Old 09-04-2018, 10:52 AM   #1
Burnsjethro
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Is there any way of lowering all the tracks a couple of decibles without using the master fader? Automation?
Put all the tracks into one folder?

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Old 09-04-2018, 11:48 AM   #2
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Click on the the Fader of Track 1,shift click on the last track. All Tracks are selected. Move one Fader.
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Old 09-04-2018, 01:55 PM   #3
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Sisaso, thank you so much.

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Old 09-04-2018, 02:41 PM   #4
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Here ctrl+A selects all tracks.
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Old 09-05-2018, 02:53 AM   #5
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Thanks Alain
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Old 09-05-2018, 07:03 AM   #6
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As a matter of interest, if I wish to raise the volume of the second part of a song slightly, to add some excitement (hopefully), do I just put my marker in the appropriate place, highlight all the tracks and then "split" (with an S) and then raise a fader?

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Old 09-07-2018, 05:44 AM   #7
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I am guessing probably not the best way. An easier way for instance might be to put all the tracks in a folder and automate the volume.

This may help explain your options:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hmfnmvpx2po

Last edited by martifingers; 09-07-2018 at 05:47 AM. Reason: Missed a suggestion.
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Old 09-07-2018, 06:15 AM   #8
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Thanks Martifingers. Great tips.

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Old 09-17-2018, 09:18 AM   #9
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Really, the BEST way is to add a compressor/limiter to the master track, then automate it to raise the gain.
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Old 09-17-2018, 02:09 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Burnsjethro View Post
As a matter of interest, if I wish to raise the volume of the second part of a song slightly, to add some excitement (hopefully), do I just put my marker in the appropriate place, highlight all the tracks and then "split" (with an S) and then raise a fader?

No, the faders work on the track level, not on the item level. That is, the track has no idea where the split is and doesn't care. The fader for the track just takes delivery of the audio from all the items on the track (and all the automation, effects, etc.)

Show the master track (in my Reaper, the key shortcut is ctrl-alt-M, but I'm not sure if that's the default -- you can find it in the action list as "View: Toggle master track visible".) You can then automate the volume, but as JeffreyET points out, you probably don't want to raise the volume above 0dB on the master track or it will clip when rendered to a 16bit integer format or conceptual equivalent (e.g. wav, mp3).

One option is to lower the sections of the song that are too loud instead of boosting the section that is too quiet.

Another option is to use the "Volume (Pre-FX)" curve on the master track and automate that. Then the effects you have on the master track (compression, limiting, etc) will aplly to the signal after the boost/cuts in the automation. As long as the master track effects are preventing clipping (they should) you would be fine.
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Old 09-18-2018, 12:34 AM   #11
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Thanks a lot for those details Clepsydra.

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Originally Posted by clepsydrae View Post
No, the faders work on the track level, not on the item level. That is, the track has no idea where the split is and doesn't care. The fader for the track just takes delivery of the audio from all the items on the track (and all the automation, effects, etc.)

Show the master track (in my Reaper, the key shortcut is ctrl-alt-M, but I'm not sure if that's the default -- you can find it in the action list as "View: Toggle master track visible".) You can then automate the volume, but as JeffreyET points out, you probably don't want to raise the volume above 0dB on the master track or it will clip when rendered to a 16bit integer format or conceptual equivalent (e.g. wav, mp3).

One option is to lower the sections of the song that are too loud instead of boosting the section that is too quiet.

Another option is to use the "Volume (Pre-FX)" curve on the master track and automate that. Then the effects you have on the master track (compression, limiting, etc) will aplly to the signal after the boost/cuts in the automation. As long as the master track effects are preventing clipping (they should) you would be fine.
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Old 09-18-2018, 12:55 AM   #12
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Although I am not sure what happens here.

Show the master track (in my Reaper, the key shortcut is ctrl-alt-M, but I'm not sure if that's the default -- you can find it in the action list as "View: Toggle master track visible".) You can then automate the volume, but as JeffreyET points out, you probably don't want to raise the volume above 0dB on the master track or it will clip when rendered to a 16bit integer format or conceptual equivalent (e.g. wav, mp3).

There is a green volume button at the bottom of all the tracks and when I press

ctrl-alt-M (which I see in the action list is the key shortcut. The boxes just move up a bit and there a black space but no track.
There is a green automation line running opposite the volume button but it is there whether I press ctrl-alt-M or not. I inserted a couple of track but when I moved the green line up and down, inserted points, ... nothing happened.

