Old 08-10-2014, 09:25 PM   #1
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Default How To: Sync Finale and REAPER using MTC

I'm using Finale 2011b and Reaper 4.71 on Windows 7 64-bit. The method I use takes advantage of loopMIDI, a free virtual MIDI cable software. I realize that there are other programs out there, but this is what I'm using. Plus, it's free, and you can create as many ports as you want! I couldn't have put this post together without the unwavering help of Soli Deo Gloria.

First things first.

0. Download loopMIDI from http://www.tobias-erichsen.de/software/loopmidi.html
1. When the program opens, set up some ports with the "+" button (you'll be able to use 16 channels per port).

Now let's set up Finale.

2. For simplicity, create a 1 staff document and enter some notes.
3. In Finale's MIDI Setup dialogue box (MIDI/Audio > Device Setup > MIDI Setup...), choose a loopMIDI port as MIDI Out. Leave MIDI In alone.
4. Click "Show Advanced >>" and enable MTC for the loopMIDI port that you selected. If you are using more than 16 instruments, set the appropriate additional MIDI outs to other loopMIDI ports and enable MTC for those, as well.
5. Hit OK.
6. Enable "Send MTC" (MIDI/Audio > Device Setup).
7. Choose "Play Finale through MIDI" under MIDI/Audio.

Ok, it's time to go to REAPER.

8. Enable for input the same loopMIDI port(s) you are sending out on in Finale. To do that, hit the audio device settings button in the top right (you can also just go to REAPER's preferences - ctrl+P) and choose MIDI Devices under Audio. Right click the port you want to use and select "Enable input."
9. Create a track, load an instrument (ReaSynth or something simple will do for now), arm it for recording and turn on record monitoring.
10. Change its input to channel 1 of whatever loopMIDI port you are using. This corresponds to the staff you have set up in Finale, which should've automatically been set to output to channel 1. If you have more staves, you'd need to set up more tracks with corresponding channels.

Almost there.

11. Right click on the play button in REAPER's transport bar and check "Enable synchronization to timecode" (alt+right click on the play button).
12. Use input: "MTC: All inputs" or "MTC: [loopMIDI port]." For this small example, the loopMIDI port is sufficient.
13. Hit play in REAPER; it will now wait for Finale to send its MIDI time code.
14. Hit play in Finale and both programs should play simultaneously, but Finale's MIDI signal should be coming out of REAPER. You can also record Finale's MIDI signal straight into REAPER - hit record in REAPER and then play in Finale. However, I prefer saving my Finale document as a MIDI file and dropping that into REAPER afterwards.

Cool, huh?

If you want REAPER's audio to output through a computer interface to headphones or monitors (rather than your computer's onboard speakers), go back to Finale and set the Audio Driver (MIDI/Audio > Device Setup > Audio Setup...) output to something other than your interface. This will allow you to change the setting in REAPER; click the audio device settings button in the top right and adjust the outputs as desired.

You can also use this to have Finale make REAPER play video instead of using the built-in video player (which as of Finale 2011 has very limited resizing options). Just make sure the frame rate for both programs match. In REAPER, this is in Project Settings. In Finale, this is under Document > Sync and Video Options... Adjusting the SMPTE start frame will adjust where the video will play from at the beginning of Finale's score.

What other uses can you come up with for syncing Finale and REAPER with MTC?
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How To: Sync Finale and REAPER using MTC (PDF)
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Old 08-12-2014, 09:08 PM   #2
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Nice work ASCAP!

How about, if that is the final version, we make it a PDF file and upload to the reaper stash?
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Old 08-13-2014, 10:57 PM   #3
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Thanks! Couldn't have done it without Soli Deo Gloria giving me the basic concept first.

I downloaded your PDF of SDG's explanation about ReWire with Sibelius just in case something possesses me to get another notation program. It's great, with the pictures and everything. I did not take the time to do that - was just quickly flipping through menus and jotting down what I remembered.

So lemme get some screenshots together for the visual learners out there... once I have done that, would you like the honors of uploading it?
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How To: Sync Finale and REAPER using MTC (PDF)
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Old 08-14-2014, 09:37 AM   #4
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thanks for asking but I really don't care a whitt about the honors..

I only care that the resources for doing things in reaper keep growing and become easy to get from the stash for anyone...

I am always happy to help to create PDF's and the like mainly just because I have some graphic tools and skills that others may not [hahah... others may well be way ahead of me mind you]

So whenever you are ready and if you want some help with it I'm here for that.

