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Old 11-14-2014, 03:25 AM   #81
jico27
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Hi,

Wanted to try this exceptional project but had this dll problem with PT v.1.0.0 mentioned above (#13) when using Reaper.
So i uninstalled this version & tried v.1.0.1 but can't install it. I now have a 'runtime error (at 14:170): Could not call proc' message.
I'm using W7 and also have the Mic Vis C++ 2013 installed.
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Old 11-14-2014, 05:26 AM   #82
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Hm, since my overpriced AKAI APC40 is just gathering dust over the last years, maybe this could be a way to use it again!?

Is there a possibility for a ableton live like implementation of the APC 40? With visual feedback and so on?
I know the apc40 is kind of resticted in its firmware, but maybe there's a way to hack this?

I would defenitely pay significantly more than 20€ to be able to reanimate this no-resale-value-pos.
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Old 11-14-2014, 07:49 AM   #83
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This adds an entirely new workflow option. Very impressive.
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Old 11-14-2014, 04:26 PM   #84
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It would be great to have video tutorials.
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Old 11-14-2014, 11:56 PM   #85
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The most useful thing for me with the ableton session view is the ability to click on each cell and record midi or audio into each one and or edit in each cell. Then audition multiple cells at the same time to see what sounds good. This doesn't seem to be anything like that. Unless I'm missing something?
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Old 11-15-2014, 02:59 AM   #86
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You can record into cells, and play cells together. Not sure if you can edit directly from the cells though, think it's an fr, you can still edit in the project though. (All AFAIK not had a chance to really get into it properly yet)
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Old 11-15-2014, 06:04 AM   #87
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Wow, so much feedback to process

@TonE

# MIDI file references

This is already possible. Remember you have all REAPER goodies at your disposal. Just mark the items on the timeline after recording them with Playtime and then "right mouse click => Item processing => Convert active take MIDI to .mid file reference". Then you can do to the resulting MIDI files whatever you want and it will affect playback in Playtime.

But if you are just interested in keeping the MIDI content of several clips in sync, there's a much easier way. When recording a clip, Playtime creates an in-project MIDI item. When you copy a clip (Ctrl+Drag'n'Drop), it creates a pooled MIDI item - also commonly called a "ghost copy". Every change you make to the source MIDI item will affect the ghost copy and vice versa. No need to cope with MIDI files.

Note that Playtime even creates ghost copies when using the "Write" button. That means the written items are still connected to the initial clips. You can replace the content of all those connected clips and items in one go. AFAIK this is indeed something Ableton doesn't offer.


# Track limit

Each slot can control an item on a different track if desired. So the limit is 64 tracks. But yes, there are only 8 groups (columns). As I wrote above, groups and tracks are not connected in Playtime. If you need more groups, you can fire up a second instance of Playtime. Multiple instances are not synchronized though. I'm thinking about increasing the maximum number of groups and scenes in future. But I think with 8x8 clips one can already come very far.


# Fill scene from selected items

Sounds useful to me. I didn't understand the ONLINE and OFFLINE thing.


# Write in another project tab

I think I know what you're getting at. Yes, reminds me of the old Cubase VST arrangements. This is very difficult though since the two projects (= different arrangments) would be totally disconnected from each other, not sharing the same tracks and items. Would be much easier if Cockos offered multiple timelines for one project. Alternative: Just write into different time passages of the project and use markers or regions to be able to jump to them easily.



@MotionMindz

Everything you mentioned is already possible

# 2. Loop lengths
This is already the case. Each clip can have an arbitrary loop length.

# 3. MIDI/CC controllable (triggers)
This feature is at the very core of Playtime.

You can also edit a clip by double clicking on it (MIDI clips: opens REAPER's internal MIDI editor, Audio clips: zooms into the item because REAPER doesn't have a separate audio editor).


@sinkmusic

# Bitbucket vs. Cockos forum

Thanks for making the requests there. Okay, discussions in the REAPER forum are fine. Voting for features and watching their progress is much better solved in Bitbucket.


@todd_r

# VST vs. REAPER extension

Playtime is actually a kind of REAPER extension, it uses the same functions that SWS extension uses for example. It's just deployed as a VST instrument. So Playtime has all the possibilities of a REAPER extension plus those of a VST plugin. That makes sense because Playtime is actually a musical instrument. It's supposed to be played with your MIDI keyboard (although using just the GUI is also nice).


# Select items from project bay

This is already possible. Project Bay => Options => Mirror selection in bay and project. Then select the item in the project bay, go to Playtime, right mouse click on a slot => Fill with selected item.

# Retain items in project bay

It's currently not possible to retain items or access the project bay using the REAPER extension API. I think the nice thing about keeping the items in the arrangement is that people have immediate access to them.


