Old 12-24-2013, 07:26 AM   #41
EvilDragon
Human being with feelings
 
EvilDragon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Croatia
Posts: 23,326
Default

PC Power&Cooling (if you can get them still) are excellent PSUs. Corsair got them now. Corsair is not bad, either. Seasonic, great, too.
EvilDragon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-24-2013, 07:46 AM   #42
brainwreck
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 20,840
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by EvilDragon View Post
Just doing it and I'm not noticing anything fatigueing. Could be just me?
Or just me. : |
__________________
It's time to take a stand against the synthesizer.
brainwreck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-24-2013, 07:54 AM   #43
DarkStar
Human being with feelings
 
DarkStar's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Surrey, UK
Posts: 18,016
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by EvilDragon View Post
There's never enough USB ports!!!

Also, thin bezel version looks interesting, but it's 1080p so it's a no go unfortunately I'm pretty sure U2412M being 1200p AND pivot rotation definitely influences its price, too. Which I'm happy to pay for, personally.

I have an Acer 21.5" 1080p LCD right now and it's quite mediocre. Dell monitor I'm interested in got rave reviews from what I read, and I also got more than a few first-hand recommendations for that particular model, from people I know that know their hardware. Iiyama isn't a name that's often heard here in Croatia, I must say.
Oops I misread . But here's the U2412M, definitely rotatable:
http://www.scan.co.uk/products/24-de...-height-tilt-s

At one time I did think of having 2 "portrait-mode" screens side by side - that would be a resolution of 2400 * 1920 !

PS My 2 Acer 223W screens are doing fine here (once I had turned down the brightness).
__________________
DarkStar ... interesting, if true. . . . Inspired by ...
DarkStar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-24-2013, 07:59 AM   #44
EvilDragon
Human being with feelings
 
EvilDragon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Croatia
Posts: 23,326
Default

U2412M is the one I'm looking to get, and what I suggested to OP several posts back. Also notice I mentioned that exact model in the post you quoted
EvilDragon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-24-2013, 08:22 AM   #45
SmajjL
Human being with feelings
 
SmajjL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Sweden
Posts: 2,102
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by EvilDragon View Post
U2412M is the one I'm looking to get, and what I suggested to OP several posts back. Also notice I mentioned that exact model in the post you quoted
Woah the price has dropped on those things.. (think, IPS in general)
I would Love some reading about the input-lag if anyone knows anything about that on this model.
The 8ms pixel response is not the same thing. (almost said i don't care, oops)
Just want to know if one can get it "ALL" today or if there is still "always something".. (if Good this! then Bad that.. kinda thing)

ps. i know you know, just saying.
__________________
:)
SmajjL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-24-2013, 08:29 AM   #46
brainwreck
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 20,840
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SmajjL View Post
Just want to know if one can get it "ALL" today or if there is still "always something".. (if Good this! then Bad that.. kinda thing)

ps. i know you know, just saying.
Always something new on the horizon: http://www.extremetech.com/gaming/16...nize-pc-gaming
__________________
It's time to take a stand against the synthesizer.
brainwreck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-24-2013, 08:35 AM   #47
EvilDragon
Human being with feelings
 
EvilDragon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Croatia
Posts: 23,326
Default

Now, how important that G-Sync thingie is outside of gaming world is, of course, questionable...
EvilDragon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-24-2013, 08:42 AM   #48
SmajjL
Human being with feelings
 
SmajjL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Sweden
Posts: 2,102
Default

brain,

lol "tempting" .. *not* (for now)
For a constant FPS feel i am actualy capping my FPS and combine that with ordinary v-sync and that works lovely for me and, it's free.
Specialy in racing sims this is mm-mm-mm.

Edit: to my monitors refreshrate 60hz i might add.

Edit2: Ps, did not mean to shoot your suggestion down like a mercyless hired gun from some western movie.
__________________
:)

Last edited by SmajjL; 12-24-2013 at 09:45 AM. Reason: Bleh.. the off topic-thing again, and this was interesting and i had So! much to say.. :( .. :D
SmajjL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-26-2013, 05:38 AM   #49
vinnie2k
Human being with feelings
 
vinnie2k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Switzerland
Posts: 103
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by EvilDragon View Post
Get two Dell monitors instead of a combo. I recommend U2412M (if you have room for 2x24"). I plan on getting two of them myself at some point. Why? Because they are 1920x1200, which is MUCH better than 1920x1080, especially for DAW work. WT Imperial theme, here I come! (Also it's an IPS matrix.)

Regarding optical drives: LGs are noisy. Get Samsung or something.

For hard drives I much prefer WD Black over Seagate and Samsung/Intel over any other regarding SSD.
Point taken on 1920x1200 instead of 1080, even if it does add quite a bit of money to my already overextended budget :-) I switched to Asus 24", a bit cheaper than the Dell you mention.
Point taken on optical drive, switched to Asus.
WD Black are very expensive compared to the Seagate but I know they're good :-) I can afford to switch to Caviar Blue instead of Black.

