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Old 10-20-2016, 05:48 AM   #1
midiman007
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Default MIDI Notes not displaying properly in MIDI editor (FIXED)

Here are two screen shots of what I am seeing. I noticed this in 5.26. If I am doing something incorrect please let me know but I think there is a bug.

Hope these screen shots are better

Last edited by midiman007; 11-29-2018 at 11:39 AM.
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Old 10-20-2016, 06:44 AM   #2
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ALT+5 might help
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Old 10-20-2016, 06:53 AM   #3
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Originally Posted by midiman007 View Post
Here are two screen shots of what I am seeing. I noticed this in 5.26. If I am doing something incorrect please let me know but I think there is a bug.

Hope these screen shots are better
Ok this was dragged and dropped from EZdrummer in reaper at bar 18. Which is showing up at note position 17 in reaper.

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Last edited by midiman007; 11-29-2018 at 11:39 AM.
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Old 10-20-2016, 07:05 AM   #4
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ALT+5 might help
Thanks but it did not work.

What it appears to me is that the midi editor is not able to is display the note if it is on the very first beat of a measure.

Also that the midi editor has the timing of the measures of the notes off.
It should be measure 18.01 for that note not 17.01.

Hope this helps and gets fixed.
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Old 10-20-2016, 02:02 PM   #5
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Could you perhaps post larger screenshots?
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Old 10-20-2016, 02:08 PM   #6
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Yeah sorry, those screenshots are impossible to see.
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Old 10-20-2016, 02:23 PM   #7
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Yeah and instead of attaching screenshots to a post, upload them to imgur or something, then post the link here.
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Old 10-20-2016, 05:23 PM   #8
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Yeah and instead of attaching screenshots to a post, upload them to imgur or something, then post the link here.
I tried to upload bigger files before this info but the system will not allow anything bigger than 800x600. Thanks for the info.

Here is the link

http://imgur.com/a/tCW9x

Sorry the images are reversed below draggd them in

Screen 1 show the tcp windows showing the note before the scroll bar.
Screen 2 shows the midi editor not showing the note
Screen 3 is the next note on bar 19.01 Which shows as 18.01.

Here is when I move the bar to the left and show the note that is not showing on bar 18.1.00 which is showing as 17.1:00

http://imgur.com/a/qRapy

The midi file was dragged from ezdrummer midi file browser menu to bar 18 from the beginning of composition.

I hope this helps you guys.

Last edited by midiman007; 10-20-2016 at 05:33 PM.
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Old 10-21-2016, 12:49 AM   #9
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(grin) you have set the midi track you are working on to display diamonds instead of actual notes. which is great if you are working on drums (what it is intended for) but not so good for anything else.
Re-set it and you will be good to go.
And download the user guide if you didnt already.
Also I am pretty sure this is covered extensively in one of the free tutorial videos on the front page here.
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Old 10-21-2016, 02:28 AM   #10
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But... these are drums. Also, why would the note shape have an influence on whether a note is displayed in the same measure as in arrange view?

I have no idea what is happening there, seems as if measure numbers don't properly line up between arrange and piano roll for some reason.
Would you mind to attach that project file to a post of yours, so we can have a better look at what's happening?
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Old 10-21-2016, 03:26 AM   #11
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Confirmed
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Old 10-21-2016, 04:02 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ivansc View Post
(grin) you have set the midi track you are working on to display diamonds instead of actual notes. which is great if you are working on drums (what it is intended for) but not so good for anything else.
Re-set it and you will be good to go.
And download the user guide if you didnt already.
Also I am pretty sure this is covered extensively in one of the free tutorial videos on the front page here.
That is because they are drums, and I like seeing my drums as triangles, but anyway here it is which is a normal note.

http://imgur.com/a/hCR7P

As I have said before it did not work either. It still did not show the missing note.

User guides do not help if there are bugs in the program that do not display the correct info. Grin.
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Old 10-21-2016, 04:06 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by gofer View Post
But... these are drums. Also, why would the note shape have an influence on whether a note is displayed in the same measure as in arrange view?

