Old 07-20-2018, 08:25 PM   #161
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Wow. So these 2 still think they're not creating noise huh? Kiddos must feel pretty special. Sorry I know this is noise as well but I couldn't help but make this just a tad more ironic.
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Old 07-20-2018, 10:42 PM   #162
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Wow. So these 2 still think they're not creating noise huh? Kiddos must feel pretty special. Sorry I know this is noise as well but I couldn't help but make this just a tad more ironic.
Here comes the man with the whip! : ) Anyway. Peace
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Old 07-21-2018, 12:38 AM   #163
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First, thank you very much for this unexpected gem of a feature.

The one general feedback I have at the moment: it would be really really nice if you made sure to test further wiring diagram design/functionality decisions with large enough VI projects also . I'm not saying you aren't doing that now, but you know, thinking out loud here just in case. Things like having plenty of multi-out instruments loaded (tens of instances), and multiple separate MIDI tracks routed to every such instrument instance, the output channels sending stuff to different buses, etc etc. The way this view evolves and how decisions are made on the graph handling and view scrolling and all such stuff... then leads to a finished view that can scale up gracefully in very large routing scenarios, too.

At the moment, the experience with large routings is pretty much this, heh: https://i.imgur.com/WATC7NE.mp4

Also, adding my +1 to the comments calling out the out of place and drawn out commentary in this thread:

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Originally Posted by foxAsteria View Post
Wow. So these 2 still think they're not creating noise huh? Kiddos must feel pretty special. Sorry I know this is noise as well but I couldn't help but make this just a tad more ironic.
Count me in with all you said there. Including the irony.

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you don't know me so probably you shouldn't make assumptions about my self. Anyway.
People don't know you, but they know how you behave in this thread. In other words: reading what you have posted here, in context and in chronological order, and the exact content and meaning of it -- that is, also taking into account what has been written to you, and how you respond to it -- gives plenty of material to base assumptions on. This was simply the wrong place to go for what you were going for; the way you also include subtle shifts of meaning and logic when your actions are being directly criticized is just solidifying the distinctly negative impression you're creating. If you feel like the assumptions are wrong, then it should also be easy for you to stop behaving like a person who would likely match those unflattering interpretations.

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Old 07-21-2018, 01:18 AM   #164
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Originally Posted by Bri1 View Post
rulez are to be broken-riight?
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your like the forum cop who aint got a badge
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Here comes the man with the whip!
This is, by design, a low-moderation forum, but there are moderators. Hi! If you want to see my badge, its at the bottom left of your screen.

Generally, I would not expect to need to moderate in a thread where the boss himself has already asked for more considered posting discipline. But OK... read THIS .

Justin and Schwa read the rest of the forum, not just pre-release threads. They comment more here because this is an active working environment. If your comment is off-topic, they aren't any more likely to reply on it here than if you'd made it in the correct forum, but its far less likely to be effective because rather than inspiring a discussion about what you have to say, you're just going to start a row about where you posted it, which obviously isn't very productive.

If regular users are telling you that what you are posting is out of place, that's part of the process of keeping this an effective working environment, you should listen to them. The next level of censure would be for some draconian moderation by a certified bastard. Hi! And that would be a temporary ban. Which would be madness, right? We don't want to do that, its simply not in the character of this place.


Post whatever you like, all feedback is welcome. However..
If its not about the current pre-release version,
keep it out of the pre-release thread
.
These are strictly for the nitty-gritty. Thanks!
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Old 07-21-2018, 01:27 AM   #165
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The one general feedback I have at the moment: it would be really really nice if you made sure to test further wiring diagram design/functionality decisions with large enough VI projects also . I'm not saying you aren't doing that now, but you know, thinking out loud here just in case. Things like having plenty of multi-out instruments loaded (tens of instances), and multiple separate MIDI tracks routed to every such instrument instance, the output channels sending stuff to different buses, etc etc. The way this view evolves and how decisions are made on the graph handling and view scrolling and all such stuff... then leads to a finished view that can scale up gracefully in very large routing scenarios, too.

At the moment, the experience with large routings is pretty much this, heh: https://i.imgur.com/WATC7NE.mp4
You're absolutely on the money by trying to post a video; the deeper a project goes into your own working methods and idiosyncrasies, the more it will differ from anyone else's arrangement of whatever constitutes a 'large project' and so the more likely that it will highlight problems and/or opportunities that simply hadn't yet been considered. Great stuff!

