Old 02-01-2011, 05:29 AM   #1
dr_After
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Default Metronome drives me mad

i noticed this issue quite long time ago in v3, but I use v4 now, so decided to post in Pre-release section.

I don't know why, but I never managed to make count-in work. I set up metronome to be enabled for recording, set "count-in before recording" set a length of one measure. And here whats happens:
1. when I press "record" trying to record from first bar, count-in works

2. When I set play cursor, clicking on the ruler Reaper pre-rolls one bar (and my pre-roll is OFF). I just want Reaper to give me four clicks, without prerolling.

3. When I click in arrange view in an empty space and try to record, there is no pre-roll and no count-in. Recording just starts. It's extremely frustrating.

Is it something wrong with my system or is it a bug?
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Old 02-01-2011, 03:24 PM   #2
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Bump!

Anyone?
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Old 02-01-2011, 03:43 PM   #3
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Sorry, can't reproduce. I am getting a proper count in in all of the 3 situations. Is any special recording mode involved?
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Old 02-01-2011, 04:00 PM   #4
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cannot see a problem here reaper 32 bit V4a37 on XP....

are you on PC or Mac?

it all works very well for me. ?
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Old 02-01-2011, 04:19 PM   #5
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there is another problem/FR with metronome...since i use reaper V3.5.

when i put 2/2 in the bar BOX, the metronome plays half the value entered in the BPM box (u hear BPM/2) wich is logic in a way.... so if i want a 2/2 bar with a pulsation of 60 ( 2 pulses in a bar) i must put 120 BPM.
maybe it should be a good idea to respect the chosen pulsation ! (quarter or semi quarter or whatever else.)
when i have to tap the pulsation, i must think twice faster the tempo i need.

this is important when u need to works with scores.

maybe there is option for this but i didnt found it...
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Old 02-02-2011, 10:34 AM   #6
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Hopi, I work with PC.

I made some tests today and noticed that my troubles with metronome appear when transport indicates "pause". Long ago I set up my spacebar to "play / pause" action instead of "play / stop" and most of time Reaper is in "play" or "pause" mode. But in my opinion that shouldnt affect count-in and prerolling.
So it's definetely a bug to me: whenever I try to record with metronome and count-in enabled and Transport indicates "pause", count-in and preroll don't work!

Another matter is - what is difference between "count-in" and "pre roll"? It looks like the same features to me - always rewinding a measure earlier, then recording from playhead :/
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Old 02-03-2011, 02:52 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dr_After View Post
Another matter is - what is difference between "count-in" and "pre roll"? It looks like the same features to me - always rewinding a measure earlier, then recording from playhead :/
For me, it is unclear too.
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Old 02-03-2011, 03:04 AM   #8
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Here's a description of the difference:

http://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=73956

Mainly it's:
Count in = no playback of existing material, just the click
Pre roll = Play back some of your existing material before recording starts
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Old 02-03-2011, 03:24 AM   #9
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Thank you, Gofer! The main difference is the monitoring - now it's clear.

But I still think we have a bug: count-in doesn't work when Reaper is paused. It only works, when DAW is at full stop.
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Old 02-03-2011, 03:50 AM   #10
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Confirmed.

"Count-in before recording" will not do the count-in when recording is restarted from pause.
"Count-in before playback" will do the count-in when playback is started from pause.

Same in v3.x, so it's not introduced with the alphas. Maybe it's intentional? I dunno. I'd think it should do the count-in before recording, but then again, I have no experience with working like that.
Can anyone think of a reason why it shouldn't?
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Old 02-04-2011, 04:44 AM   #11
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Since noone replied, I submitted this as a bug:

http://forum.cockos.com/project.php?issueid=3221
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Old 02-04-2011, 09:53 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gofer View Post
Confirmed.

"Count-in before recording" will not do the count-in when recording is restarted from pause.
"Count-in before playback" will do the count-in when playback is started from pause.

Same in v3.x, so it's not introduced with the alphas. Maybe it's intentional? I dunno. I'd think it should do the count-in before recording, but then again, I have no experience with working like that.
Can anyone think of a reason why it shouldn't?
What if you pause an running live recording (Audio Interview, Band, Event) and then unpause it to record instantly where it paused before?
Without creating a new file... just recording further on the same files.

That would be prevented with prerolling/counting in on pause.

It's not a bug it's a feature

But there are other things missing on the metronome.
Just look on my FR: http://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=73917

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Old 02-04-2011, 10:14 AM   #13
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Why would you ever have a metronome enabled when recording a live thing, be it an interview, a band or whatever?