Nor do I see how I can go abouve 0db because it just stops at 0 even if I press shift and try to raise it (as I read you should do).

Was your idea that I should be able to change the volume of all the tracks together with the master track (which I can't seem to get to work)?

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Old 09-19-2018, 01:40 AM   #13
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OK, silly me. I know see that the Master track does appear. I was looking at the bottom of the stack of tracks on the left-hand side when what it does is appear at the top. So thanks a lot for that advice.

What is the relationship between this Master track and the Master column/mixer at the bottom?

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Old 09-19-2018, 08:34 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Burnsjethro View Post
What is the relationship between this Master track and the Master column/mixer at the bottom?
They are the same thing.

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Old 09-19-2018, 08:51 AM   #15
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Thanks Xenakios.
Then I suppose the advantage with the Master track is I can apply automation to alter the volume on different parts of the entire tune.

If I want the second part of a tune (all the instruments and vocals together) to be a tad lower I use automation on the Master track!

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Old 09-19-2018, 09:32 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Burnsjethro View Post
Then I suppose the advantage with the Master track is I can apply automation to alter the volume on different parts of the entire tune.
Yeah, the "arrange view" master track gets you access to the automation envelopes and any "show in track controls" knobs you have enabled.
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Old 09-20-2018, 08:17 AM   #17
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Thanks Clepsydrae but you have to keep it simple with me. What do you mean by "show in track controls" please?

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Old 09-20-2018, 08:21 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Burnsjethro View Post
"show in track controls"
Nothing to do with volume automation. It's just a thing that ended up in the screen capture from me. (Plugin parameter knobs in the track control panel.)
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Old 09-20-2018, 08:25 AM   #19
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OK thanks so much for your prompt reply.

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Old 09-20-2018, 08:39 AM   #20
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Yeah I was just trying to list all the relevant differences between the two master track views. I didn't know the parameter knobs only showed up in the arrange view, but the screenshot demonstrates that, so I mentioned it. (I never use the mixer, myself.)
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Old 09-20-2018, 08:50 AM   #21
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Going back to your initial comments:

Another option is to use the "Volume (Pre-FX)" curve on the master track and automate that. Then the effects you have on the master track (compression, limiting, etc) will aplly to the signal after the boost/cuts in the automation. As long as the master track effects are preventing clipping (they should) you would be fine.



I am not sure what you mean by volume pre-fx curve.
And do you mean that if I were to change the volum in some section with automation the effects on the Master track would be nullified in that section?

Anton
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Old 09-20-2018, 09:22 AM   #22
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The normal "Volume" curve just automates the audio coming out of the track, after any effects have been applied. The "Volume (Pre-FX)" curve automates the volume of the signal coming out of the audio items on the track, but before it has reached the effects.

If you just want to turn down the level of the song in a section, you can just use the regular old Volume curve and it will work fine.

But sometimes in mixing (whether a regular track or the master track) you may want to automate that volume before it goes in to the effects. (If you have no effects on the master track, then the two curves will function identically.)

As just one example: if you have a recording where the overall level changes throughout the clip, and you want to use a compressor, you can use the "Pre-FX" curve to balance out the overall clip levels before they go in to the compressor on the track. (You'd probably actually use a clip-level automation curve for this, but you get the point.)
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Old 09-20-2018, 09:33 AM   #23
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Lovely explanation. Thanks a million.

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Old 09-20-2018, 10:11 AM   #24
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Without having heard the material in question, I'd be willing to bet you'd get better results making these kinds of adjustments at the track level. It should really start with parts that are played and how they fit together. If you want the chorus to be bigger, then make it bigger. More tracks playing more often and harder/louder. There is a real difference between everybody playing louder vs just turning up the mix of everybody playing quietly.

At mix time, it might still need automation, but you will have a whole lot more control if you automate at the track level. Maybe not everything needs to get quieter, but just pulling down one of two things accomplishes what you want. Maybe everything does need to get a bit louder, but by different amounts.

I guess it's an aesthetic thing, and definitely depends on the material, but in most cases I just don't see this as being the best way to go. It's not wrong if it works for you, though.
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Old 09-20-2018, 10:20 AM   #25
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This is all most welcome and sound advice. Thank you all.

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