Old 08-12-2015, 01:20 PM   #1
Troy
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Default New 5.0 Theme Standards?

Did the WALTER format just change with 5.0 or did I miss something earlier? If, as I think, it did just change is there a resource yet for the new standards?

This may be premature, but so far I have two questions:

1. In the TCP layout is there a way to force elements on to a new row regardless of their draw order?

2. How do set text alignment for the TCP label?
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Old 08-12-2015, 02:13 PM   #2
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See Here:

http://www.reaper.fm/sdk/walter/walter.php

If it hasn't been updated to cover all new 5.0 features, then I hope it will be soon. Otherwise, look at the logs and source files for clues into how to use them.
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Old 08-12-2015, 02:18 PM   #3
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Yeah, that page doesn't appear to have changed. I'm playing with new themes right now and the format for element placement is completely different. It seems much simpler, but we'll need some guidance none the less.
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Old 08-12-2015, 04:30 PM   #4
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Maybe here:

http://www.houseofwhitetie.com/reape...dit_def_5.html
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Old 08-12-2015, 05:54 PM   #5
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This might help: http://www.houseofwhitetie.com/reape...dit_def_5.html
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Old 08-12-2015, 10:49 PM   #6
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Thanks,

That is a very cursory introduction to the new flow system and these basic points are clearly explained in the rtconfig file in the new default theme.

I'll keep fussing with it until we learn more.
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Old 08-13-2015, 06:28 AM   #7
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There's a bit of useful info in this thread as well: http://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=164836&page=2

Let's hope all these improvements get documented in a coherent fashion somewhere, so we can focus on modifying and creating new themes instead of asking and answering the same questions a million times forward.
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Old 08-13-2015, 11:34 AM   #8
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The tinttcp and peaksedges entries in the rtconfig need to be expanded on, from here: http://www.cockos.com/reaper/sdk/wal...s.php#rtconfig

I've discovered some numbers that work through trial and error, but it would good to have all the possibilities laid out
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Old 08-13-2015, 01:54 PM   #9
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Peaksedges statement within the rtconfig disable the peaksedges settings in Preferences

peaksedges:

A0000000000
A (true/false) Antialized peak and waveform drawing
Where True is off and False is on.
Dezimal 1024 = No Antialized 0 = Antialized

A000000000P
P (true/false) Draw edges on peaks/Do not Draw edges on peaks
Dezimal 1 or 0

A00000000WP
W (true/false) Draw edges on waveforms/Do not Draw edges on waveforms
Dezimal 2 or 0

A0000000MWP
M (true/false) Draw edges on Midi events/Do not Draw edges on Midi events
Dezimal 4 or 0

++++++++++++++++
Example
Binär 10000000111 Dezimal 1031

No Antialized peak and waveform drawing
with
Draw edges on peaks/Draw edges on waveforms
and
Draw edges on Midi
= True

Binär 00000000111 Dezimal 7
Antialized peak and waveform drawing
with
Draw edges on peaks/Draw edges on waveforms
and
Draw edges on Midi
= True
-------------
Version 5 statement
enables Alpha Channel on background images
like for the item background

-------------

Tinttcp statement within the rtconfig
disable the tinttcp settings in Preferences
####
Set track label background to custom colors
Tint track panel backgrounds

Tint media item waveform peaks to
-Track color/Item color/Take color
Tint media item background to
-Track color/Item color/Take color
(where background means the ground color/underlying color before itembg images)
####
and also the
selitem_tintalpha=0 to 4
unselitem_tintalpha=0 to 4
(where the tint strength affected only the ground color and not the item bg image)
So if you use one item bg with alpha 255 or opaque together with the V5 statement, then nothing would be happen for the eyes

tinttcp:

11010010100 Dezimal 1684
or
XX010010100 Dezimal 148
=
All off

1101001010L true track label tinting
110100101P0 true track panel tinting

11010010W00 false tint waveform peaks to track color
110100W0100 false tint waveform peaks to item color
110W0010100 false tint waveform peaks to Take color

