OFFICIAL REALITY CHECK

[gofer]

Originally Posted by gpunk_w

The clique i mentioned was the comments along the line of, only say nice things or we will ask you to leave!!
If it isn't in this thread it will be in the thread this was split off from

You got me looking and no, I totally can't find even a single comment in neither thread that would be anywhere near that line...

[Win Conway]

Originally Posted by camerondye

we have no problem asking people to be cool or leave.

This guy isn't anything to do with Cockos as far as i know, so he wont be asking anyone to leave.
But anyway, yeah it near that line, sorry I was lazy and didn't read the thread to quote earlier

[gofer]

He may talk about asking someone to leave, but I don't read him as you are supposed to say "only nice things" or something. Plus, he is the only one even mentioning the "leave" part. Hardly makes a clique?

[gridlove]

I hate to add more to this topic but I can`t resist...

http://www.aneclecticmind.com/2008/0...y-forums-suck/

..and if you can`t be bothered to read it all heres a little snip...


"In today’s anonymous Internet world, where the vast majority of users prefer to hide behind an alias or cryptic user ID, these forums are populated by people who simply don’t care about the feelings of fellow participants. Most of them are rude know-it-alls who get more satisfaction out of blasting a fine point in someone else’s post than actually contributing helpful information.

As a result, many of these forums, which are often relied upon by large companies to provide technical support to their customers, are a frustrating mix of information — which may or may not be correct — and personality clashes. Their value is questionable — I’d go so far as to say that most of them are a complete waste of time."

[macmurphy]

Originally Posted by gpunk_w

(there is only one reality and we all share it)

as a subscriber to the 'many worlds' theory i have to respectfully disagree.

there are many realities and we share them all.

[zappsunzorn]

Originally Posted by macmurphy

as a subscriber to the 'many worlds' theory i have to respectfully disagree.

there are many realities and we share them all.

But there is only one set of principles that we all have to learn, and live by, or suffer the consequences.

[Tomm]

I too believe people shouldn't take what's said on a forum too personal. If you work hard on something and post it online, you should be prepared to face some harsh criticisms, because people can "get away" with voicing their true opinions here without much of any repercussions.

That's the reality of the internet and how humans interact. Is it ideal? No, but if you are so sensitive that a small poorly worded post gets you in the dumps then you might want to reconsider where you are spending your time.

You also have the choice to ignore comments if you expect they will damage you, so you could practice doing that. Again, it sucks that anyone would feel threatened but it's the reality of the situation.

Moderators can be given the freedom to screen posts and only show positive or nicely worded criticisms. They do that in some forums, so if you are the sensitive type you could easily find those to spend your time in.

Ultimately, it's in everyone's best interest if we all respect each other and not personally attack or intentionally try to put anyone down. We should all try and support each other in our individual interests, because we all want to be happy about what we are doing in this life, right? Always put yourself in another person's shoes before posting something. If just for a moment, imagine you are them and you are reading the words you wrote. It's pretty easy, and a good rule for all endeavors in and outside the internet.

[gofer]

Originally Posted by Tomm

That's the reality of the internet and how humans interact. Is it ideal? No, but if you are so sensitive that a small poorly worded post gets you in the dumps then you might want to reconsider where you are spending your time.

You also have the choice to ignore comments if you expect they will damage you, so you could practice doing that. Again, it sucks that anyone would feel threatened but it's the reality of the situation.

I totally agree with the gist of your post, but the quote above assumes that people who do react to the bully posts are actually "in the dump" or damage is done on them. That is by far not always the case. Some (I assume the most) react because they just don't want to leave the bullying uncommented.
It's part of reality just the same.
Of course it's often just fuel to the heat or troll feeding, but at times I'll take that risk.


What I mean is, this:

Originally Posted by Tomm

If you ...[snip]... post it online, you should be prepared to face some harsh criticisms

applies to the poster of the harsh critic just as well.

The thing that just doesn't gel with me is that all rights are reserved for the rude guy, because he's allowed to word his critic as he might see fit and that's reality and all, but those who call BS on them are too sensitive, offended, damaged and should go look elsewhere.

[macmurphy]

Originally Posted by zappsunzorn

But there is only one set of principles that we all have to learn, and live by, or suffer the consequences.

very true.

[Tomm]

Originally Posted by gofer

applies to the poster of the harsh critic just as well.

I agree.

Originally Posted by gofer

The thing that just doesn't gel with me is that all rights are reserved for the rude guy, because he's allowed to word his critic as he might see fit and that's reality and all, but those who call BS on them are too sensitive, offended, damaged and should go look elsewhere.

