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04-22-2021, 03:48 PM
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#1
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 761
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Ducking Comp Help
Howdy all, I am wanting to try something I have never done before. I can't figure out how to do it.
"I want to compress the drums and bass every time the vocal is on.I would like to pull it down a couple db"
I figured I needed to send the drums, percussion, and bass guitar to a buss. I put a comp on that buss. But I can't figure out how to setup the vocal. or if i am even going about this right.
Please help. Thank you for your time
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04-22-2021, 03:55 PM
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#2
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Lucas, TX, USA (via Luleå, Sweden)
Posts: 2,008
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You are mostly there.
1) Send the drums, percussion, and bass to a buss track on channels 1/2.
2) Send the vocals to the *same* buss track on channels 3/4.
3) Set the compressor on the buss track to compress channels 1/2 based on what it receives on channels 3/4. Depending on which compressor you use, it may call the input for channels 3/4 "side chain", "detector", "auxiliary input" or something like that.
You can see an example of how to do side-chain compression with ReaComp in this guide (scroll down to ReaComp): https://audioordeal.co.uk/guide-to-r...plugins-reaeq/
__________________
Best Regards, Ernie "lunker" Lundqvist
BDSM (Bad Dog Studio Musicians)
Windows 10 running on Z390 + i7-8700
Last edited by lunker; 04-22-2021 at 04:01 PM.
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04-22-2021, 04:03 PM
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#3
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 761
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lunker
You are mostly there.
1) Send the drums, percussion, and bass to a buss track on channels 1/2.
2) Send the vocals to the *same* buss track on channels 3/4.
3) Set the compressor on the buss track to compress channels 1/2 based on what it receives on channels 3/4. Depending on which compressor you use, it may call the input for channels 3/4 Side chain," "detector," "auxiliary input" or something like that.
You can see an example of how to do side-chain compression with ReaComp in this guide (scroll down to ReaComp): https://audioordeal.co.uk/guide-to-r...plugins-reaeq/
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thank you so much for a fast response. Let me see if I can sort this out.
Ok, I have drums on Track 1, percussion on Track 2, bass on Track 3, and Vocals on Track 4.
I need to send tracks 1, 2, and 3 to Buss 1. I need to put a compressor on Buss 1. Then I send track 4 vox to Buss 1? Did I get all this right?
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04-22-2021, 04:05 PM
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#4
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 29,260
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You can put the drums/bass in a folder just as easily if that feels simpler, then place reacomp on the folder... and another trick IIRC is you can drag the vocal's IO button onto ReaComp directly and it will automap 1/2 to 3/4 for you - just confirm the input detection in reacomp is set to 3/4 if it doesn't do it automatically via the drag and drop.
__________________
Music is what feelings sound like.
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04-22-2021, 04:07 PM
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#5
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 761
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Quote:
Originally Posted by karbomusic
You can put the drums/bass in a folder just as easily if that feels simpler... and another trick IIRC is you can drag the vocal's IO button onto ReaComp directly and it will automap 1/2 to 3/4 for you - just confirm the input detection in reacomp is set to 3/4 if it doesn't do it automatically via the drag and drop.
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thanks for your response. I am starting to think, I have to use a compressor that is made to do this? Not all comp plugs will do what I need?
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04-22-2021, 04:08 PM
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#6
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 761
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lunker
You are mostly there.
1) Send the drums, percussion, and bass to a buss track on channels 1/2.
2) Send the vocals to the *same* buss track on channels 3/4.
3) Set the compressor on the buss track to compress channels 1/2 based on what it receives on channels 3/4. Depending on which compressor you use, it may call the input for channels 3/4 "side chain", "detector", "auxiliary input" or something like that.
You can see an example of how to do side-chain compression with ReaComp in this guide (scroll down to ReaComp): https://audioordeal.co.uk/guide-to-r...plugins-reaeq/
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is what I am trying to do called "Side Chain"? And is that the only name of guys use for this setup?