1101001B100 true tint background to track color
11010B10100 true tint background to item color
11B10010100 true tint background to take color
++++++++++
Example:
11000111110 Dezimal 1598
=
track label tinting false & track panel tinting true
with
tint waveform peaks to Take color
= on
and
tint waveform peaks to item color & tint waveform peaks to track color
= off
and
tint background to track color & tint background to item color
= on
and
tint background to take color
= off
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Old 08-13-2015, 02:37 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ELP View Post
Any peaksedges statement within the rtconfig disable the peaksedges settings in Preferences

peaksedges:

A0000000000
A (true/false) Antialized peak and waveform drawing
Where True is off and False is on.
Dezimal 1024 = No Antialized 0 = Antialized

A000000000P
P (true/false) Draw edges on peaks/Do not Draw edges on peaks
Dezimal 1 or 0

A00000000WP
W (true/false) Draw edges on waveforms/Do not Draw edges on waveforms
Dezimal 2 or 0

A0000000MWP
M (true/false) Draw edges on Midi events/Do not Draw edges on Midi events
Dezimal 4 or 0

++++++++++++++++
Example
Binär 10000000111 Dezimal 1031

No Antialized peak and waveform drawing
with
Draw edges on peaks/Draw edges on waveforms
and
Draw edges on Midi
= True

Binär 00000000111 Dezimal 7
Antialized peak and waveform drawing
with
Draw edges on peaks/Draw edges on waveforms
and
Draw edges on Midi
= True
-------------
Version 5 statement
enables Alpha Channel on background images
like for the item background

-------------

Any tinttcp statement within the rtconfig
disable the tinttcp settings in Preferences
####
Set track label background to custom colors
Tint track panel backgrounds

Tint media item waveform peaks to
-Track color/Item color/Take color
Tint media item background to
-Track color/Item color/Take color
(where background means the ground color/underlying color before itembg images)
####
and also the
selitem_tintalpha=0 to 4
unselitem_tintalpha=0 to 4
(where the tint strength affected only the ground color and not the item bg image)
So if you use one item bg with alpha 255 or opaque together with the V5 statement, then nothing would be happen for the eyes

tinttcp:

11010010100 Dezimal 1684
or
XX010010100 Dezimal 148
=
All off

1101001010L true track label tinting
110100101P0 true track panel tinting

11010010W00 false tint waveform peaks to track color
110100W0100 false tint waveform peaks to item color
110W0010100 false tint waveform peaks to Take color

1101001B100 true tint background to track color
11010B10100 true tint background to item color
11B10010100 true tint background to take color
++++++++++
Example:
11000111110 Dezimal 1598
=
track label tinting false & track panel tinting true
with
tint waveform peaks to Take color
= on
and
tint waveform peaks to item color & tint waveform peaks to track color
= off
and
tint background to track color & tint background to item color
= on
and
tint background to take color
= off
I think I understand, but jesus the WORK. I'm to old and tired to be calculating binaries anymore . I guess someone could make a chart, would be really handy.
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Old 08-13-2015, 02:56 PM   #11
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What is to old?

Never been to old for something^^
And binaries are much easier to understand, which bit is involved for which setting, i mean. Just like a switch

---------
tinttcp:

11010010100 ;Dezimal 1684
or
XX010010100 ;Dezimal 148
=
All off/Ground Value for All settings to off
-

1101001010L ; Bit L = true track label tinting on
Dezimal 0 or 1

110100101P0 ;P = true track panel tinting on
Dezimal 0 or 2
-----
False Switches - means If the involved bit W is set to false(off) then the tint option is "On"

11010010W00 ;W = false(0)= tint waveform peaks to track color = On / true(4)tint waveform peaks to track color = off
Dezimal 0 or 4

110100W0100 ;W = false(0)= tint waveform peaks to item color on
Dezimal 0 or 16

110W0010100 ;W = false(0)= tint waveform peaks to Take color on
Dezimal 0 or 128
-----
True Switches
1101001B100 ;B = true(8)= tint background to track color on
Dezimal 0 or 8

11010B10100 ;B = true(32)= tint background to item color on
Dezimal 0 or 32

11B10010100 ;B = true(256)= tint background to take color on
Dezimal 0 or 256


Dezimal 64 Bit Switch 1000000 is maybe free or maybe the Boss switch for tinting the screen to black or the switch to format all drives
Guru Meditation #64-1000000 ^^
--------

The other dezimal values for peaksedges, you can see above.

