Old 07-26-2014, 07:20 AM   #1
Ollie
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Default IID#484 Convert CCs to automation envelopes?

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Summary line: ...or maybe a better idea, read on

Quote:
It would be good to have an option to convert MIDI CCs for Volume/Expression and Pan to automation envelopes. Or envelope-like mode of editing CCs (with Bezier curves, allowing exponential/logarithmic/S-curves, etc.), instead of sometimes awkward pile of rectangles. The latter is preferred.
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Old 07-26-2014, 07:25 AM   #2
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Default Discussion transfer from IID#484

Quote:
Originally Posted by EvilDragon
Suggestion improvement: Since CCs are discrete data and envelopes are continuous, there ought to be a preference that would set "when in envelope CC editing mode, send a new CC value every x ticks" with x user selectable and saveable per-project.

Who's with me?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anomaly
All CC editing improvements get my vote.
However, I would like to have the cc envelopes inside midi items, not as separate objects in arrangement view.
Quote:
Originally Posted by EvilDragon
Of course, my idea was simply replacing (or making optional), the current CC lanes with envelope drawing style.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fandango
Good point, a sort of MIDI "Density" setting.

Also, when using square envelopes (which is visually useful for ON/OFF CCs like Sustain and Portamento), only send the CC ONCE at the actual node point. (which is how it should be rendered when being exported to a MIDI file, anyway)
[img]http://img43.**************/img43/1403/71523585.gif[/img]

(REAPER's square envelopes might do this already, I'll test with CC-outputing MIDI VST)
[EDIT 1 - Yeah, seems to send out a continous stream of identical values.]
[EDIT 2 - Even when the transport is stopped! Unusual...(???) ]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lawrence
+Gazillion. CC's are at their root in this context automation after all.

Think about the current Reaper paradigm of Explode/Implode.

"Explode CC's to Envelopes". If you want to later you can "Implode CC envelope to Midi CC" (within item boundaries of course) putting the CC 's back inside of the midi item.

1. Opening a midi editor has to display those CC values from the envelopes in lanes. It might even be quite slick if in that case the key editor took on envelope lanes instead of controller lanes?

2. Of course a midi export should capture any CC's residing in envelopes to the file.
Quote:
Originally Posted by EvilDragon
fandango, sustain pedal need not to be always just an on/off switch. Pianists like me like to use continuous damper pedal, which outputs the whole CC64 range from 0 to 127, and VSTs like Pianoteq 3 accurately read and make use of that information.

But still, a MIDI "density" control for CC envelopes is a necessity. We have a large PPQ resolution in REAPER (960 or something like that?), that is a LOT of MIDI data per second. I think that bringing that down to 256 or 128 for most CCs is more than enough.

Quote:
Originally Posted by EvilDragon
Yeah, that is the best, and probably the easiest thing to make.

Compare previous CC tick with the current one, and if they are the same (or, imagine this, user preference to determine the amount of deviation that NEEDS to be done to register a new CC, in %), reject it from the CC stream.

Quote:
Originally Posted by djjedidiah
Please please look at the cc envelopes in pro tools, it's so easy to draw manual pitch bends with robotic perfection. Very necessary for some of my work.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Reaktor:[Dave]
Why not simply compare the "current" envelope point to the next envelope point and if both values are the same only send the value once?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TonE
This is already possible.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Soli Deo Gloria
But it´s akward to achieve and while recording from the ME to the envelope lanes there seem to be inconsistencies due to latency (even with a 64 samples buffer). I agree this is really needed...
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Old 07-26-2014, 08:25 AM   #3
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Another opportunity for this screenshot:



Controller lanes in a MIDI clip can be edited as
(a) discrete MIDI CC messages (CC80),
(b) CC automation envelopes (CC81),
(c) VST parameter envelopes (Glide Time).

(a) sends each CC message to the plug-in,
(b) generates and sends CC messages matching the envelope as closely as possible,
(c) maps the envelope values to the specified plug-in-parameter.

The bottom two lanes in the screenshot show the CC messages sent by (a) and (b).
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Old 07-26-2014, 08:34 AM   #4
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This FR is covered by the larger elevated FR:

http://forum.cockos.com/project.php?issueid=978
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