I could imagine pre-roll to be usable in an interview situation, so you could drop right in keeping the continuity after a mistake was made. But in that case I would want the pre-roll also when dropping back in from pause mode.
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Old 02-04-2011, 10:32 AM   #14
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I guess in the 'meantime' a possible solution would be to change your settings so it's not play\pause but play\stop and put the pause on a diff key... like P maybe?

I know I tried play\pause = spacebar for awhile but gave it up for that other way.

I'm not saying it's not a bug or something that might be 'fixed', just looking at what "I" can do today to get what I want working.

PS... just dbl checked all this and don't really find it too terrible... the metro does continue working during a recording even if I pause in the middle of the recording.. but it does not continue with preroll or count in... which when you think about it is logical... a count in comes at the start or a new recording, whereas a pause during recording is not a 'start' of a recording... see what I'm saying? So I guess if you want a count in right at that point you'd need to full stop and start again there.
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Last edited by hopi; 02-04-2011 at 11:01 AM.
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Old 02-04-2011, 11:16 AM   #15
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Moved this into the Bug reports section, so we can use it as discussion thread for the Issue #3221.

Let's see if we get some more opinions over here.


Hopi, I see where you come from. The root of the problem is (I think) that Stop moves the playhead back to where you first started the recording. Lots of people don't want that and rather have their playhead be where you stop. Play/Pause is often recommended to "fake" that behavior. This is a case where the Play/Pause workaround fails, so perhaps we should think about requesting a more versatile Stop? (Or rather bump the existing requests if we manage to find them )

Last edited by gofer; 02-04-2011 at 11:27 AM.
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Old 02-04-2011, 11:58 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hopi View Post
PS... just dbl checked all this and don't really find it too terrible... the metro does continue working during a recording even if I pause in the middle of the recording.. but it does not continue with preroll or count in... which when you think about it is logical... a count in comes at the start or a new recording, whereas a pause during recording is not a 'start' of a recording... see what I'm saying? So I guess if you want a count in right at that point you'd need to full stop and start again there.
First - I agree with gofer - when recording live metronome is obsolete.

And second - in a case when I just want to make some vocal takes (and using play/pause for a spacebar) I cannot have count-in before each take. And that is terrible - I need constantly move playhead a measure earlier, just to give metronome beat for vocalist.
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Old 02-05-2011, 07:31 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dr_After View Post
First - I agree with gofer - when recording live metronome is obsolete.
In most cases yes...

Quote:
Originally Posted by dr_After View Post
And second - in a case when I just want to make some vocal takes (and using play/pause for a spacebar) I cannot have count-in before each take. And that is terrible - I need constantly move playhead a measure earlier, just to give metronome beat for vocalist.
Hm... alright so an option to "move edit cursor on stop" would do the trick?
Then I can have my Pause/Unpause without prerolling, and you can do your takes

I missed this function before a while... Sure it isn't there?

BTW: Why don't you use the built in "take" feature of reaper?
Or do you want to record the takes one behind another in one file? Please explain me more

greets
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Old 02-07-2011, 07:25 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by davidb_64 View Post
In most cases yes...



Hm... alright so an option to "move edit cursor on stop" would do the trick?
Then I can have my Pause/Unpause without prerolling, and you can do your takes
Yes, it would, but AFAIK - there is no such option yet.

But it's not necesarry - let me explain:

There are two scenarios currently:

1. You press record, count-in starts, then Reaper records.
2. You press "play/pause" - and Reaper goes into "record/pause" mode (Play, pause and record buttons are flashing)
3. You press "play pause" again - and record continues without prerolling.

And thats how it works currently and I don't wish to change that - it's ok for me.

Scenario 2:
1. I press "play/pause" - music plays
2. I press "play/pause again" - Reaper is in "play / pause" mode - Play and pause buttons are flashing
3. I press "record" - Reaper starts recording without count-in and prerolling. And thats no good.

So - if scenario 2 would be fixed, I would be happy. And You could still use recording and pausing without prerolling, using scenario 1.
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Old 02-09-2011, 10:55 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dr_After View Post
Scenario 2:
1. I press "play/pause" - music plays
2. I press "play/pause again" - Reaper is in "play / pause" mode - Play and pause buttons are flashing
3. I press "record" - Reaper starts recording without count-in and prerolling. And thats no good.

So - if scenario 2 would be fixed, I would be happy. And You could still use recording and pausing without prerolling, using scenario 1.
Ahh... Now I see
That's indeed a not-so-cool behaviour... And should be fixed, I think!

Maybe you could add these examples to the bug-report. I think they explain the problem very good!

greets
David
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