Soli says he is working on a revised version of that PDF and might want help with it also...

I could imagine his and yours becoming merged into one big PDF which I think would about cover the needs for most people.

When and if this gets done, I'd be happy to remove the one I uploaded and let you and he be the stash uploaders.
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Old 08-18-2014, 12:03 PM   #5
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Default New Reaper user using finale 2011 PM and garritan libraries

Hello: I am a professional musician for 40+ years. 8 months ago, I started using Finale 2011 PM, with GPO4, then installed Garttian world instruments. I have no experience using a DAW, and only today downloaded reaper. I have been mixing my virtual compositions in audacity, and have been happy with the results. My next goal was to import my finale files into reaper, and delve into trying to improve the sound quality of my virtual compositions. I understand using a DAW is a big learning curve, and have been discussing it's use and reading for sometime. I read Ascap's statement above with interest. Again, for now all I am trying to do is import the staves into reaper and assign the staves to reapers channels. I am using vista x64 bit os. I have thought for a week this process, please tell me if this makes sense.

1. copy and paste aria player vst_x64.dll into reapers vst plugins folder
2. export from finale an .xml file into .xml folder
3. import the .xml file into reaper (reaper should assign the staves to channels automatically)
4. open the aria player in reaper, and assign VSTI's in aria to the channels in reaper.

Does this make sense ? Am I on the right track ?
All comments greatly appreciated.
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Old 08-18-2014, 02:56 PM   #6
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Default reaper finale

I was able to get the aria player in reaper, and dragged and dropped a midi (not.xml) file into reaper. I got that far today. I am perplexed that I read by dragging and dropping reaper should give me the option to split the file into separate tracks, the file is piano and flute and I want to be able to put each instrument on a separate channel. It looks promising though. Thank you.
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Old 08-19-2014, 10:32 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hopi View Post
thanks for asking but I really don't care a whitt about the honors..
Okay! I can do it myself, when I get some free time. I think ReWire for Sibelius and MTC for Finale should be uploaded separately. If someone has done a "MTC for Sibelius," I think that would make more sense if we combine it.
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How To: Sync Finale and REAPER using MTC (PDF)
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Old 08-19-2014, 10:51 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stevewisnoski View Post
I was able to get the aria player in reaper, and dragged and dropped a midi (not.xml) file into reaper.
You don't need to copy the ARIA Player to a separate location. In REAPER preferences, under Plug-ins, click on VST. You can try "Auto-detect," or you can manually add as many plug-in paths as you like; REAPER can scan multiple locations.

Music XML files are for music notation software, not Digital Audio Workstations, so you are on the right track dropping MIDI in instead. When you save the MIDI file in Finale, it automatically saves each instrument to a separate track based on what channel it is using. By default, multi-staff instruments like piano and harp will be mapped to the same channel, and so appear in 1 track when in REAPER.

Once you've dropped the MIDI into reaper, you should have the option to "Expand n MIDI tracks to new REAPER tracks." Leave that box checked. Leave the second box checked as well so it plays back at the same tempo you set in Finale.

Set up a track and make it a folder that contains all the MIDI tracks you've just imported. Add the ARIA player as track FX and set the instruments to the same tracks you had in Finale (remember that to save time with a large ensemble, you can save the ensemble in the ARIA player it when you create it in Finale and load it here in REAPER).

Now, set the folder's input to MIDI > All MIDI Inputs > All Channels, and it should play back just like it did in Finale. Let me know if this helps! If you're unsure of any of the terminology or procedures, you can find it somewhere in the REAPER guide. For help in Finale, press "F1."
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How To: Sync Finale and REAPER using MTC (PDF)
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Old 08-19-2014, 09:04 PM   #9
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awesome, thank you much ! I was able to import midi file with 10 instruments, and able to use aria to load the same instruments used in the .wav file exported from finale. this file https://soundcloud.com/steve-wisnosk...3-min-56-remix
I am composing for a student film.
I could not get the tympani to play in reaper, nor the string section, many issues. Unsure what questions to even ask at this time. I can see I need to finish said project as I have been, and gradually work my way into reaper, I was lucky to get as far as I did in reaper in 2 sessions.
I appreciate your response.

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Old 08-30-2014, 06:08 PM   #10
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Quote:
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I could not get the tympani to play in reaper, nor the string section
Timpani should play back like any other instrument. Check to make sure the channel all the timpani's MIDI notes are set to matches the channel you have set it to in the ARIA player.

