Old 01-11-2019, 08:01 AM   #1
The Bunker
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Default Seriously considering dumping Reaper for good

I have been a long time enthusiastic Reaper user and have been getting deeper and deeper with the software spending many hours customising it to work with my workflow. But I am finding it sooo buggy these days when it comes to its compatibility with VSTs that I amseriously considering moving onto something else. I really don't want to be doing this and want to keep using Reaper but I have gotten to a point where I just don't know how to get it to work anymore.

For example I am just starting a project, I haven't even gotten much content into the project yet a couple of synth and drum machine tracks and I have gone and created all my BUSSES and FX Return tracks, loaded a few reverbs, EQs, Comps and so on and now it has just gotten to a point where everytime I try to load another VST its like Russian Roulette whether it loads or not. I usually have to unload another VST before it will load the next one. And I have no idea why this is happening and its been very frustrating constantly trying to fix something in reaper. I have a mixture of VST2 and VST3 plugins loaded majority of which are 64bit with maybe 1 or 2 32bit plugins here and there.

Would gladly shoot the project file along to someone to have a look at to see if they can see something I am not seeing but if I can't work this one out I am really considering trying something else.
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Old 01-11-2019, 08:11 AM   #2
Coachz
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VSTs are sometimes problematic. Once you know what VSTs you can rely on you will be much happier. Feel free to post the project to dropbox with any specific issues please. Reaper is the best in my world by large measure to the competitors so as long as I delete crappy vsts I'm very happy overall.
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Old 01-11-2019, 08:14 AM   #3
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Set the option to start each plug-in in its own process (Plug-ins/Compatibility/VST bridging/In dedicate process per-plugin).
If REAPER still crash: replace your computer or audio interface.
If REAPER no longer crash: find the plug-in which is crashing and visit corresponding forum/support.

Sure, you have other options. Like replacing the DAW.
* some DAWs will not allow you to load 32bit plug-ins at all, except throw some external wrapper
* most other DAWs will not allow you to identify problematic plug-ins
* for reduced price of REAPER, other DAWs can limit you in number of tracks or effects. Or you can start with some "free" DAW, they will allow everything but in case of problems you can paint corresponding complains on your own wall.
Sure, that will help you with your original problem
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Old 01-11-2019, 08:17 AM   #4
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@aslow3, would setting it to Only Native (disable bridging) on my 64 bit Windows 7 only allow 64 bit plugs ?
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Old 01-11-2019, 08:30 AM   #5
The Bunker
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Hi guys,

Thanks for the quick replies. Yea I am actually not meaning to be crapping on Reaper at all, my experience has been that Reaper has been my favourite DAW to use for years and I would be very reluctant to shit to another DAW. I stil sometimes use Pro Tools and by no means prefer it over Reaper.

After writing that first post I have actually started reading some online discussions on various forums about the FLS limit of Windows 10 and I am thinking considering how Reaper has been behaving that this might actually have something to do with what is happening. Because as soon as I think I am finding the supposedly "bad plugin" and removing it and loading another, the next plugin I come to load after that seems to not want to load which is making me think I am hitting some sort of invisible ceiling with regards to how many instances of plugins I am allowed to have at any given time and that I am wrongly blaming this behaviour on the DAW or some rogue plugin.

How can I test this theory though? Anyone have any idea?
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Old 01-11-2019, 08:38 AM   #6
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Ok after reading this thread (https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewt...68608&start=15), I am 100% certain this FLS limit is what I am up against.

Specially this section:

"In my case there is one other factor that caused me to hit the FLS limit much faster than most others. Within my setup I am using several Novation hardware devices to access each of my plugins with Automap software (using dedicated Automap profiles for each of my plugins). As a result, all my plugins are accessed through special Automap DLL files which then communicate with the corresponding plugin. But... I found that these Automap DLL files each need one additional FLS slot!! So in this situation, almost all plugins need at least 2 FLS slots... which makes the issue clearly worse (please note that all the FLS slot numbers I have given here above are the numbers without using Automap)."