@nym

Wanting a "MIDI sampler" in REAPER was my motivation for writing Playtime Yes, you can use external MIDI devices.



@jico27

Are you on W7 32-bit or 64-bit? I will try this later and see whether I can reproduce the problem.



@evosilica

I didn't try Playtime with AKAI APC40 but it wouldn't surprise me if it's working. Playtime works with Launchpad and Orbit, including visual feedback. So if APC40 has the same protocol like Launchpad, it's gonna work. You can just try it. Please let me know if it works. Thanks


@memyselfandus

What you are describing is exactly what Playtime does. You can also edit MIDI by clicking on a cell that contains a MIDI clip (opens up REAPER MIDI editor). Audio clips are zoomed on double click because REAPER itself is the audio editor.
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Old 11-15-2014, 11:26 AM   #88
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Just published an interview with Ben on the REAPER Blog

http://reaperblog.net/?p=1748
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Old 11-15-2014, 02:32 PM   #89
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I have read your latest interview, which is very easy to understand.

So "Playtime offers 64 buttons into which you can put loops. If you press one of these buttons, the corresponding loop starts to play. If you press a second button, a second loop will start to play, perfectly tempo-aligned with the first loop."

What if the loops are in different keys? Does Playtime put everything in one key automatically?

My sincere thanks,
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Old 11-15-2014, 03:07 PM   #90
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I have read your latest interview, which is very easy to understand.

So "Playtime offers 64 buttons into which you can put loops. If you press one of these buttons, the corresponding loop starts to play. If you press a second button, a second loop will start to play, perfectly tempo-aligned with the first loop."

What if the loops are in different keys? Does Playtime put everything in one key automatically?

My sincere thanks,
It doesn't. But you can shift the pitch in the item properties.
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Old 11-15-2014, 03:10 PM   #91
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Default Gave it a spin

Gave Playtime it a spin together with the just released Lemur for Android. Quickly modified a Lemur preset to match Playtime and seems to work great!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nwy0kPwCPX0

Cheers!
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Old 11-15-2014, 03:27 PM   #92
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Wicked stuff, thanks for sharing !
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Old 11-15-2014, 07:17 PM   #93
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awesome. just read the reaper blog articles on playtime. developer seems like a good dude.

keep going, you have my full support.

devs, please grant this man any and all api requests he makes... he is opening your program up to a huge market. I'd like him to weigh in on the native vs 3rd party debate. an open api seems to make nativity irrelevant
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Old 11-15-2014, 08:04 PM   #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nym View Post
an open api seems to make nativity irrelevant
I was going to argue that devs might not see making plugins, or features only available for REAPER users a valuable use of their time. On the other hand, Pro Tools only plugins are still being made, which is making less sense every day.
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Old 11-15-2014, 09:20 PM   #95
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good argument. my thinking in response is with a comparison to sws... not useful to anyone other than reaper users but still supported via api for 3rd party devs.
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Old 11-15-2014, 11:24 PM   #96
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jico27 View Post
Hi,

I now have a 'runtime error (at 14:170): Could not call proc' message.
I'm using W7 and also have the Mic Vis C++ 2013 installed.
I'm getting the same error on my W7 32 bit machine. It installed fine on my 64 bit laptop.

Great program, BTW!
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Old 11-16-2014, 03:16 AM   #97
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anybody any idea why i am not able to use the learn function ? it is not registering any midi-note from any of my midihardware. (which is working perfectly for other stuff in reaper)

update: when i assign trough plugin-fx parameter list-learn-slot(1,1) it works but the midi note is not shown in "midi note" any ideas ?

Last edited by nolman; 11-16-2014 at 04:11 AM.
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Old 11-16-2014, 05:07 AM   #98
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Hi nolman,

can you please insert a ReaControlMIDI fx into the fx chain at the first position, press the key you want to learn and let me know what the MIDI activity log says?



Then I might find out what the problem is.

Ben
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Old 11-16-2014, 09:10 AM   #99
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Trying this out right now, but I'm not really getting it... A tutorial video for the basic workflow would be great. ^_^

I'm not really interested in using this to trigger loops, but this seems like a quick way to sketch song arrangements. Not sure if I'll be able to accomplish what I'd like to do with this plugin though. Maybe you can consider the following as feature requests:

I would like to be able to select one of the cells, then press a hold pedal to trigger recording with preroll of a couple of beats (maybe also have it enable the metronome?).

Then I would play, say, a guitar riff, and press the hold pedal again. It would trim the clip to the closest bar length (8 bars for example), then start looping it.

Next I would select another cell, again enable the recording with the hold pedal, and record bass this time, maybe 4 bars. Again stop and it would trim & loop it to fit.