Greetings ELP
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Old 08-13-2015, 07:09 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ramses View Post
Let's hope all these improvements get documented in a coherent fashion somewhere, so we can focus on modifying and creating new themes instead of asking and answering the same questions a million times forward.
That is the problem with new features. They aren't much good if no one knows how to find them and use them.
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Old 08-14-2015, 03:28 AM   #13
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Nice work, ELP ! Truely helpful and I wish that all these informations could be findable in the Walter documentation, unless I missed it. So, it seems that both peaksedges and tinttcp parameters are coded on 11 digits, which give us theorically 2048 possible values for each of them.

This said, few thoughts about the tinttcp parameter.

If I understood well your posts, the mask for it is the following :

--CZ-BYAXPL

L : track color label tinting
P : track color panel tinting
X : track color waveform tinting
Y : item color waveform tinting
Z : take color waveform tinting
A : track color background tinting
B : item color background tinting
C : take color background tinting
- : unknown

In the new default theme, its value is set to 298 -> 00100101010 binary. Which would give :

00100101010

- no track color label tinting
- track color panel tinting
- track color background tinting
- item color background tinting
- take color background tinting

There is a conflict between the three last statements. After a quick test, it seems that the 'take' bit takes precedence over the 'item' one, which would mean that the most significant bit takes precedent above the other one(s) for a same parameter. Fine, but I'm wondering why the same thing hasn't been done for the waveform parameter... EDIT - The answer is obvious, after rethinking a little more : it's better to have a stable waveforms color defined in 'theme tweak' window, otherwise we could end up with invisible ones. My bad...

Another thing : the disposal of the different bits seems rather strange :
- First, what are actually doing the 1st, 2nd and 5th bits ? Guess that they are not here for the decoration, otherwise it would have been much more easy (I think...) to use a simple byte to describe all the different parameters involved, unless Justin & Co like to complicate uselessly what could be more simple, which I doubt. At first glance, I could say the same for the peaksedges bits disposal.

- Second, it would have been more easy to manage the whole thing as following, IMO :

---CBAZYXPL

In the present mask, according to your posts, the disposition of the different bits for the waveform and background coloring parameters are placed in an awkward manner : again, what the 5th bit is there for ?

All this need to be more thoroughly tested. I'll post here eventually results if I find something interesting about it.
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Old 08-14-2015, 04:30 AM   #14
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Xes, cubic13 11 Bits but there are switches that are free for maybe feature changes I mean
or as an playfield for Guru Meditations popups

like
peaksedges:

A0000000MWP

peaksedges use at the moment only the A M W and P switch

False = ON
A= Antialized peak and waveform drawing

True= On
P=Draw edges on peaks
W=Draw edges on waveforms
M=Draw edges on Midi events


##############

and for

tinttcp:

11010010100 11 Bits used in reaper.ini
and
010010100 9 Bits used by white in rtconfig
but with 11 or 9 bits (Bit 10/Bit 11 always true) it give you the same result-at the moment...

or maybe white forget these bits which is of course also possible..
But no matter bit 10/11 are always true in Reaper.ini

But these upper 2 bits could also mean
enable or disable the obs. values for underlying item background color options

selitem_tintalpha=0-4
unselitem_tintalpha=0-4
(tint strength for selected/unselected...)


Which is really possible, I have this so far never been tested.

-------------

So

tinttcp:

per reaper.ini
11HE0GDFCBA

or
per white rtconfig
--HE0GDFCBA

= the same

True= ON
A= tracklabel tinting
B= trackpanel tinting

False=ON
C= tint waveform peaks to track color
D= tint waveform peaks to item
E= tint waveform peaks to Take

True= On
F= tint background to track color
G= tint background to item
H= tint background to take

0 = free/not used dez. 64 or for Software failure Guru Meditation #64 ^^
11 = maybe switches for -see above-
---------
And priority for tint is always Take over Item and Item over Track colors
Track>Item>Take
Item overwrites Track color Take overwrites Item
(if its tint status for the same (background or wave or both)is ON
which make of course all sence^^
---------
Version 5 Statement enables the Alpha Channel on background bgs
If you use for example the item background image then the Alpha value from these pic is involved.