However, I'm afraid your link is broken. Could you please try again, or try a screenshot or a licecap perhaps?
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Old 07-21-2018, 01:30 AM   #166
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@Lunar - I hear ya, but I don't think there's much point in posting here anymore, as there's already a new pre-release. Hopefully these kids have the sense not to start trolling that thread as well.

I've made a new thread where I hope to distill the best feedback on the promising new track wiring feature so that hopefully we can all have our cake and eat it too!
https://forum.cockos.com/showthread....10#post2014110
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Old 07-21-2018, 02:10 AM   #167
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@Lunar - I hear ya, but I don't think there's much point in posting here anymore, as there's already a new pre-release. Hopefully these kids have the sense not to start trolling that thread as well.
Haha, yep, I noticed pre2 was out before deciding to participate in the off topic stuff here (and yeah, definitely not there)

Incidentally, imgur seems to have removed my short screen cap video of the wiring view, linked above. I checked the link and confirmed it working before linking, so hmm, I don't know... It's either a temporary glitch or somehow triggering an automatic removal for what ever reason. In any case, nothing that important, the capture just showed a large project with huge swaths of hanging patch cords crisscrossing the screen, and scrolling that abstract vista from left to right
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Old 07-21-2018, 02:12 AM   #168
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However, I'm afraid your link is broken. Could you please try again, or try a screenshot or a licecap perhaps?
Echo, the video got auto-removed for some reason, or is temporarily glitching. I confirmed it working (using post preview and clicking on the actual link) before posting. Just a sec, I'll post it somewhere else.
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Old 07-21-2018, 02:14 AM   #169
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Link def doesn't work here. It might work for you because it's in the browser cache.
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Old 07-21-2018, 02:41 AM   #170
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Link def doesn't work here. It might work for you because it's in the browser cache.
Yep, that's what I noticed. Confirmed working when previewing my post (loaded it using that very url in the preview post, straight from imgur), but then noticed the same link stopped working a moment after posting. Something changed on the imgur side, afterwards, for some reason.

No biggie, here is the general vibe the video was conveying, nothing that informative, just an illustration of how it currently feels with a hefty amount of routings :

https://i.imgur.com/BzYY2Oy.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/loQN7Nv.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/WusLyRe.png
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Old 07-21-2018, 03:21 AM   #171
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Well said, White Tie, well said indeed! All my thumbs are up.
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Old 07-21-2018, 04:49 AM   #172
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Meanwhile 5.94pre2 has been posted. And BTW, I love the wiring diagram, but would also love to see this for the FX window to create complex FX routing like Studio One. Would be killer for sound design.
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Old 07-21-2018, 05:05 AM   #173
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Zoom functionnality inside this new window would be a good thing.
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Old 07-21-2018, 05:15 AM   #174
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Zoom, and filtering of module and wire visibility based on track/send/etc name, pretty much.
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Old 07-21-2018, 05:17 AM   #175
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Meanwhile 5.94pre2 has been posted. And BTW, I love the wiring diagram, but would also love to see this for the FX window to create complex FX routing like Studio One. Would be killer for sound design.
similar to this ? -> https://vimeo.com/113368060 (Product seems like dead)

- This is a long standing feature request, see FR forum.
- There are several scripts that do something similar.
- A combination of both obviously will be requested, as well: e.g. routing an output signal from one track - or even an output signal of a dedicated plugin in the FX chain of one track - to the input of a dedicated plugin in the FX chain of another track, whithout the user needing to bother with the additional track channels necessary for this.
- when offering a pin routing "beautification", it would make sense to allow for "macro plugins", i.e. a combination of multiple plugins with fixed internal routing, that can be instantiated (of course multiple times) in the same manner as a normal VST or JSFX plugin. Ideally, "macro plugins" would be able to be cascaded.
- when offering "macro plugins", it would make a lot of sense, to have those show controls for "macro parameters", i.e. turning those would turn multiple parameters of any of the contained child-plugins via user definable functions (of course the parameters of macro plugins are automatable).

-Michael

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Old 07-21-2018, 05:21 AM   #176
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- This is a long standing feature request, see FR forum.
Right on, I'm for all those FR in the FR forum about related set of features. I guess my point for bringing it up here is to express my excitement for this direction, and that now we are SO CLOSE to having it in theory, all those FR could possibly use an update now that we have this wiring diagram capability that could bring all that we are hoping for and more, since the fundamentals are laid down with this.
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Old 07-21-2018, 05:33 AM   #177
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As the devs seem to be on that track, anyway, I am inclined to spread the word outside of this spam-ridden thread, even if I (a non "optical" guy) am not likely to use it myself.