I have no idea what is happening there, seems as if measure numbers don't properly line up between arrange and piano roll for some reason.
Would you mind to attach that project file to a post of yours, so we can have a better look at what's happening?
No Offense to anyone but here is my issue I do in a way since I do not know who you are.

These are my compositions files. Not some rip of some one else's stuff.
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Old 10-21-2016, 04:12 AM   #14
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That's alright. It looked as if the project only contains the offending MIDI you said you dragged out of EZDrummer . A project file you create just for displaying the issue would of course do even better.


Quote:
Originally Posted by noise_construct View Post
Confirmed
Or, even better yet, post a step-by-step procedure to reproduce.

Last edited by gofer; 10-21-2016 at 04:18 AM.
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Old 10-21-2016, 04:18 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gofer View Post
A project file you create just for displaying the issue would of course do even better.

Or post a step-by-step procedure to reproduce.
yes please
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Old 10-21-2016, 04:25 AM   #16
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I bet his missing Note is a little bit in front of the xx measure.
Note ONs viewing as triangle or diamonds would be shown (within the arrange view) until
the regular Note Off event occurs.
And this is of course not the case within the Editor..

I would not call this a bug.. ---if this is the problem.

please attach the midi file from EZ and or your test rpp
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Old 10-21-2016, 04:43 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ELP View Post
I bet his missing Note is a little bit in front of the xx measure.
Note ONs viewing as triangle or diamonds would be shown (within the arrange view) until
the regular Note Off event occurs.
And this is of course not the case within the Editor..

I would not call this a bug.. ---if this is the problem.

please attach the midi file from EZ and or your test rpp
Ok I created another project with that midi file only. Attached is the zip file. Are you guys programmers? I also checked it it has the same issue.

Also is there anyway we can include rar files on the upload zip are much bigger than rar's.

Last edited by midiman007; 11-29-2018 at 11:39 AM.
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Old 10-21-2016, 04:49 AM   #18
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Originally Posted by noise_construct View Post
Confirmed
What does Confirmed mean?
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Old 10-21-2016, 04:51 AM   #19
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That first note (with velocity 35) has a length of 0; but it is odd that it is not displayed at the start of the clip but is displayed at the start of subsequent loops of the clip.

If you change its length, or change its position (e.g. to 1.00.001) it will appear.

Seems like a bug to me. The display should be consistent. But the bigger question is what should Reaper (or any DAW) do with a zero-length note.
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Old 10-21-2016, 04:53 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by midiman007 View Post
Ok I created another project with that midi file only.

Thanks, that demonstrates the issue. The first note in the imported MIDI has a length of zero. When displaying the notes as triangles or diamonds, this results in the first note of the item not being drawn in the editor, though it is drawn in the arrange view.

Zero-length notes are most often unintentional or created by some error, but not technically incorrect MIDI. We can fix this so that the first note is displayed in these situations, but it may be the case that for your particular situation you would prefer to make those notes longer than zero length, which you can do by switching to event list view and editing the length field. That will make the notes visible and editable.
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Old 10-21-2016, 04:54 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkStar View Post
That first note has a length of 0; but it is odd that it is not displayed at the start of the clip but is displayed at the start of subsequent loops of the clip.

If you change its length, or change its position (e.g. to 1.00.001) it will appear.

Seems like a bug to me. The display should be consistent. But the bigger question is what should Reaper (or any DAW) do with a zero-length note.
Thanks for the confirmation.
I just dragged it over from ezdrummer 2 into the open space.
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Old 10-21-2016, 04:56 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by schwa View Post
Thanks, that demonstrates the issue. The first note in the imported MIDI has a length of zero. When displaying the notes as triangles or diamonds, this results in the first note of the item not being drawn in the editor, though it is drawn in the arrange view.

Zero-length notes are most often unintentional or created by some error, but not technically incorrect MIDI. We can fix this so that the first note is displayed in these situations, but it may be the case that for your particular situation you would prefer to make those notes longer than zero length, which you can do by switching to event list view and editing the length field. That will make the notes visible and editable.
I think you should fix it since most people will just drag a midi file over and see this.