If not(no item bg used) then only the item background coloring & the
selitem_tintalpha=0-4
unselitem_tintalpha=0-4
values from reaper.ini are involved
--------

Greetings

Why there are true(normal) and false switches to push something to status ON, that knows only Justin.
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Old 08-14-2015, 05:34 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ELP View Post
...
But these upper 2 bits can also mean
enable or disable the obs. values for underlying item background color options

selitem_tintalpha=0-4
unselitem_tintalpha=0-4


Which is really possible, I have this so far never been tested.
...
Hmmm... I doubt so, as a 0-4 values range would require 3 bits to be described, which means that the 5th bit would also be needed for this. Indeed, something to be tested.

Beside this, I just tested with the 5.0 default theme a tinttcp value of 42 (by this, deactivating what is supposed to be the 'take color background tinting' flag. Result ? As expected, the take background inherits the item color, but the peak/waveform (not the background) takes the color of the one choosed in the 'Set active takes to custom color...' window instead.

This doesn't happen when tinttcp is set at 298. Rather strange, and I fear that things are even more complicated than previously thought. Maybe some of the waveform parameter bits have to be positioned to avoid this. Again, further tests needed...
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Old 08-14-2015, 05:35 AM   #16
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I decided to not bother with tinttcp and peaksedges . I just don't use these lines and set things up in preferences. Why would you want the user of your theme to open up rtconfig and jump through the binary hoop when all he wants is change a single tiny view option?
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Old 08-14-2015, 05:40 AM   #17
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" I doubt so, as a 0-4 values range would require 3 bits"
No, no these values 0 to 4 are stored in reaper.ini

selitem_tintalpha=0-4
unselitem_tintalpha=0-4

If so the upper two bits would only act as an switch to enable
selitem_tintalpha=0-4
unselitem_tintalpha=0-4
.

The settings in prefs are also grayed out if the tinttcp statement find in rtconfig but the values for that stored only in reaper.ini.
So it make sence that if statement is enable in rtconfig the two upper bits are not needed so whiteaxxe switches are set to false
You can only set these selitem/unsel in prefs if no tinttcp statement is in rtconfig, so REAPER save the tinttcp value of course with enable these two upper bits , means true....
You know what i mean?

Thats means of course also that you can hack something and it is better
if you use the tinttcp statement in rtconfig it is better to set these to false.
If not maybe they are ON but you can not control the values via rtconfig.

---
@gofer user should never hack rtconfics from third persons if designers use these statements in their themes^^
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Old 08-14-2015, 05:41 AM   #18
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Quote:
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I decided to not bother with tinttcp and peaksedges . I just don't use these lines and set things up in preferences. Why would you want the user of your theme to open up rtconfig and jump through the binary hoop when all he wants is change a single tiny view option?
In a user point of view, you're right. But I think that all this is interesting for theme developers, to get color management of the arrangement window as accurate as could be.

But sure, things will get more clear when a true documentation about these two parameters will be at disposal, if ever...
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Old 08-14-2015, 05:43 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ELP View Post
" I doubt so, as a 0-4 values range would require 3 bits"
No, no these values 0 to 4 are stored in reaper.ini

selitem_tintalpha=0-4
unselitem_tintalpha=0-4

If so the upper two bits would only act as an switch to enable
selitem_tintalpha=0-4
unselitem_tintalpha=0-4
.
You're right : indeed, as simple switches, two bits are enough. Just forgot that these parameters values are stored in the reaper.ini. My bad...
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Old 08-14-2015, 06:52 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ELP View Post
@gofer user should never hack rtconfics from third persons if designers use these statements in their themes^^
Quote:
Originally Posted by cubic13 View Post
In a user point of view, you're right. But I think that all this is interesting for theme developers, to get color management of the arrangement window as accurate as could be.

But sure, things will get more clear when a true documentation about these two parameters will be at disposal, if ever...
If I prefer, say, items be colored on their backgrounds, takes be colored on their peaks etc, that's my decision as the user. Also I don't see why a themer would bother whether I want my MIDI notes with an edge or not. These are all miniscule decisions which may even change from task to task. As long as there is no other way I reserve the right to hack that if necessary - 3rd person or not. I politely apologize in advance should I ever step on a precious designer foot when doing so .


