Old 02-07-2007, 11:00 AM   #1
funkster1
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Default OT: Anybody here using '64 Studio' Linux Distro?

Well, I'm having a major problem with it. Not technically,
the stuff it has is just working as it should AFAICS, 'Jack' is really terrific, as is 'Ardour'.
But due to having 4 HDD's in my PC, plus 2 Optical drives (CD-RW, DVD-RW) I'm having a major headache with permissions.
My Sample & Recording Drives are owned by 'Root', so I can't change/edit my sample pool or record audio to disk because I'm not allowed to. WTF??? Major pain in the rear like I said.
If anybody could help me out gaining ownership of my HDD's, that would be really, really cool.
I'll offer you a virtual beer (or a real one if you come to my region).

Tia
Raphael
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Old 02-07-2007, 11:18 AM   #2
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Originally Posted by funkster1 View Post
Well, I'm having a major problem with it. Not technically,
the stuff it has is just working as it should AFAICS, 'Jack' is really terrific, as is 'Ardour'.
But due to having 4 HDD's in my PC, plus 2 Optical drives (CD-RW, DVD-RW) I'm having a major headache with permissions.
My Sample & Recording Drives are owned by 'Root', so I can't change/edit my sample pool or record audio to disk because I'm not allowed to. WTF??? Major pain in the rear like I said.
If anybody could help me out gaining ownership of my HDD's, that would be really, really cool.
I'll offer you a virtual beer (or a real one if you come to my region).

Tia
Raphael
Are the drives mounted, or are you trying to record to raw hard drive? If it's to the raw drive, I didn't know that Ardour would do that...

If you're mounting the drives into your filesystem (which would be typical), then you're going to have to set the permissions to allow your username (or group) to access them. To change the permissions you'll need to log in as root, or go to a command prompt and 'su root -' to assume temporary root permissions. You should then be able to change permissions using the 'chmod' and/or 'chown' command.

Let's assume that your /dev/hda2 is mounted at /drive2, and that there are currently no files on that drive. (I hope so, because it's gonna be tedious to work through, otherwise.

chown -R root:users /drive2
chmod -R g=rwx /drive2

The chmod command will change the group ownership of that mount point and all subdirectories to "users", which hopefully your normal account is a member of. The chown command will give the "users" group full read/write permissions to the same group of files/directories. You should then be able to access/create files & directories anywhere in the tree from /drive2 on down.

Couple of points:

If the mount points are owned by root and don't have permissions for other users, you WILL have to get root privileges to change them. If you don't know and can't get the root password, you're kinda out of luck, unless you're feeling 133t today and want to hack the box.

If you are trying to create subdirectories below /dev/hd??, stop...you can't do it. That's a device, not a filesystem. Like trying to write directly to the blocks of the hard drive...bad idea, usually.

If there are other files already on those extra hard drives, and you don't want to globally give away permissions to them, then you can use the commands above on specific subdirectories instead of the entire hard drive's mount point.

ESPECIALLY: Do NOT do this to the root of the filesystem '/'...you will profoundly break your system. The user 'root' is called a "superuser" for a reason...it WILL let you do things that will nuke your system. Use care.

Hope this helps...

Scott
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Old 02-07-2007, 12:07 PM   #3
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Cheers Scott,
thanks very much for your detailed explanation first. Though it doesn't look like I understand half of it, since I'm VERY new to Linux (as you can tell for sure).

The drives in question are: hda5, hdc5, hde5, hdg5 and they're mounted under /media and have been renamed (which Gnome allows).

I'm normally Dual-booting here, so I still have working WinXP DAW installed on the first Partition of the first drive, FS is NTFS. All other drives/partitions are formatted with FAT32 and ext3 for Linux.

I have read a bit in the manual about the 'chown' command, but have not managed yet to succeed.
And indeed, ALL drives contain a fair amount of data already.

hda5 is my temp drive for user files, downloads, docs, mp3 etc.,
hdc5 contains all my projects (be they Reaper, Cubase or eXT related),
hdg5 contains ALL my samples, loops, VSTi data (like RMX .dat file etc, which I can't use anyway under Linux).
hde5 contains my MIDI files, music manuals, config files, patches etc.

