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Old 05-31-2018, 05:12 PM   #1
Nonlinear
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Default v5.95pre5 - "Read" automation is behaving like "Trim/Read"

I don't know if this is specific to v5.91pre5 but it is observed here.

I have Volume automation on my master track. Global automation override is set to "None". The track automation is set to "Read" mode (not "Trim/Read") and I can still move the fader independently of automation data - with resultant change in output level.

"Read" mode is behaving like "Trim/Read".


BTW - I posted elsewhere that coming from another DAW (like Cubase) it is very confusing that "Read" mode does not update control positions unless the automation item is ARMed. IMHO, everything automated should be moving in "Read" mode.
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Old 06-01-2018, 01:04 AM   #2
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...it is very confusing that "Read" mode does not update control positions unless the automation item is ARMed. IMHO, everything automated should be moving in "Read" mode.
Yes, that would be great.
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Old 06-01-2018, 01:05 AM   #3
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Originally Posted by Nonlinear View Post
BTW - I posted elsewhere that coming from another DAW (like Cubase) it is very confusing that "Read" mode does not update control positions unless the automation item is ARMed. IMHO, everything automated should be moving in "Read" mode.
Nope. Envelopes are armed for whatever mode they're in. Not just for recording.
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Old 06-01-2018, 01:07 AM   #4
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...and you can have them be armed by default in prefs.
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Old 06-01-2018, 01:19 AM   #5
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...and you can have them be armed by default in prefs.
Yes, but i don't want everything to be written when touching. Especially when touching accidently.
Also, nothing is indicating if a parameter is automated (or is it?)
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Old 06-01-2018, 02:49 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by Nonlinear View Post
I have Volume automation on my master track. Global automation override is set to "None". The track automation is set to "Read" mode (not "Trim/Read") and I can still move the fader independently of automation data - with resultant change in output level.

"Read" mode is behaving like "Trim/Read".
No change to v5.90 here. Yes, you can adjust the fader in Read mode and can hear the changes while you do so. But you won't be writing over the already existing automation data in Read mode. So you can override but not overwrite the existing automation data in this mode.

In the Trim/Read mode the regular fader changes will not get written. However, using the envelope panel fader will trim the whole automation envelope or selected area.

Last edited by xpander; 06-01-2018 at 02:03 PM. Reason: Edited for accuracy; thanks Nonlinear
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Old 06-01-2018, 10:00 AM   #7
Nonlinear
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Nope. Envelopes are armed for whatever mode they're in. Not just for recording.
And that's where the confusion lies. When recording audio or MIDI "ARMed" means "ready to record". You do not have to arm those tracks for them to PLAY.

Automation should (and in other DAWs DOES) work that same way. If you want to deactivate that automation you should uncheck the box for it in the "Envelopes" control panel. Otherwise it should be actively PLAYING.

This is one feature of Reaper I DON'T like. If I have a big mix with lots of automation I don't want to babysit all the automation lanes. If something's automated and it's in "Read" mode I should see things moving on playback so I know what it's doing.

Last edited by Nonlinear; 06-01-2018 at 10:11 AM.
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Old 06-01-2018, 10:05 AM   #8
Nonlinear
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On the other hand, in the Trim/Read mode your fader changes will get written as the automation envelope offset.
That's not how it works per the user's manual:

"Trim/Read Existing envelopes are applied, but on-screen controls do not move. Trim/Read mode might seem strange at first, but it does bring you a useful benefit. You can use a track’s controls for overall changes.
FADER MOVEMENTS ARE NOT RECORDED. For example, adjusting a track’s Volume fader in this mode will raise or lower the volume for the whole track relative to the envelope."

And that is how READ mode is behaving - and why I posted this issue here. "Trim" mode in other DAWs (and most consoles) does what you say - it adds another layer of data to the existing automation that can be merged with it. That's not how it works here.

When a track is in "READ" mode you should not be able to change the control positions independent of the automation data.

Last edited by Nonlinear; 06-01-2018 at 10:16 AM.
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Old 06-01-2018, 01:54 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by Nonlinear View Post
FADER MOVEMENTS ARE NOT RECORDED. For example, adjusting a track’s Volume fader in this mode will raise or lower the volume for the whole track relative to the envelope."
I apologize, I should've been more accurate with my description. Track or mixer control panel fader movements are indeed not recorded in Trim/Read mode. The envelope panel fader (knob) movements are. That is described in the user guide as well;
Quote:
18.11 The Envelope Panel Controls
The envelope panel's fader is used to write automation (write, latch or touch modes), show automation changes (read mode) or adjust the parameter value for the entire track or selected envelope segment (trim/read mode).
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