There surely are thinkable ways how this can be solved. Themers could write settings into their theme, so they come up as intended when the theme is switched to and still those settings could be easily editable by the user, say in the theme tweaker or preferences. Of course the edits could be save-able, so the theme comes up as tweaked by the user.
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Old 08-14-2015, 07:14 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gofer View Post
If I prefer, say, items be colored on their backgrounds, takes be colored on their peaks etc, that's my decision as the user. Also I don't see why a themer would bother whether I want my MIDI notes with an edge or not. These are all miniscule decisions which may even change from task to task. As long as there is no other way I reserve the right to hack that if necessary - 3rd person or not. I politely apologize in advance should I ever step on a precious designer foot when doing so .

There surely are thinkable ways how this can be solved. Themers could write settings into their theme, so they come up as intended when the theme is switched to and still those settings could be easily editable by the user, say in the theme tweaker or preferences. Of course the edits could be save-able, so the theme comes up as tweaked by the user.
I fully agree, but all this should be said to the bakers. AFAIK, they are the ones who decided for unknown reasons to disable several peaks/waveforms preferences as soon as a version 5 instruction is present in the rtconfig.txt script file.

What I'm just saying is that all of us, theme developers, are trying to adapt to the new situation in a way or another. Consequently, this little tinttcp and peaksedges discussion which, I think, could be helpful to understand what's going on under the hood. As all these preferences are now under themers responsability, better try to understand what's going on and how to set these in the most meaningful way for the end user.
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Old 08-14-2015, 07:42 AM   #22
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Of course it's a useful endeavour to find out how these settings tick. Much kudos goes to ELP there . I don't want to take anything away from that.

What I am saying is that I doubt it's in the interest of a theme's user to actually use them as long as things are working the way they do. As this thread is about "New 5.0 theme standads", I think this is not off-topic here, even if in the end it is Cockos who needs to be adressed with the results of a discussion about this.
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Old 08-14-2015, 07:45 AM   #23
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I fully agree, but all this should be said to the bakers. AFAIK, they are the ones who decided for unknown reasons to disable several peaks/waveforms preferences as soon as a version 5 instruction is present in the rtconfig.txt
This is an important point. The documentation on tinttcp and peaksedges says that they override reaper.ini, but not that they must be used if you enable 'version 5', as the checkboxes for those options are subsequently disabled.

Additionally, the 'tint track panel' preferences checkbox is disabled.

Any other caveats?
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Old 08-14-2015, 07:54 AM   #24
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Originally Posted by Commala View Post
This is an important point. The documentation on tinttcp and peaksedges says that they override reaper.ini, but not that they must be used if you enable 'version 5', as the checkboxes for those options are subsequently disabled.
Just to make clear: Neither tinttcp nor peaksedges need to be used. To make your theme use the new Reaper v5 tinting method you only need to declare "version 5" in rtconfig.
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Old 08-14-2015, 08:09 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by gofer View Post
Just to make clear: Neither tinttcp nor peaksedges need to be used. To make your theme use the new Reaper v5 tinting method you only need to declare "version 5" in rtconfig.
Oh I misunderstood. That's a relief because ELP's post about the way these values are set looks absolutely forbidding, although probably simple enough once you dig in.

To contribute another point to this thread, a new addition for themers to be aware of in v5 is the new adaptive text colouring. I still haven't tried it but you can have the text colour change based on the background's colour
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Old 08-14-2015, 08:20 AM   #26
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Just to make clear: Neither tinttcp nor peaksedges need to be used. To make your theme use the new Reaper v5 tinting method you only need to declare "version 5" in rtconfig.
Sorry, but I disagree. I just tested this by removing these two instructions on my own theme : the result is a completely wrecked display of both the waveforms and item backgrounds. So, sure, the theme will work but, in the end, to get a consistent color shaping of the arrangement content, you'll sooner or later have to cope with these two instructions.
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Old 08-14-2015, 08:22 AM   #27
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"But sure, things will get more clear when a true documentation about these two parameters will be at disposal"

yes of course but the switches that i explained here work as it is.

I mean nothing would be changed with offi. docu or not.
I mean at these active bit switches now^^
There are no other things to switch exception that there are little bugs with the handling of tinting waveforms/edges and selected items -in general.

