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Old 09-18-2017, 05:20 PM   #1
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Default Go Ahead, Tear My Music Apart...With My Blessings

Here is a small collection of fleshy skeletons I'd appreciate some feedback on. I mainly share at this rough stage to receive some encouragement to finish them and also get an idea of which ones people prefer, so I know which ones are worth focusing on in terms of publishing and monetizing.

I plan to refine and rework these tracks, but I have hundreds and sometimes it really helps me decide which to focus on when somebody says something insightful about it---bad or good. I get plenty of satisfaction just making the music, but if sharing elicits no response, it can be pretty discouraging...

https://soundcloud.com/twilightmyste...ets/foxasteria

Anyways, like the title says, I don't mind if you wanna tear it up. Not gonna hurt my feelings and I feel strongly that it's better to say something not nice than nothing at all. Just be honest (and detailed, if possible).

Any and all perspectives are welcome, but I just need a little acknowledgement at this point. Feeling ignored is seriously reinforcing my tendency to hide from the world.
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Old 09-19-2017, 01:21 AM   #2
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Old 09-19-2017, 01:51 AM   #3
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I hate to disappoint you Fox, but that was unexpectedly awesome - hit all the right post-rock buttons for me, especially tracks 1, 2, 3, 5, 8, 9, and 10

I like the arrangements, the instrumentation, and textures (on those tracks particularly).

I'm only listening on a set of AKG K451s at the moment, and they tend to make things sound unnaturally smooth so I'll listen again at home on the monitors - but if I'm being critical, the lower numbered tracks sounds a little muddy while the later tracks sounds clearer, but it's hard to be sure on these cans. However there is a grit that I really like.

Tres cool
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Old 09-19-2017, 04:17 AM   #4
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Far out, psychedelia with substance, you're onto something there. I got to hear the first 6 songs before this old tablet stopped loading, I would have kept going too bc they're really interesting and satisfying mood pieces.

I had the thought that if they were mine I'd try putting some up front kinda conventional vocal verses/choruses but not change anything thats already there. For example, allow the track to play as is for say 40 or 50 seconds then spring a bit of a surprise with clear vocals and cool lyrics for about say 20 seconds and then allow the track to carry on again for another good while, then do a variation of the vocal thing again. I think that would make it even more awesome and appeal to a lot of people.

The ambient vocals that are already there sound really good, is that your voice? -if so then there's no prob about putting some up front vox.
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Old 09-19-2017, 05:51 AM   #5
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Yeah! that was time well spent listening- right up my street. =)
Liking how most is more instrumental and drum heavy-for me,track 2 killed it and track 10 just made instant song.
Clever and quirky with the breath thing.
Enjoyed that! TYVM.

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Old 09-19-2017, 06:02 AM   #6
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Find yourself an etherial female vocalist and sell some records.

I think they need lyrics. Further arrangement ideas will come from them.

Some of the earlier tunes were a tad boxy, but only a tad because the meaty midrange is great. Nothing a mastering engineer couldn't clean up in a jiffy.

The drums on the later tunes were a bit choked with compression. Sometimes it worked, but sometimes it felt like it would be nice for them to open up because it got a bit claustrophobic.

I think I generally preferred the earlier tunes, they felt a bit more open and jazzy, the later ones were a bit more oppressive, but mixing them up in an album would work well.

Really, genuinely impressed. Good work!
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Old 09-19-2017, 06:04 AM   #7
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I could try to come up with some constructive criticism.....But I love them all so far. Besides, I've been following you on Soundcloud for months now, I am already on board.
Track 3 has a Robert Smith-ish guitar lick...love it.
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Old 09-19-2017, 06:23 AM   #8
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I like the music, but I'm not fond of production and mix. Being blunt, but would suggest working towards making it sound better. GL
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Old 09-19-2017, 06:26 AM   #9
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I like the music, but I'm not fond of production and mix. Being blunt, but would suggest working towards making it sound better. GL
I actually like the production....It sounds more "real" to me than it would if he had decided to make it "cleaner".... Another case of "there is something for everyone" and "there are many paths to the same destination".

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Old 09-19-2017, 07:15 AM   #10
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I actually like the production....It sounds more "real" to me than it would if he had decided to make it "cleaner".... Another case of "there is something for everyone" and "there are many paths to the same destination".