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04-22-2021, 04:08 PM
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#7
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 29,260
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimmy James
thanks for your response. I am starting to think, I have to use a compressor that is made to do this? Not all comp plugs will do what I need?
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Many but not all compressors have an external/side-chain input which is the feature you need here. ReaComp is the simplest, which also has that feature, that everyone here is going to know and easily help with.
There are probably other ways to skin this cat regardless of compressor but my suggestion is to learn to set it up with something simple, like a folder track + ReaComp to get your feet wet and keep confusion down.
__________________
Music is what feelings sound like.
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04-22-2021, 04:09 PM
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#8
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 5,207
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimmy James
thanks for your response. I am starting to think, I have to use a compressor that is made to do this? Not all comp plugs will do what I need?
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Stock ReaComp will do it
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04-22-2021, 04:11 PM
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#9
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 29,260
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^See what I mean.
__________________
Music is what feelings sound like.
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04-22-2021, 04:19 PM
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#10
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 761
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Quote:
Originally Posted by karbomusic
^See what I mean.
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thank you! I will use Reacomp for this.
I have always used a buss. Only because I know what a buss is. And everyone in the old studios a few decades back, called them a buss.
i have never used "folders" before. I will try and figure out how to use folders instead of making a buss.
I have some good info in this thread. I might be able to figure this out now! Thank you all
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04-22-2021, 04:30 PM
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#11
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 29,260
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A buss is fine if that is what you are used to. I only mentioned folders because they are typically simpler to deal with and visibly show the tracks feeding them. There is no need for a folder if you are already comfortable with using a buss.
If you did want to use a folder, just create a new track. CTRL+Click each track you want in the folder to select them all, then just drag that onto the new track and it will auto-create the folder - you can tell because a little blue line will appear showing the indent as you drag...
__________________
Music is what feelings sound like.
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04-23-2021, 04:52 AM
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#12
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2021
Posts: 627
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I found this to be a helpful tutorial on the subject.
Another good free plugin to use with this is TDR Nova, BTW, after mastering ReaComp. I use it to lower a band of EQ to make another part stand out, for example.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Tt5yWOxB2E
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04-23-2021, 01:07 PM
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#13
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 761
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Quote:
Originally Posted by karbomusic
Many but not all compressors have an external/side-chain input which is the feature you need here. ReaComp is the simplest, which also has that feature, that everyone here is going to know and easily help with.
There are probably other ways to skin this cat regardless of compressor but my suggestion is to learn to set it up with something simple, like a folder track + ReaComp to get your feet wet and keep confusion down.
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I can't figure out the difference between a "Buss" and "Folders". Are they the exact same thing? DO most Reaper users use Folders instead of a buss? And why?
Thank you for your patience and great info
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04-23-2021, 01:11 PM
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#14
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 29,260
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimmy James
I can't figure out the difference between a "Buss" and "Folders". Are they the exact same thing? DO most Reaper users use Folders instead of a buss? And why?
Thank you for your patience and great info
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Functionally they are mostly the same. I tend to use folders instead of busses out of sheer convenience... The sub tracks are always in the folder, creating and routing is as quick and nifty as the screen grab above. I can collapse the folder to save screen real estate and so on but it's really your choice so I wouldn't sweat it really.
__________________
Music is what feelings sound like.
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04-23-2021, 01:35 PM
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#15
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 761
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Quote:
Originally Posted by karbomusic
Functionally they are mostly the same. I tend to use folders instead of busses out of sheer convenience... The sub tracks are always in the folder, creating and routing is as quick and nifty as the screen grab above. I can collapse the folder to save screen real estate and so on but it's really your choice so I wouldn't sweat it really.
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Cool! Man, thank you so much. You have helped a lot. I do like the idea of being able to collapse fast and easy. I can't do that with a buss. SO I think I will experiment with folders down the road as a "added bonus" to the new things I am learning.
