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Old 09-07-2013, 10:03 AM   #1
arve
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Default Reaper performance on OS X Mavericks

Has anyone who is running OS X Mavericks noticed performance problem with 32-bit VSTs running in 64-bit Reaper since the update to Developer Preview 7?

It doesn't seem to happen with every 32-bit plugin, but some of them cause big problems - in particular I'm noticing it with QuadraSID and DrumCore3 (Free). Typical symptoms are UI freezes during actions like play/rewind, and that audio intermittently distorts, to then drop out and get reinitialized a few seconds later.

When I use the same plugins in other 64-bit hosts, like Renoise they seemingly run just fine, so it seems to be specific to Reaper, and the AU versions of the same plugins seem to run just fine in Reaper, so it seems there is something specific to 32-bit VSTs.
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Old 10-24-2013, 09:11 AM   #2
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I installed Mavericks yesterday, and have noticed a severe drop in performance on Reaper64 (latest version)

On actions like play/rewind and zoom in/out, Reaper often freezes for a few seconds... it's almost impossible to work this way.
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Old 10-24-2013, 10:04 AM   #3
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Well... looking at the download page here, Reaper doesn't officially support 10.9 yet.

I'm still running 10.6 here. The broken spaces features in the initial releases of 10.7 scared me away and then I never found time to make a sideways move into 10.8 (meaning there weren't any new features or abilities for any of my workflow other than having to update to 64 bit plugins just because).

Looks like it's upgrade time this time around though. Couple new apps and plugs on the horizon requiring it and all. I grabbed the installer while it's free at the moment. I figure by the time I get to gathering all the 64 bit upgrades of all my plugins there will be a 10.9.1 or 2 update and a Reaper 4.55 officially supporting 10.9.

Still not completely sure where the motivation is supposed to come from to upgrade to 64 bit plugins though. More memory allocation... cool... and I'll continue to watch Reaper use at most 1.5GB of my 16GB ram. Yeah...
Moving forward I guess.
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Old 10-24-2013, 10:41 AM   #4
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Both reaper 32 and 64 get hung up on 'loading native plug-ins' on mavericks on my late 2011 macbook. But my buddies late 2011 with mavericks loads up fine...
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Old 10-24-2013, 12:15 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The_Dark_Lord View Post
On actions like play/rewind and zoom in/out, Reaper often freezes for a few seconds... it's almost impossible to work this way.
I can confirm the play/rewind issue. After a few plays/stops/seeks, hitting play causes Reaper to freeze for about 2 seconds.

No problems with zooming, though.
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Old 10-24-2013, 12:26 PM   #6
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No problems/issues here on MM6.2/10.9.0.
Plugins work fine, play/rewind works fine. No performance issues on a few starts and a "bigger" mixingsession about 3h.
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Old 10-24-2013, 12:42 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ElCongelador View Post
I can confirm the play/rewind issue. After a few plays/stops/seeks, hitting play causes Reaper to freeze for about 2 seconds.

No problems with zooming, though.
Further investigation: There seems to be a problem with certain plugins. Upon throwing out Dimension LE everything works fine so far.
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Old 10-24-2013, 01:45 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ElCongelador View Post
Upon throwing out Dimension LE everything works fine so far.
Well Dimension isn't certified to work on anything past 10.6.8 (Snow Leopard) anyway.
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Old 10-29-2013, 12:42 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ElCongelador View Post
I can confirm the play/rewind issue. After a few plays/stops/seeks, hitting play causes Reaper to freeze for about 2 seconds.

No problems with zooming, though.
Also no zooming issue, but having the same play freeze issue here. Wondering if it's a plug-in thing. Can we compare plug-ins? Here's a list of what I'm running:

Battery 3 AU
Massive AU
Antares Auto-Tune Evo AU
Speakerphone AU
Altiverb 6 AU
Oxford Limiter VST

I'm on a Mid-2010 Mac Pro using 32-bit Reaper.
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Old 10-29-2013, 09:32 AM   #10
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I'm having trouble running a project that only has Waves L2, SSL and Renaissance series, I.K. CSR and Reagate, no MIDI. Haven't checked other projects yet.

15" 2012 Macbook Pro w/ Retina display 64bit running 32 host. Shitty performance after Mavericks, installed 4.55 but nothing changed.