Got to agree, it's got grit and I like that a lot

There's some boxiness in the first track, the drums/toms are pretty boomy, and some later tracks there's very audible pumping on the drums - you can hear it on the cymbals and hats mostly - but that's just style/flavour/preference, although personally I'd hold back the threshold or ratio on the comp. One of the tracks (can't remember the name), the bass player needs to learn the part better
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Old 09-19-2017, 08:12 AM   #11
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Following and will be back to listen to more later. I skimmed and listened to enough to know that I want to hear more. I just can't right now because I'm at work!
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Old 09-19-2017, 08:15 AM   #12
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actually if someone wants to move this thread to the lounge, that's probably a better place for it...
Nah, it's fine where it is and the music is great, so I'd not worry about it all and be proud. I do wish there were more vocals/lyrics but if that isn't the goal/genre even that doesn't matter.
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Old 09-19-2017, 08:26 AM   #13
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Grit doesn't mean nastiness. And the sound is nasty at places. Crank up the volume and you will have to cover your ears... unless they are so damaged you won't notice it, which is a possibility.
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Old 09-19-2017, 09:24 AM   #14
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Grit doesn't mean nastiness. And the sound is nasty at places. Crank up the volume and you will have to cover your ears... unless they are so damaged you won't notice it, which is a possibility.
The mids need a little finessing, but they're not far off. Maybe your monitors have a particularly harsh midrange?
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Old 09-19-2017, 10:10 AM   #15
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The mids need a little finessing, but they're not far off. Maybe your monitors have a particularly harsh midrange?
No, and I checked on both headphones and monitors.
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Old 09-19-2017, 10:23 AM   #16
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The mids need a little finessing, but they're not far off.
Same thing I thought when quickly listening in my studio this morning. AKA wasn't really hearing any real problems - there are subjective decisions but those aren't problems.
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Old 09-19-2017, 10:29 AM   #17
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Same thing I thought when quickly listening in my studio this morning. AKA wasn't really hearing any real problems - there are subjective decisions but those aren't problems.
If you like the polished hi-fi sound, then I could understand this sounding nasty.

The polished hi-fi sound is passé now though. Even in polished productions they're sticking a bit of the nasty mids in these days.
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Old 09-19-2017, 10:36 AM   #18
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If you like the polished hi-fi sound, then I could understand this sounding nasty.
I like a little bit of everything (pretty and ugly) but yea, I see what you mean by differentiating.

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Even in polished productions they're sticking a bit of the nasty mids in these days.
Would be less like that if they had more than 2 dB of DR. IOW, I don't think it's possible to have a clean/polished mix when smashed that terribly.
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Old 09-19-2017, 10:41 AM   #19
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Would be less like that if they had more than 2 dB of DR. IOW, I don't think it's possible to have a clean/polished mix when smashed that terribly.
They also want to get lots of mids in because that grabs the ear more for mall/car/TV ad use. You don't get the smiley EQ like you used to in the 70's and 80's, that's a waste of headroom!
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Old 09-19-2017, 11:06 AM   #20
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Well, you can still have loads of grit sounding nice. Like latest korn album, which is heavy and gritty as hell, but when you crank it up to the max, it just have enough of every right frequency to not to sound harsh. Obviously for productions like that, you need super well recorded material and studio where you can crank music up to 85 db of audible volume.
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Old 09-19-2017, 11:12 AM   #21
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Well, you can still have loads of grit sounding nice. Like latest korn album, which is heavy and gritty as hell, but when you crank it up to the max, it just have enough of every right frequency to not to sound harsh. Obviously for productions like that, you need super well recorded material and studio where you can crank music up to 85 db of audible volume.
That's really not the same vibe at all. That's a polished metal production with a hint of grit.

I'm not saying it doesn't need a bit of finessing, but it's not nearly as far off as you think.
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Old 09-19-2017, 11:41 AM   #22
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I get plenty of satisfaction just making the music, but if sharing elicits no response, it can be pretty discouraging...
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Feeling ignored is seriously reinforcing my tendency to hide from the world.
Maybe finding out the real reason for this would be time well spent.

I mean, we live in a time where we can have an audience of millions with the touch of a few buttons. IF we wish so... Imagine being a musician living in the past. Let's say, a few hundred years ago. Most of them never even heard their own music being performed... it sat all in their minds and written down on paper. They took it to the grave. Too expensive to hear it performed.

Moreover, we live in a time where we can make the music we want. Not even J.S. Bach had such freedom, as his existence was more or less in service (a slave) to the church.

Maybe honing your craft in silence and patience will show you more than attention might ever bring. All things worthy are hard earned. Maybe this silence is trying to tell you something...
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Old 09-19-2017, 12:59 PM   #23
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That's really not the same vibe at all. That's a polished metal production with a hint of grit.