Thanks for the tips, I'll post the updated build once I'm done reading all the comments :-)
__________________
vinnie2k, n00b | How Audio Works | "Better finished than perfect" Yem
vinnie2k is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-26-2013, 05:44 AM   #50
EvilDragon
Human being with feelings
 
EvilDragon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Croatia
Posts: 23,326
Default

Black only. Forget about Blue (the difference was quite obvious for me, I had both). Asus displays aren't as good as Dells, from what I've seen and read. If you can't afford a Dell, try Samsung and LG, but definitely go with 1200p if you can find them.


Sometimes it's better to save up a bit extra than to pick out lesser components...

Last edited by EvilDragon; 12-26-2013 at 05:49 AM.
EvilDragon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-26-2013, 05:46 AM   #51
vinnie2k
Human being with feelings
 
vinnie2k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Switzerland
Posts: 103
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DigiDis View Post
Why are you getting 1 stick of memory? I would get 2x8gb of memory. If you plan to OC the hell out of that processor then you need the Noctua. You could also get great results with the Cooler Master EVO 212 for less money. I would not put a lot of trust on the included PSU with that case. PSUs are critical for system stability. I wouldn't get any PSU that wasn't at least rated Bronze and it is better to get a platinum rated PSU. Think Seasonic. Also note that the Samsung EVO SSDs are the best value today.
I switched to 2x4. That's enough for what I need to do, and with 4 slots, I can always go to 16GB later.

No OC planned :-) Which is why I'm wondering if I need to extra Noctua case fan with the water cooling I plan to get (see build later down the thread)?

I did change the case and PSU to Corsair. I must say that I'm writing this on a Sonata III with included PSU and and I never had any issues with it.

I did switch to a Samsung EVO SSD :-)

Thanks for the tips!
__________________
vinnie2k, n00b | How Audio Works | "Better finished than perfect" Yem
vinnie2k is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-26-2013, 05:48 AM   #52
ivansc
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Near Cambridge UK and Near Questembert, France
Posts: 18,941
Default

Agree on WD Black. Great drives.

I have 2 x 23" LG IPS panel monitors which re the same model but I cant get them to setup to be identical in colours, although apart from the b;lue background I use being lighter on one than the other it is o big deal.
And of course they are 1080.
Haven't really had any issues with that, as I put mixer on one screem and main page on the other

Other than the perennial GAS, I have not felt any need to go bigger or better.

And they were just over 100 UK Pounds each.
ivansc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-26-2013, 05:54 AM   #53
vinnie2k
Human being with feelings
 
vinnie2k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Switzerland
Posts: 103
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by EvilDragon View Post
Black only. Forget about Blue (the difference was quite obvious for me, I had both). Asus displays aren't as good as Dells, from what I've seen and read. If you can't afford a Dell, try Samsung and LG, but definitely go with 1200p if you can find them.


Sometimes it's better to save up a bit extra than to pick out lesser components...
You're killing me :-D
__________________
vinnie2k, n00b | How Audio Works | "Better finished than perfect" Yem
vinnie2k is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-26-2013, 05:59 AM   #54
EvilDragon
Human being with feelings
 
EvilDragon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Croatia
Posts: 23,326
Default

You'll say thank you later.
EvilDragon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-26-2013, 06:05 AM   #55
vinnie2k
Human being with feelings
 
vinnie2k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Switzerland
Posts: 103
Default

Here's the current build:

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant / Benchmarks

CPU: Intel Core i7-4770 3.4GHz Quad-Core Processor ($249.99 @ Microcenter)
CPU Cooler: Thermaltake Water 2.0 Performer 81.3 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler ($69.99 @ SuperBiiz)
Motherboard: Gigabyte GA-H87-D3H ATX LGA1150 Motherboard ($100.24 @ Amazon)
Memory: Crucial Ballistix Elite 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($79.99 @ Amazon)
Storage: Samsung 840 EVO 120GB 2.5" Solid State Disk ($88.99 @ Amazon)
Storage: Western Digital Caviar Black 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($87.98 @ SuperBiiz)
Case: Corsair 330R ATX Mid Tower Case ($100.07 @ TigerDirect)
Case Fan: Noctua NF-S12B FLX 59.2 CFM 120mm Fan ($21.99 @ Mwave)
Power Supply: Corsair Builder 430W 80+ Bronze Certified ATX Power Supply ($39.99 @ Amazon)
Optical Drive: Asus DRW-24B1ST/BLK/B/AS DVD/CD Writer ($19.98 @ OutletPC)
Operating System: Microsoft Windows 8.1 - 64-bit - OEM (64-bit) ($99.98 @ OutletPC)
Monitor: Dell U2412M 60Hz 24.0" Monitor ($276.11 @ Amazon)
Keyboard: Logitech MK120 Wired Slim Keyboard w/Optical Mouse ($12.98 @ OutletPC)
Total: $1248.28
(Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available.)
(Generated by PCPartPicker 2013-12-26 08:03 EST-0500)