I'm not sure how to do this yet, or if it's even possible right now, but that would be an ideal workflow for me for quick sketching. I don't need separate recording triggers for separate cells, but instead one global trigger that would work for the selected cell.

Well, hopefully this is/will be possible with Playtime. It certainly seems like a powerful plugin. Thanks for working on implementing this quite popular feature into Reaper!

PS. Seriously classy website you got there!

PPS. "a CC-mappable action to record the currently selected slot" I see that this is already planned. Nice!
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Old 11-16-2014, 11:04 AM   #100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Seventh View Post
I would like to be able to select one of the cells, then press a hold pedal to trigger recording with preroll of a couple of beats (maybe also have it enable the metronome?).
There are threads on this forum on using reaper as "loop station" which is basically what you describe. I don't believe the methods they detail involve locking to an existing tempo: i think when you hit the magic key (or sustain pedal) the loop is immediately created, but i think there are now actions to "delay next action until next measure" that could achieve that (or did i just imagine seeing that come through in a pre a while back?).

Here's one of the threads: http://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=17238
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Old 11-16-2014, 12:59 PM   #101
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@Seventh

You will be able to do this as soon as this and this is implemented. These two features will come soon, I guess right after OS X support.

Ben
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Old 11-16-2014, 03:07 PM   #102
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found my problem : monitoring should be on for the track with playtime ?
now midi learn works.
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Old 11-16-2014, 03:12 PM   #103
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@Seventh

You will be able to do this as soon as this and this is implemented. These two features will come soon, I guess right after OS X support.

Ben
Sweet! I'll have my wallet ready.
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Old 11-16-2014, 04:34 PM   #104
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I want to ask.. is it possible to map individual keys on the typing keyboard to each block? is very easy to do in ableton live
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Old 11-16-2014, 09:22 PM   #105
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sunaj, try using the virtual midi keyboard for that, as it allows for keyboard triggering

otherwise, look at some key->midi translators, like bome's, or glovepie

----

regarding launchpad support: helgo, please allow midi out (for LED) customization for custom/less common controllers like the quneo, lemur, and customized launchpad devices.

basically, FR: if a cell is occupied with a clip and it is learned to a midi note, send a NOTE ON for that note out for LED purposes upon load and/or upon "refresh" command (since many of these devices can browse away to different modes and will need their LEDs refreshed). if the clip is stopped or deleted, send a NOTE OFF. if the clip is playing, send NOTE ONs and NOTE OFFs at a tempo synced interval.

users can and will route this to the device LED feedback input as necessary -- trust us to do this. please don't go the ableton/novation way and seize command of the device LEDs.

if this is at all confusing, please reach out and let's talk

Last edited by plamuk; 11-17-2014 at 10:23 AM.
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Old 11-16-2014, 09:53 PM   #106
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This looks excellent, helgoboss. I'm not able to test right now (OSX), but I'm curious... Is this stable enough to play live? Does the limit of 8 columns/slot groups restrict you to eight mixer channels? (And if so, are there any plans to increase that limit, and/or the scene limit?)

Quote:
Originally Posted by gpunk_w View Post
For me, this should have been built in to the project bay from day 1, the project bay may have had some use !
Absolutely. Come on Cockos, live a little. Splash out. Seize the day. One of those things.
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Old 11-17-2014, 10:12 AM   #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gates of Horn & Ivory View Post
Does the limit of 8 columns/slot groups restrict you to eight mixer channels? (And if so, are there any plans to increase that limit, and/or the scene limit?)
Quote:
Originally Posted by TonE View Post

8x8 are great, but why not allowing multiplications of this structure, e.g. 12 or better 128, one bank for each bank select message? Sending a bank select message to Playtime will shift to the correct bank of 8x8 clips. Each 8x8 matrix can be regard as a 'song playground' and you can design 128 'songs' in one go, for a bigger 'live set'.
It's a VSTi, load multiple instances.
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Old 11-17-2014, 10:20 AM   #108
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I like that columns aren't restricted to certain tracks, but still 8 concurrent loops is a bit low I think (I know you can load multiple instances, but would be good of you could keep it all in one instance)
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Old 11-17-2014, 10:22 AM   #109
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It would integrate much better into reaper if it could be docked directly, rather than in the fx browser. Is that possible, or is there an FR for it?
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Old 11-17-2014, 10:31 AM   #110
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You can't dock a plugin's GUI without the FX browser, limitation of Reaper.
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Old 11-17-2014, 10:50 AM   #111
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http://forum.cockos.com/project.php?issueid=5100

Here's the FR (turns out I'd already voted on it)