-Michael
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Old 07-21-2018, 05:38 AM   #178
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lolz--ok,so where are we @ now? insults,ok,so that is how it rolls here,obvious.
feedback: wiring is well broken,i guess that's gonna mean a lot more (fixing!)

@White Tie-- have'nt you also got a lot of work left to do> namely,wt imperial v5? where is it m8?
you have blantantly just ignored precious peoples wishes,and ignored posts--- way to go m8.
roll on v6-where the magic is all revealed,and everything just works...yay.
glhf,grownups,us kiddies will be waiting for more sweets that will ruin our smiles,coz willy wonky is good to us i'm sure.
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Old 07-21-2018, 05:47 AM   #179
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@Bri1, I appreciate your frustration, but could you *please* keep that to other threads than pre-release threads? We all have things we want/wish/need and it's very distracting in this kind of thread. Reaper is far from perfect, but so are all other DAWs. The fact that we can engage right here with the devs 1-on-1 during pre-releases is a great benefit to us all -- please respect their wishes to keep these kinds of comments in other threads. They are not censoring you BTW, they are trying to keep the process moving forward and they are being remarkably open about it compared to other devs. I'd hate to see them change their open style of development and close off the pre-release forum if these kinds of threads become places that distract from the actual purpose of the thread.
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Old 07-21-2018, 05:52 AM   #180
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@White Tie-- have'nt you also got a lot of work left to do> namely,wt imperial v5? where is it m8?
The same goes for you what I (and others) said to deeb. This only ^ shows the lack of understanding context, and it can be interpreted as arrogance, and not understanding what is appropriate behavior on a forum. This isn't an insult, it's just pointing out you are really, really out of place with all of this commentary in this thread, and end up looking like a jerk when you repeatedly back it up with multiple defensive rhetoric devices.
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Old 07-21-2018, 05:56 AM   #181
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They are not censoring you BTW
The admins should move really unrelated / offending / ill phrased posts away (e.g. to the "Nitpicks") from this subforum !

-Michael
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Old 07-21-2018, 05:57 AM   #182
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fetidus,i wish to help and show total honesty about all of what reaper can,or cannot do..i really like the programme and obviously want the very best of the best especially great to be able to test----but i just do not see logic here.
cockos put this into public view(pun) with 0 instructions of what they expect these things to do..ok it's clear to some what appears,but others need some type of labellings or something...no tool tips?

how is anything expected to be tested, if there is no intended working goal or aim of new for any feature/plug's existence.?

cockos could simply say "hi guyz,girlz...we have this new wiring view-- we expect this to do this,and that todo that...can you please check both this+that"
^without this or that--people are simply left scratching head+balls trying to figure it all out for themselves if no tips or labels are supplied to begin.
there is a lot more noise here than what i create which is not being checked.

++honestly,i am the very last person who wants to knock or complain about other people's work-i wish they just done a tighter job to begin so they save themselves the actual embarrasment of being called out on it.sorry bout that m8's. but..i will if i feel.
simple. over n out.

Last edited by Bri1; 07-21-2018 at 06:08 AM. Reason: 1Xtra.
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Old 07-21-2018, 06:05 AM   #183
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fetidus,i wish to help and show total honesty about all of what reaper can,or cannot do..i really like the programme and obviusly want the very best of the best especially great to be able to test----but i just do not see logic here.
This goes into the defensive rhetorics territory. The logic is, if you had simply pointed out you'd like the wiring view to have more labeling and a more clearly explained layout, you would have been 100% on topic. Instead you went on a rant and touched a number of subjects you are unhappy about (just read your first posts, attacking the very idea that a pre-release has an iterative experiment/fix cycle) -- and then took that even further in several defensive replies when people kept pointing out this is well outside the scope of what is being discussed here. These are separate things, and you can't just rhetorically make all of that "more helpful" and "more logical" after the fact. It was what it was. Now is a good time to let it rest, hah.

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over n out.
Likewise !
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Old 07-21-2018, 06:08 AM   #184
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fetidus,i wish to help and show total honesty about all of what reaper can,or cannot do..i really like the programme and obviously want the very best of the best especially great to be able to test----but i just do not see logic here.
cockos put this into public view(pun) with 0 instructions of what they expect these things to do..ok it's clear to some what appears,but others need some type of labellings or something...no tool tips?

how is anything expected to be tested, if there is no intended working goal or aim of new for any feature/plug's existence.?

cockos could simply say "hi guyz,girlz...we have this new wiring view-- we expect this to do this,and that todo that...can you please check both this+that"
^without this or that--people are simply left scratching head+balls trying to figure it all out for themselves if no tips or labels are supplied to begin.
there is a lot more noise here than what i create which is not being checked.
simple. over n out.
Right on, I totally understand what you are saying. And that is great feedback IMO for the developers. But please, just not HERE in the pre-release section.