The monitor and disk drives changes really increased the spend, wondering if they're really that necessary for my hobby-type use (see OP). It's so hard to decide whether it is or not *sigh*

Unless I start getting some real mixing gigs...
__________________
vinnie2k, n00b | How Audio Works | "Better finished than perfect" Yem
vinnie2k is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-26-2013, 07:50 AM   #56
vinnie2k
Human being with feelings
 
vinnie2k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Switzerland
Posts: 103
Default

After looking up distributors in Switzerland, it looks like certain parts are harder to get / really more exepensive / not sure if the models are the same.

As a result, here's the latest build, for CHF 1339 @digitec.ch:

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant / Benchmarks

CPU: Intel Core i7-4770 3.4GHz Quad-Core Processor ($249.99 @ Microcenter)
CPU Cooler: Corsair H55 57.0 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler ($54.99 @ Amazon)
Motherboard: ASRock H87 Pro4 ATX LGA1150 Motherboard ($92.98 @ SuperBiiz)
Memory: Crucial Ballistix Elite 4GB (1 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($44.98 @ OutletPC)
Memory: Crucial Ballistix Elite 4GB (1 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($44.98 @ OutletPC)
Storage: Samsung 840 EVO 120GB 2.5" Solid State Disk ($88.99 @ Amazon)
Storage: Western Digital Caviar Black 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($87.98 @ SuperBiiz)
Case: Corsair 330R ATX Mid Tower Case ($100.07 @ TigerDirect)
Case Fan: Noctua NF-S12B FLX 59.2 CFM 120mm Fan ($21.99 @ Mwave)
Power Supply: Corsair Builder 430W 80+ Bronze Certified ATX Power Supply ($39.99 @ Amazon)
Optical Drive: Asus DRW-24F1ST DVD/CD Writer ($19.99 @ Newegg)
Operating System: Microsoft Windows 8.1 - 64-bit - OEM (64-bit) ($99.98 @ OutletPC)
Monitor: Dell U2412M 60Hz 24.0" Monitor ($276.11 @ Amazon)
Keyboard: Logitech MK120 Wired Slim Keyboard w/Optical Mouse ($12.98 @ OutletPC)
Total: $1236.00
(Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available.)
(Generated by PCPartPicker 2013-12-26 09:46 EST-0500)

CHF 1339 = USD 1494. partspicker.com has the best price match at USD 1276. That's over USD 200 more for the same stuff. FML (L = Location :-))
__________________
vinnie2k, n00b | How Audio Works | "Better finished than perfect" Yem
vinnie2k is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-26-2013, 11:07 AM   #57
DigiDis
Human being with feelings
 
DigiDis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 289
Default

I wonder why you are going for "extreme" cooling. Technically the included cpu cooler is more than enough. It might get a little loud when the CPU is running at >50% but then again it will be in a quiet case. If you want really quiet and lower temperatures you should just get the Coolermaster Hyper 212 EVO cpu cooler. Trust me, it is the best bang for the buck CPU cooler out there. And you won't need the extra case fan as the two included with the 330R are just fine. I would spend the saved money on a slightly better PSU. The Corsair CX series is OK but I think the Seasonic G450 would be a much better choice.

Edit: By the way, if you want to save some money, get a Seagate 7200.14 Barracuda instead of the WD Black. Seagate got a bad rap a few years ago but their current DHs are just as good and reliable as the WD Blacks are today. If anything, Seagate has upped their quality and it seems WD has fallen a bit. If money is no issue get the WD Black, but the current Barracudas are just fine.

Last edited by DigiDis; 12-26-2013 at 11:18 AM.
DigiDis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-26-2013, 12:49 PM   #58
bluzkat
Human being with feelings
 
bluzkat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 6,919
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DigiDis View Post
Why are you getting 1 stick of memory? I would get 2x8gb of memory.
Someone else noticed!!

To the OP if you are having problems with Kontakt and Alchemy I would add as much RAM as possible (its relatively cheap, you know!). I would think your lack of RAM was more of a problem with Alchemy and Kontakt and not so much CPU.

I would get a minimum of 16GB, more likely 32GB. YMMV


__________________
Peace...
bluzkat
bluzkat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-27-2013, 04:02 AM   #59
vinnie2k
Human being with feelings
 
vinnie2k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Switzerland
Posts: 103
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bluzkat View Post
Someone else noticed!!

To the OP if you are having problems with Kontakt and Alchemy I would add as much RAM as possible (its relatively cheap, you know!). I would think your lack of RAM was more of a problem with Alchemy and Kontakt and not so much CPU.

