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Old 09-15-2015, 02:58 PM   #1
dijon
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Default Recording settings: Input quantize results in stuck MIDI notes (merged thread)

Problem:
Recordings from a midi keyboard using the midi input quantize option on a track produces stuck notes. The same recording without midi input quantize does not.

Reproduce:
Arm a track and load a VSTi - something with some sustain, not drums (Kontakt in my case but also confirmed w/Absynth)
Check 'Quantize Track Midi Recording' and leave at 1/8
Record a scale and a few chords or something.

Result:
Playback will have sticking notes everywhere

Control:
Do the same thing without checking 'Quantize Midi...'
No sticking notes.

System:
Windows 8.1 64bit
Reaper 5.01 32bit
Intel i7-4790k 4GHz
16GB Ram

Last edited by juliansader; 07-21-2017 at 02:36 AM.
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Old 09-15-2015, 03:23 PM   #2
zyisrad
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I can reproduce the same issue. Enabling Quantize note-offs will fix it.

Windows 7 x64
Reaper 5.01 rev 9976a4
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Old 09-15-2015, 06:44 PM   #3
dijon
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Sort of. Enabling note-quantize will work if you play lightly - lower velocities. However, try playing hard - velocities above 100 or so or just 127 to be sure and the same behavior is exhibited.

Either way, something is borked with midi note quantize.

New Case:
Turn on quantize note-offs
Play a scale and some chords lightly.
All is good.

Now play a scale and chords much harder
midi notes stick everywhere.
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Old 09-15-2015, 09:09 PM   #4
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I ran into this bug a few days ago while recording some MIDI.

I just tried to reproduce it again and this is what I got:

Audio sample (bad, two stuck notes): http://files.cfillion.tk/reaper-quantize-bug.wav
Screenshot of the MIDI editor (looks good, except for the 7th chord): https://i.imgur.com/gZQ9ykc.png

Oddly, after adding or removing any note in the MIDI item, the stuck notes vanished (including the little extra note after the 7th chord in my screenshot above). This is definitely not normal!

EDIT: Video showing a few stuck notes being there and then vanishing: https://i.imgur.com/iACNQqG.gif (ignore the title in french, I forgot to remove it)

(OSX user here. REAPER v5.01, x86_64)

Last edited by cfillion; 09-15-2015 at 09:42 PM.
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Old 10-22-2015, 09:52 AM   #5
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Default Stuck Midi notes with input quantize turned on...

Quote:
Originally Posted by dijon View Post
Problem:
Recordings from a midi keyboard using the midi input quantize option on a track produces stuck notes. The same recording without midi input quantize does not.

Reproduce:
Arm a track and load a VSTi - something with some sustain, not drums (Kontakt in my case but also confirmed w/Absynth)
Check 'Quantize Track Midi Recording' and leave at 1/8
Record a scale and a few chords or something.

Result:
Playback will have sticking notes everywhere

Control:
Do the same thing without checking 'Quantize Midi...'
No sticking notes.
I'm having the same problem. I suspected it was the quantization setting, so it's excellent to have that confirmed.

Any news on getting this fixed? I always play too early when adding a "texture" or long notes/sustained part. Quantize midi input has been a real time saver for me.

TT
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Old 11-03-2015, 02:01 PM   #6
Nystagmus
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Default Please test MIDI input quantization

Please test MIDI input quantization for 16th and 32nd notes.

I have discovered recently that input quantization always messes up my performances. It didn't happen until Reaper got to version 5.

The way I cope with it now is that I turn it off, record everything and then go back and do quantization within the MIDI editor which DOES work.

By studying how accurate my timing is before quantization I've realised that my performance playing is pretty good and just needs minor amounts of quantization, usually to 16th notes.

However, when I engage input quantization, not only do the note timings come out wrong, but I get stuck (held) notes also which makes the recordings worthless. So the problem is compound: stuck notes on input quantize, and failed/wrong quantization on input quantize.


I only quantize note positions. I don't allow notes to shrink/grow.

Reaper developers, please run some tests on this in your labs. I think you might find some bugs there.
As I said before, the problem didn't happen until the upgrade to version 5 of REAPER.


But if you fail to reproduce the problems, it's important to know that I'm running REAPER on Ubuntu Studio Linux v14.04.3 via Wine v1.7.50 at Windows XP mode.

And like I said, non-input, normal quantization functions are working fine.
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Old 11-03-2015, 02:13 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nystagmus View Post
However, when I engage input quantization, not only do the note timings come out wrong, but I get stuck (held) notes also which makes the recordings worthless. So the problem is compound: stuck notes on input quantize, and failed/wrong quantization on input quantize.
The stuck notes go away by themselves if you make any edit to the MIDI item (like adding an extra note):

http://forum.cockos.com/showthread.p...17#post1572617


(ignore the irrelevant title screen...)

Last edited by cfillion; 11-04-2015 at 09:05 AM.
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Old 11-07-2015, 11:05 PM   #8
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Default verified MIDI input quantize problem

Just to be sure, I tested MIDI input quantizing in 32-bit Windows EnergyXT v3beta1 and input quantizing works perfectly there. So I know the problem is not my MIDI controller or my playing.