I'm not saying it doesn't need a bit of finessing, but it's not nearly as far off as you think.
So are you trying to tell me my ears are too sensitive? ;D

Hint of a grit? C'mon man. Put it on and bring your volume to 11.
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Old 09-19-2017, 01:05 PM   #24
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So are you trying to tell me my ears are too sensitive? ;D

Hint of a grit? C'mon man. Put it on and bring your volume to 11.
It doesn't have that midrange grind. Metal isn't the right genre to compare this kind of post-rock stuff to.
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Old 09-19-2017, 01:12 PM   #25
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Maybe finding out the real reason for this would be time well spent.

I mean, we live in a time where we can have an audience of millions with the touch of a few buttons. IF we wish so... Imagine being a musician living in the past. Let's say, a few hundred years ago. Most of them never even heard their own music being performed... it sat all in their minds and written down on paper. They took it to the grave. Too expensive to hear it performed.

Moreover, we live in a time where we can make the music we want. Not even J.S. Bach had such freedom, as his existence was more or less in service (a slave) to the church.

Maybe honing your craft in silence and patience will show you more than attention might ever bring. All things worthy are hard earned. Maybe this silence is trying to tell you something...
Dude, you're talking utter nonsense.

Bach had music school, and had his operas performed non stop. He was loaded and famous. He had almost 30 children. And he was not a slave. And he wrote music he wanted to write, always. It's disgusting to twist history like that.

Many musicians and composers in the past might have had patron. Others would form bands. And all of them wrote music they wanted. There was more demand for life music then then there is now, for obvious reasons, therefore those who were working were payed real money, not a pint and a shag(Those two were a bonus )
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Old 09-19-2017, 01:15 PM   #26
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It doesn't have that midrange grind. Metal isn't the right genre to compare this kind of post-rock stuff to.
I'm not sure what post rock midrange grind you talk about. I never heard produced rock band where there would be unpleasant midrange grind. Could you maybe refer me a track to listen to?
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Old 09-19-2017, 01:39 PM   #27
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Maybe finding out the real reason for this would be time well spent.


Moreover, we live in a time where we can make the music we want. Not even J.S. Bach had such freedom, as his existence was more or less in service (a slave) to the church.

.
This servitude did not stop him having the freedom to being amongst the first to develop and exploit equal temperament (as well as many other innovations that have influenced musicians ever since). I don't think many of us will use our "freedom" with as much technical and creative brilliance. Fact is we all inhabit our ideologies religious and otherwise.
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Old 09-19-2017, 01:59 PM   #28
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Sorry, foxAsteria. I think your thread's been hijacked.
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Old 09-19-2017, 02:25 PM   #29
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I'm not sure what post rock midrange grind you talk about. I never heard produced rock band where there would be unpleasant midrange grind. Could you maybe refer me a track to listen to?
Something like this?



Mixed with a trip hop, lo fi kind of aesthetic.
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Old 09-19-2017, 05:17 PM   #30
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Well holy moly with a side of crapoly, I really didn't expect all that! This is a bit much for me to respond to individually so I'll just do a general response for the moment.

Somebody said I should get an ethereal female vocalist to help finish up the vox...planned on it actually. Here's my sister's stuff: https://soundcloud.com/pearlsandperils She's doing that all herself but a few of the tracks I either mixed or wrote the music. We're living in different states atm.

That's me on all the parts for foxAsteria, so yea I'm not awesome at everything, but I know how to get my ideas down and if I spend the time, I can always get some good takes. Just wanted to see if and what people responded to before putting in the hours on mixing and re-recording. Most of these were written and recorded in a night or two, thanks to my ultra-streamlined Reaper workflow!

I usually just use Amplitube 57 Deluxe with Pulse IR cab and Sir Elliot Pre-Amp for all the guitars, so that's the grit you hear and I also discovered that my tele with a mini-humbucker in the neck and my strat really compliment each other through that same chain. You get the indistinct (even muddy) low mids from the tele with some bite and clarity from the strat. It's a little embarrassing and I didn't plan on having all Fender guitars and even playing through a virtual Fender amp...but hey, they make some good stuff.

Sorry I'm not sure why the tracks are "not available in UK." If someone knows how to change that, I will...

I'm kind of a fan of overly compressed drums. I really like the way the cymbals wash up in-between the beats. But I'll see about backing it off a bit when I mix, cause sometimes I just crank the thresh down on the limiter for some quick and dirty drum buss volume. So yea, the mixes aren't refined because I haven't actually finished the songs yet or started mixing. They'll get cleaned up, but overall they have the basic sound and feel I wanted.