I don't know if I can login as root on 64 Studio, since many distros don't allow this. And yes, it seems that the mount points are owned by 'root'.
I'd like to have at least FULL permissions over hda5, hdc5 & hdg5 as I'm often to change or add files on these drives.

I'm trying out diff. distros ATM, since I'd like to leave $MS-BS behind me, but it's really a hard task. Kubuntu for instance handles this more elegant. I was able to grant permissions to those drives no problem. But then it is not made for multimedia work and there are other problems which I won't go into now.

I'll have a further look at the 'chmod' - 'chown' commands to see if I can make it happen.

Cheers
Raphael
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Old 02-07-2007, 09:10 PM   #4
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Hey Scott,

after fooling around with 'root' account, editing /etc/fstab and some more tries to do the 'chown' or 'chmod' command I'm still not getting 100% there.
Whenever I try the 'chown' command, it says for EACH file 'operation not allowed'. However, through editing 'fstab' (adding the options 'rw' for all the partitions) I could at least grant write & execute permissions from the root account to the group 'root'. So I made myself a member of root and can now write to those disks. But now I have an error about a file $home/.dmrc containing some unallowed options and that the user must own the /home dir. Due to this session can not be saved (or something along those lines) on my user account.
Root account works a treat though and is even quite a bit faster it seems. Also Jack reports less CPU usage.
But from what I understand, it's not so good to logon as root. I have a DHCP enabled network card and the PC is continuesly connected to the net. Anyway, I'll find a way to get things working like they should.

Raphael
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Old 02-07-2007, 09:18 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by funkster1 View Post
Hey Scott,

after fooling around with 'root' account, editing /etc/fstab and some more tries to do the 'chown' or 'chmod' command I'm still not getting 100% there.
Whenever I try the 'chown' command, it says for EACH file 'operation not allowed'. However, through editing 'fstab' (adding the options 'rw' for all the partitions) I could at least grant write & execute permissions from the root account to the group 'root'. So I made myself a member of root and can now write to those disks. But now I have an error about a file $home/.dmrc containing some unallowed options and that the user must own the /home dir. Due to this session can not be saved (or something along those lines) on my user account.
Root account works a treat though and is even quite a bit faster it seems. Also Jack reports less CPU usage.
But from what I understand, it's not so good to logon as root. I have a DHCP enabled network card and the PC is continuesly connected to the net. Anyway, I'll find a way to get things working like they should.

Raphael
Get thee behind a firewall...and then fuggedaboudit.

Most of the low-latency patches for the Linux kernel can only take full effect when run as root. (last I remember, anyway).

Scott
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Old 02-07-2007, 10:27 PM   #6
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...
Most of the low-latency patches for the Linux kernel can only take full effect when run as root. (last I remember, anyway).

Scott
That's what I've read as well. Don't know for the firewall though since I can't seem to add repositories to the distro's own package manager (Synaptic). Although specifically mentioned on their website, I can not add i.e. http://ftp.uk.debian.org or whatever repository.
Getting older 'n older just to find out that I've ever to learn more 'n more it seems. But it's getting harder every day.

Anyway, I'm not finished testing diff. distros.
There's JAD coming (Jack Audio Distribution, based on SusE 10.2, first beta available already), Musix, Mubuntu (planned for april or so), Planet CCRMA and counting.

Btw, did I already thank you for your help??? Consider it done now

Raphael
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Old 02-08-2007, 12:29 AM   #7
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my experience:
audio-specified distros are buggy-beta-shit..JAD even didnt recognised my ps2-keyboard, i couldnt login to see what it looks like..
my advice: use some major distribution, i hate to say this - like ubuntu. But i think its fucked to make music with operating system, that cant play mp3 out of the box. So - wait some time, and get PCLinuxOS - the best OS, but now its in new version development period, a lots of audio packages are missing..
http://pclinuxos.com
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Old 02-08-2007, 07:35 AM   #8
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I don't know if I can login as root on 64 Studio, since many distros don't allow this. And yes, it seems that the mount points are owned by 'root'.
Probably not. I've testing out 64studio on my daw, separate from my MS install. It's only on one drive, so I don't have those drive issues.

But, once you log in, and open a terminal, you can 'su' at the prompt, this will log you into the superuser account. Just put in the password you entered when you created the box. You should have been asked for a admin password, then the normal user/password.

Sorry if you already knew that, but it seemed like you wanted to be logged in as root.

