falls under that knife whether you meant it to or not. I reread ^that, it wasn't part of the joke best I can tell.

Now, to be fair, I reread all my posts and best I can tell, they weren't super nice, but were civil and I was calling out "behavior" not calling you names or degrading you as a person. I was always taught to call out behavior not people.

Otherwise, water under the bridge as far as I'm concerned, other than we both apparently owe ivan a paypal payment or something.
.... as an old fart struggling along on a SS pension reduced by the US government by 50% BECAUSE I don`t live in the US any more, I`ll PM you BOTH my Paypal address.

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Old 12-04-2019, 03:26 AM   #125
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Originally Posted by ChristopherT View Post
I find the people here with the most posts, are usually the most negative, are hardly ever helpful, and it seems like they have nothing to do but argue / find a way of negating shortcomings and feature requests / attempt to sell cumbersome work arounds for all of the shortcomings / have an excuse for every improvement suggested...

Just mention a better workflow on another DAW - and watch them go in like vultures to attack.
( Usually drummers and guitarists )

I'm amazed that you guys have so much time for forum responses and relentless arguing - I now understand after dropping in here for the last few years that you guys probably don't make much music at all.
All puffed up with WAY too much spare time on your hands.

Back to your endless posturing posts !!!

PS - Robert is a gem !
I would hold karbomusic as my first exhibit as to why that is not true.

He has a metric ton of posts, is regularly helpful to people in the forums, and posts a lot of music here.

...and he's not the only one.
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Old 12-04-2019, 03:27 AM   #126
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Not too long ago I started a post asking for a suggestion on how to handle a minor MIDI problem that I continue to have. Zero responses. I posted it again a week or two later in the bug section, not even sure if it was a bug or just me. Zero responses.

The original poster here is correct. If you start a thread about something like "Reaper Sucks" or - the the most ridiculous thread of all time - "Compression is for kids", then all of a sudden everyone is an expert and can set you straight.

Chalk up a win for the OP.
I don't start new threads asking for help often, but a fair proportion of them have gone unanswered.

I don't take it personally, and still try to help others when I can.

I certainly don't presume that people read the post, know how to solve my problem, but simply decide to ignore me.

Last edited by Judders; 12-04-2019 at 05:05 AM.
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Old 12-04-2019, 04:25 AM   #127
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Originally Posted by fred garvin View Post
I thought that compression thread was amazing... an in-depth discussion by working pros and other yes, expert-level types on how they use one of the most important tools in audio processing. I was going to write a thank you post but decided no one would give a rat's but now... Coachz and all participants, thanks for that awesome thread.

I'll take that over yet another complaint thread any day.
You bet. I agree. The thread was extremely educational with great opinions for and against using compression. For some sad reason, some people on the internet just like arguing and will argue against anything. Really weird.

I'm guessing those same people also have not made any killer music in Reaper. I have a new album coming out done all in Reaper and yesterday we drove out into the country listening to it in the car to check it out. It sounds great and I can't say enough good about Reaper. Make some great music people!
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Old 12-04-2019, 04:27 AM   #128
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I would hold karbomusic as my first exhibit as to why that is not true.

He has a metric ton of posts, is regularly helpful to people in the forums, and posts a lot of music here.

...and he's not the only one.
He's also runs a wicked soldering iron.
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Old 12-04-2019, 04:30 AM   #129
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I start new threads asking for help often, but a fair proportion of them have gone unanswered.

I don't take it personally, and still try to help others when I can.

I certainly don't presume that people read the post, know how to solve my problem, but simply decide to ignore me.
In my experience if a thread is ignored then it is usually a pretty niche topic that many don't know the answer to. Having good descriptive subject titles is helpful too I find.
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Old 12-04-2019, 05:06 AM   #130
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In my experience if a thread is ignored then it is usually a pretty niche topic that many don't know the answer to. Having good descriptive subject titles is helpful too I find.
Yeah, most of my questions are answered by searching, but if searches don't turn anything up there's a good chance it just isn't common knowledge.
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Old 12-04-2019, 05:26 AM   #131
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Yeah, most of my questions are answered by searching, but if searches don't turn anything up there's a good chance it just isn't common knowledge.
I use this search. I don't know why it seems to work better than the forum search but it does for me.

https://cse.google.com/cse?cx=002458...%3Anbhva-j9iic
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Old 12-04-2019, 05:54 AM   #132
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I use this search. I don't know why it seems to work better than the forum search but it does for me.

https://cse.google.com/cse?cx=002458...%3Anbhva-j9iic
Yeah, I just search "reaper forums [question]" in google.
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Old 12-04-2019, 06:30 AM   #133
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I am not going to point any fingers, but some of the replies in this thread have been very effective at proving Robert's points about the forum to me, and it has been very frustrating to read some of the replies.