It would be easier on other users. I will test my Cubase 8 and see if it also has the same issue.

I left Cubase for Reaper.
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Old 10-21-2016, 04:59 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by schwa View Post
Thanks, that demonstrates the issue. The first note in the imported MIDI has a length of zero. When displaying the notes as triangles or diamonds, this results in the first note of the item not being drawn in the editor, though it is drawn in the arrange view.

Zero-length notes are most often unintentional or created by some error, but not technically incorrect MIDI. We can fix this so that the first note is displayed in these situations, but it may be the case that for your particular situation you would prefer to make those notes longer than zero length, which you can do by switching to event list view and editing the length field. That will make the notes visible and editable.
You are welcome schwa.

Zero-length notes in EZ Drummer 2 might be for accidents that make the drums sound more real.
I am not sure on this.
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Old 10-21-2016, 05:03 AM   #24
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For info: here, zero-length notes at the start of the clip are never displayed (no matter whether rectangles, diamonds or triangles).

My 2p: display them in all cases, then the user can sort out what to do with them.

---------------
Did those zero-length MIDI notes actually trigger anything in EZDrummer? I wonder about what happens in other sample-players too.
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Old 10-21-2016, 05:07 AM   #25
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Zero length notes are valid, though as I said most often unintentional. We often see them in MIDI that was recorded from e-drums. They will trigger a note with most plugins/devices. But they are certainly not common and seeing one at the very start of a MIDI item is extremely uncommon.

Regardless, for the next build, REAPER will display these notes.
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Old 10-21-2016, 05:57 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by schwa View Post
Zero length notes are valid, though as I said most often unintentional. We often see them in MIDI that was recorded from e-drums. They will trigger a note with most plugins/devices. But they are certainly not common and seeing one at the very start of a MIDI item is extremely uncommon.

Regardless, for the next build, REAPER will display these notes.
Thanks.

Now may I ask are you guys the programmers?
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Old 10-21-2016, 06:15 AM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkStar View Post
For info: here, zero-length notes at the start of the clip are never displayed (no matter whether rectangles, diamonds or triangles).

My 2p: display them in all cases, then the user can sort out what to do with them.

---------------
Did those zero-length MIDI notes actually trigger anything in EZDrummer? I wonder about what happens in other sample-players too.
Yes it did an accent on the the shaker. It is very important for EZ drummer
to play like a real person not a machine.

It also is not only not displaying on that bar but not playing the accent also.

This should be normal since it is not displaying the note.

In tech terms, WYSIWYG - what you see is what you get.
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Old 10-21-2016, 06:27 AM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by schwa View Post
Zero length notes are valid, though as I said most often unintentional. We often see them in MIDI that was recorded from e-drums. They will trigger a note with most plugins/devices. But they are certainly not common and seeing one at the very start of a MIDI item is extremely uncommon.

Regardless, for the next build, REAPER will display these notes.
IT would be very nice if you could please reply since I have another bug or real annoyance with the editor and the focus and I would like to address the correct person with this.
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Old 10-21-2016, 06:36 AM   #29
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may I ask are you guys the programmers?
Schwa and Justin are the two developers/programmers.
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Old 10-21-2016, 06:46 AM   #30
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"recorded from e-drums."
within the real device MIDI world such "zero" notes would never result in a zero Note...
at least 0.64-0.96 (with some device much more than 1 milliseconds) from Note On to Note Off.

Zero Notes are of course valid, because ON & Off events are two independent events

but this doesnt mean that viewing zero Note length related to trigger/playing an Instrument with a Note ON|Off trigger is a good way to do/view within the editor,
I personally find zero is somewhat bull....
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Old 10-21-2016, 06:58 AM   #31
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Schwa and Justin are the two developers/programmers.
Thanks for the info. Greatly appreciated.
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Old 10-21-2016, 06:59 AM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ELP View Post
"recorded from e-drums."
within the real device MIDI world such "zero" notes would never result in a zero Note...
at least 0.64-0.96 (with some device much more than 1 milliseconds) from Note On to Note Off.