Edit: I just noticed an apparently random hiss that comes and goes for aprox. 1 second

Last edited by Fausto; 10-29-2013 at 09:52 AM.
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Old 10-29-2013, 10:49 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BWinter View Post
Also no zooming issue, but having the same play freeze issue here. Wondering if it's a plug-in thing. Can we compare plug-ins? Here's a list of what I'm running:

Battery 3 AU
Massive AU
Antares Auto-Tune Evo AU
Speakerphone AU
Altiverb 6 AU
Oxford Limiter VST

I'm on a Mid-2010 Mac Pro using 32-bit Reaper.
It's likely a plugin thing. I have none of these. To find out which one is the culprit, remove them all from the project, then add them again one by one; each time check if the issue appears.
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Old 10-29-2013, 11:08 AM   #12
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Well, since updating to Mavericks, Reaper is really messed up for me - I discovered today when trying to show someone a large multitrack band project I have been working on and Reaper just breaks down, either playing back slowly or playing like a broken tape player with crazy popping sounds - I am using a couple of native plug-ins and some 3rd party reverbs, bypassing all fx doesn't help. I have a 2012 Macbook Pro

anyone else experiencing this??
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Old 10-29-2013, 11:10 AM   #13
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hiss could be a plugin which has lost its authorization? hissing for 1s is a frequent plugin trial-mode behavior.
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Old 10-29-2013, 11:13 AM   #14
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...also not to be an old man but it is very unwise to upgrade system software so soon in the cycle if you rely on software which uses a lot of plugins and drivers! I recommend always remaining a full cycle behind at least to give all players a chance to catch up.

And of course there are very very few new features in Mavericks if any that add anything worthwhile for folks making music, and quite possible many steps back.
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Old 10-29-2013, 12:50 PM   #15
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Well... the downloads page still says support for up to 10.8 for Reaper v4.55, so no official support yet from Reaper.

I'd just grab the installer while it's a free beta release and start building a new R&D system separate from your current working system. (Updates - 10.9.1, etc - will always be free once you own the base 10.9 system.)

I got as far as putting the installer on a USB stick the other day. Going through all the installed plugins is next on the list...
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Old 10-30-2013, 01:36 AM   #16
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Default Newest reaper Version on Mavericks Bad....

On Mountain Lion reaper runs flawless.

On Mavericks now with reaper working is not possible.

Newest project 24bit 96khz with duet 2:

Recording two tracks drum. One effect track with lexicon reverb plugin.
Playback and suddenly reaper freezes. After 4 seconds it works again
Butt Freezes shortly again.... and so on....
Deleted the effect track, reaper works again.

This behavior is with every plugin i use.

Maybe its a 96khz problem because using vsti synth, reaper only stutters crackles with big
latency. 3zta, sylenth....all the same.

Created a 44,1 kHz Project with two tracks drum recording:

lexicon reverb on effect track freezes reaper....so no 96khz problem..

Last edited by tomgadd; 10-30-2013 at 10:52 AM.
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Old 11-01-2013, 12:54 PM   #17
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I'm also experiencing the delay after pressing Play. This is on 2 machines with Reaper 4.55. One machine is a 2012 Mac Mini with an Onyx 1220i Firewire mixer. The second is a 2008 Mac with an Onyx 1640i.

The problem is present in all the Reaper files I try.

Hoping a fix comes soon!
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Old 11-01-2013, 01:18 PM   #18
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I've downloaded but put off installing, but I noticed this on Focusrite's site:

"Some users have reported experiencing audio glitches and drop outs with the Scarlett range of interfaces since updating to OSX 10.9 Mavericks. If you are experiencing these problems with your interface, it is possible to utilise Apple’s USB audio driver by downloading and running the class compliant mode application below, while we investigate further"

And they give a link to download the class compliant USB driver. I'm wondering if installing it will also provide a temporary fix for Reaper users (?)


http://uk.focusrite.com/node/20097
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Old 11-02-2013, 01:08 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flareless View Post
I'm also experiencing the delay after pressing Play. This is on 2 machines with Reaper 4.55. One machine is a 2012 Mac Mini with an Onyx 1220i Firewire mixer. The second is a 2008 Mac with an Onyx 1640i.

The problem is present in all the Reaper files I try.

Hoping a fix comes soon!
This problem from 32bit plugins. more exact from 32bit bridge
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Old 11-02-2013, 05:15 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vmichel View Post
This problem from 32bit plugins. more exact from 32bit bridge
Thanks for the tip. I've removed as many plug-ins as I could (TAL Reverb seeming to be a culprit) and it seems to be working ok now.

