07-10-2021, 01:55 AM | #1 |
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What to use for a simple 5.1 headphone mix?
I am overwhelmed by the amount of software out there and about to do my first surround mix for a short film. The client wants it to be 5.1 and a stereo mixdown as well. What can you guys recommend for doing that with headphones only?
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07-10-2021, 02:45 PM | #2 |
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Have you checked the new ReaSurround plugin?
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07-10-2021, 03:45 PM | #3 |
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Yes, thanks! I think it would tick all the boxes regarding the mix itself (only thing missing would be a surround reverb). But I only have a pair of AKG K271 stereo headphones. So I was wondering if there is some good plugin or other software out there to emulate a 5.1 speaker monitoring.
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07-10-2021, 06:18 PM | #4 |
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Then, maybe look at the IEM ambisonic plugins: you can have a monitoring track with a binaural decoder for monitoring on headphones, and a "speakers" track on which you can setup the 5.1 array with the AllRADecoder plugin.
You can find an AllRAD json configuration file for the 7.1 setup here: https://git.iem.at/audioplugins/IEMP...s/7point1.json This file can be loaded in AllRAD to view and edit the speaker setup (you can remove the extra side speakers to make it 5.1, or create your own 5.1 from scratch). Last edited by sguyader; 07-10-2021 at 07:07 PM. |
07-12-2021, 08:25 AM | #5 |
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07-12-2021, 01:55 PM | #6 |
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So, this isn't "simple" per se, in that you need to buy some expensive plugins. But I typically mix in 5.1 while monitoring stereo by using the Nugen Halo plugins. All of my panning and routing stays 5.1 throughout. You can do this without a dedicated plugin though-
L to L at 0db R to R at 0db C to L at -3db C to R at -3db Ls to L at -3db Rs to R at -3db Lfe- mute I'm pretty sure you could set up an instance of ReaSurroundPan with these parameters, and put it on your main bus before the Master. Have found no success emulating 5.1 with headphones, unfortunately. On the plus side- for the majority of mixes I'm not sure you need it. |
07-12-2021, 09:00 PM | #7 |
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I second the IEM and Blue Ripple recommendations and use both. Having said that, I have yet to find a Binaural encoder that works adequately with my ears and I've tried plenty of them. The best I've achieved with Binaural over headphones is better left / right externalisation but nothing really convincing front / back or up / down.
In fact, the only convincing Binaural recordings I've heard are the virtual barber shop and a few others created with the Neumann Binaural head (ku100 I think from memory). In order for Binaural to be truly convincing, I'm suspecting I'd need to have a custom HRTF created for my ears and I don't have the funds for that.
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07-13-2021, 01:25 AM | #8 |
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Thank you so much for the valuable input, everyone! I guess the culprit always is a proper head tracker to really "feel" the surround in your headphones. I am willing to get one if I can first make the surround plugins work and understand. So, step by step I guess...
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07-13-2021, 02:12 AM | #9 |
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I was just testing Waves' NX head tracking system and although it is a rather small sweet spot I can work in, I was amazed by the ease-of-use together with ReaSurroundPan. Very straight forward workflow! If I was about to get a head tracker, what would you recommend? Thinking about TrackIR or a bluetooth device or even my phone strapped up on my head.. although that might just weigh too much over time.
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07-16-2021, 08:46 PM | #10 |
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I'm of the opinion that a head tracker would be most effective if the HRTF was well matched to the listener first. I haven't bothered finding one because I've yet to find a convincing HRTF.
Waves NX coloured the sound too much for my liking and didn't provide a very convincing image despite many hours of testing and tweaking it's settings.
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07-16-2021, 10:10 PM | #11 | |
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07-18-2021, 04:23 AM | #12 |
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There is no need to use ambisonics if you want to binauralize a 5.1 mix - at least not for a static rendering without head tracking. You can convolve the 6 channels with HRIRs or BRIRs (binaural room impulse responses). BRIRs will have a more coloured sound but (maybe) more effective externalisation.
I made a little 5.1 binaural example using the BBC listening room BRIRs (CC-BY-SA-4.0 License): https://stash.reaper.fm/v/42451/Binaural51-demo.zip I'm not sure if there is a simpler way to do the routing in the project. I wanted to put all the ReaVerbs on one track but couldn't figure it out. |
07-18-2021, 09:55 AM | #13 |
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You really need to have an Audio devise that has 6 outs. Put those outs on a 5.1 audio system and then finish your project.
You cannot really get good 5.1 results from headphones. Robert |
08-02-2021, 05:02 AM | #14 |
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Brief summary
Hey everyone, I just wanted to give a little update.
I am trying out two different head trackers at the moment. At first, Waves' NX arrived and I like the ease-of-use for a simple 5.1 mix very much. I only need it on my master track and an instance of ReaSurroundPan on each track and I am done! Although even with both, bluetooth and camera on, it keeps dropping out every now and then. Supperware's headtracker is much more reliable even with big head movements. I guess it also has to do with it being connected via USB instead of bluetooth. Since Supperware "only" supports Ambisonics and not Waves' NX, I went with the IEM plugin suite and am using the headtracker via OSC and the Scene Rotator plugin which works like a charm. I went for 3rd order Ambisonics (16 channels per track) to create the mix and then still need to find a good way to convert the final mix into stereo or 5.1 reliably. EDIT: I just saw that Blue Ripple comes with a simple 5.1 decoder, too and it has 16 inputs, so that one does sound a bit better as far as I can tell. I still need to hear it on a proper setup, obviously. A lot of confusion still, but getting there and having a head tracker makes this new way of mixing very enjoyable! Oh, and does anyone know where I can get Ambisonic room tones??? Last edited by timothys_monster; 08-02-2021 at 05:41 AM. |
08-02-2021, 04:35 PM | #15 | |
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08-04-2021, 01:13 PM | #16 | |
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I really like the IEM stuff too but the Blue Ripple decoders sound better to me by a fair margain. The rest of the IEM suite is just as good quality wise as Blue Ripple though from my experience.
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08-05-2021, 10:28 PM | #17 | |
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https://www.boomlibrary.com/sound-ef...-tones-europe/ 2x40 (just pad to 51) https://shop.prosoundeffects.com/pro...opean-capitals 51, unknown order https://freesound.org/search/?q=room...advanced=0&g=1 usually SMPTE 51 , but also CCAT https://www.asoundeffect.com/sound-l...-2-o2a-stereo/ 2oA Ambix https://shop.prosoundeffects.com/pro...ffects-library 1oA , probably fuma?? |
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