I wouldn't say they should look elsewhere, but they are free to do so. They are also free to use the "Report Post" button on the left. The moderators are then free to take certain actions. I have no problem with a forum that deletes posts that are obviously disrespectful or troll baiting. It depends largely on the maturity level of the forum in general. Like has been said before this is not exactly a public area and anything goes... there can be a certain amount of control against bad behavior.

[ivansc]

Originally Posted by Tomm

I agree.

They are also free to use the "Report Post" button on the left.

I KNOW I have seen report post button somewhere but for the life of me I cant see one on here..

[Tomm]

Originally Posted by ivansc

I KNOW I have seen report post button somewhere but for the life of me I cant see one on here..

It won't be there if you aren't logged in.

[White Tie]

Originally Posted by Forum Rules

By agreeing to these rules, you warrant that you will not post any messages that are obscene, vulgar, sexually-oriented, hateful, threatening, or otherwise violative of any laws.

The owners of Cockos Confederated Forums reserve the right to remove, edit, move or close any thread for any reason.

As you can see, the line is quite high, depending on your definition of 'hateful'

Everyone should take note of the second paragraph though; we regularly have people bleating on about their rights and their freedom of speech and so forth, oblivious to the reality that rights and free speech are valued and preserved here, as an integral and positive value of the forum, but that is a courtesy and no more. They have agreed to the rules. As it happens, the culture on this forum is to moderate with a very, very gentle hand ...and that's a good thing that we all benefit from daily. But its certainly not based on anyone's 'rights'.

There's something very meta when, as a courtesy, a moderator (such as I) respectfully preserves everything someone has said, even if some of it lacks courtesy, as they complain about their rights while other try to point out the value of courtesy.

Originally Posted by Tomm

I too believe people shouldn't take what's said on a forum too personal. If you work hard on something and post it online, you should be prepared to face some harsh criticisms, because people can "get away" with voicing their true opinions here without much of any repercussions.

That's the reality of the internet and how humans interact. Is it ideal? No, but if you are so sensitive that a small poorly worded post gets you in the dumps then you might want to reconsider where you are spending your time.

Again, its very important we all make sure we are talking about the same thing here; not criticism. Rudeness. Criticism can be absolute and unequivocal but polite, constructive and encouraging. And so it should be, and that's a reasonable thing to request and expect. Most of us here work and/or play in creative environments; we know this to be true. Theming is a creative endeavour in very much the same way.

I completely understand what you are saying about the internet Tomm. Indeed, I pontificated with much windbaggery about it here. But I don't think we need to take it lying down (would you not agree?), the internet is just an extension of society as a whole these days, not the preserve of netizens and their oddness. And anyhoo, this is the Reaper forum, dammit. Its always been much nicer than the internet at large. Anyone who stands up against the degrading of that tradition has my utmost respect, no matter how futile it may be

Much of theming is subjective, so one person's criticism is only valid for them on such factors and should be presented as such. Some things are beyond the control of the themer, and generally speaking it is the themer who will know best what they are. Some things will be compromises the themer has been forced into by theme engine, or by a need to satisfy differing objectives. They fight this battle alone, voluntarily, and for no reward. It is fair and appropriate for them to request a little consideration, and it is heart warming and community spirited when users support them as deserving it ...as long as they do it politely. The social contract is to be polite to one another and to treat with respect anyone who is voluntarily trying to help you or your community. To behave otherwise is to break that social contract, and I understand why that makes it them seem okay for onlookers to think "Right, you've broken the social contact, so I can now freely give you the abuse you deserve." Right on. But please, please don't. Some restraint gents. By all means speak up, but take the higher ground by being polite, or the whole thing will descend into a slanging match.

Using the 'report post' button is worthwhile, but note that all it does is summon a moderator. So if there's already a moderator in the thread then arguably its not going to achieve much!

[airon]

Originally Posted by gpunk_w

OFFICIAL REALITY CHECK

If a theme is released publicly, then the public has every right to say whatever they want about it, simple as that
This is a public forum right ? people can have opinions right ?

I doubt anybody is going to be insulted by somebody elses remarks on a forum, but it does always amuse me that defenders of such (In this case defending themers) is done by 3rd parties, where as the themers themselves could not give a fly f**k
Some people have created themes and done things in them that nobody else has done in any other theme (Myself included here) and never actually release them, why ? cause we couldn't care less what anybody else thinks or wants.
Harsh ? no REALITY

In all, to me this means, don't be too sensitive about critique of themes. You don't need to defend themers. The gray area from "not my thing" to douche-bag statements is very large, and there's no value in getting emotional about another users more or less sophisticated expression of taste.

We rarely have discussions about more than personal taste when it comes to themes anyway. Don't sweat it fellas. Be smart with your time.

[ivansc]

Originally Posted by Tomm

It won't be there if you aren't logged in.

And there was me thinking that was saying there were roadworks on the forum....

(grin)