Old 01-12-2012, 07:56 AM   #1
buckman
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Default Reaper keeps knocking out my Waves Plug ins?

I recently reformatted my old PC Laptop and put Reaper on there as a recorder, and my usual set of Waves plug ins bundle. Its an old bundle as its an old PC and I think its v5.0 which is fine for me.

I've had no problems before but if i launch a Waves plug on a Reaper track, all is fine. If I close Reaper and re-open and come back to Reaper, I get the message "Waveshell not found, please reinstall" or something similar?

Reaper is pointing to my Waves folder fine, but it seems to be when I open Reaper?

I'm using 4.14 on Windows XP. I've never had this before, or could it be a windows / program problem?

Help..
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Old 01-13-2012, 04:15 AM   #2
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I had this issue using both waveshell v4 and waveshell v5.
The same thing.
Did you know Waves don`t support Reaper officially?
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Old 01-13-2012, 05:00 AM   #3
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I'm not convinced its just Reaper? Maybe it is as it doesn't officially support reaper

But even Acid Pro the waves plug ins don't load and it says they are missing and have to be reinstalled?

I've never had this before with v5 Waves? Maybe I should go for v3.5 as its old but maybe has less issues, but still has some of the identical waves processors
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Old 01-13-2012, 05:08 AM   #4
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What XP patch level? (SP1,2,3)

http://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=43067
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Old 01-13-2012, 05:25 AM   #5
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Reaper 32bit on old p4 1.7ghz windows xp with SP2.

This has worked fine before?

One thing which is unrelated just CPU wise, is that Acid Pro beats Reaper on this system for number of tracks without hiccups which surprised me!

Acid pro 3 or 4 can run about 90 audio tracks on this pc with only 768mb ram installed as its old from around 2001!

Would this be down to acid being older software and better suited to this old processor and reaper has moved on and updated over the years?

Looks like on this laptop im better off with Acid Pro 4?
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Old 01-13-2012, 05:37 AM   #6
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Ollie
This thread is great! Thanks!

buckman
Maybe you`d better find a substitute for Waves plugins if you want to contitue with Reaper. There`s no chance Waves will support Reaper in near future. Stability and reliability not guaranteed.
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Old 01-13-2012, 05:41 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buckman View Post

This has worked fine before?
What did you change? If it's only REAPER, does it still work with the version that used to work?

Quote:
Originally Posted by buckman View Post
One thing which is unrelated just CPU wise, is that Acid Pro beats Reaper on this system for number of tracks without hiccups which surprised me!

Acid pro 3 or 4 can run about 90 audio tracks on this pc with only 768mb ram installed as its old from around 2001!

Would this be down to acid being older software and better suited to this old processor and reaper has moved on and updated over the years?

Yes. These old CPUs are generally not so happy about DAWs with a 64-bit audio engine like REAPER.
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Old 01-13-2012, 05:44 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Megabass View Post
There`s no chance Waves will support Reaper in near future.
Do you know something I don't? Spill it!
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Old 01-13-2012, 05:47 AM   #9
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Thanks Ollie, yes I'm not sure what I've changed tbh? Weird??!

Anyway thanks for your input on acid vs reaper. I was shocked but maybe your right as my computer is old it may want to stay at 2001 level and stick with Acid Pro from around the same time

As Reaper has updated to 64 bit engine then that would be why it sometimes stutters on just one track let alone 90!

At least I know to maybe forget Reaper on this system unfortunately unless I can get an old reaper say v3.0? Is it worth going back to something like this or sticking with Acid Pro?
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Old 01-13-2012, 05:57 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ollie View Post
Do you know something I don't? Spill it!
I`m just a poor Waves customer for about 9 years and I know enough about their unshakeable top-notch snobbery.
I think Reaper must cost 500$ or more to merit The Merciful Godlike Attention of Waves Support.
I abandoned my hope many bucks ago.
...but I don`t want to start another Waves thread!

buckman
I think 64 bit engine doesn`t matters. You can set Reaper`s inner mixing resolution to 16 or 24 bit in Project Settings.
Going backward to older versions for compatibility? I don`t think it`s the best solution. Maybe it will be better to upgrade your machine or use working setup without changing anything.
But I`m maybe wrong because my main workstation is 5 years-old PC and it`s still working so I don`t plan to upgrade it...

Last edited by Megabass; 01-13-2012 at 06:14 AM.
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Old 01-13-2012, 06:17 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buckman View Post
As Reaper has updated to 64 bit engine then that would be why it sometimes stutters on just one track let alone 90!