Just as a reminder, here is all the topics/issues that Robert has brought out about REAPER:
Takes, Scripts, Theme, Text Boxes, Routing, Modulation, Helping, COCKOS, Options, Whiners, Instruments, Remote, Hotkeys, ReaPack, Navigator, Monitor FX, Macros, Sample Browsing, NRPN/Sysex, Docking, Envelope Points, Future Looks...

Last edited by BirdBird; 12-04-2019 at 06:49 AM.
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Old 12-04-2019, 08:02 AM   #134
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I find it very very weird that Cockos allows the Lounge to exist, and that the main forums aren't moderated better. Insulting other forum members and politics/religion shouldn't have any place in a company's user forums, especially when the forums are the primary place for customer support and pre-release testing.
The gotcha there is that the very thing that makes the Cockos forums unique, a company run by, what, 1 or 2? with 2, 3 or 4 directly involved in day to day of the product (I'm just guessing) with no marketing to the users of extras, so the forums tend to be user populated with the occasional post by Cockos when necessary or helpful, means there simply isn't the person-power available to moderate more. It's nearly a full time job on a such an active company support board. Perhaps if Cockos hires an office person for something they've been handling themselves they can have them lightly moderate the forums as well. But to go from here to more moderated would cost time and money, and I'm happy they choose to spend it elsewhere (even if the Lounge is one of the off-topic forums anywhere most in need of moderation, at least it was before I bailed. But that's the risk taken anywhere when opening an OT forum.)
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Old 12-04-2019, 08:14 AM   #135
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Regardless of moderation, I would think the very invention of "lounge" sub forums in forum software is to specifically keep noise unrelated to the product out of the main forum - In that regard, it reduces moderation needs on the "main highway". That said, I've seen users who have never actually even posted outside the lounge, or just one or two posts and I'm not even sure if they make music or use reaper LOL.
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Old 12-04-2019, 08:20 AM   #136
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The gotcha there is that the very thing that makes the Cockos forums unique, a company run by, what, 1 or 2? with 2, 3 or 4 directly involved in day to day of the product (I'm just guessing) with no marketing to the users of extras, so the forums tend to be user populated with the occasional post by Cockos when necessary or helpful, means there simply isn't the person-power available to moderate more. It's nearly a full time job on a such an active company support board. Perhaps if Cockos hires an office person for something they've been handling themselves they can have them lightly moderate the forums as well. But to go from here to more moderated would cost time and money, and I'm happy they choose to spend it elsewhere (even if the Lounge is one of the off-topic forums anywhere most in need of moderation, at least it was before I bailed. But that's the risk taken anywhere when opening an OT forum.)
It is not at all uncommon practice for boards to be moderated by volunteers, so that is a possibility. I personally think the current system works quite well, surprisingly. I've been on far, far worse boards (unfortunately). Most people here are very helpful and I see almost no rudeness, at least to any concerning degree. It's going to happen from time to time though.. you can't get all bent out of shape if one or two people get out of line here and there. I mean.. you can, but you'd be making a mountain out of a molehill, imo. That said, I'm not close to a long termer here, so I concede some of you have been here long enough to have had enough from "the usual suspects".

Anyways, Cockos.. keep all your money tied up in development If this board needs moderation though, I guarantee you can find people to do it for free. however, as I said earlier in this thread, that always sounds like a great idea on the surface. I've seen that stir up a lot of drama too, as sometimes you get the opposite problem.. over moderation. And god forbid you'd over moderate an American! :P (I kid, I kid)
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Old 12-04-2019, 08:25 AM   #137
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It is not at all uncommon practice for boards to be moderated by volunteers, so that is a possibility.
As far as I know it already is, see the moderators list. Except I don't know if all of them, have mod rights for the entire forum, some are for sub forums those users suggested, then subsequently manage:

https://forum.cockos.com/showgroups.php

I do know they try really hard (cockos) to urge participants to police themselves and only moderate heavyily when they have no other choice. I have seen that taken advantage of though at times. However, call people names and insult them personally very much and they'll get banned temporarily at first and if it continues it becomes permanent, seen that quite a few times. Name calling seems to be a ban trigger which I obviously agree with.
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Old 12-04-2019, 08:31 AM   #138
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tbh the premise of this post is something the internet doesnt need more of
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Old 12-04-2019, 08:33 AM   #139
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As far as I know it already is, see the moderators list. Except I don't know if all of them, have mod rights for the entire forum, some are for sub forums those users suggested, then subsequently manage:

https://forum.cockos.com/showgroups.php

I do know they try really hard (cockos) to urge participants to police themselves and only moderate heavyily when they have no other choice. I have seen that taken advantage of though at times. However, call people names and insult them directly very much and they'll get banned temporarily at first and if it continues it becomes permanent, seen that quite a few times.
Ahh OK, that to me is generally a good way to go about it. Unfortunately, posts will sneak through from time to time that people are offended by. The thing is, what offends a handful of people isn't necessarily going to be the same as what offends the majority of people. It's not easy to moderate, and you get a lot of bickering about that with one side pulling towards "you need to rid the forum of these posts" and the other side "you need to let me say what I want". As long as they do well to keep personal attacks under control, I think that system works. I'm surprised there's no "report" button here though, that would help. As someone who has moderated other forums before, it can be hard to catch everything.
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Old 12-04-2019, 09:02 AM   #140
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Ahh OK, that to me is generally a good way to go about it. Unfortunately, posts will sneak through from time to time that people are offended by. The thing is, what offends a handful of people isn't necessarily going to be the same as what offends the majority of people. It's not easy to moderate, and you get a lot of bickering about that with one side pulling towards "you need to rid the forum of these posts" and the other side "you need to let me say what I want". As long as they do well to keep personal attacks under control, I think that system works. I'm surprised there's no "report" button here though, that would help. As someone who has moderated other forums before, it can be hard to catch everything.
There is a report button. Little red triangle.

I use it when I spot spam. Never reported a user though, although one who was insulting me did get banned. Don't know if a mod spotted it or another user reported them.
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Old 12-04-2019, 09:03 AM   #141
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Reaper sucks - making me nervous.
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Old 12-04-2019, 09:06 AM   #142
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I am not going to point any fingers, but some of the replies in this thread have been very effective at proving Robert's points about the forum to me, and it has been very frustrating to read some of the replies.

Just as a reminder, here is all the topics/issues that Robert has brought out about REAPER:
Takes, Scripts, Theme, Text Boxes, Routing, Modulation, Helping, COCKOS, Options, Whiners, Instruments, Remote, Hotkeys, ReaPack, Navigator, Monitor FX, Macros, Sample Browsing, NRPN/Sysex, Docking, Envelope Points, Future Looks...
I am not going to point any fingers...



...but bitching about people bitching without addressing any of the points you feel are worth discussing is being the person you dislike.

It's not like this is a feature request, and when you stick "you guys are unhelpful snobs" amongst a load of information, it is human nature to respond to that part.
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Old 12-04-2019, 09:07 AM   #143
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There is a report button. Little red triangle.

I use it when I spot spam. Never reported a user though, although one who was insulting me did get banned. Don't know if a mod spotted it or another user reported them.
Ahh, thanks.. missed that.
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Old 12-04-2019, 09:15 AM   #144
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It's not like this is a feature request, and when you stick "you guys are unhelpful snobs" amongst a load of information, it is human nature to respond to that part.
I'm pretty sure I could literally reword the entire first post, get the exact same issue concerns across and it wouldn't spin for 100+ threads about attitudes and be far more constructive. And... I'll be labelled as offensive but I think "break up letters" in forums are silly, sorry, it's just my opinion because again, they bury the actual need in appeals to emotion, which fuels unnecessary back and forth.
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Old 12-04-2019, 10:42 AM   #145
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It's human nature and it's all relative. Humans are tribal and they do defend what they like, correctly or not, and it all comes down to relativity. Anywhere there's tons of people on a forum there's always going to be some of that.

On the "relatively scale" as relates to defensiveness and unnecessary drama Gearslutz and KVR are probably at the top, or the worst. So many people there think their choices and preferences are the ONLY valid choices and preferences and the defenders think almost all complaints about whatever they love are unwarranted.

All DAW product forums have some of that, some more than others. I can safely say without being wrong that there is a tiny bit more "defensiveness" here than in some other DAW product forums, but they all have "defenders".

One clear notable stand out to that is MOTU Nation, those guys are way out there. If you say you don't like something about DP it's like you raped their sister.

But like someone earlier said, with so many people posting here all day every day, it's unavoidable... and as someone also said, the initial post here appeared to be designed to do exactly that, the way it was worded, to cause a little drama. Airon could have touched on each of those points and not annoyed anyone.

Anywho, there is no perfect DAW. My dream DAW would have Reaper's audio engine, Studio One's UI, Cubase MIDI deepness, Ardour's mixer flexibility and staging, and some other things.

Last edited by Lawrence; 12-04-2019 at 10:53 AM.
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Old 12-04-2019, 03:02 PM   #146
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One clear notable stand out to that is MOTU Nation, those guys are way out there. If you say you don't like something about DP it's like you raped their sister.
Oh my. That's pretty extreme.

(also... totally correct).

If we're going to say all things are relative, and that "that place" is in the mix, then these forums are a 99.99/100. It's easier to just forget they exist as to not throw off the averages
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Old 12-04-2019, 07:50 PM   #147
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lol, only newbies like me will believe and come here for conclusive evidence. then to forward a link to this thread to those who advised REAPER
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Old 12-06-2019, 07:23 PM   #148
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A search on Sucks (Titles) found only 38, though there would be more.. scared to search/know more, but it was funny to, me.
Not counting titles that use the insinuate method...
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Old 12-07-2019, 03:19 AM   #149
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Reaper sucks - making me nervous.
my wife too but I love it.
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Old Yesterday, 03:45 AM   #150
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my wife too but I love it.
Don't worry, it's normal for your wife to make you nervous.
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