Old 10-07-2019, 12:22 AM   #1
WernerB
Human being with feelings
 
WernerB's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2019
Location: Munich / Germany
Posts: 4
Default No disclaimers?

I am about to share some of my JSFX files. But having no formal education in (legal aspects of) software production, I am wondering:

Virtually nobody seems to care about legal disclaimers although people regularly exchange scripts, program code and the like in this forum.
So I wonder what would happen if there was a claim that their programs have harmed somebody else’s IT assets/rights?
What is the seemingly secret mechanism that indemnifies the REAPER community against such mishap?

What have I missed out? Please help because my future posts could be shorter and my world could be happier if I can do without disclaimers.

Many thanks
-Werner
WernerB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-2019, 01:35 AM   #2
swiiscompos
Human being with feelings
 
swiiscompos's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Lausanne (CH)
Posts: 1,107
Default

Many scripters use the GPL license which already includes such a disclaimer.
swiiscompos is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-2019, 04:40 AM   #3
enroe
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Posts: 398
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by WernerB View Post
What have I missed out?
Yes, you missed something.

In a fully monetizated and profit-driven world there are rare islands
of freedom (GPL, Creative Commons). Look here and here!
__________________
free mp3s + info: andy-enroe.de songs and weird stuff: enroe.de
enroe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-2019, 05:44 AM   #4
nofish
Human being with feelings
 
nofish's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: home is where the heart is
Posts: 9,041
Default

I think OP may actually have a point.
I only know Reaper users and this forum as incredibly 'easy going' so I din't care about license or disclaimer in my scripts but what if at some point someone comes along claiming my script did some harm?

Last edited by nofish; 10-07-2019 at 05:50 AM.
nofish is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-2019, 06:49 AM   #5
Xenakios
Human being with feelings
 
Xenakios's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Oulu, Finland
Posts: 7,913
Default

Maybe when creating a new script, the IDE should add some kind of license/disclaimer text at the beginning?
__________________
For info on SWS Reaper extension plugin (including Xenakios' previous extension/actions) :
http://www.sws-extension.org/
https://github.com/Jeff0S/sws
--
Xenakios blog (about HourGlass, Paul(X)Stretch and λ) :
http://xenakios.wordpress.com/
Xenakios is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-2019, 06:53 AM   #6
snooks
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Sep 2015
Posts: 1,623
Default

Maybe a sticky indicating the "free love" nature of code on this forum would be good? Everything's copyleft and without guarantee unless explicitly stated otherwise by the author?
snooks is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-2019, 04:15 PM   #7
WernerB
Human being with feelings
 
WernerB's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2019
Location: Munich / Germany
Posts: 4
Default

Many thanks for your comments that shed light on different aspects of my question. I intend expanding on some of these aspects in more detail soon.
WernerB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-2019, 09:46 PM   #8
Lokasenna
Human being with feelings
 
Lokasenna's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Calgary, AB, Canada
Posts: 6,238
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by WernerB View Post
What is the seemingly secret mechanism that indemnifies the REAPER community against such mishap?
The fact that it hasn't happened yet, and therefore nobody has had to care. That said, the open-source community at large

Quote:
So I wonder what would happen if there was a claim that their programs have harmed somebody else’s IT assets/rights?
Scripts are typically provided for free, with no obligations for support or guarantees of correctness/safety. Users have to specifically choose to install and use them.

So... I doubt there would be much of a legal case in the event of supposed damage unless you could show outright malicious intent (i.e. a script that intentionally tries to remove C:\Windows\System32).

As far as removing how much extra text you have to write, you could just specify in a comment that your code is released under the MIT or Gnu license with a URL to read it - no need to include the whole text these days.
Lokasenna is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-2019, 11:54 PM   #9
Tale
Human being with feelings
 
Tale's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: The Netherlands
Posts: 2,973
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by WernerB View Post
What is the seemingly secret mechanism that indemnifies the REAPER community against such mishap?
I don't know, but a few words at the beginning of your source code are likely not going to change that. Also, I can use a script without looking inside, so how would you know that I have read (let alone agree with) any disclaimer?
__________________
Martinic Kee Bass - Scanner Vibrato - Elka Panther - Tale's JSFX Pack
Tale is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-08-2019, 12:26 AM   #10
azslow3
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Heidelberg, Germany
Posts: 706
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by nofish View Post
I think OP may actually have a point.
I only know Reaper users and this forum as incredibly 'easy going' so I din't care about license or disclaimer in my scripts but what if at some point someone comes along claiming my script did some harm?
Has someone ever seen any code which provides warranty/liability?
Also I do not know cases when someone really tried such claims against free software. In case something has no explicit license that is still copyrighted, but the user has no rights (not even implicit) since there was no explicit agreement.

From what I know, there is no special regulations for "found" software. I mean if you have found a gun or other dangerous materials (and they are not registered as stolen), or if you have found some forbidden material, or if you have found some suspicious baggage on a train station... the owner can be responsible for the consequences. That is explicitly mentioned in laws and rules.
But if you have found an umbrella, a pen, a CD or a piece of source code and you have used that to harm someone (or yourself), the owner (copyright holder in case of software) is from my knowledge can not be made responsible for the consequences.

In addition no disclaimers or licenses prevent claims the author has violated patents/copyrights/etc.

I can imagine only one way to avoid problems: publish code anonymously, from an open WiFi hotspot, using modified MAC address of WiFi adapter
azslow3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-09-2019, 12:13 AM   #11
WernerB
Human being with feelings
 
WernerB's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2019
Location: Munich / Germany
Posts: 4
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tale View Post
Also, I can use a script without looking inside, so how would you know that I have read (let alone agree with) any disclaimer?
Tale, you are one of my favourite (software) contributors indeed, there is so much to learn and copy from your JSFX Pack!
On this occasion I should like to confess that I will draw heavily (!!!) on code from your mono_synth in my upcoming project(s). Therefore I have looked inside this program and know that you have actually bothered earmarking it with an LGPL licence. But I am convinced that the validity of the licence terms is not affected by anyone reading them or not. (If we bother reading) we read phrases as the following all over the place: “Downloading or using the xyz software constitutes acceptance of the terms of this license.” So not reading is at our own risk.
After all legal considerations (and I still have to digest the other replies to my thread), I dearly hope to meet you again in matters of program development.
WernerB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-09-2019, 07:58 AM   #12
Tale
Human being with feelings
 
Tale's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: The Netherlands
Posts: 2,973
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by WernerB View Post
On this occasion I should like to confess that I will draw heavily (!!!) on code from your mono_synth in my upcoming project(s).
Cool!

Quote:
Originally Posted by WernerB View Post
Therefore I have looked inside this program and know that you have actually bothered earmarking it with an LGPL licence.
Yeah, I did... However, my JSFX libraries are now WTFPL.
__________________
Martinic Kee Bass - Scanner Vibrato - Elka Panther - Tale's JSFX Pack
Tale is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 03:30 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions Inc.