I mean as long as both switches waveform and background tinting is ON
(for the same thing Track/track ; Item/item; take/take)
then
for seleted items:
the color for the waveform and if enable the edge-color switched to the color value that you assiged in Dev/theme... which is maybe the correct way

but
if only the waveform tinting for the same thing is enable, then the waveform
stays at the user waveform color and the edge color changed to that color that you fixed assigned in Dev/theme -for selected items.

Which is maybe not the correct way

That means if edge visible is enable the edge color for selected items is always one fix color assigned in dev-theme..
For unselected items the base waveform color assigned by the user is involved also for the edges. Means waveform and edge color .
But only for unseleted items
---

"Sorry, but I disagree. I just tested this by removing these two instructions on my own theme : the result is a completely wrecked display of both the waveforms and item backgrounds. So, sure, the theme will work but, in the end, to get a consistent color shaping of the arrangement content, you'll sooner or later have to cope with these two instructions. "

And yes i also agree with you cubic13.
Maybe these two upper switches involved which are always enable without one tinttcp statement and activate both selected/unselected Alpha on colors 0-4^^ togeteher with the new Version 5 statement-Alpha on background with pics- ....maybe- dont know
I am going to tests these behavior later at the evening. I will know it
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Old 08-14-2015, 08:37 AM   #28
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Originally Posted by cubic13 View Post
Sorry, but I disagree. I just tested this by removing these two instructions on my own theme : the result is a completely wrecked display of both the waveforms and item backgrounds. So, sure, the theme will work but, in the end, to get a consistent color shaping of the arrangement content, you'll sooner or later have to cope with these two instructions.
I don't think that happens with my own theme. And I think (didn't try after some pre release versions in) that I can delete both from default theme and still get the same visuals just by setting the tint options accordingly. Take that with a grain of salt, maybe there has been changes since. I should try it again.


EDIT: Just did and It seems to work.

EDIT#2 Wait... something with peak edge color when selected...
Default theme has pretty bright "Media item peaks edge highlight when selected". When I comment peaksedges out, it will use them. With the original line
peaksedges 0
it seems to ignore the color and draw peaksedges pretty dark (supposedly peak color, or unselected peakedge color?).

Either peaksedges 0 is intended to make Reaper ignore that color (for which reason?), or it's a buglette. Not because of not using peaksedges, but rather because of using it.

Last edited by gofer; 08-14-2015 at 09:27 AM.
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Old 08-14-2015, 09:05 AM   #29
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I don't think that happens with my own theme. And I think (didn't try after some pre release versions in) that I can delete both from default theme and still get the same visuals just by setting the tint options accordingly. Take that with a grain of salt, maybe there has been changes since. I should try it again.
Just to make this more visually clear :

- with tinttcp 298 and peaksedges 0



- without any tinttcp or peaksedges instruction :



Which one is best, in your opinion ?
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Old 08-14-2015, 09:34 AM   #30
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You need to set the options to match those that would be set by your theme, obviously.

EG "Tint track panel backgrounds" needs to be enabled to see your color displays.

What's up with your item backgrounds, I can't tell you (without seeing tint options at least set up the same). I can however assure you that my theme and Default 5 both properly use the image files (itembg.png and itembg_sel.png or whatsitcalled). I assume some wrong setting here as well.
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Old 08-14-2015, 10:16 AM   #31
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Here's an illustration using default theme. I can't illustrate using my theme, because I don't know how my settings translate to tinttcp/peaksedges.



the only difference I see is that the bright white(ish) color WT has set in "Media item peaks edge highlight when selected" is not used in original Default v5. It is however used in the edited version.
I must say, it doesn't look nice that way, it's too close to the item background, so peaks look wrong. I'd choose a different color... I can make it look exactly like the original by setting these two colors to match the "peak when selected" color.
If there's a way to properly use "peaks edge highlight when selected" even with peaksedges set in rtconfig, then all is fine. If not, then I must say I can't even consider using peaksedge in my own theme, because I like me a black(ish) edge around white(ish) peaks on selected items.


