Old 11-24-2018, 07:52 PM   #1
Eddy
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Default binaural headphone mix workflow needed

Hi, I have just done a 4-channel installation and now have a binaural headphone piece for the same visual artist.

What is the workflow you would use for taking a mutitrack reaper project into a binaural headphone space? From looking at this forum it seems

Reaper > ambisonic > binaural/whatever ie mix into Ambisonic and then convert. Is that the normal method? If so, what would be the cheapest effective toolset to get that job done? I would prefer being able to dynamically move the sound objects and fields with an effective interface if possible.

Or for my current project would something like the Sennheiser AMBEO Orbit binaural plugin be about as good as it gets for binaural?



thanks for any help

Last edited by Eddy; 11-24-2018 at 08:31 PM.
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Old 11-25-2018, 03:51 AM   #2
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Hi, Eddy
Binaural and Ambisonic are very huge topic. It won't hurt to do some preparation phase and read about it (if you have not already).

about HRTFs:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Head-r...nsfer_function
simply put, when you listen music on headphones your sound field is unique and separate for each ear, but if you listen on monitors your sound field is connected - each ear hears the signal of each monitor (with headphones is not like that).

To start with Binaural free plugins:
http://anaglyph.dalembert.upmc.fr/ (uses .sofa file format which can be downloaded free of charge)
I see you know about Ambeo, but check out one of the best in the game and VR development Oculus Ambisonic it is free:
https://developer.oculus.com/downloa...-starter-pack/ beware this is 5GB download!!!

More from Oculus:
https://developer.oculus.com/downloads/audio/

The best for binaural mixing is Oculus Spatializer, but you might be interested in Oculus Ambisonics Starter Pack, Oculus Audio Loudness Meter, Oculus Audio Pack 1, Oculus Audio Profiler for Windows as well.

Take a pick at myBino. It is phenomenal free plugin: http://www.cmap.polytechnique.fr/xaudio/mybino/
audio-video demo: https://youtu.be/HdC4RfZKOOo

The not so expensive plugins: Panagement, TB Isone

The expensive suspects: Harpex, dearVR, Waves Nx, Blue Ripple, Spatial Audio Designer, etc.

Ambisonic explained:
https://www.waves.com/ambisonics-exp...ound-engineers

To start with free plugins for Ambisonic:
http://www.blueripplesound.com/products/o3a-core

http://www.matthiaskronlachner.com/?p=2015

Standard stereo mixes (and surround) achieve that with Reverb (although it is used mostly as an acoustic simulation of real environment). Thus they sound plausible on headphones as well if done right.

4-channel installation (quad) or First order Ambisonic (or B-format).
Binaural is usually 2-channel (microphone pair to represent the pair of ears we all have).

Binaural is ideal for real environment recordings where real objects produce the sound. Ambisonic is better used for virtual environment simulations like VR, 3D sound design, video games, 360 video renderings. Although nothing stops you from recording real objects with Ambisonic (good luck though, it is not cheap).

After all at the end of the day we all put our pair headphones and try to enjoy the mix.

Good luck!

Last edited by adXok; 11-25-2018 at 04:09 AM.
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Old 11-25-2018, 04:22 AM   #3
Eddy
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thanks for that great information adXok - looks like I can go straight to binaural this time but I will have a look at everything you link to and mention so that I have an understanding of what I amc hoosing.