At least I know to maybe forget Reaper on this system unfortunately unless I can get an old reaper say v3.0?
REAPER always had a 64-bit audio engine so there's no difference between v3 and v4 in this regard. However, a single track stuttering points to a general problem with REAPER and the system.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Megabass View Post
I`m just a poor Waves customer for about 9 years and I know enough about their unshakeable top-notch snobbery.
Ah sorry to hear that. However, "not officially/actively supported" doesn't necessarily mean "won't work" since there are many REAPER users actually using Waves plug-ins Some versions/packages may cause more trouble than others though.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Megabass View Post
I think 64 bit engine doesn`t matters. You can set Reaper`s inner mixing resolution to 16 or 24 bit in Project Settings.
That's the bit resolution of the audio files, not the audio engine, which can't be changed. REAPER always processes audio internally with 64-bit, regardless of the bit depth of the material to be processed.

Last edited by Ollie; 01-13-2012 at 06:29 AM.
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Old 01-13-2012, 06:52 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ollie View Post
REAPER always had a 64-bit audio engine so there's no difference between v3 and v4 in this regard. However, a single track stuttering points to a general problem with REAPER and the system.


Ah sorry to hear that. However, "not officially/actively supported" doesn't necessarily mean "won't work" since there are many REAPER users actually using Waves plug-ins Some versions/packages may cause more trouble than others though.



That's the bit resolution of the audio files, not the audio engine, which can't be changed. REAPER always processes audio internally with 64-bit, regardless of the bit depth of the material to be processed.
I think with all that above I am best sticking to Acid Pro for multi tracking. I'm not upgrading this laptop as its so old, which is why I always watch the slowest computer to run reaper threads

Now it's official that the 64 bit engine could be my problem, I think running Acid Pro at 90 tracks which to me is still quite staggering considering this pc is 10 + years old !

I'll stick to Acid Pro 3 or 4 depending on which one WASN'T overtaken by Sony!
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Old 01-13-2012, 07:00 AM   #13
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One thing to check carefully is that the samplerate of your audio clips etc match the project samplerate. If not, remember Reaper does the conversion "on the fly", which takes cpu (which is in short supply, sort of).

One track stuttering is a sign of a deeper setup problem. I would get this issue sorted before considering what, if any other problems exist.

What is the fx count like for this one track? Does it do it with no FX? etc.....

cheers,

db
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Old 01-13-2012, 07:08 AM   #14
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Seems issues with Waveshell are quite common.
Quite a few people use the info and utility in the Following forum post to extract the Individual VST.dll's from waveshell and the problems are far fewer then.

Might be worth a go if you have problems in Acid too.

http://forum.cakewalk.com/tm.aspx?m=...e=1&print=true
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Old 01-13-2012, 07:13 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Bob View Post
One thing to check carefully is that the samplerate of your audio clips etc match the project samplerate. If not, remember Reaper does the conversion "on the fly", which takes cpu (which is in short supply, sort of).

One track stuttering is a sign of a deeper setup problem. I would get this issue sorted before considering what, if any other problems exist.

What is the fx count like for this one track? Does it do it with no FX? etc.....

cheers,

db
All the usual windows audio tweaks dOne and when looping audio in reaper it can play fine but then the next loop maybe on the 5th time round jumps and it carries on.

I think the 64bit engine is the killer. I do this in Acid and it's rock solid and glitch free!
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Old 01-13-2012, 08:24 AM   #16
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Ollie,
I thought `Track mixing bit depth` in Project Settings refers to MIXING, not to FILES. HOw could I know?
Manual simply says: "If unsure, leave default settings" lol

And of course you are right again, mr. Smart Cat. Renaissance Bundle works almost fine on my PC, but nobody in Waves support can answer why some older Waves plugins (C series and so on) cause strange stutters and glitches in my Reaper.

buckman,
I`m really sorry for such a rude question, but...
Why don`t you just upgrade your computer?
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Old 01-13-2012, 09:07 AM   #17
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Yeah, you're right "track mixing" bit depth is there now (totally forgot that and misread your post, sorry). All the different bit depth things make my head spin at times. Not sure though if switching that does actually affect CPU (need to test that, played with that option only once to play with lo-fi bit depths)
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Old 01-13-2012, 09:14 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Megabass View Post
buckman,
I`m really sorry for such a rude question, but...
Why don`t you just upgrade your computer?
Not rude at all and a good question

This isn't my main computer, I have a mac running reaper and Ableton, logic etc

This old knackered pc is still surprisingly agile and it just won't die!!

