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Old 08-14-2013, 08:34 AM   #1
fabrizio benedetti
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Default Freeze when linking Program Change to Preset while playing (FIXED)

When a plug-in's User Presets are linked to ProgramChange messages, and Reaper plays, and an incoming ProgramChange causes a preset switch, Reaper freezes.

The sample project here:

https://app.box.com/s/rerokjeg4as46p7y7gp1

contains 2 tracks: one has a wavefile playing, and a ReaComp in an insert slot; ReaComp presets are linked to ProgramChanges on MIDI channel 1. The other track is recording MIDI (maybe you should check the selected MIDI input) and sends MIDI to the first track.

Press Play, and send some ProgramChange to Reaper on Channel 1 (low numbers, please check the number of entries in your presets list). Just a few messages, and Reaper will freeze (interestingly, the audio card buffer is always cleared in my case, I am always left with silence).

Freeze doesn't occur when switching in the ReaComp window presets list using the mouse on the presets ComboBox.

Reaper 4.402 x64
Windows 7 Home Premium 64bit
MOTU AudioExpress on USB
ASUS B121 w/ Intel Core i5-470UM, 4G RAM
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Old 08-14-2013, 09:26 AM   #2
fabrizio benedetti
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If I have ProgramChange events programmed on a MIDI track, freezing never seems to occur like when sending them via a MIDI input.
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Old 08-15-2013, 09:43 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fabrizio benedetti View Post
If I have ProgramChange events programmed on a MIDI track, freezing never seems to occur like when sending them via a MIDI input.
Unfortunately, sequenced Program Change events are also capable of freezing Reaper.
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Old 08-15-2013, 03:11 PM   #4
fabrizio benedetti
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The bug only appears when the presets switched by the ProgramChange message are loaded from a .rpl file; when presets are coming from the stock patches of the VST plugin, I can send ProgramChange messages with no problems.

I have discovered this using the old ClassicDelay from Kjaerhus Audio: until I switched its stock presets, everything was fine; as soon as I saved a User Preset, and an entry appeared under the section "---- User Presets (.rpl) ----", and I sent ProgramChange n. 0 (the first User Preset), I had Reaper crashing.

Obviously, the handling of stock VST presets happens in a different way -and a safer one, as it turns out. Something is wrong with the handling of the .rpl file in the context of receiving a MIDI programchange (remember that switching User Presets using the Presets ComboBox always works fine, even while Reaper is in Play).

This restricts the usage of Reaper in a live scenario. At least, MDI switching should be restricted to VST patches, excluding User Presets, which would limit the plug-ins that can be used live to those capable of properly managing VST programs.

Last edited by fabrizio benedetti; 08-15-2013 at 03:15 PM. Reason: Clarification: GUI switching always works
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Old 08-15-2013, 10:24 PM   #5
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Thanks for the report! I get it to freeze even when transport is stopped.

It should work as expected when you use good old .FXB preset files instead of REAPER's own preset system.
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Old 08-15-2013, 11:20 PM   #6
fabrizio benedetti
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ollie View Post
It should work as expected when you use good old .FXB preset files instead of REAPER's own preset system.
As I understand, .FXB files should be supported by the plugin, or am I missing something? I tried to have my presets saved to an .FXB file instead of a .RPL, but it doesn't work - at least, not with the plug I need to switch (LePou LE456), and it doesn't work with Kjaerhus' ClassicDelay either.
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Old 08-17-2013, 02:00 AM   #7
fabrizio benedetti
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Any chance to have it fixed before... say... my next gig?

Anyway, switching .rpl User Presets while playing _does_ work, when triggered by GUI action (I can scroll the mousewheel over the Presets ComboBox and have Presets changed like crazy with no issue); when executed from the audio process there is maybe the need for some additional synchronization.

I understand User Presets come from the .ini file in the Presets folder in the profile: is that file opened, read and closed each time a preset is switched? Maybe that should not be done in the audio thread, so User Preset switching should be deferred asynchronously to a non-real-time thread when received as a MIDI event (this is not the case for VST Programs, where a plugin is supposed to store them all for immediate recall, or implement its own synchronization).

I also understand how the devs have to bear with such users talking too much technical...
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Old 08-26-2013, 05:40 PM   #8
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Default Confirmed

I can confirm this. I am having the exact same issue.
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Old 08-27-2013, 05:49 AM   #9
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Fix coming soon in 4.5!
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Old 08-28-2013, 05:29 AM   #10
fabrizio benedetti
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin View Post
Fix coming soon in 4.5!
Great!!!
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Old 08-30-2013, 01:36 AM   #11
fabrizio benedetti
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Anyway, I have to admit that I didn't put the bugfix to test yet; I have used a workaround to set up the projects for tonight's show, and I didn't have time to test the 4.5beta...
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Old 01-16-2017, 05:25 AM   #12
wakodoha
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Hi how did you fix the problem with the LE456?
With the last version of reaper 5.31 and LE456 64bit the volumes of the amp keep jumping randomly when channels are switched!
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Old 03-06-2017, 07:21 PM   #13
tater01
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Default Not solved! Still happening to me in v5.35

This is exactly what I am looking for still. It does the same thing to me using any type of midi message from Midi Designer. I'm trying to use Reaper as a guitar jam trainer and having this same problem. If I save a custom preset as a .rpl preset and try to switch them with any type of midi message it freezes! Still happening in v5.35!
So this post is not solved!
I wanted to also ask if anyone knows a better way to save presets and switch them via midi?
I was thinking about maybe saving LBX Stripper script presets or snapshots? Anyone tried that for switching presets?
What about FX Chains, Track Presets, Track Snapshots? Anyone have any experience with them and if they switch more smoothly?
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Old 03-06-2017, 08:30 PM   #14
wakodoha
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Hi Tater, you need to use this:
http://www.sws-extension.org/
and learn how to use their 'live config', it will allow exactly what you want to do. Is looks annoying at first to go through the documentation but it's worthy!
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Old 03-08-2017, 10:28 AM   #15
tater01
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Default Thank you Wakodoha

Yes, that is exactly what I needed. I'm familiar with SWS extensions, just never put it together with Live Mode. SWS Live Mode is exactly what is needed to switch presets on the fly. But, I found the SWS Snapshots to be more useful to me. As far as I know you can't just switch to next and previous patch in Live Mode. It saves a giant list to be switched with a lot of control change messages. To me this is more tedious programming and learning all these commands. Plus that would require a lot of buttons or the ability to bank up and down on your footswitch to get to the presets. To me SWS Snapshots works better as you only need two buttons on your footswitch to change to next and previous presets! Also, I do like reading manuals but the available manual online for SWS is for version 1.7.1, it doesn't have any info on Live Mode in the manual. So, all in all SWS Snapshots doesn't freeze on me and works great! Would be nice if Cockos could fix the bug that makes it freeze when switching .rpl presets vid midi! Thanks Wakodoha for guiding me to the right place!
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Old 03-09-2017, 01:03 AM   #16
wakodoha
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My pleasure, I'm on the same path as you are for live use, it takes a long time to figure out how to use the reaper..
There's a thread with a help file for live configs here:
http://forum.cockos.com/showthread.p...47#post1099347
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Old 03-10-2017, 03:39 AM   #17
wakodoha
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Hi Tater, actualy what you want is in
Action
live apply next config..
You can assign that to your footswitch..
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