DEV please for the next update...

[Vincent Sermonne]

In your new versions, when you change the parameter order of a cockos plugin for the parameter modulation function (Reasamplomatic for example) you break all the parameter links created on the old configs... wouldn't it be possible that your additions are at the bottom of the list so that these links are kept? I have to do it all over again every time.

[vitalker]

So if it breaks everything, maybe it's better to post in bug reports?

[Vincent Sermonne]

Originally Posted by vitalker

So if it breaks everything, maybe it's better to post in bug reports?

is not bug.

[akademie]

PLease elaborate more, it may be interesting...

Should I understand it like this?:
In old version of Reaper (e.g. in RS5k) I create parameter modulation/link for a parameter X. Then in new version of Reaper, there are some updates in RS5k (parameters reorganized, one parameter added = Portamento). And if you load that older project, then different parameter (parameter Y) is modulated/linked than in old version???

If it's that, then it I would consider it a BIG and SERIOUS BUG, for sure!!!

(I cannot test it right now myself)

[Vincent Sermonne]

This is not a bug but a modulation parameter introduced in the middle of a list rather than at its tail. A problem that I have already pointed out but remained totally indifferent.

[akademie]

Originally Posted by Vincent Sermonne

This is not a bug but a modulation parameter introduced in the middle of a list rather than at its tail. A problem that I have already pointed out but remained totally indifferent.

Still don't understand.
Example, please. Thanks.

[akademie]

Originally Posted by Vincent Sermonne

...<snip>
... you break all the parameter links created on the old configs...
<snip>...

That seems to me as serious problem if not a bug, at least.

[Justin]

The parameter order in RS5k did not change, only the UI layout.

[Vincent Sermonne]

The modulation parameters are listed by number. If you link a number, e.g. the bypass positioned second last in the list, and this number changes to the next version, the link that is assigned changes the parameter. In Reasamplomatic, the new Portamento parameter has taken the number that the bypass had. All my linked bypasses have become portamento... so the links are broken.

[akademie]

Justin, I just tested it, IT'S HUGE BREAK.

In older version (e.g.6.11) try to put ReaSynth and then RS5k on track as FX.
Set RS5K Bypass to be linked from ReaSynth Bypass.
Save.
Open that older project in latest version e.g.6.12+dev0616 (where both have added Portamento param, so it is shifted one number down..)
You see RS5k Bypass is not controlled by Bypass, but by Portamento of ReaSynth..

This should be tied internally no matter what the name oif param is (or changes later) or in which order or arrangement they are listed (that can change also over time, for better UI of course).

If we decide to control param A by param B, their internal identification should stay unchanged over new versions.

EDIT: While I typed reply Vincent already mentioned the same as I see.

[Vincent Sermonne]

Originally Posted by akademie

Justin, I just tested it, IT'S HUGE BREAK.

In older version try to put ReaSynth and then RS5k on track as FX.
Set RS5K Bypass to be linked from ReaSynth Bypass.
Save.
Open in latest versin (where both have added Portamento param, so it shifts one number down..)
You see RS5k Bypass is not controlled by Bypass, bu by Portamento of ReaSynth

....thank you, sorry for my French !

[operator]

Originally Posted by Justin

The parameter order in RS5k did not change, only the UI layout.

BUT please, take a second look at the order of the ADSR. Especially the Sustain and Decay. Having the Sustain before the Decay... this is just nasty *jk* ;-).

But for real... the conventions in this matter and therefore the order was and always should be A,D,S,R...
Two time related parameters, then the amplitude level, followed by a third time related parameter.

I remember my first contact with a synth and those parameters (Sylenth1, 2010). These were the first controls I´ve ever learned about Music Software and they were the first I understood, because they are straight forward. If they were in the order like in RS5k, I could imagine this would have confused me much more... it´s a UX faux pa, please set it straight again...

[akademie]

^^^^^^ operator, please this is a different story here.
It's about internal routings and mappings of parameters - and maninly about breaking linking between them by adding new ones, removing old ones etc.

Let's discuss the order/arrangement of UI element opinions in its own thread, please. Thank you.

[operator]

Originally Posted by akademie

[...]

You´re right, sorry...

[akademie]

Originally Posted by operator

You´re right, sorry...

No problem, no need to apologize.
I only wanted keep the thread direct, so that the devs would not be de-railed by side discussion, when there is a big problem to solve/fix, you know.

[Justin]

The wet and bypass parameters are encoded with a hint so this is not an issue with envelopes/LFO/ACS/learn.

When wet or bypass are used as a source for parameter linking it is using the index and not hinting them, which is a bug. We will fix this, however for old projects in this case you'll have to manually fix them (sorry!). It is pretty limited in scope, but could affect a few people (obviously).

[akademie]

Originally Posted by Justin

The wet and bypass parameters are encoded with a hint so this is not an issue with envelopes/LFO/ACS/learn.

When wet or bypass are used as a source for parameter linking it is using the index and not hinting them, which is a bug. We will fix this, however for old projects in this case you'll have to manually fix them (sorry!). It is pretty limited in scope, but could affect a few people (obviously).

OK, fine, good to know.
Thankfully it's only those two parameters (wet, bypass), so not so much cases affected I believe.
Thanks for info.

[Vincent Sermonne]

Originally Posted by Justin

The wet and bypass parameters are encoded with a hint so this is not an issue with envelopes/LFO/ACS/learn.

When wet or bypass are used as a source for parameter linking it is using the index and not hinting them, which is a bug. We will fix this, however for old projects in this case you'll have to manually fix them (sorry!). It is pretty limited in scope, but could affect a few people (obviously).

good news !! thank's Justin... on the other hand I've already encountered this problem on an update of reasamplomatic with the sustain that was moved in the list...

[Justin]

Originally Posted by Vincent Sermonne

good news !! thank's Justin... on the other hand I've already encountered this problem on an update of reasamplomatic with the sustain that was moved in the list...

Sustain wasn't moved in the list, the only change was the addition of a new portamento parameter (at the end before the built-in Bypass/Wet parameters).

[Vincent Sermonne]

I was talking about an older update of ReaSamplomatic, in the version 5 of Reaper, which had made a big mess for the same reason in a big drum bank only made with Reasamplomatic... that I shared but dropped because of this problem... Indeed, on this update, the sustain parameter modulations have not changed.