So I feel that I should incorporate it somehow in my studio instead of it being left to rot on the floor!

So I am going to try and use it as a recorder for all my mac plug ins and samples.

Don't ask me why but I have this OCD thing that I like to record from one computer to another in the style of the olden days of tape? Maybe cus then I know a track which is just full of audio files doesnt tax the computer much and has more chance of loading without plug ins automation etc

So I was going to use this as a recorder which acid pro would be fine for

At some point this will die as its over 10 years old now but with no plugs, a couple of programs rrecording audio and an editor, it seems to keep going !

I think it's an OCD thing where I can't have anything lying around not doing anything! It needs to work and earn its place. So I think acid would be best, especially as Reapers 64bit engine is the culprit for some glitching. At least I know it's not me or a tweak I did, so am happier having found that out.
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Old 01-13-2012, 09:42 AM   #19
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This thread is about 1) Waves V5 not working after upgrading to 4.14
2) Old pc, bit depth, etc.

RE: #1) I had the same problem when I went to 4.14. Once I rolled back to 4.0 all was fine. Some other people have mentioned this. Something in 4.14 doesn't like the Waves waveshells, all other plugs are fine...

Duo-core, 4gig sdram, XP 32bit sp2.
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Old 01-13-2012, 09:51 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Richan View Post
This thread is about 1) Waves V5 not working after upgrading to 4.14
2) Old pc, bit depth, etc.

RE: #1) I had the same problem when I went to 4.14. Once I rolled back to 4.0 all was fine. Some other people have mentioned this. Something in 4.14 doesn't like the Waves waveshells, all other plugs are fine...

Duo-core, 4gig sdram, XP 32bit sp2.
Thats interesting Peter, as that would tally up as to why it was all working fine before and I have done nothing, except upgrade to 4.14?!

I think this Waveshells bug needs to be logged with the mods and quick!
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Old 01-13-2012, 11:04 AM   #21
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Default Reaper keeps knocking out my Waves Plug ins?

Listen Waves! Bob and weave... KEEP THOSE GLOVES UP FOOL!!

Sorry... Clubber Lang flashback...

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Old 01-13-2012, 11:06 AM   #22
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I think the answer here then is to roll back to a slightly earlier version of Reaper, ie: 3.11 (which I may have downloaded still on my laptop from a couple of weeks ago) if you want to keep working with Waves Plug ins..

In the meantime, hopefully the dev's will look into this, as this is quite a biggie as alot of users I would think, use Waves plug ins.
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Old 01-13-2012, 04:56 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ollie View Post
REAPER always had a 64-bit audio engine so there's no difference between v3 and v4 in this regard.
Oh really? I thought maybe if I went back to say v3.6 which is a while back before the 64bit mixing engine option that this maybe better just for multi track recording on a P4 xp32
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Old 01-13-2012, 09:42 PM   #24
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I don't miss my waves plugins one bit, that's all I'll say.
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Old 01-13-2012, 11:11 PM   #25
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Buckman, you can download previous versions of REAPER from "Downloads". Might be less compatibility problems if you use, say, v4.10 rather than a v3.xx

A version 3 install might balk at some v4 features...

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Old 01-14-2012, 02:01 AM   #26
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Quote:
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Buckman, you can download previous versions of REAPER from "Downloads". Might be less compatibility problems if you use, say, v4.10 rather than a v3.xx

A version 3 install might balk at some v4 features...

>
Hi I don't mind compromise of v3.5 , say for stability and a lot of CPU as its an older version and I'm using an older computer.

I'm not sure where a big cut off is for when the 64bit stuff came in?

So not bothered about features if it's stable and records multi track.

So either v4 as you say to see if it's a bit leaner, and of not probably v3.5? ( i didn't want to go all the way back to v2?!)

I just want to match the stability and track count of Acid Pro
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Old 01-14-2012, 02:16 AM   #27
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You can change 32/64 bit float mixer in the project settings
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Old 01-14-2012, 02:24 AM   #28
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Quote:
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You can change 32/64 bit float mixer in the project settings
Yes thanks but I think we've established earlier that this isn't the same thing unfortunately
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Old 01-14-2012, 11:58 AM   #29
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Dunno if this will help, but:

While I haven't used any Waves in my Reaper sessions in about 2 years, I USED to use the "Waves Complete" bundle, with NO problems. However, I remember 2 important things:

1: It seems to matter where the waveshell resides. IIRC, I had problems when I used to keep a separate "VST plugins" folder. When I gave up on this and went back to the Steinberg folder, pugins from several manufacturers started behaving better.