Really appreciate your efforts in helping me
all the best, Eddy
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Old 11-25-2018, 05:07 PM   #4
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You could also use the free IEM Plugin Suite and use the RoomEncoder to create some early reflections, which helps externalization. Then use the BinauralDecoder to create your binaural signals.
https://plugins.iem.at
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Old 11-26-2018, 03:37 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RDan View Post
You could also use the free IEM Plugin Suite and use the RoomEncoder to create some early reflections, which helps externalization. Then use the BinauralDecoder to create your binaural signals.
https://plugins.iem.at
thanks for that one as well - will test it tomorrow but looks very good. And at a price I can afford
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Old 12-02-2018, 08:36 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adXok View Post
Although nothing stops you from recording real objects with Ambisonic (good luck though, it is not cheap).
With the new Zoom H3-VR it may not cost a lot more than a good binaural recording... and it does also binaural :
https://www.zoom-na.com/products/fie...handy-recorder
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Old 12-06-2018, 01:34 PM   #7
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Maybe, because it is around $350 (US dollars).
Has a direct Line out signal, which am not sure how will that translate into separate channels 1st order (quadro mic or B-format). Maybe they provide a dedicated cable as well or internal decoder thru USB (driver, latency?).

Batteries? Power supply. Many of those things matter even more than a cable or decoder. Cheap price comes with a reason.
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Old 12-06-2018, 02:29 PM   #8
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Oh, it works. According to several people on the Ambisonics mailing list. There are a few complaints, like the mics attachment being not too sturdy. And the software being a bit rough on the edges. You don't need to use that software. Plenty of other software around and I'm sure Zoom will update it. But the recordings are OK and the preamps too.

It's not the cheapest one, btw. There's a Chinese handheld that's around 150$, but I forgot the name and I haven't seen it available anywhere. What I saw was a bit meager on detail too...
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Old 12-07-2018, 12:17 AM   #9
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It is Twirling720.
I have the "Lite" version that works well with a smartphone or a tablet : it is very light and small that makes a perfect portable solution.
But the mic quality... it needs a ton of EQ to make it acceptable :-(
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Old 12-07-2018, 12:27 AM   #10
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To adXok : about the battery in the H3-VR, it is even more economic than the H2n. I think you can last a day with 2 AA !

The line out and phone can be set to provide stereo mix or a binaural one for monitoring.
Of course, you won't use it for ambisonics ;-)

But since it can work as a soundcard, you can use it in realtime with a computer through USB with either the A-Format (when they will provide a plugin version of their converter) or the B-Format that you can decode as you want.
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Old 12-07-2018, 01:42 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jm duchenne View Post
It is Twirling720.
I have the "Lite" version that works well with a smartphone or a tablet : it is very light and small that makes a perfect portable solution.
But the mic quality... it needs a ton of EQ to make it acceptable :-(
Thanks for refreshing my memory

Easy modding of the mics possible? Maybe Primo electrets?

I'm looking for a very portable solution, preferably with an iphone. I'd get a Zoom, but I'm certain I won't have it with me when I need it

The phone is always with me and a small extra maybe would work...
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Old 12-07-2018, 08:12 AM   #12
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My H3-VR will be here tomorrow, I'm going to use it with a GoPro Fusion 360 - the Fusion already has ambix spatial audio - I tested it's spatial audio last night and I can export and upload to youtube and as I pan around the room (with mouse on desktop or my body with VR headset) the audio and video follows.

However, the Fusion's mics/audio can't handle a loud live band with the clarity I need with it's cheaper mics and built in limiting/lack of audio controls. So, H3-VR it is. I'll post a video around Monday as I'll be officially testing with 360 video on Sunday. I will say it is encouraging that YT fully supports the 360 stuff I want to do FWIW. The current goal is to track the video and audio, process the video in Davinci Resolve, master the audio in Reaper, merge them and post on YT as 360 VR.

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Old 12-07-2018, 08:22 AM   #13
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Quote:
Has a direct Line out signal, which am not sure how will that translate into separate channels 1st order (quadro mic or B-format).
From my skimming the manual, the headphone out and/or the line out provides stereo or binaural only.

Quote:
Maybe they provide a dedicated cable as well or internal decoder thru USB (driver, latency?).
It's also my understanding that the ASIO driver allows receiving all four channels into Reaper via USB audio - I don't plan on using it that way, I'll be exporting the audio from the SD card, stay tuned.
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Old 12-08-2018, 09:11 PM   #14
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Moved here to it's own thread: https://forum.cockos.com/showthread....86#post2068186

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