FWIW, I've got 64studio playing back on my ESP1010, but haven't recorded yet. It's difficult to get going, not much for help files =).
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Old 02-08-2007, 09:19 AM   #9
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What can I say scum, when you're right, you're right. I've tried quite some (audio) distros already (mostly Live CD's, but that's what they're for, no?), and not ONE of them pleyed nice out of the box.
You can argue that Win systems also need to be tweaked for optimum performance and security, but at least WinXP runs stable out of the box. You can use all your hardware, driver installation is not such a chore and it's by far less complicated to error handling/trouble shooting (although sometimes on Win this can also be a hardcore task, but you get my point I guess).

Whatever Linux disro I have tried, there were always some very basic/fundamental problems, like not be able to use my secondary screen, installing a DSL modem i.e., or even simply configuring PPPoE. And although during the install process you specify locale and keybourd layout, after the first boot (IF it ever boots, because Grub or LiLo can really funk your MBR up) you're thrown back to the distro's default.

Coming from a Win world, these things are already a major hurdle, so trying to get people come to the other side seems a major, and definitely not easy, undertaking.

I for one buy into the whole Open Source, GNU and FREE software stuff, and I really want to try hard to get rid of MS stuff. The money I can get back from selling my software licenses, could be well spent otherwise. And I really don't want to invest into Vista, DRM, TPM or whatever.

Anyway, back to test other alternatives.
Btw, other than my original problem, 64 Studio seems to run just fine. Ardour and Jack play nicely together, Rosegarden seems to work as well (didn't dig too deep yet, but it'll be definitely needed for my MIDI tasks) and there are a few nice synths (ZyAddSubFX, which I already know from my WinXP DAW, is really a great and versatile puppy, my audiocard is recognised well (Delta 1010LT) and EnvyControl24 replaces the M-Audio panel.
Other than that, it seems to have quite a small audio package, and I don't know yet how to SAFELY add other stuff I'd like. It seems that you can't add other epositories to their package manager to download from other sources.

Cheers
Raphael
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Old 02-08-2007, 09:30 AM   #10
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Probably not. I've testing out 64studio on my daw, separate from my MS install. It's only on one drive, so I don't have those drive issues.

But, once you log in, and open a terminal, you can 'su' at the prompt, this will log you into the superuser account. Just put in the password you entered when you created the box. You should have been asked for a admin password, then the normal user/password.

Sorry if you already knew that, but it seemed like you wanted to be logged in as root.

FWIW, I've got 64studio playing back on my ESP1010, but haven't recorded yet. It's difficult to get going, not much for help files =).
Thanks for joining pjk,

well, you CAN logon as 'root' in 64 Studio, but you have to explicitly allow that in the boot/login options, using su.

I have done some test recording today, just to see how it works and SOUNDS. All I can say is, you have to seriously rethink your routing options/habits coming from Win, 'cause Jack just gives you soooooo many options to interconnect apps, it's like day and night. So this needs some thinking ahead. Also, I have the impression that Lunx accesses my hardware at a much profounder level than Win does, so I have some phasing- and other issues with my Delta. And yes I know what you mean, regarding documentation

For many apps there's not even a wiki or online manual. Why can't those *nixers not simply create some pdf files from the existing docs instead of putting all online.

Raphael
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Old 02-08-2007, 12:36 PM   #11
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OK, problems mostly solved.

The boot error has been corrected by changing rights of my user home folder.
I had accidentally granted write permissions for the group, which isn't allowed to do.

For the write permissions to my drives, there's only the projects partition which hasn't got it yet. But now I at least know how to do that;

logon as 'root'
change permissions (give write perm. to 'group')
log off 'root'
logon 'your username'
Voila, no more stories

Cheers
Raphael
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Old 03-12-2007, 12:55 AM   #12
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I just browsed through this thread...
You're really asking for trouble with all the chmodding and running as root, but going into detail about doing it the right way is a little too much for now, since I don't even know what kernel you are using.
However things will get way easier with Ubuntustudio. I'm running Feisty Herd5 at the moment (alpha)... And the Ubuntu Studio package, as well as the packaged low latency kernels are lifesavers. Basically you install the linux-lowlatency and ubuntustudio-audio meta-packages, reboot, and you have an audio workstation with loads of apps and plugins. No need run as root for lowlatency...
That means: from a freshly installed system you open the terminal (Applications-Accesoirs-gnome-terminal), and type "sudo apt-get install linux-lowlatency ubuntustudio-audio" and that's it!