In this pic you can see that item backgrounds obviously are used properly and color fields in tcp/mcp work just fine:
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Old 08-14-2015, 10:28 AM   #32
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Originally Posted by gofer View Post
You need to set the options to match those that would be set by your theme, obviously.
Which ones ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by gofer View Post
EG "Tint track panel backgrounds" needs to be enabled to see your color displays.
It's disabled for any theme that contains the version 5 instruction in the rtconfig.txt file. What to do, in this case ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by gofer View Post
What's up with your item backgrounds, I can't tell you (without seeing tint options at least set up the same). I can however assure you that my theme and Default 5 both properly use the image files (itembg.png and itembg_sel.png or whatsitcalled). I assume some wrong setting here as well.
Any hint about what could be misbehaving ?


Overall, I just tried to show the differences between using both the tinttcp and peaksedges instructions and without using them, for exactly the same theme and the same preferences settings : the difference are obvious.

I just tested the 5.0 default theme and the differences are also clearly visible : the peaks/waveforms colors are not the same, as well as the items background and the tracks color display in the index box : I have two other screenshots available at your disposal, if you want.

Sorry to say, but it's not theme dependent. The presence of both the tinttcp and peaksedges instructions are obviously essential for any properly behaving Reaper 5 theme.
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Old 08-14-2015, 10:57 AM   #33
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Which ones ?
For example you should disable peaks to be colored and instead set item background to be colored. That's just the obvious one. Plus you should definitely set "Tint track panel backgrounds".

Quote:
Originally Posted by cubic13 View Post
It's disabled for any theme that contains the version 5 instruction in the rtconfig.txt file. What to do, in this case ?


Any hint about what could be misbehaving ?
No, it is only disabled as soon as rtconfig contains a valid tinttcp line. You need to close/reopen Preferences to see the change, though (if it stayed open while you changed to the theme without tinttcp).



This theme uses "version 5" (color fields work, item colors are true) but not tinttcp (and not peaksedges). Track tinting options are available and working as expected. The other options you can't see in this pic - concerning peaks and items - are made available by not using peaksedges.

(Mind that "tint backgrounds works differently when you declare "version 5". It now depends on how transparent your tcp/mcp bg images are. With a completely opaque tcp_bg.png nothing will be tinted. This is also true for item bg tinting. Maybe that's a clue to what's going wrong with your selected item?)


Quote:
Originally Posted by cubic13 View Post
Overall, I just tried to show the differences between using both the tinttcp and peaksedges instructions and without using them, for exactly the same theme and the same preferences settings : the difference are obvious.
But you didn't. Your settings were different in the two images. The one with tinttcp and peaksedges has overridden your settings and used its own instead. The one without tinttcp and peaksedges used your actual preference settings.

You can see a comparison using the same theme with the same settings in my previous post. The similarity is obvious.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cubic13 View Post
The presence of both the tinttcp and peaksedges instructions are obviously essential for any properly behaving Reaper 5 theme.
I doubt that. I think my pic has shown that a theme can be looking exactly the same with or without these two instructions. With one exception. I'm even tempted to say that the peak edge color observation (a color from the theme editor not used when peaksedges is declared) indicates that it's the absense, not the presence, of peaksedge which makes a theme behave proper.
Attached Images
File Type: png 500-tint-track-panel-bg.png (46.8 KB, 2460 views)

Last edited by gofer; 08-14-2015 at 11:34 AM.
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Old 08-14-2015, 11:49 AM   #34
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For example you should disable peaks to be colored and instead set item background to be colored. That's just the obvious one. Plus you should definitely set "Tint track panel backgrounds".

No, it is only disabled as soon as rtconfig contains a valid tinttcp line. You need to close/reopen Preferences to see the change, though (if it stayed open while you changed to the theme without tinttcp).

This theme uses "version 5" (color fields work, item colors are true) but not tinttcp (and not peaksedges). Track tinting options are available and working as expected. The other options you can't see in this pic - concerning peaks and items - are made available by not using peaksedges.

(Mind that "tint backgrounds works differently when you declare "version 5". It now depends on how transparent your tcp/mcp bg images are. With a completely opaque tcp_bg.png nothing will be tinted. This is also true for item bg tinting. Maybe that's a clue to what's going wrong with your selected item?)

But you didn't. Your settings were different in the two images. The one with tinttcp and peaksedges has overridden your settings and used its own instead. The one without tinttcp and peaksedges used your actual preference settings.