Are the REA plugins (ReaEQ, ReaGate, etc...) that come with 64 bit Reaper 64 bit themselves?
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Old 11-02-2013, 05:45 AM   #21
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May be need use 32bit version reaper and forget about this trouble untill repair from reaper developers?
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Old 11-02-2013, 05:52 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vmichel View Post
May be need use 32bit version reaper and forget about this trouble untill repair from reaper developers?
Can you run both versions on the same machine? Will they share common directories so that each will have the same VSTs, etc...?
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Old 11-02-2013, 05:59 AM   #23
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I have installed both vers.
And I can use any of them.
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Old 11-02-2013, 06:06 AM   #24
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Small update; TAL-REVERB II v1.61 is the plugin causing my problems. If I remove it from any project it is in the project works fine. I've had to replace it at least for now with ReaVerb.

Darn.... I liked that reverb!
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Old 11-03-2013, 11:35 PM   #25
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I've narrowed it on my machine to the Waves GTR effects.
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Old 11-04-2013, 04:20 AM   #26
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It's deeper than TAL for me. I'm still having issues. Starting to suspect some of my Native Instruments components which I can't remove.

When in doubt.... Re-route!

I've installed the 32 bit version of Reaper on my machines and they run perfectly. All the settings, VSTs, etc... are picked up from my 64 bit install and I'm able to work again. Thanks for the tip Vmichel.
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Old 11-04-2013, 05:07 AM   #27
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I have to run Reaper 64 bit exclusively because of some heavy 64 bit only plugins which I need in several commercial projects.

Now with OSX Mavericks, Reaper has become totally useless. Clicking anywhere on the timeline takes seconds(!!) before anything happens. Same with playback let alone recording.

Amplitube guitar plugin and PODFarm guitar plugin have enormous lag and stutter, my Focusrite Forte seems fine but somewhere between the output of the Forte and the input of plugins/DAW things get really messed up.

Apple have really let me down with OSX Mavericks and I hope I can roll back to Mountain Lion without having to reset the entire system and reinstall everyting...

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Old 11-04-2013, 05:39 AM   #28
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As pioneers we take some arrows in the back.

As someone mentioned earlier in the thread (and in numerous others) updating a system that works is a recipe for disaster. I'm a 30-year IT veteran and should know better. I like to upgrade anyway.

Upgrades ALWAYS break something. That's a law of computing just like; Hard disks will ALWAYS fail and it will likely happen at the worst time. These are LAWS.

Those of us who crippled production machines....shame on all of us. There has been no consistent positive response on the upgrade issue on the forums yet we plunged away headlong on our production machines. That's nuts! Now if we did it on separate partitions, another machine, etc... we would have discovered the problems. But no. I, like many of you said "What the heck - I'm going for it".

OUCH! ARROWS!

Fortunately I found a decent work-around. Next time I'm notified of a Reaper update or an OSX update I think I've learned to wait a while, check the forums and watch for other pioneers with blood running down their back.

Or I might just upgrade again - sometimes I never learn!
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Old 11-04-2013, 06:29 AM   #29
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Very true.

I guess we engineers also fall prey to the marketing hype. "OSX Mavericks is free and available today! Gotta download it now!"
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Old 11-04-2013, 09:49 AM   #30
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Quote:
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Apple have really let me down with OSX Mavericks and I hope I can roll back to Mountain Lion without having to reset the entire system and reinstall everyting...

Take a look at the Reaper download page. 10.9 isn't officially supported yet! This is not something Apple has any control over. If you downloaded the free beta of Mavericks you are in fact beta testing.

And is Reaper the culprit? Not one of your plugins that also hasn't announced official support yet?

As for rolling back to 10.8, it would be a quick clone of your 10.8 system backup right?

This is beta test land here folks. Keep your 10.8 backup clones near by or build a clean 10.9 install just to test.
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Old 11-04-2013, 11:54 AM   #31
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Default TAL instrument woes

I am having difficulty with some TAL synth plugins on a new Macbook running OS 10.9 and Reaper 4.55/64.

Inserting TAL-Elektro as the first instrument on a new track is problematic. The instrument's UI controls do not respond (until I go up to the close window button and suddenly the controls jump to the positions I moused them to!).

TAL-Bassline has a similar problem. However, TAL-Noisemaker works fine, and if I insert Bassline or Electro AFTER Noisemaker, they seem to respond normally too! I can delete Noisemaker from the plugin chain and the other 2 keep working.

Last edited by yks; 11-04-2013 at 11:54 AM. Reason: spelling error
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Old 11-04-2013, 05:23 PM   #32
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Default seems that the 32bit bridge i causing problems...

installed the 32bit version and everything runs smooth....
so 32bit bridge is the cracker...?
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Old 11-04-2013, 05:35 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Neurotica View Post
Very true.
"OSX Mavericks is free and available today! Gotta download it now!"
Yeah
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Old 11-07-2013, 12:59 AM   #34
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Default Mavericks performance VST bridge

I too just upgraded to Mavericks - after finishing my current project though. Have had all previously indicated problems with delays after pressing play etc. Ive narrowed it down (for my setup) to the 32/64 bridges.