I like the idea of putting some sparse, but upfront vocals. I'm not super confident in my own voice though and prefer to stick to Ooo's and Ahhh's, but I was inspired to write some actual lyrics on a couple and maybe I'll do some more.

If I did try to "sell some records," instead of just doing an independent digital release, do any of you want to recommend some suitable labels to try? I don't play shows, so have no audience per se, which is why I wasn't really considering a more traditional release.

I'd still like to get some specific criticism, but maybe that can wait until I get them more finished and ya'll can tell me what's left that could still use some work. But you guys are totally giving me that validation I so desperately needed and that's a real confidence booster. Thanks!!!
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Old 09-19-2017, 05:56 PM   #31
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Somebody said I should get an ethereal female vocalist to help finish up the vox...planned on it actually. Here's my sister's stuff: https://soundcloud.com/pearlsandperils She's doing that all herself but a few of the tracks I either mixed or wrote the music. We're living in different states atm.
Love her stuff too!

You guys could be a real musical force to be reckoned with! Different states doesn't matter too much these days...

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Sorry I'm not sure why the tracks are "not available in UK." If someone knows how to change that, I will...
I'm in the UK and had no problem listening to them, so I'm not sure what that's about.
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Old 09-19-2017, 06:30 PM   #32
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You guys could be a real musical force to be reckoned with! Different states doesn't matter too much these days...
Thanks! That's true, I think she's just been pretty busy lately playing shows and work and stuff. I had an electronic album I was trying finish and get her to record another track for, but it's been some months and I don't think she's started yet. Anyways, people don't seem to like my electronic stuff as much, so maybe the newer rock tracks are what I should be focusing on getting published.
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Old 09-19-2017, 06:43 PM   #33
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Thanks! That's true, I think she's just been pretty busy lately playing shows and work and stuff. I had an electronic album I was trying finish and get her to record another track for, but it's been some months and I don't think she's started yet. Anyways, people don't seem to like my electronic stuff as much, so maybe the newer rock tracks are what I should be focusing on getting published.
If I were you I wouldn't worry about if a tune is electronic or rock. Mix it up and just use whatever you think is your best stuff.
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Old 09-20-2017, 06:06 AM   #34
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Nope. Nothing to rip here. Some of the songs sounded like outright modern psychedelia to me. Sort of 'if Floyd were heavier...'.

And I remember those old Sir Elliot plugins! I used to have most of them. They still out there?
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Old 09-20-2017, 06:16 AM   #35
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And I remember those old Sir Elliot plugins! I used to have most of them. They still out there?

Not to go off topic, but this is the first mention of "Sir Elliot" plugs that I have seen in my admittedly limited and new really looking at these forums....all of that to say that I would be lost without my "VOLUME 11" limiter.

I love the thing!
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Old 09-20-2017, 08:53 AM   #36
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Doesn't sound overly harsh to me, bands like Russian Cricles or Tides from Nebula (if we're at post rock) use dirty tones like those, often in dirtier and nastier way and nobody complains. Nice sounding stuff.
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Old 09-20-2017, 10:01 AM   #37
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Not to go off topic, but this is the first mention of "Sir Elliot" plugs that I have seen in my admittedly limited and new really looking at these forums....all of that to say that I would be lost without my "VOLUME 11" limiter.

I love the thing!
Just old and nasty sounding goodness, esp with the pre amps (when you wanted them nasty). I think I miss them now.
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Old 09-20-2017, 10:09 AM   #38
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I've had a bunch of those plugs lying around somewhere but hadn't got around to trying them. Rather than go look for them I dl'd em again from here -


https://sirelliot.wordpress.com/download-section/
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Old 09-20-2017, 01:23 PM   #39
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all of that to say that I would be lost without my "VOLUME 11" limiter.
Checkin it out now. Odd that the knobs only go to 10 though, eh? I just saw there are a couple more preamps on the site I haven't tried. I use Peak Limiter II and RT-1 a lot but never tried any of the rest yet. Here's what you call a good feedback loop!
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Old 09-20-2017, 04:15 PM   #40
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Originally Posted by foxAsteria View Post
Checkin it out now. Odd that the knobs only go to 10 though, eh? I just saw there are a couple more preamps on the site I haven't tried. I use Peak Limiter II and RT-1 a lot but never tried any of the rest yet. Here's what you call a good feedback loop!
Dude, if you leave everything as it came fro the download and just use the knob on the left hand side, ...well let's just say, I've never had to go past "3". In fact I found that to be too much on some things, so usually just go about "2 and a half" anything past 3 is just insane.

YMMV
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