Unfortunately, as a DAW EnergyXT isn't as powerful as Reaper and I'd rather work in Reaper. But Reaper's input quantizing is useless on my system until the bug is fixed. I still use Reaper for MIDI composing, but I have to do all the quantizing after the recording.

By test the input quantizing in EnergyXT, I'm reminded of how much it accelerates the composition process. In EnergyXT the input quantizing is a global option tied to the project's grid size, so you don't have to enable it for each track individually.

That would be a nice implementation for Reaper. Please test and think this over, Reaper developers. And thanks.

I am using 32-bit Reaper v5.04 Windows version in Ubuntu Studio Linux v14.04.3 LTS via Wine v1.7.50
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Old 04-02-2017, 09:16 AM   #9
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This is still present in 5.40, 32bit on Win7 64bit. Devs, fix this bug please.
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Old 04-02-2017, 09:19 AM   #10
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Bumping this thread, seems to be still present in 5.40 (32bit version on Win7 x64)
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Old 04-09-2017, 04:27 PM   #11
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quantization on record is broken, it doesn't even quantize here, and i have had everything set according to tutorials.
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Old 07-19-2017, 03:44 AM   #12
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I have seen this issue get exacerbated in the the last few versions of Reaper and in the pre-release.

There are a few instruments that seem to have more problems than others. For example Omnisphere, and East West Play seem to have the most problems. I've noticed some kontakt instruments have more problems than others but it's mostly omni and play that give me the most greef.

There real problem for me is that the action to send all midi notes off does not work on some instruments. If have to manually scroll to those instruments, disable and re-enable the instrument to get them to kill the notes. It's very cumbersome to work around this.

In Cubase, if you sent a midi note off message, you always kill all stuck notes. Which leads me to believe this more than just a note off problem.

I believe we are seeing a bug here. This same problem is happening on my two clone machines which are on Windows. I have also tested this on an Mac OSX machine with the same result.
I really need to be able to use input quantize so I'm hoping we can find a solution soon.

Anybody else have a magic preference or action work around for this problem?
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Old 07-20-2017, 11:46 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by srdmusic View Post
Anybody else have a magic preference or action work around for this problem?
Perhaps try running the action "Correct overlapping notes" after recording.

(Alternatively, as cfillion demonstrated above, if you enable the option "Correct overlapping notes while editing", any small MIDI edit will trigger this action. The small edit will also induce the editor to sort the MIDI data, which should ensure that note-offs are placed before the next note-ons at the same PPQ position. This unsolved problem and suggested workaround actually dates back more than five years: Stuck / Hung Notes with Input Quantize.)

I am not sure if the autocorrect option will also affect notes while recording - perhaps if you record directly into the MIDI editor?

In another thread, someone mentioned that enabling note-off quantization does not fix the problem, which I found surprising.

Last edited by juliansader; 07-21-2017 at 03:03 AM.
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Old 07-21-2017, 01:27 AM   #14
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Can anyone confirm that notes sometimes get stuck even when "Quantize note-offs" is enabled?

If so, would it be possible to upload a small MIDI snippet that demonstrates the stuck notes?
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Old 07-21-2017, 01:54 AM   #15
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This is getting way too confusing. Currently there are TWO threads running on the stuck notes issue - be nice if someone on the admin side merged them.
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Old 07-21-2017, 03:07 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ivansc View Post
This is getting way too confusing. Currently there are TWO threads running on the stuck notes issue - be nice if someone on the admin side merged them.
Actually FIVE threads, by my last count!

I have merged the two bug report threads that focus on input quantization. (Perhaps I should even merge in the duplicate report from 2011, just to emphasize how ancient this problem is.)

The other active threads appear to cover separate issues, namely stuck notes caused by various unusual edits during playback and the unreliability of the "all notes off" action. There is yet another thread in the General Discussion forum, but too little specifics are given in that thread.

Last edited by juliansader; 07-21-2017 at 01:47 PM.
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Old 05-18-2018, 12:03 AM   #17
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While I hate to revive an old thread, this is what my search yielded...so has a solution been found for this because I'm having issues with the input quantize. I hope so because I'm starting to like REAPER but this would be a deal-breaker.
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Old 08-20-2018, 09:17 AM   #18
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Quantized real-time midi recording is a mess, at least using the virtual keyboard.
Reaper 5.941 64 on Win10/64.

I have to use other software for midi. A pity.
Cheers,
Miguel.
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Old 08-23-2018, 12:57 PM   #19
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Default Problem still there

Been using Reaper for some years but today I decided to start using input quantize and found the issue of stuck notes - and now found others have the same. As previous users have said it's not happening on all VSTs - in my case an Orchestral VST and especially violins. Using quantize note off helps but it is a bit overkill for me trying to get some expression into the playing.

I guess using quantize after the event is the way to go to resolve this but do hope it gets sorted out.
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