The reason I say this is because there were times where if I closed an Automap version of a plugin that I thought was preventing me from loading another plugin and then opened its non-automap version all of a sudden I could load that particular plugin I thought I thought I couldn't. This falsely led me to believe there was just something wrong with Automap, but it seems that Automap just uses more FLS slots which explains why when I am near that limit unloading an Automaped plugin and loading its non-automaped version gives me an extra slot to play with.
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Old 01-11-2019, 08:43 AM   #7
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My usual advice to newbs on this, which since you aren`t a newb I assume you already tried, is to do a portable install and add your plugin paths one by one till reaper starts playing up again.

At least that would narrow it down.
Another area worth looking at is the order of the locations in your plugin lists, just in case that is messing with 32 bit v 64 bit - another fave cause of this sort of behaviour.


Sorry I cant offer much more in the way of help at this stage, but FWIW I regularly get issues with plugins, since I do beta testing for several developers & also run the betas in three other DAWs, but Reaper in general is pretty robust, usually coping with nasty plugs at LEAST as well as Studio One, Sonar, Tracktion & MixBus.
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Old 01-11-2019, 09:06 AM   #8
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News about FLS:
https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=7281357

PS if relevant, what is the FLS limit in Windows 7?
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Old 01-11-2019, 10:03 AM   #9
azslow3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coachz View Post
@aslow3, would setting it to Only Native (disable bridging) on my 64 bit Windows 7 only allow 64 bit plugs ?
Yes, 32bit plug-ins can not be loaded then. But you still will see them in the browser.
If you just want avoid adding 32bit plug-ins from the browser, you can set "NOT ( x86 )" in the Plug-ins/Only show FX matching filter string.

Quote:
For example I am just starting a project...
That was a bit misleading
Also it is a good idea to mention that you are using evil wrappers like Automap.
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Old 01-11-2019, 10:49 AM   #10
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Do I understand correctly from reading this that instances of bridged 32 bit plugins are limited? And that limit is OS related and beyond Reaper?
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Old 01-11-2019, 11:11 AM   #11
The Bunker
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Yea all this stuff is news to me... it is only fairly recently that I actually have a powerful enough computer that even lets me hit this FLS ceiling. Before it used to just be hitting the CPU or RAM ceiling. Now 20% CPU in and BAM no more plugins can be added to the project.
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Old 01-22-2019, 02:12 PM   #12
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What interests me and even more interesting why no-one else seems to ask is WHY CAN'T PEOPLE WHO WRITE THESE PROGRAMS EVER TELL YOU WHAT THE ISSUE IS - LIKE ERR " FLS LIMIT REACHED" IS THERE SOME REASON THIS IS NEVER DONE??????!!!!!!
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Old 01-22-2019, 02:15 PM   #13
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^It depends on what the exact underlying error the developer receives back from the OS is, sometimes it's specific, sometimes it is accurate but not specific, and sometimes it's just developers not taking the extra time.
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Old 01-22-2019, 05:28 PM   #14
Cranky Emu
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Bunker View Post
I have a mixture of VST2 and VST3 plugins loaded majority of which are 64bit with maybe 1 or 2 32bit plugins here and there.
Don't be so rash to toss it aside. I had problems with Reaper crashing every now and then for no apparent reason. It was one of the 32 bit VST's that was causing the problem. Projects without that VST - no problems, solid rock (great Aussie song too!). Those with it would crash Reaper, it took a bit to find due to:

- Sometimes it would crash on project load
- Sometimes run the whole project no issues (this was rare)
- Lucky to get 2 or 3 bars in before crashing

In my case it was a VST called Chorus CH-2, sad because I liked what it could do. Once I removed it from the chains, all was good again.

So start peeling off plugins one-by-one and see if that nets a culprit.
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