I've got my own issues with Reaper, but I've finally figured out how the devs work, more or less. Justin and Schwa are NOT typical developers. Their unique approach puts them right here, out in the open with everyone (which is fantastic), but they also have a philosophy that takes a bit to wrap your head around. And it can be both brilliant and frustrating. Inspiring and cryptic. But it eventually makes sense.

They are very unlikely to change their approach, BUT they are totally accessible, and extremely reasonable, and they do pay attention. So if you bring up your points in another thread/area, and start a discussion about something, you'll be much more effective IMO. In this kind of thread, it's not helpful though.

My two bits. And now I better back out of the thread, since I'm starting to be distracting.
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Old 07-21-2018, 06:23 AM   #185
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185 comments on the thread!
Probably 1 bug report!

All the rest, with a few exceptions are: feature requests, and noise qualifiers, and push forward comments like "go go go" just as valid/noisy as "don't don't go" comments should be.

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Old 07-21-2018, 08:47 AM   #186
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There was more than one bug report, but whatev'.
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Old 07-21-2018, 09:02 AM   #187
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This only ^ shows the lack of understanding context,
Sometimes it's also the horror of, and inability to come to terms with being wrong from time to time. I blocked that dude long ago due to that and grammar that is so terrible you can't even tell what he means half the time.
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Old 07-21-2018, 09:38 AM   #188
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+ Track wiring diagram view
Hey guys, looking good!
-Many of the wires go off the screen. I think this is to avoid visual 'interference', but they're spaced out a bit too far.

-Also, can you add a feature that allows you to click on the wire to highlight it? That would make it much easier to trace.

-Maybe even add a separate function to colour the wires (right-click on wire shows simple colour palette. This could even be inherited from the properties of the connection.)

-Can we get tabs for Grouping Matrix, Routing Matrix, Wiring please? (The same appearance as toolbar tabs.)

-Is this the beginning of post-fader FX?


Thanks so much,
Dax.
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Old 07-21-2018, 10:42 AM   #189
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This is my last bit of noise and then I'll butt out. Thankful for brand new innovative features, will forever buy/promote/talk-up Reaper, just flabbergasted by prioritization.

Folks, Copy and Paste (of all things!) is super broken!!! This isn't a pet feature, it's not a feature at all, it's literally the knife and fork being dirty at a 4-star restaurant and we're being offered new desserts!

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Originally Posted by ferropop View Post
ABLETON:


Result: Exact duplication of selection


REAPER:


Result:
1. Track-2 volume automation chopped at edge of item. Bye-bye reverb/delay tail.
2. Track-3 volume automation broken up into pieces. Bye-bye reverb/delay tail.
3. Track-4 automation not even copied because there are no items.

...now throw Automation Items into this mess.

This is just the tiniest example of just how flawed the current duplication is in Reaper Again, Reaper destroys Ableton in a million other ways, but this is Such core functionality that is going to drive the new crop away immediately.

I just want Reaper to be the best it can be!!! This would get it 99% of the way there.
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Old 07-21-2018, 02:34 PM   #190
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Folks, Copy and Paste (of all things!) is super broken!!!
Have you tried tip from Kenny's video...
Time Selection Editing in REAPER
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RiWY...youtu.be&t=450

Seems to work OK here (Win7),...
Alt+Right mouse drag to select area/marquee items.
Shift+Control+C to copy.
Set edit cursor, Control+V to paste.

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Old 07-21-2018, 05:15 PM   #191
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Just a thought. It maybe just me, but it seems very difficult to negotiate the schematic diagram view in complex, or large projects. I'm thinking a schematic diagram navigator, similar to the project navigator window might be useful?
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Old 07-22-2018, 07:11 PM   #192
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Just some more noise.
Move along
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Old 07-26-2018, 06:40 AM   #193
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Default Plugin wiring diagram view

Hello from Portugal!

I'm a newbie here and i don't know if it is the correct place to ask if is possible to do the same modular wiring (midi and audio) between plugins on the same FX track like we have in other software like DDMF Metaplugin,Image Line Minihost,etc...

If not, I think it was a very welcome and useful feature!

I apologize for any grammar errors and my limited english, it is not my native language.

My best regards

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