Everyone vote!
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Old 11-17-2014, 12:28 PM   #112
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Quote:
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That doesn't seem relevant.
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Old 11-18-2014, 11:40 AM   #113
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It is great!
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Old 11-18-2014, 05:31 PM   #114
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nolman View Post
found my problem : monitoring should be on for the track with playtime ?
now midi learn works.
Yes, input monitoring needs to be on (as in the track template). I just added this information to the user guide. Thanks.
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Old 11-18-2014, 05:52 PM   #115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nym View Post
sunaj, try using the virtual midi keyboard for that, as it allows for keyboard triggering

otherwise, look at some key->midi translators, like bome's, or glovepie

----

regarding launchpad support: helgo, please allow midi out (for LED) customization for custom/less common controllers like the quneo, lemur, and customized launchpad devices.

basically, FR: if a cell is occupied with a clip and it is learned to a midi note, send a NOTE ON for that note out for LED purposes upon load and/or upon "refresh" command (since many of these devices can browse away to different modes and will need their LEDs refreshed). if the clip is stopped or deleted, send a NOTE OFF. if the clip is playing, send NOTE ONs and NOTE OFFs at a tempo synced interval.

users can and will route this to the device LED feedback input as necessary -- trust us to do this. please don't go the ableton/novation way and seize command of the device LEDs.

if this is at all confusing, please reach out and let's talk
That's how the Launchpad support is implemented right now. Pure MIDI (see user guide section "Visual feedback with Launchpad and Co.").

Two differences however:
- "refresh" command not implemented. Do you know how that refresh command looks like? A special CC value?
- Tempo-synced NOTE ONs and NOTE OFFs are sent only if a clip is going to start soon (countdown)
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Old 11-18-2014, 06:04 PM   #116
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gates of Horn & Ivory View Post
This looks excellent, helgoboss. I'm not able to test right now (OSX), but I'm curious... Is this stable enough to play live? Does the limit of 8 columns/slot groups restrict you to eight mixer channels? (And if so, are there any plans to increase that limit, and/or the scene limit?)
Concerning stability for live use, until now nobody has reported a crash to me yet. But of course Playtime is pretty young. Time will show. If someone experiences a Playtime-related crash, please report it on the issue tracker.

The 8 columns/slot groups don't restrict you to eight mixer channels. Each clip can be on a different mixer channel (track).
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Old 11-18-2014, 06:11 PM   #117
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TonE View Post
Hey boss,

8x8 are great, but why not allowing multiplications of this structure, e.g. 12 or better 128, one bank for each bank select message? Sending a bank select message to Playtime will shift to the correct bank of 8x8 clips. Each 8x8 matrix can be regard as a 'song playground' and you can design 128 'songs' in one go, for a bigger 'live set'.
That would actually not be that difficult. There's also no big GUI change involved. I already put a similar feature request to myself.

Quote:
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Offline, Online thing is important with midi file references and using external midi processors, my favourite is Keykit by Tim Thompson, its command line variant, lowkey.exe in the Keykit package, what I mentioned already a few times in this forum. If you want to use such an external midi processor with Reaper, those referenced midi files inside Reaper have to be 'released' first, this is done with selecting those midi items, changing their status to OFFLINE, now you can process those midi files with your own keykit code, via command line, when command is finished, taking 1 or 2 seconds usually, switching back the processed items to ONLINE and Reaper will update to the new versions. You can do all above in one go, if you use AutoHotkey, triggering required Reaper actions from there, too. In practice it means, press one hotkey, finished. Exactly as you do in Reaper itself, only here, this is an external processor. If you say, Playtime does not cut any of those 'external processing capabilities', everything still will be correctly updated EVEN inside Playtime, then great. Another reason Ableton can go home, to Berlin.
OK, now I get the online offline thing. Makes sense. Yes, Playtime doesn't cut any of those external processing capabilities.
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Old 11-18-2014, 06:12 PM   #118
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I've tried the demo and this looks pretty neat.

Does anyone know how PayPal works if the price is shown only in euros and you want to pay in US dollars? Is the amount converted at the point of sale?

Thanks-

-Susan
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Old 11-18-2014, 06:18 PM   #119
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Quote:
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I like that columns aren't restricted to certain tracks, but still 8 concurrent loops is a bit low I think (I know you can load multiple instances, but would be good of you could keep it all in one instance)
I want to extend this in future (FR). But in order to resolve a possible misunderstanding: There can be only 8 concurrent loops per scene right now, yes. But if you disable "exclusive mode", you can play several concurrent loops in one column. Then you have 64 concurrent loops in total. Already now.
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Old 11-18-2014, 06:19 PM   #120
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Quote:
Originally Posted by todd_r View Post
http://forum.cockos.com/project.php?issueid=5100

Here's the FR (turns out I'd already voted on it)

Everyone vote!
Just voted
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