Oh, when using the folder system, is the first track in the chain like the buss? If I had all the drum tracks in folders, and i wanted to compress the group. Would I just put a comp on the very first track?
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04-23-2021, 01:37 PM
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#16
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 761
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gibson_GM
I found this to be a helpful tutorial on the subject.
Another good free plugin to use with this is TDR Nova, BTW, after mastering ReaComp. I use it to lower a band of EQ to make another part stand out, for example.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Tt5yWOxB2E
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thank you so much! All the videos helped, but this one sealed the deal. I still don't know "why" I do some of the things, but I have made it all work. I will keep checking this video and try and burn it in my brain.
Thank you to everyone in this thread. Every poster helped me so much. I am so happy I have made this work!
IS there anything else anyone wants to add? Anything you guys wish you knew when you started using Sidechain?
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04-23-2021, 02:35 PM
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#17
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 761
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I set it to "pre-fader" as he did in the video tutorial. Does this mean I can also use Volume Automation on the vocal track and not ruin the side chain? And if so, is this "overkill"
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04-23-2021, 02:40 PM
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#18
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 13,333
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimmy James
I set it to "pre-fader" as he did in the video tutorial. Does this mean I can also use Volume Automation on the vocal track and not ruin the side chain? And if so, is this "overkill"
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Yes, exactly. And pre-FX means you'll get dry signal.
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04-26-2021, 01:57 PM
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#19
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 761
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vitalker
Yes, exactly. And pre-FX means you'll get dry signal.
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thanks man, the pre-fx makes this trick even better
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04-26-2021, 01:59 PM
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#20
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 761
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Quote:
Originally Posted by karbomusic
Functionally they are mostly the same. I tend to use folders instead of busses out of sheer convenience... The sub tracks are always in the folder, creating and routing is as quick and nifty as the screen grab above. I can collapse the folder to save screen real estate and so on but it's really your choice so I wouldn't sweat it really.
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When I use folders, let's say it is a drum group. I always have my kick drum first. If I put all the drum tracks in a folder and want to compress or eq them. Do I put my plugs on the kick drum (the first track in the folders) ????
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04-26-2021, 02:20 PM
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#21
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 13,333
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimmy James
When I use folders, let's say it is a drum group. I always have my kick drum first. If I put all the drum tracks in a folder and want to compress or eq them. Do I put my plugs on the kick drum (the first track in the folders) ????
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Consider folder as a group. If you want to compress all the drums, then add fx to the folder. If you need to tune only kick or snare etc., then you'll put fx on their tracks.
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04-26-2021, 02:27 PM
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#22
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 29,260
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimmy James
When I use folders, let's say it is a drum group. I always have my kick drum first. If I put all the drum tracks in a folder and want to compress or eq them. Do I put my plugs on the kick drum (the first track in the folders) ????
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Remember, all audio of child tracks flows through the folder track as if it were a buss by default. So, to put FX on all drums like a buss, is to put FX on the folder track when it's a folder...
Also notice the indent shows that the individual drum tracks are inside the folder named "All Drums":
__________________
Music is what feelings sound like.
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04-27-2021, 10:52 AM
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#23
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 761
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thanks so much guys. I think I see now. When I do the folder thing. If I want to treat it as a buss, I need to add a new track as the "parent" track. This new empty track can be used to process the entire group.
Thank you all!
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04-27-2021, 01:20 PM
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#24
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Dec 2019
Location: Pereira, Colombia
Posts: 151
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I would suggest this video, it explains the small differences between Folders and Busses and also explains the very useful VCA's:
https://youtu.be/P62cSnHY7IA
One important thing, you can use folders to add FX's like filters or EQ to the tracks in the folder but don't touch the fader of a folder because it will affects sends and returns, the video is self explanatory.
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04-28-2021, 05:42 PM
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#25
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: St George, UT _ USA
Posts: 2,881
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Feel like this should be a 'Sticky' ..... whether here or in newbieland.
Good stuff by capable Reaperites !
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