I would get a minimum of 16GB, more likely 32GB. YMMV


When my machine was stuttering while rendering the 70+ tracks I had, I checked my RAM and it was just fine. The CPU, on the other hand... I am getting 2x4, and with 4 slots, I can always add the other 2x4 or upgrade to 4x8 if needed.
__________________
vinnie2k, n00b | How Audio Works | "Better finished than perfect" Yem
vinnie2k is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-27-2013, 04:39 AM   #60
vinnie2k
Human being with feelings
 
vinnie2k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Switzerland
Posts: 103
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DigiDis View Post
I wonder why you are going for "extreme" cooling. Technically the included cpu cooler is more than enough. It might get a little loud when the CPU is running at >50% but then again it will be in a quiet case. If you want really quiet and lower temperatures you should just get the Coolermaster Hyper 212 EVO cpu cooler. Trust me, it is the best bang for the buck CPU cooler out there. And you won't need the extra case fan as the two included with the 330R are just fine.
I'm still asking myself the question. While tracking, the PC won't ever be running at >50% CPU, I can be almost 100% sure of that. Mixing is another story but then I won't need the silence :-) I am leaning towards getting rid of the extra cooling for now - I can always add it later if I notice my CPU is getting too hot too often.

If I get rid of the extra CPU cooling, do you think I still need the extra case fan?

Quote:
I would spend the saved money on a slightly better PSU. The Corsair CX series is OK but I think the Seasonic G450 would be a much better choice.
G-450 (SSR-450RM Active PFC), is it this one you're talking about?
http://www.seasonic.com/product/pc_retail.jsp
I couldn't find it at first, it's under "Retail" and not under "PC-ATX" :-)

Quote:
Edit: By the way, if you want to save some money, get a Seagate 7200.14 Barracuda instead of the WD Black. Seagate got a bad rap a few years ago but their current DHs are just as good and reliable as the WD Blacks are today. If anything, Seagate has upped their quality and it seems WD has fallen a bit. If money is no issue get the WD Black, but the current Barracudas are just fine.
I had the Barracuda in there but EvilDragon seemed adamant about the WD Blacks :-) The latest figures I found were returns (not failures) from 2012 and both Seagate and WD were close at around 1.4-1.5%. I write this on two RAID1 mirror 7200.11 and I'm doing fine (hope I'm not jinxing myself...). The WD warranty is longer at 5 years; I checked it on the WD site http://support.wd.com/warranty/polic...pe=end&lang=en and of course, it's full of limitations :-) The performance seems to be better with Seagate's drives (http://www.hardware-revolution.com/b...september-2013, no source cited), and with better prices... I guess I'll have to switch back to Barracuda unless EvilDragon comes up with some ace up his sleeve :-D
__________________
vinnie2k, n00b | How Audio Works | "Better finished than perfect" Yem
vinnie2k is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-27-2013, 05:27 AM   #61
DigiDis
Human being with feelings
 
DigiDis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 289
Default

You can build the computer with the included heatsink and then if it bothers you or if it gets too hot then get that Coolermaster I suggested. You probably won't need an extra case fan, but it is very easy to add more to that case afterwards if you discover you need more ventilation. For the PSU, that is the right one.

As for the WD HD, it is a generalization based on a long history. For a long time Seagate had some issues and developed a bad reputation and the current drives always will be judged on the past drives' reliability. It's a shame because the current Barracudas are really good, fast, and cheap. For a while WD has had a good reputation and their current drives carry that with them, even if there are now a lot of WD drives failing, especially the green series. I think the WD Blacks might be a little bit better made, but it doesn't warrant the big difference in price between it and the Barracuda. Realistically, you will have to back up either one. For the cost of 1 Black you can almost get 2 Barracudas and use 1 as a backup. You will still need to get something to back up a Black if you go that route. All HDs will fail, its just a question of when.
DigiDis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-27-2013, 05:50 AM   #62
EvilDragon
Human being with feelings
 
EvilDragon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Croatia
Posts: 23,326
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by vinnie2k View Post
I guess I'll have to switch back to Barracuda unless EvilDragon comes up with some ace up his sleeve :-D
5 years warranty with WD Blacks. I think Barracudas are 2 or 3. Don't quote me on that.
EvilDragon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-28-2013, 02:23 AM   #63
vinnie2k
Human being with feelings
 
vinnie2k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Switzerland
Posts: 103
Default

I back up my system to an external drive and my data to the cloud every 15 minutes. At some point when I can save up some money I'd like to buy a small NAS system (Synology DS213j), backup my audio files there and then back that up to the cloud.
__________________
vinnie2k, n00b | How Audio Works | "Better finished than perfect" Yem
vinnie2k is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 07:33 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions Inc.