Previously I was running 64 bit Reaper and all of my plugins in that particular project are 32 bit. It took a while to load (under Mountain Lion and Mavericks took maybe twice as long). Running the 32 bit version of Reaper and the project loads in half the time it did under Mountain Lion and performs just fine - no playback delays or anything at all.

Seems that there has always been a performance hit for the bridges under Mountain Lion that has been made worse for what ever reason under Mavericks.

Right now with 32 bit Reaper and all 32 bit plugins - I cant fault anything at all under Mavericks.
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Old 11-08-2013, 02:55 PM   #35
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For what it's worth:

MBP early 2011 upgraded to 16gb of RAM.

A little project containing one instance of Kontakt 3.5 (2 instruments) and one VST (MrTramp).

- Lion (not a clean install but updated from 10.6.8): CPU: 8-9% and RT CPU at 26%. I'm able to go down at 48 samples on my Roland Octa-Capture without crackles.

- Mavericks (updated from Lion): CPU 11% but RT CPU starts at 26% and jump suddenly at the middle of the piece to 40-50% and it begins to crackle... 48 samples too.

Tried the 10.7 drivers (installed with Pacifist) and the 10.9 drivers, results are the same!Somewhat ok at 64 samples.

In conclusion, it could be that Reaper isn't optimized for 10.9, the Roland drivers are not as performant under Mavericks or that Kontakt or MrTramps struggles with Mavericks! Who knows? Anyway, for now, I stay with Lion to make music.

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Old 11-08-2013, 03:38 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flareless View Post
Those of us who crippled production machines....shame on all of us.
I did, but it was only an hour or so of work to restore it to its former glory, so I'd consider the exercise worthwhile - at least now I *know* that Mavericks isn't ready for me just yet, and I've hopefully helped in some small way to point out the issues so they can be fixed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by serr View Post
Take a look at the Reaper download page. 10.9 isn't officially supported yet! This is not something Apple has any control over. If you downloaded the free beta of Mavericks you are in fact beta testing.
The free version that's been available for a week or so now is a full release though. Well, at least in name
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Old 11-08-2013, 11:57 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tomgadd View Post
On Mountain Lion reaper runs flawless.

On Mavericks now with reaper working is not possible.

Newest project 24bit 96khz with duet 2:

Recording two tracks drum. One effect track with lexicon reverb plugin.
Playback and suddenly reaper freezes. After 4 seconds it works again
Butt Freezes shortly again.... and so on....
Deleted the effect track, reaper works again.

This behavior is with every plugin i use.

Maybe its a 96khz problem because using vsti synth, reaper only stutters crackles with big
latency. 3zta, sylenth....all the same.

Created a 44,1 kHz Project with two tracks drum recording:

lexicon reverb on effect track freezes reaper....so no 96khz problem..
Strange, I've been facing all these problems on 2 of my machines, 1 on Lion and 1 on Mountain Lion! I'm in a fix, considering a complete re-install! But, if this is a Reaper vs Mac related issue, it will be a pointless pain in the ass.
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Old 11-12-2013, 05:32 AM   #38
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Pioneer Flareless reporting in on 4.56 & Mavericks;

Play button lag test seems to be fixed. I can place the cursor on any point in the project, press play and it works.

Loading a 32 bit VST (TAL Reverb) into the project caused the beach ball to appear for several minutes before the VST appeared in the FX chain.

Verdict; Unsure - more testing required. Watch for arrows!
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Old 11-13-2013, 08:12 AM   #39
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Not sure if this is a fix for anyone else, but it worked for me: I had an issue that when a plugin window (or any window) was open, that the play/pause buttons would freeze for about 5 seconds before resuming. I talked to Apple support, and they mentioned that App Nap might be the problem. App Nap basically puts any apps in the background in a sleep mode to save resources for the items you are working on. So in my case, when I had a plugin window open, App Nap was slowing the main Reaper app down in the background. To disable app nap for a specific application, go to finder-> Applications. Look for Reaper, right click it, choose get info. On the info dialog, check the box "Prevent App Nap"
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Old 11-13-2013, 10:59 AM   #40
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Default The 32bit bridge causes the lagging...

I#m pretty sure thats the problem.
checked a lagging reaper project and disabled all 32bit plugins. bridge was gone=lagging was gone.
replaced the 32bit versions with 64bit plugs...reaper running smooth.

mavericks, 44.1khz 32bit project.
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