2: For some reason, the Waves installer would always put the DX versions on my drive as well as the vst versions, no matter how I set the installer. (A bug that Waves didn't acknowledge or care about.) Reaper did not seem to like this.

Manually dumping any DX Waves plugins, plus the DX waveshell (IIRC) cleared up any remaining problems.
-------------------

Caveat:

I think I stopped using Waves at the same time that I upgraded to Win7 / 64. The above solution was almost definitely with XP. So, who knows .......
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Old 01-16-2012, 01:50 AM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ollie View Post
REAPER always had a 64-bit audio engine so there's no difference between v3 and v4 in this regard.
Doing some tests now with the original v4.0, and going back to 3.6, and it maybe a "little" better..

I just wanted to check with regarding the bit depth and mix engine mix ups in this thread whether your right on all versions of Reaper v2, v3, v4. etc are all 64-bit and this maybe my downfall whatever version I try?

My spec is (which is why it grumbles as 2012 64-bit mix engines and the like!) :

Intel Pentium 4-M CPU 1.70Ghz (from 2001/2002 so its I guess a single core?!)
768mb RAM
Windows XP Professional SP2
40Gb HDD

I think I'm probably better off on Acid Pro from around 2001 on this machine?? yes?

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Old 01-16-2012, 09:17 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buckman View Post

My spec is (which is why it grumbles as 2012 64-bit mix engines and the like!) :

Intel Pentium 4-M CPU 1.70Ghz (from 2001/2002 so its I guess a single core?!)
768mb RAM
Windows XP Professional SP2
40Gb HDD

I think I'm probably better off on Acid Pro from around 2001 on this machine?? yes?

wtf! my door stop isn't working with reaper, I think there's a bug with reaper.
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Old 01-16-2012, 09:40 PM   #32
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Is that a hard rubber door stop or a newish elastomer door stop? 32 or 64 inch? Can you upload an example door or post a link to it?

Please note that 64 inch doorstops need wider doors, otherwise you cannot open them wide enough, slowing down passage times considerably. Also, although REAPER is compatible with cork and improvised beer coaster stops, stability may not be entirely satisfactory. Sorry for the inconvenience!
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Old 01-16-2012, 09:49 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buckman View Post
Doing some tests now with the original v4.0, and going back to 3.6, and it maybe a "little" better..

I just wanted to check with regarding the bit depth and mix engine mix ups in this thread whether your right on all versions of Reaper v2, v3, v4. etc are all 64-bit and this maybe my downfall whatever version I try?
All REAPER versions process audio with 64-bit internal precision and all 64-bit engine DAWs will run slower on that computer than their 32-bit counterparts in theory, if that could be compared directly and not apples to door stops.

However that costs only some performance and if that computer has a problem running REAPER at all (that and some simple recording/playback works on a PII-400MHz) it may have a problem running something else as well.
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Old 01-17-2012, 01:18 AM   #34
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Stop panicking guys, it was a simple question as Reaper does state it will work on a W98se machine (but not supported) and some users are getting away with lo spec laptops.

I've dropped this now and gone onto a MacBook pro i7 so all good
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Old 01-17-2012, 01:57 AM   #35
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I'm sure after some thorough research it will turn out to be something quite simple and obvious causing the problem. There are a few threads about similar laptop woes and you could try the usual things recommended in pretty much all of them (disable onboard devices, run dpc checker, check disk transfer mode...)

Code:
laptop stutter site:http://forum.cockos.com
Maybe it's an easy fix, that laptop won't run a pro VSTi movie score orchestra but it could still be a nice 4-track replacement/single VSTi-host/many cool things etc.
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Old 01-25-2012, 10:50 AM   #36
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Just had a thought on this and I suppose anyone using a lower spec laptop from years back

Isn't there a preferences setting that I just remember that takes you into another window regarding CPUs , number of cores etc?

Maybe I should put all these to the lowest setting? For low spec CPU

Only just remembered this and sure I didn't dream it?

EDIT : I think this is the Advanced UI / System settings, and it does have some specific tweaks for W2000 / XP (for us older computers)

Not sure what to tick or the "CPU number (1?)
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