You can see a comparison using the same theme with the same settings in my previous post. The similarity is obvious.
I must honestly admit that you are right : I was focusing on the version 5 statement. The key is, indeed, to get rid of any tinttcp line to get the peaks/waveforms preferences available again, no matter if the version 5 statement is here or not. But how on earth this is still not documented ? Guess that theming is no longer a true concern for Cockos crew...

Setting the 'Tint media item background to' as 'Track color' gives almost what I previously set for my theme with the tinttcp statement. There is one problem remaining, though : the media item label background doesn't follow the media item one. Guess that more research is needed...

Thanks for your patient explanations !
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Old 08-14-2015, 12:17 PM   #35
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As i said at the beginning, the two upper bit 10&11 which REAPER via reaper.ini always set to true
do nothing. So only --HE-GDFCBA is needed for one correct rtconfig tinttcp statement.
With or without it´s the same result.
-------
If there is one item-bg in use then unselitem_tintalpha(0-4)is disable
The same with item_bg_sel. It disable selitem_tintalpha(0-4)

So no switching bits 10+11
------

But @gofer you have to admit -at cubic13 example:

If one themer want control the behavior and the way it is designed for + the look then he should use these tinttcp and peaksedges statements in the rtconfig.
If not then not.^^
But otherwise all these things can look and behave completly different.

And we are again there back where we were:
one readme inside the download that of course nobody read
that explain which settings are needed to look and behave the same as on the themers picture^^
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Old 08-14-2015, 12:29 PM   #36
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Back in the days a themer tried to make his theme look good with any setting combination

Kidding. I don't even think that's still possible (given the plethora of settings to be considered) and even if it was, not without heavy compromises.

As said, I understand where this is all coming from, but I doubt it's well done as it is. I say it again, these settings could and should be done like other settings in the theme tweaker window - available for the theme creator to pre-set but still readable and configurable by the user without mindfuck.


EDIT:
Think I should also mention once more that I absolutely appreciate and admire your detective work on this. Thumbs up!

Last edited by gofer; 08-14-2015 at 12:39 PM.
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Old 08-14-2015, 07:18 PM   #37
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Yes of course Gofer.

So only for interest how the peaksedges & tinttcp variables work
and if themers want use these statements within their rtconfig;
These are all actual/current "Bitswitches" to enable/disable visual options.

(You can of course also grab involved values vom reaper.ini,
but it is always good to know how things work)

peaksedges:
Bitswitch
&A0000000MWP

peaksedges use at the moment only the A M W and P switch

False = ON
A= Antialized peak and waveform drawing

True = On
P=Draw edges on peaks
W=Draw edges on waveforms
M=Draw edges on Midi events
-----------------------------
tinttcp:

per reaper.ini
Bitswitch
&11HEXGDFCBA

or
per rtconfig
Bitswitch
&--HEXGDFCBA

= both the same result

True = ON
A= tracklabel tinting
B= trackpanel tinting

False = ON
C= tint waveform peaks to track color
D= tint waveform peaks to item
E= tint waveform peaks to Take

True = On
F= tint background to track color
G= tint background to item
H= tint background to take

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Old 08-14-2015, 07:22 PM   #38
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It'd be neat if a theme could include definitions for "red", "blue", etc, that the themer can pick to work with his theme, and then the user just sets their track to "red" and it automatically works with every theme.
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Old 08-15-2015, 12:53 AM   #39
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I'm curious if there are any issues or benefits with "upgrading" existing themes to the 5.x standards. I briefly added the version 5 tag to my rtconfig and saw some changes to track and item colors that I didn't care for. I'm sure those can be ironed out. I've spent a lot of time tweaking my theme when I should be making music, working, eating, sleeping, etc and would hate to have it become obsolete.
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Old 08-15-2015, 02:31 AM   #40
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Only if you care for colors be shown on (an area on) tcp/mcp/items exactly as chosen in the color picker.

With the v4 method you always need to make compromizes about which color the user can actually use for tracks/items because they will always be altered by the theme color. But if you have found a compromize with your theme that's pleasing you, there's no other reason to do "version5".

Or wait... I don't know whether tinttcp and peaksedges work without declaring version 5? If not and you want to set the tinting options within your theme, that might be another reason to use version 5. Should test that .
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