What is getting you into trouble is that you are running a distribution that is being maintained by only a handful of people. Right now there really is no newbie-friendly audio distribution. Ubuntu will need another month, and Suse is the choice for the next weeks , just because of the Jacklab kernel. Gentoo is well suited, but... not newbie friendly.

The best way to solve problems is to register at the forum for your distribution, and ask there. Of course the bigger the userbase, the faster and the plentier the solutions.

My perception is that over the last years Linux has not only become user-friendly, but almost retard-proof. But then I'm using it since 97. Your best bet is to find someone who can help you in person, the next best thing is to adress your questions one at a time at either your distribution's forum, or at linuxquestions.org.

good luck!
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Old 03-12-2007, 03:39 AM   #13
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However things will get way easier with Ubuntustudio. I'm running Feisty Herd5 at the moment (alpha)... And the Ubuntu Studio package, as well as the packaged low latency kernels are lifesavers. Basically you install the linux-lowlatency and ubuntustudio-audio meta-packages, reboot, and you have an audio workstation with loads of apps and plugins. No need run as root for lowlatency...
That means: from a freshly installed system you open the terminal (Applications-Accesoirs-gnome-terminal), and type "sudo apt-get install linux-lowlatency ubuntustudio-audio" and that's it!
This sounds really promising. Do you know if UbuntuStudio is still on track for an April release? There doesn't seem to be any "status" page on their website.

Cheers,

Malcolm.
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Old 03-12-2007, 04:37 AM   #14
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Well... I think the heart of Ubuntu Studio are their meta-packages. -
Meta packeges depend on other packages so you don't have to pick bits and parts of programs by yourself. For example, if you just install ardour, it will not work, you need the jack server. And it takes care of compatibility between the programs/versions.

You don't really need the install-cd, since it's not really a different distribution anyway. It's already in the Feisty Repository, and it's working (not on x86_64 (64 bit archidecture)) so far, but I guess that will be fixed.
It's kind of odd that they don't have an iso out already, but like I said, it's not terribly needed. It saves you a few steps of setting it up, but that's about it.
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Old 03-13-2007, 04:12 AM   #15
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http://www.ubuntu.com/?action=fullse...lsearch=Search
There is no reason not to try it already. I've alredy entirely switched to Feisty. And you can contribute by sending bug reports if something should not work.
Herd5 is currently the latest release. The beta will be coming soon.
I'll really try hard to switch to linux in the studio... Reaper port or no.
It's come to the point where I can hardly justify sacrificing harddisk space for windows.
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Old 03-13-2007, 04:26 AM   #16
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You don't really need the install-cd, since it's not really a different distribution anyway. It's already in the Feisty Repository, and it's working (not on x86_64 (64 bit archidecture)) so far, but I guess that will be fixed.
Thanks for the heads up. I think I'll wait until the Beta is ready, but good to hear that it's still on track.

Cheers,

Malcolm.
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Old 03-13-2007, 06:06 AM   #17
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I just browsed through this thread...
You're really asking for trouble with all the chmodding and running as root, but going into detail about doing it the right way is a little too much for now, since I don't even know what kernel you are using.
I cringed a bit myself... but I think he will be a-ok so long as he doesn;t open the box to the internet (aka, be behind a firewall wilth no ports open to the box) and he is the only user. If the box were open to the outside or had more users than him, I might worry more. However, some services get pissed if you change permissions on certain things like SSH as they self check themselves for security issues and won't start if the permissions to certificates or whatever are funny. Just avoid chmod'ing system stuff like /var /usr /etc /proc /dev etc. I would only mess with your music data partitions/mount points personally.
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Old 03-14-2007, 02:25 AM   #18
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Yeah... As long as you're not doing it on a productive system... chmod is one of the 3 commands that I managed to completely fry my system with. The others are rm and fsck.

Apart from the security issues... Recursively chmodding is pretty tricky if you have linked directories within the directory you are chmodding that you do not want to change permission on. Or even worse if you have a file system mounted in one of the subdirectories.

Last edited by roman; 03-14-2007 at 02:35 AM.
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