Zero Notes are of course valid, because ON & Off events are two independent events

but this doesnt mean that viewing zero Note length related to trigger/playing an Instrument with a Note ON|Off trigger is a good way to do/view within the editor,
I personally find zero is somewhat bull....

Not here it is needed for the accent of the shaker.
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Old 10-21-2016, 07:03 AM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by schwa View Post
Zero length notes are valid, though as I said most often unintentional. We often see them in MIDI that was recorded from e-drums. They will trigger a note with most plugins/devices. But they are certainly not common and seeing one at the very start of a MIDI item is extremely uncommon.

Regardless, for the next build, REAPER will display these notes.
Can you guys please fix the focus of the grid in the midi even viewer. After you select the grid type can you please have it move away from that grid.

The reason being is that after I select the grid and hit the space bar to start playing. it just blanks out the grid and does not move off of the grid until I select play with the mouse.

I find this really annoying.

Kind regards.
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Old 10-21-2016, 07:15 AM   #34
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midiman007: Not here it is needed for the accent of the shaker.

EZ is only a plugin and not a device.
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Old 10-21-2016, 07:17 AM   #35
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midiman007: Not here it is needed for the accent of the shaker.

EZ is only a plugin and not a device.
Yes a plugin that uses that missing note to accent the shaker.
To make is sound human not like a machine playing the shaker.
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Old 10-21-2016, 07:27 AM   #36
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yes, yes but the note is not missing.. the zero note is playing...

or go into the listview and you would see your missing zero note at 1.1.0 or open the raw view

It is at the moment only a visual thing for the piano roll & notation view and not a real missing Note event.
So your skaker sounds the same with or without these visual missing note ....
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Old 10-21-2016, 07:34 AM   #37
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That note doesn't need to be zero length to be used as accent, so it is a bit sloppily done by whoever created the file.

Regardless, Reaper should of course handle this case gracefully, in that it should display and transmit the note in a proper way.
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Old 10-21-2016, 07:35 AM   #38
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yes, yes but the note is not missing.. the zero note is playing...

or go into the listview and you would see your missing zero note at 1.1.0 or open the raw view

It is at the moment only a visual thing for the piano roll & notation view and not a real missing Note event.
So your skaker sounds the same with or without these visual missing note ....
This is what I am experiencing, it is not playing when I do not see it.

It is playing, on the next bar when it is showing.

I just listen to it twice. When I expanded the bar to the left and I see it then it plays on bar 18.

Kind Regards
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Old 10-21-2016, 07:46 AM   #39
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Originally Posted by gofer View Post
That note doesn't need to be zero length to be used as accent, so it is a bit sloppily done by whoever created the file.

Regardless, Reaper should of course handle this case gracefully, in that it should display and transmit the note in a proper way.
The file was created by Toon track. There might be a difference in velocity from 0 to 1 which is why it is set to 0. This I do not know.

I do know velocity scales from 0 to 127. Each device or vst can treat that in a different way depending on what it is supposed to trigger.

0 could be one trigger, 1 could be another. That depends on the way the samples are layered. So to say it's sloppy I would not.
It could do a CC function like Kontakt does.

If it was NI battery I could easily see what it was triggering.
Unfortunately in EX Drummer 2 you can not or maybe I am missing something in EZ Drummer that is editable.

Either way your last statement is 100 % correct.
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Old 10-21-2016, 07:50 AM   #40
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Quote:
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Can you guys please fix the focus of the grid in the midi even viewer. After you select the grid type can you please have it move away from that grid.

The reason being is that after I select the grid and hit the space bar to start playing. it just blanks out the grid and does not move off of the grid until I select play with the mouse.
This bug does not yet have its own dedicated thread, but you can track it in Various MIDI editing bugs/faults, or in the Bestiary of MIDI bugs under the MIDI editor window management heading.
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