I don't bother with keyswitches in REAPER, so instead of using the KS string patches, if you'd like to switch from arco to tremolo or pizz, add separate string patches in the ARIA player. Then in REAPER's MIDI editor, change the channel of those notes you want played differently to whatever channel you put the separate string patch as.

Good luck!
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Old 08-30-2014, 07:41 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hopi View Post
thanks for asking but I really don't care a whitt about the honors..
Done! It is on the stash:

https://stash.reaper.fm/v/21707/How%2...sing%20MTC.pdf
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Old 08-30-2014, 08:30 PM   #12
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Beautiful Job on the PDF my friend...

Now I'd point out a strangeness of the stash... when we post in the Misc category we don't get to have comments by other posted to the file on the stash... but I think the Untagged category does allow comments...

so maybe you'd bother to deleted the one you up'd to the stash and then re upload it to the Untagged category... just a thought.
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Old 09-01-2014, 08:02 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hopi View Post
Beautiful Job on the PDF my friend...

Now I'd point out a strangeness of the stash... when we post in the Misc category we don't get to have comments by other posted to the file on the stash... but I think the Untagged category does allow comments...

so maybe you'd bother to deleted the one you up'd to the stash and then re upload it to the Untagged category... just a thought.
Thank you! What a little Paint.NET and Open Office Writer can do...

I did not know that about the stash... thanks for letting me know - I'll change it so that comments are allowed.
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Old 09-01-2014, 08:06 PM   #14
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Quote:
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re upload it to the Untagged category...
I didn't have to re-upload; I was able to just change the category.

How to Sync Finale and REAPER using MTC (the Stash)

If uploading completed "how tos" becomes popular, we may have to request a "How To" category.
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Old 09-28-2014, 02:01 AM   #15
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Thanks!
Trying this with Notion 4,
but it seems Notion don't send mtc,
so no sync.
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Old 10-18-2014, 10:45 AM   #16
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Default reaper is delayed

I have this working except that, when I start finale, reaper doesn't start output for about 1 and a half beats. Do you know how to fix this?

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Old 10-20-2014, 08:03 PM   #17
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I did notice a small delay for me, too, but REAPER quickly "catches up" if you let it keep playing. If you pause finale (not stop) after it's been playing for a bit and take a look at both clocks, you'll notice that they are still not perfectly synced - maybe a fraction of a second off. My guess is that this is just a normal time delay in sending the MIDI Time Code signal from one program to another.
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Old 02-02-2015, 08:14 PM   #18
amoretam
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Hi ASCap...

I am about to setup Finale with Reaper..

What I want is to be able to perform with my midi keyboard and be able to see the written notation equivalent, and of course edit afterwards..

This is possible right?

Sorry, I am very new to notation soft-wares..
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Old 02-02-2015, 08:40 PM   #19
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amoretam, thanks for your post!

Honestly I would only recommend syncing Finale and REAPER for intermediate or advanced users of both programs. This is not really necessary for basic note-entry tasks.

If all you want to do is play on your MIDI keyboard and edit the notation, I would recommend Finale's Speedy Entry or Hyperscribe modes. If you need more help with this stuff, check out the user manual or head on over to Finale's forums - there are a lot of helpful, knowledgeable Finale users over there.

REAPER does not have a notation-editing mode, although you can edit recorded MIDI with the inline or piano roll editor.
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Old 12-24-2017, 11:44 AM   #20
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I'm try that but the loopmidi acuses of shortcut! ( I know the new version of finale that works in rewire i have tried but i dont like finale 25 rewire at all, i found it was not estable ( it crashes and i have to every thing I made reclick rewire ) So anyone doing that with finale 2014?
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Old 12-28-2017, 07:40 AM   #21
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ASCap,

This is pretty terrific and thank you for taking the time to document this. I'll certainly give it a go.

I wonder if you could help me understand one use for this (workflow related). I typically don't work in a DAW because even though you can edit and shape midi and audio with great detail it's too frustrating to go back and forth between Finale and Reaper especially if you change something. So for my workflow I always start with Finale and would do all editing of musical ideas in Finale. Performance editing however would be better served in Reaper which as stated above I typically don't do.

How would syncing the two applications help alleviate this frustration?

Steve
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Old 01-03-2018, 06:10 PM   #22
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ASCap,

Thanks again for the tutorial. I did get everything to work however Human Playback doesn't work which is something I hadn't considered before.

Do you use other methods for modifying expression with this setup? I'm wondering if this isn't something that won't suit my workflow though I do like experimenting.
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